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Jun 02, 2008, 09:34 PM
Slopeosapien
jonesymj's Avatar
MiseryQ: My wattmeter readings were a bit different, but that is probably due to the great variation in these cheap motors. I got the following #'s off my wattmeter:

Etec 7.4v 2s 1250mAh, CC Phoenix 25 esc
APC 5.1x4.5E 9.2a 57w 6.23v
APC 4.75x5.5 Speed 400 8.2a 52w 6.38v
GWS 5x3HD 5.9a 39w 6.76v

I had this same setup on my profile Raceduck (another Chara design) which weighed a little over 8 ounces all up with that 1250 2s, and it hauled the mail, and the battery was only mildly warm (barely at all) after a "beating on it" flight. I haven't tried any larger props, in fear of baking my TBird... I've only got one small ESC so it's very valuable... Well, it looks calm enogh to give it a try... Wish me luck guys!!!
Last edited by jonesymj; Jun 03, 2008 at 12:28 AM.
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Jun 03, 2008, 12:24 AM
Slopeosapien
jonesymj's Avatar

Sucess!!!


Alright, Got a good maiden and flew both my 2s800 batteries through it tonight...

THIS THING IS AWESOME!!!!!

First, it had more than enough power... I may prop it back a little to extend flight times. WOT was hilarious fun, but totally un-necessary. Second, it actually flies awesome. Flew straight out of my hand, needed 4 clicks of up trim, which is me gluing something crooked, no doubt. Rock solid, even in some not so friendly gusts (it was really a little too windy to maiden it, but I was there, and the batteries were charged... ). Very predictable, and very consistent. Third, the Thrust Vectoring effect is very noticeable and fun to mess around with... I was trying to do backflips 30ft high on the second pack... ... And didn't break it. 45* high alpha passes are almost easy... It flies very stable at speed (40 something mph) too, which doesn't seem that fast until you do it with an 18" span jet... Gets small awfully fast.

Chara, two thumbs "way the hell" up!! First the Raceduck (retired due to structural abuse... me flying the hell out of 3mm depron ) and now this one... One of the guys at the field tonight really wants one too, we should see him on this thread sometime soon. (Get in here Gary!!) A really great little plane, I'm really excited about building the bigger one now... I have a different idea for the Thrust vectoring for the big one...

Here I go... Messing with a perfectly good plan again... For our viewers at home (this means you): the small one works perfect from the plan. I mean PERFECT. Build one... You're missing out if you don't!!
Jun 03, 2008, 12:43 PM
Registered User
ok, you got me. i'm a HUGE fan of chara designs, too. had a harpy that was way too much fun. so this one is next. got a welgard 2208-08 and zagi carbon prop that makes 21 oz thrust at 90 mph pitch speed for 20 amps on 3S. that should make this a VERY interesting little plane if i go for about 28" span.
Jun 03, 2008, 03:21 PM
registered foam addict
chara's Avatar
jones,
congrats for the successful maiden-flight! You seem to enjoy it as much as I do.
kev,
designing the H-29 was great fun and of course it makes me happy if you guys like it too!

Thanks for all the encouragement!

PLANS:
on the first page you'll find the 200% version and the 130% versions of the plans.
oh, and just a side-note. I have decided to extend the strakes a bit further towards the nose. the alternative measurements are shown in the plans as well.
Have Fun!
Last edited by chara; Jun 03, 2008 at 03:29 PM.
Jun 03, 2008, 06:21 PM
Registered User
fr4nk1yn's Avatar
Metrics drive me nuts. It wouldn't be so bad if I had, or could find local, a metric "yardstick" for cutting. AND I like templates so I spent a little time tracing the wing tail and nacelle in AutoCAD.
The rest of the parts in Chara's PDF plans should drop right on.
I tried to keep the front the same metric size but the rest has been changed slightly to imperial measurements.

I'll know for sure later.

-edit- Made a minor change in the PDF. Tail spacer built into the nacelle.
Last edited by fr4nk1yn; Jun 04, 2008 at 05:40 PM.
Jun 03, 2008, 06:38 PM
RC WANABEE
Chara, Do you think this plane will work with say an Edf 40? I would sure like to try it, but have had some thrust line issues with it on other designs.
Jun 04, 2008, 12:24 AM
Slopeosapien
jonesymj's Avatar
Chara: I very much enjoyed it, and I'm looking forward to enjoying it more... The only problem I see is I only have 2 800mAh 2 cells... This thing is enough fun to warrant the purchase of 2 more!!! Thanks a ton (or tonne!! LOL) for the bigger fuse parts, too... I've already printed them and cut them up... Man, this thing is BIG!!! I love it!! I just need to get down to my see my parents, and sneak a half an hour on my dad's small lathe... I saw a design (I'll give credit to the designer if I can ever find the thread again!!) for a yoke-style 2d vectored thrust motor mount... This should be interesting!! Roll and pitch through the tailerons, and yaw and pitch through the motor... I'll get a 0 airspeed backflip out of this one I bet!! I'll get some pics of the King Kong sized version when it's more than just a pile of fanfold pieces... Maybe tomorrow??

MiseryQ: PM me your address, and I'll send you one of the steel yardsticks that's also a meter stick (both scales)... I got a couple spares (they were on sale, you know how that goes...), and I'll even send you one of the unused ones!!

To everyone else: Thanks for the compliments and encouragement... This is how a place like this thrives and grows. Funny how us modellers (even the Gassers and those crazy Helicopter guys) can get along, but the rest of the world can't... Well, that's the solution then. We need to convert everyone into RC'ers... Should be easy...
Jun 04, 2008, 02:39 AM
Nanaimo BC Canada
Amen to that, I was blown away with the performance of this thing , and it Was gusty. Very good design for tiny park jet, looks great up there too. I def have to have one. Love it . Great design. Cya out there again M
Jun 04, 2008, 04:16 AM
Registered User
Chara what type of foam are you using? (for some reason I am the only person that doesn't know!)

Rudes
Jun 04, 2008, 12:16 PM
Slopeosapien
jonesymj's Avatar
Rudes: I used FanFoldFoam/Protection Board III... Chara used 6mm depron for his original. Both would work equally well, I would think....

Rotatto: That you Gary?? I'm glad you found the thread ok... Now break out half a sheet of fanfold, and get cutting... I want to do some formation flying!!!
Jun 04, 2008, 12:36 PM
Registered User
fr4nk1yn's Avatar
dern my phone browser ): I wanted to post the 130% templates this morning but ran out of time. The size surprised me a bit but I alwayed liked the smaller planes. What really surprised me is the wing area of these planes. The original is over 140sqin'.
Jun 04, 2008, 01:45 PM
registered foam addict
chara's Avatar
Q, thanks for posting the plans! I'm sure lots of people will appreciate that.I'm usually too lazy to do templates for "easy" parts. I just draw them directly to the foam and cut them out.
"Metrics dive you nuts"? now you know how the rest of the world feels with these handy "1yard, 2 feet, 32/143 inch" designations *LOL*

RCWANNABE,
EDF40 should work but will need some modifications to the fuselage spine I guess
(for undisturbed airflow to EDF).
oh, and keep it VERRY VERRY light! EDFs are notoriously whimpy in that size.

jones,
you're sure you want to build the 200%. It won't look that nice in large scale I believe (too simple). You can try one of "jetset44"'s designs - simply the best large jets around! Or just do maybe a 160% version?

rudes,
jones is right.
3mm depron should be doable as well with some more stiffening of the wing, but I believe the benefit (in weight) will not be that noticable.

cheers
chara
Jun 04, 2008, 01:55 PM
Slopeosapien
jonesymj's Avatar
Chara: I thought about that as I was cutting things out, but anyone that knows me will tell you I'm a simple guy!! I did have the same though as you, though, so I cut out 2 extra nacelle peices, and I'll make 3 dimentional engine nacelles for it, and I'm going to build a small fuse to go beneath the built-up upper fuse, to fill it out a little and give me somewhere to attach the lower mount for the VT yoke. Like I said... Here I go messing with a good thing!!! I like jetset's series of designs, but for my VT experiments, there's a little too much build time involved to take a chance. This one's much quicker to build, and therefore not such a great loss if it gets "lawn-darted"

MiseryQ: mine isn't a "floater" by any means, but that would put me at about 6oz/sq ft.... Pretty low wing loading for a jet!! BTW, the 2 packs (20c continuous 800mAh 2 cells) came down barely warm on monday, so I guess I got a colder wind than you did... No surprise on these cheapo motors. Thank god for the wattmeter!!
Jun 04, 2008, 05:57 PM
Registered User
fr4nk1yn's Avatar
I added the 130% templates to the other post.

I'm a n00b with parkjets, From my reading their wing area is close to 250sqin.
I could be wrong but here goes: I resized the template to 200%, which for comaparison brings the WS to 37".
Running the AutoCAD 2009 area calculator, I love that new feature, The area is 290sqin! X2, That's more that a SlowStick!

I was a little nervous about destroying a good motor before the first one I rewound, I did two, until I found two teeth had 15turns one had 16turns and the other 14. IIRC when I tested the motors the KV was about 2950. My 2nd rewind was slower than stock. Perhaps you got one that has some extra turns (:

Too windy to fly a maiden tonight so that gives me some extra time to make her pretty.
So I'll finish the airframe and maybe do some paint tomorrow. That still gives me plenty of time to drop in the gear and get a flight in tomorrow night if the weather allows.

Then it's on to building the 130% to take a Don's Wicked motor and annoy the Slimers at the school yard. Can we talk about "them" here? (:
Last edited by fr4nk1yn; Jun 04, 2008 at 06:03 PM. Reason: bad math.
Jun 04, 2008, 08:41 PM
Slopeosapien
jonesymj's Avatar
MiseryQ: timocharis (Dave North) found the same thing with one of the DT700's or 750's... here's the thread over in powersystems: https://www.rcgroups.com/forums/show...ighlight=dt750

I'm guessing if it's a problem in the bigger motors, we'll have the same problems with our little ones. Doesn't really matter, as long as you give it a bench test to see what it'll do. I think most of the jetset designs end up around 10 or 11oz/sq. ft, and a lot of the ducted fan jets end up higher in that... We're doing good where we're at.

By your calculations above, do you mean that the 200% size one has 600sq. in of wing area?!?!?! Holy crap... well my big one may be a floater, if that's the case. Of course, I could just put a 2400mAh 3 cell (3 800mAh 3 cells in parallel) in it and stay up for a week... The powersystem going in that one will crank out 140'ish watts, so as long as I keep it under a 13oz I should still end up with a rocket....


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