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Mar 02, 2008, 06:49 PM
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Thread OP
Idea

NOTAR Heli


as you can guess from the name i am new to the rc helicopter scene however i have been told that i am skilled at making things and i am currently studying physics i have allot of experience with rc cars and planes so i understand servos and power units.

the reason i have posted this is because i have a idea i would like to build from scratch a NOTAR rc helicopter and i am just wandering if anyone has ideas on how this can be done.

i know that this will not by any stretch of the imagination be easy but i am being taught by a instructor at the moment how to fly a rc helicopter and i am capable of flying well (or so i am told) please don't tell me this is a big project or it will be expensive/hard or that i should drop the idea because i want to do it and if i want to do something i usually go ahead and do it.

any ideas will be appreciated

Many thanks
Carl

attached a diagram showing how a NOTAR heli works.

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Mar 02, 2008, 06:57 PM
by Alary Design
Photoship One's Avatar
Vario makes NOTAR helicopters

http://www.vario-helicopter.de/md_520n.html?&L=1
Mar 02, 2008, 07:08 PM
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yes i had seen those but i would love to scratch build one
Mar 02, 2008, 07:10 PM
Renewed interest
ozace's Avatar
sounds like fun, for the sake of simplicity i would consider using a ducted fan in a boom tube to provide the 'wind' for this excercise, controling it will be fun.

Please keep us informed with your progress.
Mar 02, 2008, 07:19 PM
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i wander if you can set this up with a gyro well i think i will draw some plans tomorrow and put them up for you all to comment
Mar 02, 2008, 07:21 PM
Registered User
You'll need to use a gyro.

Question: can you already fly helis? Because this won't be the machine to learn on. Fun project though.
Mar 02, 2008, 07:24 PM
Team Mulikow
Gino CP's Avatar
This project is best for bigger scale. Some guys have been working on one without success in micro scale.
Mar 02, 2008, 07:24 PM
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yes i can i have nearly finished learning i had Dave willshire from motors and rotors teaching me as he is a family friend
Mar 02, 2008, 07:24 PM
Renewed interest
ozace's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by helli newbie
i wander if you can set this up with a gyro well i think i will draw some plans tomorrow and put them up for you all to comment

In its simplest form you would set it up like a motor driven tail on a dragonfly. ESC and gyro in line. This would result in motor power varied to give tail control. It will work but not with huge authority.
Mar 02, 2008, 07:26 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Gino CP
This project is best for bigger scale. Some guys have been working on one without success in micro scale.
how large is large?
Mar 02, 2008, 07:27 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ozace
In its simplest form you would set it up like a motor driven tail on a dragonfly. ESC and gyro in line. This would result in motor power varied to give tail control. It will work but not with huge authority.
i have one of those and they are not that gr8 to control most of the time they just spin wildly
Mar 02, 2008, 08:10 PM
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ukgroucho's Avatar
This does look like a really cool project btu it will be challenging.

I think Ozaces idea to use a ducted fan for 'wind' is a great proposal but I'm not sure that a ducted fan on it's own will be responsive enough for the gyro to be able to respond to yaw quickly enough.

What might work is to allow air from the ducted fan to be directed out of both sides of the tail and use a servo controlled 'gate' to divert some or all of the air flow one side or the other.
The gate would be controlled by the gyro - rather like controlling tail pitch.

You would not need to have both 'vents' on the end of the tail. For a counter-clockwise main head (as per your diagram) the vent on the end of the tail would be on the left side (as per your diagram) to allow most thrust / authority. The second vent could be part way down the boom - effectively this would be a waste gate although it would assist in nose right piros.

The gyro should be able to move the gate / flap pretty rapidly to adjust the balance of air flow one side or the other.
Mar 02, 2008, 08:36 PM
Bush Pilots Bounce Higher
Spidious's Avatar
If you follow the Vario link you can see how they did it ! Looks like a large ban is needed to move a lot of air. But the waste gate to control the air flow is what fascinated me !
Mar 02, 2008, 10:45 PM
Registered User
Quote:
Originally Posted by helli newbie
...
attached a diagram showing how a NOTAR heli works.

It's a NOTAR, but it doesn't really explain how the Coanda effect works.

The early NOTAR experiments were pretty much failures because they just used pure ducted airflow to keep the tail still, which requires a huge amount of airflow. Take a look at the Hiller J-10 in my Hiller Aviation Museum thread...it has a massive tailboom for this reason.

https://www.rcgroups.com/forums/show...03#post3399403

Toshi
Mar 03, 2008, 01:43 AM
My hobby is why Im broke
darthdrk's Avatar
Ive worked on a micro NOTAR but at the time I wasnt able to get a powerful enough motor for my Notar system. I think there is one now available that will fit the EDF fan unit.
The project has been put on the back burner but I do plan on picking it back up one of these days


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