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Mar 19, 2005, 01:02 PM
Love gliders & speed !
guillaume83's Avatar
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e-Scorpion 2 60" by CCM


Hi all,

The Scorpion 2 is a moulded 60” made by the French company Cévennes Concept Modélisme (CCM).They are a very friendly bunch of people and will try and please all of your desires.

I have been flying their Scorpion 2 (glider version) for over a year and a half now and had one complete model with hollow carbon wing as well as a bagged carbon wing. AUW with the hollow wing is 710gr and 826gr with the bagged wing.

I also had a spare fuselage, and after I had a small crash with the glider version, I decided to convert the “damaged” fuse to e-power and build the brand new fuse as a pure glider.
So I sent the damaged fuse back to CCM to have a new Vtail fitted as well as the nose cut.
Both of my fuses were electric fuses anyway as I quite liked the idea of a longer nose on the slope to try and keep the AUW down thanks to less balancing lead.

You can see many pictures of my Scorpion 2 on the slope as well as many photos I took during the build on the Scorpion 2 thread I did last year (I lived in Cardiff/Wales at the time).

Wing section is an MH43 which is not very common on gliders.

One of my problems with the e-Scorpion 2 before was that I could not fit a motor big enough for what I wanted to do with the model on flat field, and I had the same issue with the cells…just as I reluctantly decided to order (yet another) Hacker B20-15L geared 4/1 (I have one in a 1.8m Highlight already, weighing in at 670gr with 3s Thunder Power 2100), a new range of motors came out from our national manufacturer in France….and I saw the light
Indeed, the Cyclon Mini Elite from Electronic Model was rated at 300W continuous/450W shorts bursts for only 78gr!!!!
I HAD MY MOTOR! ( I wanted to make the model at hotliner"ish" as the Highlight 1.8m is my compact thermal ship already).

Just needed to find the cells that could handle the currents I wanted to draw now (and still fit in the fuse).
The Scorpion 2 will only take 500AR/KAN1050/HE1100 size cells,and one has to build them all in line to fit them in. It’s not like me to purposely build packs for one model only,I like using the same packs for different models,but in this instance,I did not see the point of having two complete pure gliders either, so I went ahead and ordered the power train for ir.

Cells??? Well,funnily, I first heard about the GP1100 at about the same time as the Cyclon range came out…and they were very highly rated.

I decided to run the motor on 8 cells originally,as I wanted to keep the weight down and I thought the Scorpion 2 would not balance with more than that….but after a chat with CCM,they said I should be able to fit 10 cells and still get the correct CG…I saw the light again .

Instead of pulling 45A on 8 GP1100 (with Graupner 14x9.5) as originally recommended by Electronic Model, I decided to pull 40A on 10 cells…prop size to be determined (I had an RFM 10x8 laying around).

You can see several shots of the Cyclon Elite Mini:
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Mar 19, 2005, 01:06 PM
Love gliders & speed !
guillaume83's Avatar
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You can see everything fits very tightly in the fuselage. The servos are as far forward as possible and are flat in the fuse to allow the controller to sit above it.
I have to put the wing servo wires in the fuse first when I assemble the model,plug them into the Rx (forget the Multiplex 6pin connector for ease of connection of the wing servo to the fuse,there is no room for it),then tighten the wing onto the fuse (note the original wing fixation system),the put the cells in (with the controller outside the fuse),push the Rx above the pack (it sits on it with Velcro) and plug the pack to the controller. The controller sits above the servos as stated above…and MAGIC,the CG is spot on. I have about 2/3cm to move the pack to get the right CG and this is just right. With the CG positioned,I can move the pack 1.5cm each way more or less.

AUW is 982gr with 10 GP1100.

The controller is a Flash 40K3 from the same manufacturer (up to 60A short bursts) and has been giving some issues (cut offs) due to the built-in/non-programmable LiPo cut off.You can read all about it here.

Pictures below show the e-Scorpion 2 with large cooling holes I made to try and keep the lot cool.
Mar 19, 2005, 01:10 PM
Love gliders & speed !
guillaume83's Avatar
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Close up on the cooling holes and the fuse.

In the last picture,you can just about see a GP1100 cell.
Mar 19, 2005, 01:13 PM
Love gliders & speed !
guillaume83's Avatar
Thread OP
Anyway,by charging the pack at 3A on the field (voltage was about 15.2V) and reducing the throttle’s range on my Tx,I managed to get round the issue. I put the RFM 10x8 rather than the Graupner 10x6 as I once got a reading a 380W/40A with it whereas I only managed to measure 300W or so with the 10x6 before the controller cuts off.

With the weather forecast today,it would have been a crime not to “maiden” the model.
Once at the field,I charged the pack,and off it went….straight vertical.With about 7secs of motor,I was at a VERY comfortable height.
What I expected
I also avoided the cut off from the controller….until the 3rd climb out where it cut off over ¾ throttle on the Tx.
So I did my other climbs with less power but still,the model had a nice climb rate.

I should say that the motor is so TORQUEY,I had to put some right aileron on many climbs to counteract this.I am VERY happy with the model and with the motor too.

I must have had 6 climb outs before I decided it was time to land…after 15mins of flying that is!

Not bad for a molded 60” weighing in at 982gr.
I used quite a bit of camber for thermal flying, but also did some low passers with a bit of aerobatic. I did not try to keep the model up there as much as possible by any means…but it was a VERY thermally day.

I hope you can see by the length of this post I was very excited and am very happy with the combination of the Scorpion 2 with this power train.
I cannot wait to completely solve the issue with the controller and fly the model full throttle at each climb.

I only had 1 flight on it today because I was busy with other models,but what a flight! It was great fun.

By the way,the Scorpion 2 is now available in the US via SoaringUSA (as well as the other models from CCM). If you forget the hassle of having a long battery pack,I find it makes a very good performer as a HOTLINER”ish” molded 60” (I used to have an FVK Bandit and I much prefer the Scorpion 2 being an all molded plane with much better energy retention).

Pictures belowe show how I did the Vtail linkages (not as recommend by CCM,I also made some "wipers" for cleaner aerodynamics) and how neatly (and tightly ) everything fits in the fuse.

Guillaume
Last edited by guillaume83; Mar 19, 2005 at 01:21 PM.
Mar 19, 2005, 06:10 PM
Registered User
Aio_1's Avatar
Glad to hear you got it going and that you're so happy with it. Hopefully you can get the ESC cutting problem sorted without too much trouble.

Any chance you might be able to get some video footage so I can see what you mean by Hotliner-ish?

How come your weather was so great, that's not fair?
I spent about 6 hours hanging around Bicester Airfield waiting for the fog to clear to do some full size soaring. It eventually did around 3pm and I got a couple of short flights.

Aidan

P.S.
By the way, thanks for all the pictures in your threads. They do make them even more interesting and enjoyable.
Last edited by Aio_1; Mar 19, 2005 at 06:16 PM. Reason: Added P.S.
Mar 20, 2005, 05:11 AM
Love gliders & speed !
guillaume83's Avatar
Thread OP
Aidan,

I do not have any proper video camera but my still one can take video...I don't think the quality would be satisfactory on a flat field though as the model gets small quickly.
It shoots in AVI format,but I can then convert to mpeg...but cannot host it online anyway.

I forgot to mention that the motor and battery were both cold after the flight.
I could put my fingers on the motor without feeling any heat,and the same goes for the battery...good sign

We are in a cocoon in London,there is so much pollution it keeps us warm that'd explain the weather difference.

I don't know why I keep saying it is a Hotliner"ish".I guess it depends on people's experience.But anyone seeing the model climb would say it is a FAST climb.
To me,it feels fast but not as fast as it could be.I don't think it climbs as fast as my Highlight with the Hacker inside,but the Highlight is over 300gr lighter (and I put around 220W in it)...but I haven't flown the Highlight in 8 months,so this might not be an accurate comparison.

For instance,I have a Sokol with Mega 16/15/3 and APC 4.75x4.75 on 3s TP 2100.People have measured this set up around 100mph.I felt fast at the beginning,but now I have got used to it,it feels like it could be faster if you know what I mean.

I also used to have an FVK Bandit hotliner which climbed straight up too....this is what I am basing my comparison upon (or feeling rather).

All I can say is that the model goes straight up,and I have plenty of height in about 7secs.The climb might be spectacular for some,but I am used to this type of performance so I guess I do not qualify it as AWESOME.Don't get me wrong though,I LOVED the climb rate and never thought I could achieve it in a model where the room is so tight.
It probably qualifies my e-Scorpion 2 as a hotliner then I guess

Guillaume

ps:don't forget i still need to play with prop sizes,I'd like a bigger prop with less pitch,maybe 12x4,12x5 or 11x7....
Last edited by guillaume83; Mar 20, 2005 at 05:19 AM.
Mar 20, 2005, 05:34 AM
flight999
7 sec. to towline height is not a bad climb rate for
any model.
Glad to read you are enjoying the Scorpion so....
...... and the Cyclone. Should be a great success
when you sort out your ESC.
If I didn't know who you were flying with I would
ask what Tx and receiver combination you were
using. This problem is obviously taking some sorting.
Mar 21, 2005, 03:50 AM
Love gliders & speed !
guillaume83's Avatar
Thread OP
Hi,

I tested the power train with 10 fully charged CP1700 and I had no cut-offs even with the throttle range set at 100% on my Tx...that confirms that my problem is coming from the controller cutting off.
It is going back to the manufacturer this week and hopefully,I won't have to worry about the cut-off after that.

Guillaume

ps:I forgot to say the wing is a full carbon wing.People who purchase the Scorpion 2 in order to build it as an e-glider usually go for the fibreglass wing,which is cheaper and lighter (by at least 50gr).
Mar 21, 2005, 05:33 AM
Registered User
Hi,

I got the same Cyclon and i am a bit worried by some play in the front shaft (5mm) : do you have some too or it's only mine ?
I am using an Aeronaut 12x5.5 folding prop.

GF
Mar 21, 2005, 05:37 AM
Registered User
By the way the controller I am using is an MGM Compro 4016 with all the parameters adjustable : great controllers but badly distributed; I bought mine fron Icare Ikarus in Canada !

GF
Mar 21, 2005, 05:54 AM
Registered User
Aio_1's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by Gustave Flaubert
....i am a bit worried by some play in the front shaft (5mm) : do you have some too or it's only mine ?...
Do you mean 5mm play or just that the shaft is 5mm diameter?
Mar 21, 2005, 06:02 AM
Registered User
The shaft is 5 mm and the play is noticeable when you are holding it. EM. told me this was "normal" and I was just asking Guillaume if its Cyclon has the same play.

GF
Mar 21, 2005, 06:27 AM
flight999
Guillaume,
Thanks to the recomendations in your thread, one of
my friendly rivals in the club went and bought the one
available Mini Cyclon yesterday
To think I even pointed it out to him, must be mad

I now expect to be even more soundly beaten in our
club competitions We fly the same models and his
will not only have more power, but will also be lighter.
Mar 21, 2005, 07:06 AM
Registered User
Aio_1's Avatar
flight999,

Where did you try for the Cyclon?
Mar 21, 2005, 08:12 AM
flight999
I didn't!!!
They have a trader's market before the BEFA
a.g.m. and the guy that imports them had a stand
with all the Cyclon motors on display. Unfortunately
he is a comparatively new dealer and I don't appear
to have his name or web site on my computer. All the
stuff he imports appears to be French.


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