View Poll Results: Vote one of three options for the proposal.
p) Change of Model Glider, in favor 8 66.67%
p) Change of Model Glider, opposed 3 25.00%
p) Change of Model Glider, neutral 1 8.33%
Voters: 12. You may not vote on this poll

Thread Tools
Feb 23, 2020, 08:44 PM
Terry Edmonds
Thread OP
Poll

2020 FAI Rules Proposals


This year there is only one F3K proposal on the attached 2020 CIAM agenda, page 34. I am posting a poll for it and ask only USA participants vote.
Thanks

Terry Edmonds
Sign up now
to remove ads between posts
Feb 24, 2020, 08:26 AM
Registered User
eitanro's Avatar
this change was proposed during the last WC by Mickey if I'm not mistaken, the reason is - because so many of us are used to the "old" rules (pre - WC in 2015) and not aware the "new" rules that say that a competitor has to retrieve his model even during "all up" (there was an exclusion in the "old" rules for this task), a better explanation was needed to make sure that everyone are aware of this change.

Eitan
Feb 24, 2020, 05:38 PM
aka: Pauly Knuckles
plankaujr's Avatar
This seems too harsh a penalty on first reading but I have an open mind. My reason for saying it’s too severe is that the pilot is already receiving a “0” for the land-out flight and this rule has the potential for the pilot to also receive zeros for the subsequent one or two flights if their land out is either too far away or un-retrievable. If the pilot was able to use their backup model they could at least attempt to salvage some score for the task.
Feb 24, 2020, 06:06 PM
I'm not as bad as they say.
Quote:
Originally Posted by plankaujr
This seems too harsh a penalty on first reading but I have an open mind. My reason for saying itís too severe is that the pilot is already receiving a ď0Ē for the land-out flight and this rule has the potential for the pilot to also receive zeros for the subsequent one or two flights if their land out is either too far away or un-retrievable. If the pilot was able to use their backup model they could at least attempt to salvage some score for the task.
Seems harsh on a cursory examination, but is no worse than a treed plane on your first flight of any other task. At the end of the round there is only 1 score between 0 and 1000, same as any other task. If you are going to open the door to redemption on flights 2 and 3, then you have to consider the same relaxation for all the other tasks.
Also this language is not changing the rule. The rule is already in place. It's just clearly stating the rule, as we have had to re-state it at the last two WC's. This is just making the rule clear so we don't have to keep discussing it at pilot's meetings.
Latest blog entry: AIrcraft I've built.
Feb 24, 2020, 09:00 PM
Time for me to Fly...
Mr. Wiz's Avatar
I don’t see the sense in making a guy retrieve a plane that landed outside the field before he can take a new plane from the model box for any of the tasks. But if this adds clarity to an existing rule, then I believe it’s a good thing.
Latest blog entry: The latest and greatest
Feb 25, 2020, 07:12 AM
I'm not as bad as they say.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mr. Wiz
I donít see the sense in making a guy retrieve a plane that landed outside the field before he can take a new plane from the model box for any of the tasks. But if this adds clarity to an existing rule, then I believe itís a good thing.
The sense is that it discourages the pilot from flying super risky and getting super lucky and having the contest be decided, or or the outcome significantly altered, much more by luck than by skill. Not to say that no luck is involved, because there is, but you fly differently when you know you have to get the airplane back to fly the next flight.
Latest blog entry: AIrcraft I've built.
Feb 25, 2020, 12:41 PM
Registered User
eitanro's Avatar
The reasoning is that in WC competition (or any other major contest), a pilot will lose a model to get the time, for example, when there is only one obvious thermals and the conditions are very weak, a pilot stick with the thermal to do his 3 minutes even though he knows that he will be able to come back.

Eitan
Feb 25, 2020, 01:39 PM
Time for me to Fly...
Mr. Wiz's Avatar
I suppose at the WC level guys will be willing to risk losing a model to make a time but if they don't get back they still take a zero for that flight. I guess they want to limit risk taking??? That doesn't make any sense to me but I'm just some middle aged guy in Michigan that occasionally likes to pretend he's a real F3K competitor.
Latest blog entry: The latest and greatest
Feb 25, 2020, 01:47 PM
Wayne Wimbish
wdwimbish's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mr. Wiz
... I'm just some middle aged guy in Michigan that occasionally likes to pretend he's a real F3K competitor.
Oh Mike, you are a REAL competitor, just like me. I just have to remember that 'competitor' does not equal 'contender' more often than you do.

Wayne
Latest blog entry: Paying for Purchases by PayPal
Feb 25, 2020, 03:13 PM
Ryan Gonsoulin
Ryans Rebel's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mr. Wiz
I donít see the sense in making a guy retrieve a plane that landed outside the field before he can take a new plane from the model box for any of the tasks. But if this adds clarity to an existing rule, then I believe itís a good thing.
Not having to retrieve the "old" model prior to launching the "new" model would be equivalent to a "drop"
Feb 25, 2020, 06:47 PM
Time for me to Fly...
Mr. Wiz's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ryans Rebel
Not having to retrieve the "old" model prior to launching the "new" model would be equivalent to a "drop"
Gotcha.... I didnít think of it that way.
Latest blog entry: The latest and greatest
Feb 25, 2020, 09:16 PM
Registered User
eitanro's Avatar
Mike, You'll be surprised what people are willing to do during WC - technically everything! it's crazy...
Feb 25, 2020, 11:36 PM
aka: Pauly Knuckles
plankaujr's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by mnowell129
Seems harsh on a cursory examination, but is no worse than a treed plane on your first flight of any other task. At the end of the round there is only 1 score between 0 and 1000, same as any other task. If you are going to open the door to redemption on flights 2 and 3, then you have to consider the same relaxation for all the other tasks.
Also this language is not changing the rule. The rule is already in place. It's just clearly stating the rule, as we have had to re-state it at the last two WC's. This is just making the rule clear so we don't have to keep discussing it at pilot's meetings.
Mickey,
Thanks very much for the response . If all this is doing is clarifying an already existing rule than that makes much more sense. Appreciate all you do to help make this crazy hobby better!


Quick Reply
Message:

Thread Tools

Similar Threads
Category Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Discussion 2020 FAI Rules Contradictions and Clarifications ttraver Hand Launch 42 Dec 24, 2019 12:11 PM
Discussion 2020 FAI Rules Posted MattN Hand Launch 2 Dec 16, 2019 11:30 PM
Poll 2016 FAI F3F Rule Proposal 5.8.7. Organisation of Starts tedmonds Slope 3 Mar 07, 2016 09:01 AM
Poll 2016 FAI F3F Rule Proposal 5.8.1 Definition tedmonds Slope 1 Mar 03, 2016 07:15 PM
Poll 2016 FAI F3F Rules Proposals tedmonds Test Forum 0 Mar 03, 2016 11:26 AM