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May 18, 2007, 04:02 PM
Ken's CAD Models
dz1sfb's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bobber Bob
Hi Folks...

AH... The TomKat rears its head again...

To address both SkunkWorks and BGRs comments:

I have Designed a servoless Swing Wing TomKat, and that was back in the late "80s", and it was to have been a SLOPE glider.

With my experiments, with a "halfspan" model, I proved the areodynamic principle that an airfoil (that is generating lift) will rotate foreward (into the wind), and NOT be blown back.

That is why "autorotation" works, and why an AutoGryo's rotor rotates into the direction of the on coming air.

Bob Reynolds
. "ComeUpHere"
Bob,

Is'nt the phemomena you describe here dependant on the slight negative pitch relative to the rotational axis of the airfoil (wing or rotor blade), and the assistance of the greater presented frontal area of the retreating airfoil relative to the airflow through them?

I mean, I agree with your statement concerning an airfoil going into the wind (still need slight negative pitch). That is how a sailboat sails into the wind (which is also dependant on a slight negative pitch relative to the apparent direction of the wind), but there are several more dynamics involved with the autorotation of a gyrocopter. Sorry for being so wordy, I am not sure I am using all the correct terminology. I thought I understood something about Autogyros, but this kinda threw me.

Do you have any articles or documentation that could be studied? It sounds interesting.

Curiously puzzled,
Ken
Latest blog entry: Ken's CAD Models new web site
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May 18, 2007, 08:21 PM
Kat Builder
Bobber Bob's Avatar
Hi Ken...

My studies and interest in this phenomena is from observed details while studing the way aircraft are built and flown and operated.

The start of my interest in this came from noticing a drawing for the construction of a light plane's wing. There, right in the middle of things was a "drag strut" that was made of a small dia. alum tube, and it appeared to be loaded in compression.

That puzzled me, as I was of the "logical" opinion that the drag backwards of the wing by the on coming air was the dominit force. And it bothered me that the tube was in compression, and not in tension.

I was in my teens then, and could not get any interest in my questioning of that puzzle, let alone any answers. It was not until I had the realization that the unpowered rotors of a gryo and heli rotated into their local airflow.

That led me to the study of the lift vector, and there was the answer...

So, no articles or documentation, just observation.

Bob
. "ComeUpHere"
May 19, 2007, 06:07 AM
RC-Kraut
relaxr's Avatar

Me 262 Schwalbe


Hi - after lots of time without any news, here we are: I did a Me 262 "Schwalbe" - a nicely loking plane I think. It has 10`` span, is made from 3 mm depron and weighs all in all just 14 gr. Standard xtwin gear, soldered to B, small pagers (had no large). The fuse can be nicely adapted to a profile construction.
Cause of rain and windy conditions just a small maiden up too now: it flies looses some alt in turns, but I will do more trims on it. Allows just short stick inputs, but looks like a dream. Behaves like a jet, loves large and round turns and fly by's. I love it with the paint job. . The mock nacelles make fine add vertical stabs. Gave it also some anhedral for roll stability. More to come (trims + vid) with better wheather....enjoy (like me)

Edit: Thanks to a calm evening, I have trimmed it out. Thats a nice plane, flying level with half throttle, turns very sensitive, but has an unique behaviour if turning it wide and soft - it rolls into the turn like with ailerons. High in air one can do very sharp turns but with some loss in alt - all in all very cute - it made my evening

CU
Last edited by relaxr; May 19, 2007 at 01:09 PM. Reason: added the "Edit"
May 19, 2007, 04:21 PM
Duane Cruz

All depron hollow body.


I've been noticing a lot of people making/carving EPS models as I have made some attemps at it as well, but I wanted to see if I could shrink down some parkflyer plans from 30+ inches to a 9.5inch wingspan and this is what I came up with. All 2mm depron with exception of the nose and canopy. Without the guts, it is at 8.5 grams. Not guts installed yet, but it glides like a dream and looks really nice. Flight report at a later date.

Let me know what you guys think!

Duane
May 19, 2007, 04:24 PM
Philippians 4:13
It is beautiful! I was actually thinking about building one myself simply since noone else had. I guess I won't now :-) Yours looks too nice. I am anxious to see a video.
May 19, 2007, 10:12 PM
Ken's CAD Models
dz1sfb's Avatar
Nice work Relaxr and Duane,

Is there no end to the creative and artistic madness? I hope not!

Ken
Latest blog entry: Ken's CAD Models new web site
May 19, 2007, 10:20 PM
Registered User
skunkworks2006's Avatar
Nice work Relaxr and Duane!
That's a great looking profile, Relaxr. Nice way to include engine nacelles without adding too much drag and weight.
Duane, what can I say...fantastic. I hope it flys as good as it looks when you get it all together!
P.S. did you ever get your c-130 figured out?
May 20, 2007, 12:14 AM
Duane Cruz
Thanks guys...but, let it be known all of you are the motivators on this project. I was totally content with the profile mods but and then you guys got started on the carved models. My wife never heard the end of that one! Now she actually said she's proud of the job I did. "Yes...finally got her on my side"

So, a big thanks to all of you!

Skunkworks, I'm still "tweaking" the C130. I got frustrated with it quite a bit last week and instead of letting my "anger" get the best of me and throwing it again the wall, I thought I would calm down and give it a rest for a week. So, its now been that long and going to give it another shot this week. Got some slight CG adj to make and probably a wing adj. Hopefully that will do it.

Again, thanks and I'll keep you posted on all of my progress.

Duane
May 20, 2007, 01:49 AM
RC-Kraut
relaxr's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by skunkworks2006
Nice work Relaxr and Duane!
That's a great looking profile, Relaxr. Nice way to include engine nacelles without adding too much drag and weight.
Duane, what can I say...fantastic. I hope it flys as good as it looks when you get it all together!
P.S. did you ever get your c-130 figured out?
Thats the point skunkworks: drag! I prefer those profile constructions because of low drag, making the planes faster and less "massive". And its a also a bit of an excuse as I am not so successful in carving full body fuses . But as Ken said, dont let us stop this all . . .Nice F4 Phantom Douane - I choosed between the F4 and the Me, the Me was (now) the winner. CU
May 20, 2007, 09:02 AM
Turn 'N Burn
trooper8's Avatar

B1


Anyone up for a nice B1 bomber? That would be sweet with a solid body...

I've got an F4 on the table and a BD5 in the queue.
May 20, 2007, 12:30 PM
BGR
BGR
Foam Junkie
Quote:
Originally Posted by trooper8
Anyone up for a nice B1 bomber? That would be sweet with a solid body...

I've got an F4 on the table and a BD5 in the queue.
Yes I think a Bone would be a nice model for the AA guts.
May 21, 2007, 08:04 PM
Registered User
BRG, IMHO tomcats look coolest by far swept full aft.
in which case could be built as a delta. save complexity is bad.
Relaxr, very cool 262 man. i love it.
how did you paint it?
later, chris
May 22, 2007, 12:15 AM
BGR
BGR
Foam Junkie
Sure Tomcats are cool, but how many is one to build? Variety is good and I think a full fuse Bone would be a cool plane to have along with a Tomcat and a few others.
May 22, 2007, 12:45 AM
RC-Kraut
relaxr's Avatar
2phar - thats my standard paint: its color concentrates (latex based) for staining in-door wallpaper paints. I mix them for the individual colors. The color stays bit elastic and adheres perfect to depron. I apply with a simple paintbrush (stolen from my daughters water colors). It adds for a full job on an xtwin just max. 2gr. And those colors are cheap (small bottle - ca. 3 ).

CU
May 22, 2007, 09:25 AM
Ken's CAD Models
dz1sfb's Avatar
BGR,

I have to agree with you! B1 would be very nice in full fuse. Do you have a good 3-view? I have not seen one on the web yet, nor have I really looked.

The wing root area would really be cool. I am sure the horiz. and vert. stabilizers would require a slight enlargement. Lots of room for CG adjustment.

If I can get a good 3-view I will accept the challenge.

Ken
Last edited by dz1sfb; May 22, 2007 at 03:21 PM.


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