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Dec 19, 2006, 09:53 AM
1855-1921 Naval Fan
Stu :)'s Avatar
Thread OP
Help!

Motors and ESC's


Right-o Hello everyone.

I've found myself in a bit of a pickle, to date I've been building and modifying plastic ship kitsets to RC. So far I've built a 1/350th Tamiya Musashi using servo and a simple three way switch, a 1/150th Trumpeter Zhong Shan using a FA260 with a circuit from a servo as a speed controller, 1/350th ICM Konig with 3x RF-020 servo motors and a modified servo circuit, 1/350th MHM Pola using a pair of 'Toy' motors (FA130's I me thinks) and a cheap park flyer ESC... which has been recovered far too often due to no reverse.

Now I've got a Revell 1/72 HMCS Snowberry to contend with, I've got it setup to run with a Tamiya TEU-101 ESC, with a 7.2v 2000mAh NiCd and a 45mm brass prop. What motor should I be running? The temporary motor from the bits box doesn't sound, nor smell good at half throttle.
It would be nice to have some speed, but not the kind of speed that would exceed the hull speed, nor do I want speed boat 'speed', I have a Vosper for that soon.

Also I'm a bit confused with something I've read regarding using capacitors on motors. I've always bridged the terminals with a ceramic cap, normally a 0.1F, however it mentions that I should also- "The capacitors should be soldered from each motor terminal to the motor case"
Huh?!? Wouldn't that short out the power supply to the motor?

Many thanks,

Stu
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Dec 19, 2006, 10:10 AM
Where's Pamela?
patmat2350's Avatar
nope, is alright. the caps don't pass any current through.
Dec 19, 2006, 10:17 AM
no wings any more, just dust!
Ghost 2501's Avatar
stu, for a 45mm prop, I would imagine a speed 600E 5-pole motor (or equivilent), you want torque NOT revs, so a 5 pole motor is best. Your temp motor is probably working its guts off and struggling.

for an esc, try a 25A one. I will check up for you on some corvettes, but My Sydney star has a speed 500E, 35mm prop and a 15A Viper15 esc for the main motor

the soldered capacitors for suppression, yes that is right, one across the terminals and one from the terminals to the can. and NO they dont short. to put it simple, what they do is divert the spark to make less arcing- of my models, only Espirit does not have the terminal to can capacitors
Dec 19, 2006, 10:45 AM
No recomendations for a motor, sorry. About the capacitors though. Capacitors will 'pass'/conduct DC for a very very short span of time, till the capacitor charges to it's 'capacity'. Then, no more DC going through it. That charge time is very short and the resulting 'path' to ground is for only fractions of a second, no real problem. For AC (which most interference is to start with) it's a different story. A capacitor will provide a path to ground for AC, meaning that it 'strips' the AC/interference from the DC before it gets to the motor, which is the whole point to using them. That's a very simplified explanation of how capacitors work, so don't take it for 'gospel'. But, it's 'close' enough to make sense to the average person not too familiar with all that electronic 'hocus-pocus' stuff. Hope that helps...
- 'Doc
Dec 19, 2006, 11:41 AM
Registered User
steveciambrone's Avatar
I have the same boat and propeller and use a Dumas 6v motor on six cells and it runs fine. Great slow speed performance and enough high speed to get it out of trouble if something arises.

The flower class builds into a fine ship model and takes to R/C just great. Keep the internal weight low, ballast it to the water line and it will have fine handling qualities.

There were several threads on the build so you may want to do a search and review them.

Thanks
Steve
Dec 19, 2006, 12:17 PM
no wings any more, just dust!
Ghost 2501's Avatar
if I recall, the flowerclass 'vette is one of the most popular kits available
Dec 19, 2006, 03:28 PM
Is life for real?
pkboo's Avatar
Stu, I believe U'r a little bit underpowered for those props. Let's see U'r boat is about 30", water has some serious resistance and U'r using way to big a prop for that size of ship (Ghost!). Go back to a 35mm or even try a 30mm, three bladed, regular prop (check www.raboesch.com), use a 400 type motor geared 1:2 (you'll get about 5,000-6,000rpm on the prop) and an 25/30A ESC (just to be in case if you need a higher rev motor). I bet you'll get the speed you want and need!

I got a Lindy fletcher which I'm powering with a 400 graupner driving (1:2.5) two 30mm three bladed working (wide blades) props, dry tests look good. I'm probably starting a thread next summer. Good luck --> Eugne
Dec 19, 2006, 05:40 PM
no wings any more, just dust!
Ghost 2501's Avatar
pkboo, i think Stu's model the 1/72 corvette, which probably has a stocl 45mm scale prop if i remembere the kit, i know the prop was BIGGER than the kit prop supplied with my sydney star model
Dec 20, 2006, 07:55 AM
Is life for real?
pkboo's Avatar
Ghost, than you might be right that he would need a 500/550 type motor. Still at models you never know, the motto is test and test again especially with propsize. No doubt though that he's using to small a motor.
Dec 20, 2006, 08:21 AM
Is life for real?
pkboo's Avatar
Way to go Kaskazi!
Dec 22, 2006, 08:34 AM
1855-1921 Naval Fan
Stu :)'s Avatar
Thread OP
Thanks for all your help. Yes the temporary motor was too small and over powered (it seized up on a bath trail), so it's off with me to the hobby store on the other side of the city tomorrow for a 500 or maybe a 540, the guy on the phone said a 540 maybe a better setup.

Stu
Dec 22, 2006, 10:34 AM
no wings any more, just dust!
Ghost 2501's Avatar
try a 545 type. Its the same can size and fittings, but has 5 poles not 3, giving lower draw and longer run times. its also less revvy. the 3-pole 540 type are quite revvy.
Dec 24, 2006, 09:16 PM
1855-1921 Naval Fan
Stu :)'s Avatar
Thread OP
Well the local hobby store recommended a Tamiya Super Stock TZ motor, it didn't seem right so I when to other hobby and they to made the same recommendation, so I drove half an hour across town to hobby store with a model boat person in the store, rather than a RC car or plane staff. You know what? He said the same darn thing Tamiya Super Stock TZ motor. So now have one.

One more thing, does this motor need to be run in? I've tried a 3x and 4x D cells, but the motor does not turn, the only other idea is to hook it up to the boat without the prop and leave it with the transmitter trim at 3/4 throttle.

Stu
Dec 25, 2006, 02:56 AM
Registered User
before you go any farther with running the motor, check to see if there are any mounting screws interfering with the rotor(the screws are sized for use with a mount and if screwed all the way in, can cause the motor to act like is siezed). hmm think I would have gone for a 27t motor... run in; well there are prolly more ways to do this than smiths in the phonebook... easiest is to apply a small drop of oil to each bushing/bearing, install the thing in the ship and simply run the thing at half throttle for the 1st pack or two(in other words, just run it like you intend to) after a couple of runs the motor should be fine.


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