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Nov 07, 2018, 10:23 PM
low tech high tech
vtdiy's Avatar
GPW any 1/4" foam sheet would do. Your blue fanfold (without the covering) weighs the same. Dollar Tree stuff is nice if you want to paint some color on, since it's white, but otherwise, there's no real benefit. Model Plane Foam would work as well.

The motor and/or brick can be out of any of the recent RTF or BNF microlights, or bought as spare parts for them. The bricks from Banggood I mentioned earlier are Flysky compatible, but for DSM2 (Spektrum) compatible you could use parts for Hobbyzone or Parkzone micros like the old Champ, or P-51.

I use a Devo transmitter to fly all of the above -- but it's been modified to do that with Deviation firmware and other mods. The Flysky replacement parts from Banggood seem to be the cheapest bricks around. Some people have had poor luck with them apparently -- not me. Can't say why.

Anyway, today it's amazing what's available at very reasonable prices.
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Nov 07, 2018, 10:34 PM
low tech high tech
vtdiy's Avatar
re free-flighting the mini T1 -- nothing new about that -- I took that verbatim from GPW as the design intent -- a freeflight plane, whose direction you could interrupt by wiggling a transmitter stick! Just like the early days of R/C. My foam Mambo is exactly that type.

What I did specifically after glide testing was to put a bit of masking tape across the stab and rudder, offset to give it a slight left turn, and one across the H-stab and elevator to keep it neutral. There were no pushrods to the servos yet. The throttle was usable however -- which was a lot more advanced control than a timer, or limited fuel reservoir on a free flight plane's motor!

Setting the throttle at about half and a gentle hand launch saw the plane doing a wide circle and maintaining altitude. A little more throttle made it climb, less made it descend. Land and adjust the tape(s) if any different flight trim is needed. Simple!

Day before yesterday when I did that it was drizzling but absolutely calm, so no problems with drift, or trees. Today was a different story, but by then I had added the pushrods and we were IN CONTROL!.
Nov 07, 2018, 10:56 PM
low tech high tech
vtdiy's Avatar
BTW, doing a freeflight test (if a plane is stable enough) is a nice way to check for engine thrust line adjustments. Since you've already done glide tests to set the CG, the plane should fly straight with a neutral rudder and elevator and sufficient throttle to make it fly.

You should have a reasonable level of climb (not a zoom) all the way up to full throttle (unless you're over powered). Zooming indicates a need for some down thrust. And a turn with rudder neutral under power indicates the need for side thrust, to correct.

There's a tendency with full radio control of surfaces, to correct problems with the stick trims -- but that makes things inconsistent at different speeds. If you are free-flighting it, you can't fall back on trims for thrust line problems. And for a beginner, one control (throttle) is better than three while trimming out a plane. Too easy to get mixed up and throw a plane into a spiral dive.

In calm weather, with a decent amount of space, and a stable design (as a primary trainer should be) free flighting, after glide testing is a useful tool. It's also fun, surprisingly enough, even though the ultimate aim is R/C.
Last edited by vtdiy; Nov 07, 2018 at 11:03 PM.
Nov 08, 2018, 07:01 AM
gpw
gpw
“There’s no place like Foam”
gpw's Avatar
Thanks VT , well stated !!!
We’ve got a QX-7 FrSky TX , and the old ACE Micropro ( FM ) … I may have to pick up a cheap transmitter for the new small units ?

Gosh when we started RC , we had a one channel push button Hinode radio and rubber band escapement … on a rather large balsa J-3 , silkspan covered and full of patches ( I think it was a Sig kit ) free flight with a non throttled .15 engine … Tricky to learn to fly on … That’s where we learned how important trimming the flight characteristics , and thrust line really was *( and not putting much fuel in ) … Best we’d manage is a couple big circles and then a controlled crash … It was WONDERFUL !!! Took me Months to do that , then the J3 flew away ( too much fuel , unreliable radio ) That’s when we realized we should put our name and phone # on the model … Aargh !!!
Then we got a single channel Ace Pulse Commander 72 …. a tail wagger … That and an Ace High glider with a Cox Golden Bee engine , ( and foam wings ) had many memorable and successful flights … The Glider was easier to trim out and flew Fine without an elevator …. ( A motor control would have been Nice though eh ! ) Today it’s all so easy , and then there’s drones that fly themselves and you just steer them around …. We’ve come full circle … sorta ‘ , ish ‘ …
Last edited by gpw; Nov 08, 2018 at 07:07 AM.
Nov 08, 2018, 08:00 AM
Build straight - Fly twisty
Whiskers's Avatar
My experience with free-flight is what makes testing a new RC model a pretty stress free event for me.
Firstly it makes me take time to set up the model properly. Free-flight does that to you. Unless the setup is good you start the free part and the flight part can be of very short duration indeed.
Having done 'due diligence' the actual flight test, where controls can be used and power controlled, is a mere nothing compared to launching a free-flighter and not be able to do anything to stop it destroying itself if that is what it sets out to do.
We have it so good now.
I wonder what they will have in, say, 50 years time.
Nov 08, 2018, 11:10 AM
low tech high tech
vtdiy's Avatar
GPW, I did a little research on transmitters for the type of bricks I've been using (Flysky type). It looks like they will work with the latest Flysky transmitter, the FS-i6 -- $39.95 from Banggood (without receiver).

The airplane receiver bricks that will work with it are in the F9x9 series (ie F949, F959) and the V911 series (but these don't seem available from Banggood any more).

Here are some links:

TX: https://www.banggood.com/FlySky-i6-F...-1148659.html?

RX Brick 3 channel : https://www.banggood.com/WLtoys-2_4G...r_warehouse=CN

RX 4 channel brick (still available???): https://www.banggood.com/WLtoys-F949...r_warehouse=CN
Nov 08, 2018, 11:55 AM
Registered User

31.5 inch wide depron


dear sirs,

I have some 6mm black depron left from an old project. Problem is, that's about 0.6 inch shorter than the T1 wingspan. Could I get away with it? Longer cord maybe?

Raoul
Nov 08, 2018, 12:22 PM
low tech high tech
vtdiy's Avatar
Raoul, do you mean shorter than the center section of the wing? Because it can be cut out as three separate pieces, the center section, and two tip pieces.

Anyway, I can't see how losing 0.6" will really make a difference in flying -- the greatest impact you can have is in using lighter gear and construction.
Nov 08, 2018, 12:36 PM
Registered User
Quote:
Originally Posted by vtdiy
Raoul, do you mean shorter than the center section of the wing? Because it can be cut out as three separate pieces, the center section, and two tip pieces.

Anyway, I can't see how losing 0.6" will really make a difference in flying -- the greatest impact you can have is in using lighter gear and construction.
I meant shorter than the entire wing. As I've had my issues with warped wings (and getting scolded/torched by some builders here ), I'm wary of deviations so I'd prefer to bend as one, and then cut of the tip pieces.
Nov 08, 2018, 01:06 PM
low tech high tech
vtdiy's Avatar
Well, to be honest with you Raoul, cutting the pieces apart will probably change them anyway. I generally adjust the pieces by hand and eye to match each other (and the drawing, more or less). The most important thing is to assemble them together without twist. I put down waxed paper on the building table, and put them together with 5 minute epoxy. This gives you time to adjust the dihedral and make sure everything is not twisted.

I find hot glue cools far too quickly for me in this application -- I'd rather have time to check everything -- 5 minutes is still a very short time. I also do only one tip at a time. Let that cure, then do the other. The less you have to correct or pay attention to while getting alignments straight, the better.

It's also important to first sand the joining edges to the right bevel. This can be done by putting the wing section on top of a board and the TE and LE at its very edge. Then lifting the end of the wing section to half the intended dihedral height. The mid chord will then look like it extends past the edge of the board. This is what you will be sanding off.

Hold the sanding block vertical and sand the end of the wing panel until you get to the edge of the board That acts like a guide and a stop. Do the same for all panel edges (4 total in T1). They will all then match and have the right bevel for glkuing.
Last edited by vtdiy; Nov 08, 2018 at 01:17 PM.
Nov 08, 2018, 01:17 PM
Registered User
Quote:
Originally Posted by vtdiy
Well, to be honest with you Raoul, cutting the pieces apart will probably change them anyway. I generally adjust the pieces by hand and eye to match each other (and the drawing, more or less). The most important thing is to assemble them together without twist. I put down waxed paper on the building table, and put them together with 5 minute epoxy. This gives you time to adjust the dihedral and make sure everything is not twisted.

I find hot glue cools far to quickly for me in this application -- I'd rather have time to check everything -- 5 minutes is still a very short time. I also do only one tip at a time. Let that cure, then do the other. The less you have to correct or pay attention to while getting alignments straight, the better.

It's also important to first sand the joining edges to the right bevel. This can be done by putting the wing section on top of a board and the TE and LE at its very edge. Then lifting the end of the wing section to half the intended dihedral height. The mid chord will then look like it extends past the edge of the board. This is what you will be sanding off.

Hold the sanding block vertical and sand the end of the wing panel until you get to the edge of the board That acts like a guide and a stop. Do the same for all panel edges (4 total in T1). They will all then match and have the right bevel for glkuing.
Good ti;s. Will try to follow. Thanks Vt.
Nov 08, 2018, 05:38 PM
low tech high tech
vtdiy's Avatar
I took a chance trying to get a video just before dusk with an almost discharged camera battery, and a camera Velcroed to my hat. Didn't do well, but did manage to get about half a minute of the plane in frame!

Flying a few feet off the ground is easy -- launched at half throttle and even backed that off by the time I had the model in frame. Sorry this is so short, but you do get to see it fly anyway.

Towards the end you can hear full throttle up near the trees when a small gust came by.

TrainerOneMini1 (0 min 33 sec)
Nov 08, 2018, 06:13 PM
treefinder
springer's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by vtdiy
GPW, I did a little research on transmitters for the type of bricks I've been using (Flysky type). It looks like they will work with the latest Flysky transmitter, the FS-i6 -- $39.95 from Banggood (without receiver).

The airplane receiver bricks that will work with it are in the F9x9 series (ie F949, F959) and the V911 series (but these don't seem available from Banggood any more).

Here are some links:

TX: https://www.banggood.com/FlySky-i6-F...-1148659.html?

RX Brick 3 channel : https://www.banggood.com/WLtoys-2_4G...r_warehouse=CN

RX 4 channel brick (still available???): https://www.banggood.com/WLtoys-F949...r_warehouse=CN
Just want to add to what VT said, for it's price the FS i6 is an incredible radio. I picked up one with an fs-ia6b (telemetry) receiver when they were on sale for $30 at banggood sort of on a lark, but also as a possible suggestion for guys getting into the hobby who didn't want to or couldn't spend much money. The radio works with both the older Flysky afhds2 and newer afhds2a protocols (cool for me as I have probably thirty or forty of the afhds2 receivers). It's a physically small radio, but once i played with it a bit, was comfortable to use. The best thing is qba667 has hacked the firmware and enhanced it to 14 channels, added timer, and a ton of other stuff, so a $30-$40 radio does all sorts of stuff that radios costing hundreds more can do! I hadn't thought of using it for my banggood brick in my half sheet Aeroncia, have to try that!
Nov 11, 2018, 07:28 AM
gpw
gpw
“There’s no place like Foam”
gpw's Avatar
That does sound intriguing … perhaps Santa will bring me a box of new radio goodies , and a motor or two …   
Latest blog entry: Lost plans
Nov 11, 2018, 01:40 PM
Registered User

T1 Ribs?


Not the bbq kind..

Guys, I'm doing a T1 build with some 6mm black depron I had left, but after hairdrying the wing to achieve the airfoil to follow the curve of the fuse, I'm noticing that the material too easily bends back to it's original form. Afraid this is going to cause warp-problems. Now I'm thinking of adding 2 ribs (top shape copied from the fuse) on both sides to keep the wing from losing it's intended shape.

Thoughts?


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