Lee, like I said in the past, you are the at master EPP building; a Genius. I would be amused to see what you said you can do. I'm in...

This is a post I made on a flying wing thread. This is a straight plank wing but a similar thing could be done with a tapered swept forward flying wing with a fuselage. A bird shaped tail could be added for fun too.

Have you ever made a plank wing? Here is a plank wing modification to the 34" Pelican with ailerons by CTH.

http://www.crashtesthobby.com/pelican-34.html

When we leave the horizontal tail off a plane we call it a Q-plane so this I guess is the Q-Pelican. When you have a straight wing without sweep it is called a plank wing.

I have been playing with Q-planes designs since the 1980s. See old picture below when I was thin, had hair was was good looking.

Here is a link to a RCG thread with more Q-planes with poly wing I did in 2008 with an 46" Albatross sized plane. These versions were flying with rudder, elevator and throttle (RET). The elevator was in the middle of the center section of the poly wing on this design group. These were good flying planes which can be seen in the videos at the start of the thread and could be built with the stock all EPP poly wing Albatross and Pelican kits.

https://www.rcgroups.com/forums/show...lane-Trainer**

If you go back and look at some of the old Bill Evans designs it has potential. The big difference is we are building with EPP foam and making extremely durable versions of the basic concepts.

The obvious change is there is no elevator (horizontal stab) so it is flying as a flying wing with elevons. The total all up weight is 17 ounces with a 3S 1300 lipo and a 2812-1534 motor and a 7x6 prop which was a motor upgrade from the picture after I burned the smaller motor out. I kind of added an unintentional smoke system to the plane on the second flight.

When you make a Q-plane the CG moves forward to 3 cm or 1.25" back from the leading edge of the wing.
CG is critical. If the CG is too far back it won't fly.
The ailerons become elevons with elevator mixed in.

I laminated the wing, fuselage and rudder to make it faster. The laminate does add about 2.5 ounces to the plane.
I tapered the fuselage for a sleeker look. The fuselage is a solid piece of 1.9 lb EPP foam.
I put in a working rudder which will make the plane snap roll when mixed with full elevon movement.
I put a little reflex or up in the elevons. It didn't take as much reflex as I thought it would.
The motor angle stays the same as the kits.

Is it fun to fly? (Hehehehehe) Are you kidding???
It is fast and sleek. It is flying at 70mph and rolls like it is on rails.
It is very agile and has great performance in loops and vertical but still slows down for landing.
It looks great in the air toooooo as it goes zipping by.
It reminds me of the pylon racers it will turn so fast if you are generous with the elevon movement.
With extreme elevon and rudder deflection it will all but stop and spin in the air. Way cool if you are as crazy as I am.
It isn't any harder to see or fly than a conventional plane with the longer tail and straight wing.
The spots and stripes were a test of which is more visible. The stripes are easier to see but the R/W/B colors are great for visibility.

It is amazing how this modification changed the way the plane looks and flies and yes this same concept could be done with the Albatross with ailerons.

http://www.crashtesthobby.com/albatross-46.html

To build get the Pelican with ailerons kit and 10' laminate if you want the wing and tail laminated.

http://www.crashtesthobby.com/10-feet-of-laminate.html

Have fun

Lee

Does this qualify for a Flying Bird? Modded from Otto Dieffenbach's Plan.

Completed but not flown yet.

If she quacks...

Originally Posted by KenChin

Does this qualify for a Flying Bird? Modded from Otto Dieffenbach's Plan.

Completed but not flown yet.

It has feathers. I'll call it a bird.

Covid restrictions have put me back in the design mode since I seem to have a lot more down time than I used to.

I am having the cutter here at CTH cut me a couple of swept forward wings. On will be symmetrical and the other will be high penetration and glide semi-symmetrical airfoil. They will be 40" span without feathers. Flying characteristics, controllability and performance are the main priorities not looks although I expect the looks will definitely be eye catching. If I can get them to fly as well as the QP plane I would be delighted.

The questions are???

Do I put dihedral in the wings?
How much do I sweep the wings forward?
What do I make the fuselage and tail look like?
Do I go glider or powered?
I may make a powered fuselage and a glider fuselage for each and trade the wing back and forth.

What are your thoughts???

CrashTestHobbies QP Prototype (4 min 32 sec)

Hey Lee, I'm liking the looks of those elevator-less planes !

There's just something cool about the combination of a nice fat-chord wing with a slender fuselage and vertical only. I always wanted one of those pelicans but somehow never got one.

As far as glide ratio goes I have found that you can't beat a slightly forward swept wing. I used to know the technical reasons why, but as I get older the tech stuff sorta bores me and I just go for it with new designs- probably a wing-tip/air-flow thing.

Another shape which I used on my first scratch -built plane, a goofy fat chord Parasol with music wire struts - was the taube shape (tips of wings swept back). There was something magic about that goofy little plane in terms of generating lift, but I'm not sure it related to the wing shape. I also bent the swept back tips up slightly at a 45 degree angle - a weird idea - but made it look cool.

One thing you might wanna try that worked for me on my little epp hawk - I gave the v-tail tip a little "up-ness" by gluing a thin strip of epp at an angle. This did allow me to have zero reflex in the elevons theoretically giving more lift. But I did have to trim those things down to almost nothing - they were so effective. - Of course if you have no elevator this doesn't apply.

Speaking of interesting wing shapes, I made a small wing with large chord swept backwards with a smooth curve on leading edge and tapered a bit, with a smallish portion of the tips bent upwards at a 45 degree angle giving a bit of both dihedral and reflex. (It's gone now - squished in a move and I have no pics). - That thing gave me a huge grin when I flew it the first time, I've never seen anything float up so fast on so little power (it was small -24 inches or so with light motor and battery).

My idea was to copy the shape of that flying/gliding seed (I forget it's name but you can find it). Just another one of my "I need to try this again" ideas. I stupidly wanted more power on it so I put in a heavier motor and I never got that sweet spot on the cg again and never got the same "elevator up" flights. I made it as a pusher with 2 little verticals each side of the motor sorta like the cutlass (my favorite flying wing).

I think the Q-plane elevatorless design are potential bird planes.

Here is my latest projects for the holidays.

I have two more experimental wings in the design and building mode.

They are going to have symmetrical airfoils so I can flip the wings on the fuselage and fly the same wing with anhedral or dihedral. I have about 2" of dihedral or anhedral on each wing tip. I'll have to remember to change the direction of my elevons movement or I will be in deep trouble.

One wing is swept forward 3" at the tips. The other is a straight wing with a straight trailing edge. Cutting the sweep angles in the wing will make the forward swept wing 43" span and the straight wing 47" span. This is going to make it so the CG will vary by as much as 3" so I will need to set up the fuselages to compensate for the CG with the different wing configurations. I won't bevel the wingtip angles so that the wingtip is the same whether the wing is anhedral or dihedral. I might try small fins on the tips to see if they make a difference.

I am using the same airfoil and taper as our Rebel S-14 because of its incredible performance and strength but it is still a thinner profile. It is also thick enough I can stand the servos up I will cut access holes so the wires can go out either side of the wing to connect to the receiver so each wing can be flown with anhedral or dihedral.

http://www.crashtesthobby.com/rebel-40.html

Depending on what I learn I may try the same thing with a the high penetration glider airfoil of the Widowmaker.

http://www.crashtesthobby.com/widowmaker-39.html

These pictures may give you an idea of what I am thinking. The wings as shown don't have the elevons yet so they will be a deeper chord than shown. The fuselage is a Pelican fuselage because of how well it worked with the Q-P I realize that the fuselage will have to be longer to get the CG correct on the swept forward version of the wing:

Finished off the very rough assembly of this big girl tonight. If all goes well first test will be about 14 hours from now. Based on the 1.2m prototype the design is workable but I never got the CG range nailed on that.

The rudders are hinged to fold flat under the tail when on the ground so not visible here.

Some 'interesting' facts I will be pondering when I launch it:

• I only built this because I ordered 6mm underfloor insulation that turned out to be the near perfect colour without having to paint. Was shown as blue on the site so if I order again I'm not sure I'll get the same stuff. I have one sheet left. In other words not enough sheet left for major repairs or alterations.
• With new Covid restrictions coming in I don't think I'll be back at the club field after tomorrow. No pressure.
• This is by far the largest thing I've built at 2.4m total span. Normally work at 1.2m and below. AUW is ~1600g.
• It's actually got a decent airfoil shape instead of a KFmwhatever or some ugly mess of foam.
• I've spent enough hours to be emotionally invested now. Don't mind if a quick build or prototype fails. Will be quite disheartened if this one does.
• Between this and my hovercraft I think I've used all the worlds fiber reinforced packing tape. Just had 6 more rolls delivered.
• That elevator servo is carrying my hopes and dreams. It's a Savox digital metal gear backed by a 5A BEC and it seems tough in bench testing. Proof will be in flight. Looking at it now I wonder if hinging the elevator further back on the wedge tail would be more sensible. Too late for second thoughts! The long extension of the tail is freely hinged so no aerodynamic loads in flight.

I have a ton of decoration and tidying up to do if it actually flies alright. I can post up a PDF/DWG of the profile if anyone wants it.

OK that thing looks like something outta a Sci Fi movie - I like it.

Inspires me to get off my butt and make one of those "Reign of Fire" dragons.

One of the best movies ever made - very entertaining and those dragons !

The first animated "monster" that was done right - perfect smooth movements.

I did make it out but did not find much success.

I was the only person at the club field (which is now more of a swamp) which meant I had to hand launch myself. Grip on the belly isn't great so I couldn't really throw it forward, more relying on it leaving my hand by thrust alone. I was so worried about being tail heavy I went too far in the other direction. I did get 10 seconds of 'flight' with full up elevator and no climb. Just like the prototype cutting throttle immediately drops the nose into the ground. Knew the motor mount was vulnerable and it did take a hit. Repaired it enough for a slightly better flight but not exactly great. Then it broke off from another hard landing and I left the field rather demoralised.

On the upside I've found the same orange foam back in stock so I can make more repairs and modification. I'm toying with the idea of making another 1.2m version to nail the CG range. I've found tail heavy and excessively nose heavy but not the sweet spot. I also think having the whole wedge tail pivot as an elevator isn't the best choice. Would be thinking of fixing the front 1/2 of the wedge as part of the body and rear half as elevator or something along those lines.

I may try twin puller motors on the wings instead of a single motor at the front. If it's going to nose-bonk on landing might as well spare the motor the impact.

At this level of detail, I am afraid would see some day such creature nesting an egg ...

https://www...FB...com/UNILADTech/vi...98940650271709

I have spent literally months looking for an old thread/project from a good number of years ago of a scratch-built peregrine falcon that one of the evergreen/regular members at RCG built, it was beautifully crafted and shaped in foam with 'glass' eyes and painted masterfully, by far the most accurate and clean falcon soarer I have seen and I kept a folder of all his images and files and data but lost my hard drive and despite RCG's powerful search tools and endless internet searches I have not come even close to finiding it - can anyone help?

Hi FMA. Not sure who you were referring to but this guy was the first person I thought of...

https://www.rcgroups.com/forums/show...PP-Harris-Hawk

Sorry! You said Falcon! Was it one of these guys? Let me know

Amazing! Does this Peregrine Falcon RC is a glider?

Originally Posted by G-LO

Sorry! You said Falcon! Was it one of these guys? Let me know