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Sep 22, 2019, 09:22 AM
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Here Goes...... A Discussion....


How do I begin, well lets fall back and punt ! I am writing this for a intelligent discussion, no flaming, awkward responses etc.

Here's my thought: As with any motorsport, advances are typical, just look at the 'funny cars' of drag racing, in as much as the Q-40 racers with the model aircraft family. This is where I am going. Since racing tends to cost more and more and through various groups, aka, AMA sanctioned Sport racing classes with easy obtainable aircraft an spec engines, to keep things in perspective,lets take a side bar on this.

What if we start all over and stay there. Meaning taking a Spickler Q-500 'stock' plan/short kit and a shall I say, a K&B .40 engine and have racing as an intro class but still competitive. Here's a link how the Q-500 started: www.nmpra.net/HOF/Spickler.htm

Either scratch build, buy foam wing cores, all materials to build a plane along with K&B engines are still avail through the 'Bay' or MECOA at reasonable pricing. And the plans are avail on Outerzone: https://outerzone.co.uk/plan_details.asp?ID=6868

And then theres this: https://www.rcgroups.com/forums/show...-Spickler-Q500
Of course, limit props and fuel to.

I am I blowin' smoke or is the interest is not there for an application like this.

Mike
Last edited by RACE 66; Sep 23, 2019 at 07:36 AM.
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Sep 22, 2019, 04:01 PM
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I like it Q500 started as a poor mans or biginners race class
Sep 22, 2019, 06:28 PM
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I would be leery of banking on Mecoa having k and b 40s. Website says if you try to order one, it will be placed on backorder and you would be notified when it is available, which means maybe, maybe not..
Sep 22, 2019, 08:01 PM
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But i agree, a good, inexpensive event would be nice. The thunder tiger pro 40 with the apc 9x6 sport prop was doing well for a while, then the thunder tigers went away. The evolution 46 with the later one piece muffler, again with the 9x6 apc prop, was close enough to the thunder tiger performance that they were approved, also. That kept things going a while longer in the AMA 424 quickee class, but now those are gone, too. 424 does not allow hollow molded composite wings, which helps keep cost down. Trouble is, it is difficult in this electric era to find a consistent supply of 40 sized engines.
Sep 22, 2019, 09:20 PM
WBE
WBE
White Fang
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I flew this combination forty (geez really!?) years ago. This sounds appealing if only from a nostalgia point of view. If you’re talking about club level, or maybe even a neighboring statewide level, I bet a dedicated group could keep themselves supplied with K&B 40’s (or any of the once common sport 40’s) for a good while. I just checked and right now there are a dozen K&B 4011’s on just the first page of ebay and at least 4 that have listed here in Sept 2019 and showing as unsold.

Was thinking about doing this with QM15 on a club level using only plain bearing 15’s, wood airframes etc. If we can get four of us churning out planes, stockpiling engines etc. I bet we could keep ourselves busy having fun until they catch us and stick us all back in the nursing home.
Sep 23, 2019, 08:00 AM
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A Little More Follow Up.....


Good to see some positive response regarding the article. To help prove the point, our club has raced 1/12th Reno racers for the last 15 years !
What started out as H.O.B. AT-6's and Unlimited racers that have raced in the Reno Championship races. Along with that, the O.S. - LA .15 engine is used in the 'stock' AT-6 and with the Unlimited's, we use any .15 size engine, with restrictions on any race style engine. Both classes are limited to prop size and fuel type to. As time has evolved, not only we have glow powered entries, we now have two classes of electrics and 1 class of the British Vampire electric ducted jet. And as the race series, we have a summer class with points and end of season championship race that everyone starts out without any point carry over. So, it really makes a good, enthusiastic racing event within the club.
Now we've had our up's and down's but, the core group of guys kept plugin' along tweaking this and that and the numbers have grown in entries and in enthusiasm. Yes, the guys do either scratch build the planes via a set of plans or 'scrounge' the auction sites for kits and supplies, but, that's where we at right now. Our current club size is around 75 members and this shows that a large group of guys are participating. And many members are of the 'mature' variety, not just the younger guys only, in which we do have plenty of them participating also.

Just maybe with this link and continued talk and bantering, the word will get out and we can see ' localized' racing going on with the 'stock' Quickie aspect. Lets keep our fingers crossed.

Mike
Jan 16, 2020, 06:46 PM
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BARKS (Glen Spickler's home club) tried to bring back a version in the 1990's. The original kits were still available from Glen's successor, and he sold them at discount to the LHS to support the cause. We chose the OS 40FP as the standard engine, and you could buy the kit and engine for $70 at the LHS. Within about six months, we has two dozen members with planes, and at least 12 every race. We all ran from the same can of fuel, and modding the FP usually made it run slower. APC 9x7 prop was required.

This was a blast - minimal investment, easy build, and as easy to fly as any low-wing taildragger can be. Most of all, they were evenly matched. We had gauges to check wing thickness, and attempts to alter the FP40s generally slowed them down. We even had a few times when we switched planes to see if it changed anything - never found that it did. Guys were really nice about helping each other get better, and it wasn't uncommon to share a plane with someone who wanted to try. I even buddy-boxed a couple of times to give a newbie a taste of the fun. It was magic!

Then a couple of guys who wanted to compete elsewhere - and didn't want to build a plane that couldn't compete THERE - nagged the club into changing to what became 424 rules..... and we never had another Quickee race of any kind.

In today's environment, I'd take something like this and use a short two-pole course. https://www.horizonhobby.com/product...-basic-efl1850
Jan 16, 2020, 08:55 PM
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Thread OP

How Ironic !


Teachu2.... Sitting on my trophy ledge is a 2nd place finish with a BARKS sponsored quickie race, in October of 1980 @ Famoso ! This was just before my first daughter was born and my wife there in full regalia. My ride was a Spickler quickie with the graphics taken from the kit box of Spickler and a K&B .40 and a Semco 'flo-thru' muffler with my first Kraft radio, which I have and still works! Was leading the race until Ron Gilman, put the moves on me. Good racin' and good people to be around. Good times they were. I blame it all on Rusty Van Baren. My mentor.

Mike
Jan 17, 2020, 12:05 AM
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I was a college Junior then, at Sac State. That was just after the demise of F1 at Famoso, wasn't it? You were running with the fast crowd!
Jan 17, 2020, 09:06 PM
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I think it would be a great idea. An all wood Q500 can be framed in a couple evenings and covered over a weekend. I agree that the power plant would be the issue. As much as I hate to say it, I think that glow power would just get some of us " old guys " involved where electric power has the potential to attract new blood and attract more club support. It would be very easy to get a laser cutter involved to cut wing kits. This keeps everyone on s level playing field. I would be more then happy to make up a fuselage mold and sell ready to use fuselages for $75. When you figure the cost of wood, glue and covering, a wood fuselage would run $50 plus several hours of labor.
Jan 20, 2020, 09:01 AM
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Hi,
For you folks in the USA a class very close to what you are describing exists, its club 40, The airframes are all wood and available as an ARF from World models or as a builder's kit from Stegall hobbies. Stegall hobbies also sells plans for the plane. It has several available glow engines approved and operates on a 2 pole race course. You might want to check it out. For the dedicated folks, Club 40 is also raced at the US Nationals in Muncie every year.
We have a small group in Southern Ontario Canada that races EF1 on the 3 pole course. We are close enough to Muncie to race at the US nationals so we follow those rules.

Hope your plans work out.
Jan 22, 2020, 06:16 PM
DHG
DHG
Kinetic Sculptor
Personally, I think your best bet would be to copy the EF1 rules on motor, battery, prop, and everything else except the scale replica requirement. Then if you want to find a local guy to cut parts for a box fuselage/Hershey bar wing thing that can be assembled in a day or two and run on the same course as the scale ARFs, so much the better.

While I agree that the "good old days" were good, it's hard to find a reliable source for those vintage engines—especially if you want to keep them all closely matched in horsepower. The EF1 motors all run within a few rpm of each other, so races are won or lost by a couple of plane lengths. That's real racing!

Cheers,
Duane
Jan 22, 2020, 08:01 PM
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Some races are lost by mid-airs!!!
Jan 22, 2020, 10:09 PM
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I quit counting after 30.
Jan 22, 2020, 10:41 PM
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exf3bguy's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by Highplanes
I quit counting after 30.

Bob, how many with pylons?


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