The 3D printer is just great for doing scale items. There is a trade off in that the surface finish is not necessarily very good. This can be sorted on, say, a cowl by sanding it down and filling but on a Vickers gun or rotary engine, this isn't really possible. Mind you, short of a competition model, the finish is usually good enough.

Originally Posted by Ianda217

The 3D printer is just great for doing scale items. There is a trade off in that the surface finish is not necessarily very good. This can be sorted on, say, a cowl by sanding it down and filling but on a Vickers gun or rotary engine, this isn't really possible. Mind you, short of a competition model, the finish is usually good enough.

Being that 3D printers are kind of in their infancy, perhaps the resolution will improve?

Phil

At the present time, the limitation is due to the material being laid down in layers. Even printing at 0.15mm, layers leaves a noticeable "woodgrain" effect on rounded surfaces. Some materials can be smoothed with chemicals but PLA - the most common material - is not susceptible to this method. It can be sanded down and/or filled with spackle. However, from 5 or 6 feet away, none of this is really a big issue.

The two photos below show the effect. The first one is a close up of the dummy engine and shows the woodgrain effect and the rings that are left on sloping surfaces. It simply isn't possible to sand or fill a print like this. The second picture is a close up of a test print of the battery hatch after a quick sanding and a coat of Tamiya acrylic. It will be possible to do a little more work on this one to get it really smooth.

All in all, I think it's still a great solution to scale detail. The dummy engine weighs 100 grams. It could be made lighter but I will probably need the weight so I made no effort to make it light. Once you have paid for a 3D printer, and allowing 100% wastage factor for failed prints, supports and the like, the motor would cost about $6. Over here in the UK, a single 1/6th scale Williams Brothers Rhone cylinder costs $6

One big warning about getting a 3D printer - you can become obsessive about 3D printing and it'll drive your wife mad. "Where are you going to keep that thing?" "I'm fed up with the noise of that thing". "How much electricity does that thing use?" Etc., etc.

I'd be happy with that printed motor, looks great!

Phil

Phil,

It's certainly the best I've ever had. Once it's tucked away inside the cowl, it won't be easy to see it anyway.

Not surprisingly, there's not a lot happened over the last couple of days. Lots of distractions. Most of the stuff I have done has been indoors as the shed has not been very inviting recently. I've been doing even more 3D printing. The Nieuport has a couple of sheet metal fairings/recesses where the guns are mounted on the forward fulselage. I realised that the easiest way to replicate these was to print them. The results are shown below. I also got a couple of pilot torsos printed off ( downloaded from Thingiverse). The goggles aren't really WW1 but they are much better than most of what you can buy. They have been printed as a 0.8mm thick shell with no infill so they are very light for their size.

I have made a start on the tail feathers and have got the first leading edges laminated for the tailplane and fin. I am slightly concerned whether my design for these parts will be strong enough. Because of the proportions of the plane, I have tried very hard to keep the tail surfaces as light as possible but also as scale as possible. The full size's tail surfaces were sheeted with tulip wood and I am trying to replicate this with an open structure sheeted with 1/32" hard balsa sheet. I have also designed the surfaces with a 6% thick symmetrical airfoil and this will make the building of these parts that bit more difficult. Obviously, I will report back on how I get on.

As an aside here, I recently read through a "build" report on the Seagull Models 1/5th scale Nieuport 28. This model appeared to have solid tail surfaces made from 1/8" ply sandwiched between two sheets of 1/8" balsa. The builder of that model had to add 36 (yes - thirty six) ounces of lead in the nose. That tends to confirm the need to build the tail as light as possible.

Ian, it's all looking very good. Having just purchased a $45 Williams 1/6th scale LeRhone (and that feels like a good deal because I've seen it listed at over $100 some places) I am very interested in learning about 3D printing. Especially because I'm clumsy with my detail work.

I trawled back through the thread and couldn't find a mention of what printer you're using? And knowing what you know now, if you were to go back and buy a new printer would you buy something different? Many thanks.

Martin, I use a Creality Ender 3 printer. I'm not savvy enough to advise you on what the best printer is but the reason I got that one (October 2018) was that it was new on the market, got excellent reviews, had a Faceb**k group for help and it was cheap. There are a number of newer printers on the market since I got mine and there are hundreds of Youtube videos offering advice and information. Hobbyking are selling the Ender 3 at around $180 at the moment.

Since I got mine, I haven't bothered keeping up with developments in printers because I would just find out that all the newer printers are supposed to be better (or maybe not) and it would just annoy me.

A big issue is doing the design work for parts. That can be a very steep learning curve although it's something that I actually enjoy doing. As I wrote previously, I am using AutoCAD Fusion 360 which is a very powerful programme and is free to hobbyists.

Not really an answer to your question but researching 3D printers is pretty easy with Google and Youtube.

Understood. Thanks for the reply.

Well, I'm back from Oz. Actually got back last Friday but I've spent the time finishing off a couple of other models ready for the start of the new flying season (if we ever get the weather). I got a powered glider for Christmas and I've set that up as a long range FPV model. In addition to that, my club was donated a very old Flair Cub a few months ago. This model was IC powered and had really ancient (early 70s) radio gear in it. It was very dirty and nobody wanted anything to do with it so I thought I would give it a go. I stripped out the motor and radio gear and removed all the old film covering. I had to cut up the front end to make a battery compartment and to fit an electric motor and then recovered it in olive drab to replicate the military L4 Grasshopper.

The final task on these models took about 15 minutes this morning then they were laid aside and I started thinking about the Nieuports. I t took me a while to get my head around where I had left off. I had to read back through this thread to get things sorted out and to establish what the next task is to be. Tail feathers.

Going back a while to before Christmas, I had realised that I had made a mistake when I drew up the laser cutting drawings. Because the main wing ribs are all the same and effectively flat bottomed, I didn't need to add stand off tabs for wing alignment so when I was doing the symmetrical airfoils for the tailplane and fin, I forgot about the tabs so I now have lovely, laser cut ribs but no way of aligning them properly. To make matters worse, I discovered today that I had not had enough ribs cut as I had only drawn one of each rib instead of two. The simplest solution would have been to get the ribs re-cut with tabs. I will have to get some ribs re-cut anyway to make up the shortfall. However, when I realised that the tabs had been omitted, I worked up a complcated solution since I was in the middle of 3D printer fever at the time. I drew up a set of solid jigs to build the tailplane on and printed them off. Because of the limited size of my printer, the jigs don't support the entirety of the tailplane but I'm hoping that they are close enough.

So today, I tried out my planned building method as detailed in the photos below.

First job was to set up the 3D printed jigs in their proper alignment over the drawing of the tailplane and cover them with sellotape and polythene. Next, I glued up three sheets of 1/32" balsa and cut out the lower sheet onto which I marked the positions of the ribs. Next, I fitted the laminated leading edge around the jigs and laid in the bottom sheet which I then super glued to the leading edge. After that, it was a simple job to glue in the ribs followed by the shaped trailing edge. Following a light sanding, the top sheet was glued in place with Titebond, pinned and weighted down. I will need to wait until tomorrow to find out if this procedure has worked. If it has, then I can go on to do the elevators and vertical fins and get the missing ribs ordered up for the second model.

Good to see you back at it...Nice use of the tools on hand to save your work..

Originally Posted by Ianda217

…………………………………...

I gave a lot of thought to the rigging wires during the design stage and eventually decided to keep it simple whilst still being functional. On the last WW1 model that I built, the rigging was fully functional and as scale as I could make it with scale fork ends, turnbuckles and the lot. It looked fantastic but it was a pig to rig for flying and, from 10 feet away, you couldn't see the detail anyway. It was also very expensive. So, this time, simple it is. The rigging will be made up from 18 gauge piano wire with 2mm threaded rod brazed on each end into metal clevises which then clip into little brass brackets fixed to the wing spars. I tested the strength of the clevis joint with the bracket by fixing a bracket to a roof beam in the shed and hanging a 50 lb. weight on the end of the wire. It held that so should have no trouble with the shared loads from a 7 lb. airplane.

……………………………....

Nice alterative to (typically) costly turnbuckles and I will add to my files.

Several years ago I picked up an immaculately built 1/5 scale Nieuport 17c, covered in what I suspect is silk and with the U.S. Lafayette Escadrille markings. The weight of the finished model, less electrics, powerplant but with wheels and pull-pull linkages to tail surfaces and the wonderfully wacky but scale aileron bellcrank connection into fuselage, is only 3lbs, 9oz. so I'm expecting an auw weight of around 5lbs, 12oz - with a OS fs-70 Surpass but haven't yet figured out if any ballast will be needed. Wing span is 64" with wing area of 955sqin. This model has a nice sized, flat fuselage bottom section between the landing gear legs, which allows for a nice access hatch for batteries, etc.

I did not meet the original builder but the plan sheet for the fuselage and lower wing was passed along to me: Nexus Plans Service, Boundary Way, Hemel Hempstead, Hertfortshire ….. but I can't find the outfit on online and don't see this particular plan in any online plans repository.

The plan sheet showed hardwood engine bearers, printed statements saying a Laser 75 was used in the prototype and 6degrees down thrust and 4 degrees right (with penciled in notes by the builder of my model saying 1degree down thrust, 2degrees positive incidence on the wings and 2degrees negative on the stab)
https://www.rccanada.ca/rccforum/sho...t=nieuport+17c

Michael in Ontario, Canada

Michael,

Nexus plans are now managed by Sarik Hobbies in the UK. They have a plan for a 1/5 scale Nieuport 17 but I don't think it's the same plan as yours. It is 62" span and power is quoted as .90. The designer is Dale Tattam.

Link to the plan is: https://www.sarikhobbies.com/product...-nieuport-17c/

The old Traplet plans are now distributed by Traplet in Australia but they don't appear to have a 1/5 scale Nieuport 17.

Originally Posted by Ianda217

Michael,

Nexus plans are now managed by Sarik Hobbies in the UK. They have a plan for a 1/5 scale Nieuport 17 but I don't think it's the same plan as yours. It is 62" span and power is quoted as .90. The designer is Dale Tattam.

Link to the plan is: https://www.sarikhobbies.com/product...-nieuport-17c/

The old Traplet plans are now distributed by Traplet in Australia but they don't appear to have a 1/5 scale Nieuport 17.

Thanks for your sleuthing.

I'm pretty sure that the Nieuport 17c I have was built off the Dale Tattum plan you cite.
The plan sheet I have - that includes everything except the top wing - carries the printed number 1641a
But definitely the top wing of my plane is 64"...…. it wouldn't be the first time a specification listing is in error. I can only understand the .90 engine specification as ballast influenced; the model certainly doesn't need that much power.

Michael in Ontario, Canada

Hi Ian, I see that the tailplane outline is formed from four laminations of 1/16th (?) balsa and I was just wondering if you soaked or steamed the wood before pinning it to the plan. (if so, what with?) Also, you don't seem to use a false leading edge to support the 1/32 balsa sheet, do you rely solely on the superglued joint between the sheeting and the leading edge?