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Sep 09, 2007, 07:59 AM
Bertrand MICHELS
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2kg Panther Kero-powered Jet ! Built-thread


Hello,

after my Kolibri powered twinjet ( Kero-twinjet built thread and Article EN FRANCAIS publié dans un Magazine FRANCAIS ) that I have built with my uncle Francois GUINAND in France...




... I decided buy another same 200 grammes turbine to built a new jet ( the turbine comes from LAMBERT ) and to move up in size... from a 1 kg Jet to a 2 kg Jet ! With a Thrust of 1,7kg for this more recent Kolibri, a 2kg plane will also be OK.

So, besides my 'old' Kero-twinjet, here is my new " kolibri-powered" plane: an Aeronaut Panther, converted from EDF to Kerozene







To do this, I teamed with another modeller: Thierry Declerc (obviously very happy... after the first flight) who lives close to me in Belgium. He is a much better pilot than me and as crazy as me about "unusual projects"








and it fly !

Video Bungee Launch

video SLOW PASS

video ACRO

Landing WITH 1/2 FLAPS.


I am happy So, following, please find the details of the built and some more videos
Last edited by bmaaa; Sep 10, 2007 at 01:26 PM.
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Sep 09, 2007, 08:30 AM
Bertrand MICHELS
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First, we decided to add Flaps. Indeed, due to the residual 200gr thrust, with the Kero-Twinjet, we were unable to land without totaly shutting off the turbine. We were hoping that the flaps will permit to land with the turbine at iddle (still 100.000 rpm !), even if we know that it is safer to land with the turbine OFF.

We also decided to make some new horns, significantly longer that the one provided in the kit, in order not to have to restrict too much the servo displacement (we wanted to keept maximum servo torke)








For the tail, we decided to use 2 servos (Hitec HS65 - 11 grammes) rather than only one bigger one. This gives added security and prevent to use a "Y-shaped" pushrod.






AND... we started to apply heat protection ... Inside (ceramic painting) and outside (3M Aluminium tape)





Last edited by bmaaa; Sep 10, 2007 at 05:40 PM.
Sep 09, 2007, 08:49 AM
Bertrand MICHELS
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same painting in the rear fuse. Beware, ceramic paint is heavy. So, don't make too-thick painting.



You then take your "big" turbine



Take some strong ply-wood and make a nice mounting, for fixing the turbine into the fuse against the rear spar (at 90°).




and you fixit, using the 3 bolts already made by Aeronaut for fixing the EDF.




Last edited by bmaaa; Sep 10, 2007 at 05:42 PM.
Sep 09, 2007, 08:51 AM
Bertrand MICHELS
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Now it becomes more complicated. You need to put a tank in the fuse (isn'it ?), but, since the tank weight varie quite a lot between full and empty, it can't be placed like lipos in the nose. Indeed, it need to be as close as possible to the GC in order not to vary too much the GC localisation during flight. So we had to cut a hole into the main spar, and to reinforce this spar with a 4mm frame fited around the tank. I use a 500cc Graupner Tank.








and a vue from behind

Last edited by bmaaa; Sep 10, 2007 at 05:44 PM.
Sep 09, 2007, 09:05 AM
Bertrand MICHELS
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Now, we need to install all the turbine components in the fuse. We need to take 2 points into consideration:

1 - since there are no "heavy" lipos in the noze, we will need to put the installation as much as possible in the front of the plane in order to be able to ballance GC well without added weight. So, the 2 batteries are in front (RC & Pump batteries), followed by the 2 pumps (kerozene and... smoke system)

2 - we need the pumps and the ECU as far as possible from the receivers/antena. Since it is not praticable here to put the rx in the wings (as I did with the twinjet), we need to be carefull to spread the installlation in the fuse corectly. So Pump & ECU are in the nose and the 2 rx (yes, I use again the diversity system from ACT made of 2 4 channels Rx) are in the air intake.







Last edited by bmaaa; Sep 10, 2007 at 01:36 PM.
Sep 09, 2007, 09:24 AM
Bertrand MICHELS
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Now we need to install the Rx and connect the tank



That is a LOT of connectors for 2 smalls 4 channels Rx ! (note: thanks to the diversity system, the 2 linked 4 channels rx becomes a 8 channels rx with 2 antenas. One antena goes to the whip and the other, positioned at 90° to the whip, goes inside the right wing. - See my Kero-twinjet built thread )




but also, we need to add a "filter" in the intake to protect the turbine




Last edited by bmaaa; Sep 10, 2007 at 05:48 PM.
Sep 09, 2007, 09:44 AM
Bertrand MICHELS
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Now let's finish the cokpit (NO it is NOT a RC spider ! )



do some thrust mesurement (good surprise, we get 1,7 kg instead of 1,5 kg that I get from my other 'older' kolibri )




and let's go flying (I am always very nervous for a maiden flight, but now that I have my personal 'test pilot', I am not nervous... he is )


Last edited by bmaaa; Sep 10, 2007 at 01:37 PM.
Sep 09, 2007, 10:05 AM
Bertrand MICHELS
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Well, it fly wonderfully, much more jet-like than the Kero-twinjet (it is very neutral: you push-it stay in the dive), and the flaps do not have side-effects (no elevator mixinhg needed).

Just 2 mods :

We just need to put 1,5mm down trim, as aeronaut suggest in the brochure (we did not implemented this because we throught such big adjustment was a mistake, but unfortunately, no, it is needed . Believe it or not, bellow, this is the correct down trim )



and we had to modify the rails that are used to avoid the nice underwing of the plane to be scrached by sliding on the ramp of the catapulte. Those springs are indeed needed because the rails stayed under the wing during part of the first 2 flights... I am not sure this is good for the flying caracteristics of the plane to fly with the 2 rails embarked !



so we are happy:

And now some videos:

Video bungee launch

Video Fast pass 1

Video Fast Pass 2

Video of a... Touch-and-go !


And a BIG HDef VIDEO : This one is 25Mo, so PLEASE download it to your HardDisc BEFORE you play it. BIG video
Last edited by bmaaa; Sep 10, 2007 at 01:39 PM.
Sep 09, 2007, 10:32 AM
Bertrand MICHELS
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But this is not enough ! ! now we want smoke !





So, using a pump similar to the pump used by the Kolibri for the Kerozene, a 1mm (internal) brass tube and an old Speed-controler for brushed motor, we have made a "50 grammes + tank " complete smoke system (it used the same 2s Lipo battery than the Pump for kerozene).



of course a second tank is needed. We used an old 200cc tank, positioned above the Kerozene tank (still at the GC location)






And we need to inject the smoke liquid inside the thrust tube







The 'injector' is a 1mm brass tube, closed at the end, with 2 holes of 0,3 mm to difuse the liquid.








[B]Video of test for positioning the injector in the thrust tube

Video of test on the ground of the installed system.


Video of "in flight" smoke system

As you can see...In the sky, the result is not so good . OK, we had a cloudy day (so not good to see a white smoke), but also, the gazoline provide a light-gray smoke instead of a nice dense WHITE smoke. So now I need to experiment with other smoke liquid to get a denser and white smoke or may be do some more 0,3mm holes in the injector tube ? but I will loose pressure ?.

Any suggestions ?
Last edited by bmaaa; Sep 10, 2007 at 01:42 PM.
Sep 09, 2007, 11:15 AM
Bertrand MICHELS
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So, final weight, with BOOTH tanks full (500cc kerozene and 200cc smoke liquid) is 2600gr, and... it is really not a problem in flight. Still fly and land very gentle. With booth tank empty, we are JUST AT 2000gr (landing weight).



The propulsions system is quite light for 1700 gr of thrust !



But let's not forget this "old" Kero-Twinjet that was at the begining of this nano-jets madness.




Click here for a Sample VIDEO of launch !

link to the complete built thread of the 'original' Kero-Twinjet and Article EN FRANCAIS publié dans un Magazine FRANCAIS )


..... He is only waiting for someone to give me 2 extra lambert turbines to get a major upgrade






And the story is not finished. My Uncle Francois GUINAND is also Now building a second Kero-PAnther. So again wi will do dog fight !
Last edited by bmaaa; Sep 10, 2007 at 05:52 PM.
Sep 09, 2007, 04:36 PM
Registered User
Hello Bertrand, when you say gazoline for the smoke you mean gas for spark engines??

Here we use diesel fuel for smoke but the most dense is the one from 3w or Powerbox.

Juan.
Sep 09, 2007, 04:40 PM
Bertrand MICHELS
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I mean diesel for the cars.


Thanks for the info, but which one give best results: 3W or Powerbox ?

Have you also heard about "Parafine oil", "Bio diesel", « B&B smoke oil » or l« MDW Super-di smoke oil ».


Do you have links for the smoke liquid from PowerBox ? (PowerBox do smoke fluid ??)

thanks
Last edited by bmaaa; Sep 09, 2007 at 04:56 PM.
Sep 13, 2007, 03:08 PM
Registered User
Beau travail et beau vol!

Franck
Sep 16, 2007, 04:59 AM
I know I'm stupid but...
FGuinand's Avatar
Thank you Bertrand for sharing those informations with those of us who dont know yet that there are some very small turbines like the Kolibri that allow our beloved Panther to sound like the real thing with not so many modification.

This Kolibri turbine powered Panther is Very interesting to say the least !

I did practice some EDF until I saw and heard a turbine version...there is nothing to compare ! Since I have mofified a Twinjet into a turbine version with the same Kolibri that Bertrand is using, I know i will stay wit Kerosen, No question about it !

the electric version of the Panther look very nice, fly very well but when I did hear his ridiculous sound my dream was over.... you simply feel and realise that you are a big boy playing with a little boy 's toys...just see bertrand's turbine version and then you have the feeling of seeing the real thing, it's so much more exciting that there is no way back !

Just play,watch and LISTEN some of his videos, and you are going to understand what you are really missing..!

My own Panther with a Kolibri is already on the bench and hope to have it ready to fly next month...Life is beautiful !
Sep 19, 2007, 11:53 AM
Bertrand MICHELS
bmaaa's Avatar
we tried "parafine oil" with our smoke system... wiyh no luck !

I will be at "JET POWER" meeting in germany this week-end and see what Smoke fluid they sell.


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