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Jul 21, 2019, 07:09 PM
Free my speech
BACKEMFNRG's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mike Freas
You do realize China has a mandate for solar and EV’s right?
Yes, I do. They don't care what it takes to do that.

So what?

You do realize they don't care how many of their people they will kill to get the job done either right?


Are you ready for this? I'm not, even though it is upon me.

China’s "Social Credit System" Has Caused More Than Just Public Shaming (HBO) (5 min 45 sec)


Better

A Look Inside China’s Social Credit System | NBC News Now (8 min 7 sec)
Last edited by BACKEMFNRG; Jul 21, 2019 at 07:23 PM.
Jul 21, 2019, 07:30 PM
KK4NOP
Mike Freas's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by BACKEMFNRG
Yes, I do. They don't care what it takes to do that.

So what?

You do realize they don't care how many of their people they will kill to get the job done either right?


Are you ready for this? I'm not, even though it is upon me.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Dkw15LkZ_Kw

Better

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0cGB8dCDf3c
Textbook goal post move.

I made no arguments about China other than their solar power and EV mandates.

There is a reason they are mandating these changes.
Jul 21, 2019, 07:42 PM
Free my speech
BACKEMFNRG's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mike Freas
Textbook goal post move.

I made no arguments about China other than their solar power and EV mandates.

There is a reason they are mandating these changes.
I don't care.

China is making lots of changes. You want to follow or emulate what China does, fine.

The fact remains that they don't care about how much they are polluting the world, they only care what is best for them.

What good is clean air and EV's if you have no freedom? You think you are going to keep your freedom forever? Social credit score in North America has already started. It's in it's infancy here.
=y5-0llHaZDs

China has no real recycling plan unless it started up in the last year. They look at profit first and human cost last. They don't care if a mandate kills off million here or there, lots of people to go around.

https://www.sixthtone.com/news/10026...as-solar-boom-
Last edited by BACKEMFNRG; Jul 21, 2019 at 08:03 PM.
Jul 21, 2019, 08:01 PM
KK4NOP
Mike Freas's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by BACKEMFNRG
I don't care.

China is making lots of changes. You want to follow or emulate what China does, fine.

The fact remains that they don't care about how much they are polluting the world, they only care what is best for them.

What good is clean air and EV's if you have no freedom? You think you are going to keep your freedom forever? Social credit score in North America has already started. It's in it's infancy here.
=y5-0llHaZDs
Another goal post move.

I stated already, Iím not defending China or itís policies. I made a true statement about solar power and EVís.
Jul 21, 2019, 11:32 PM
Registered User
Sherlock's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by robogizzard

IC=fossil combustion>mechanical energy
.
Ugh, no.

IC = drill, pump, transport, refine, transport, combustion, mechanical energy. Funny how you left all that out. It is better pollution wise and more efficient to fossil-EV. Even with coal.
Jul 22, 2019, 07:06 AM
Free my speech
BACKEMFNRG's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sherlock
Ugh, no.

IC = drill, pump, transport, refine, transport, combustion, mechanical energy. Funny how you left all that out. It is better pollution wise and more efficient to fossil-EV. Even with coal.
Gasoline was originally a waste product that Rockefeller's used to dump in rivers.

https://www.attendly.com/rockefeller...-rid-of-waste/

So was the IC engine created to make money from a waste product? Looks like it. After the car took off to make the Rockefeller's filthy rich they tore up all the electric rail systems that could have been one of the greenest technologies today. Everything is going electric now no??

We started out right but Rockefeller's made a mess of the earth and leave us to clean it up, how quaint.
Jul 22, 2019, 07:55 PM
Registered User
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sherlock
Ugh, no.

IC = drill, pump, transport, refine, transport, combustion, mechanical energy. Funny how you left all that out. It is better pollution wise and more efficient to fossil-EV. Even with coal.
Oh, so you are talking about those self-sustaining power plants that produce their own fuel. I call those perpetual power plants.

Since we are talking about things that don't really exist, then yeh, EV wins every time in every way.
Jul 22, 2019, 07:57 PM
Registered User
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mike Freas
Another goal post move.

I stated already, Iím not defending China or itís policies. I made a true statement about solar power and EVís.
Solar power and EV makes sense.

And since we are talking about things that don't really exist, like perpetual power plants and adequate and reliable solar power, then the EV is the winner by far.

All day, EV is a winner.

GO EV!
Jul 23, 2019, 07:11 AM
KK4NOP
Mike Freas's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by robogizzard
Solar power and EV makes sense.

And since we are talking about things that don't really exist, like perpetual power plants and adequate and reliable solar power, then the EV is the winner by far.

All day, EV is a winner.

GO EV!
What does not exist? Solar? EV's?

You don't want to argue my point on efficiency so you post garbage like this?

How about you argue your position like an adult.
Jul 23, 2019, 08:09 AM
Registered User
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mike Freas
What does not exist? Solar? EV's?

You don't want to argue my point on efficiency so you post garbage like this?

How about you argue your position like an adult.

That's what they do....

post digressive,[1] extraneous, or off-topic messages in an online community (such as a newsgroup, forum, chat room, or blog) with the intent of provoking readers into displaying emotional responses[2] and normalizing tangential discussion.
Jul 23, 2019, 08:46 AM
Registered User
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mike Freas
What does not exist? Solar? EV's?

You don't want to argue my point on efficiency so you post garbage like this?

How about you argue your position like an adult.
Adequate solar to power a less than meaningful amount of ev does not exist.
Reliable solar that provides power at night to charge your car while you sleep does not exist.

The only thing ev are capable of is short drives and separating the combustion and load with thousands of miles of wire.

As far as efficiency, I just don't see thousands of miles of wire, numerous transformations, storage, numerous ac/DC rectifications, and all of the needed infrastructure and environmental impact to be efficient, at all.

I don't need to buy in to your fantasy.
Last edited by robogizzard; Jul 23, 2019 at 08:54 AM.
Jul 23, 2019, 09:00 AM
KK4NOP
Mike Freas's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by robogizzard
Adequate solar to power a less than meaningful amount of ev does not exist.
Reliable solar that provides power at night to charge your car while you sleep does not exist.

The only thing ev are capable of is short drives and separating the combustion and load with thousands of miles of wire.


I don't need to buy in to your fantasy.
This is one of the most ignorant post I have ever read on this forum. Seriously.

Do you do any research yourself?

Solar power exists, enough to power whole cities.

Grid scale battery storage of renewable energy exists and is working really well. Look it up.

EV's are capable of driving long distances quiet easily. Now, if you quantify that a trip will take longer due to charging than that is fair. Be specific though, if you're traveling in a Tesla that extra time is minimal. If you're driving in any other current EV than it takes a bit longer due to slower charging speed.

This is how you have a meaningful discussion like an adult. Time to grow up a bit.
Jul 23, 2019, 09:09 AM
Registered User
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mike Freas
This is one of the most ignorant post I have ever read on this forum. Seriously.

Do you do any research yourself?

Solar power exists, enough to power whole cities.

Grid scale battery storage of renewable energy exists and is working really well. Look it up.

EV's are capable of driving long distances quiet easily. Now, if you quantify that a trip will take longer due to charging than that is fair. Be specific though, if you're traveling in a Tesla that extra time is minimal. If you're driving in any other current EV than it takes a bit longer due to slower charging speed.

This is how you have a meaningful discussion like an adult. Time to grow up a bit.


Research? I helped site some of the largest solar projects in the nation, and I know how well they are working.

There is not adequate solar to power any meaningful amount of ev, much less powering cities.

Let's do some math.

Total US production by billion kwh:

Solar 63
Fossil fuels 2,651


Somehow I just don't see solar carrying much of the load. Better start peddling the EV.


I am not the one having child-like fantasies where my car is powered by a solar panel. BTW, I have lived off grid enough to know what it takes.
Jul 23, 2019, 09:09 AM
KK4NOP
Mike Freas's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by robogizzard
Adequate solar to power a less than meaningful amount of ev does not exist.
Reliable solar that provides power at night to charge your car while you sleep does not exist.

The only thing ev are capable of is short drives and separating the combustion and load with thousands of miles of wire.

As far as efficiency, I just don't see thousands of miles of wire, numerous transformations, storage, numerous ac/DC rectifications, and all of the needed infrastructure and environmental impact to be efficient, at all.

I don't need to buy in to your fantasy.
Ah, a post edit to address the efficiency piece.

So your saying that thousands of miles of wire and transformers are required for dedicated for EV charging?

There is no need for DC storage unless you want to have the ability to charge when grid power is not available.

AC/DC rectifiers are only required for DC quick charging. The additional cost is minimal and charging efficiency is about the same.

Environmental impact huh? How is EV charging, given the vast majority is at home, impacting the environment?

So you can't argue my efficiency breakdown. Got it.
Jul 23, 2019, 09:22 AM
KK4NOP
Mike Freas's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by robogizzard
Research? I helped site some of the largest solar projects in the nation, and I know how well they are working.

There is not adequate solar to power any meaningful amount of ev, much less powering cities.

Let's do some math.

Total US production by billion kwh:

Solar 63
Fossil fuels 2,651


Somehow I just don't see solar carrying much of the load. Better start peddling the EV.


I am not the one having child-like fantasies where my car is powered by a solar panel. BTW, I have lived off grid enough to know what it takes.
If you truly designed a solar farm you would have a much better understanding of how much electricity EV's require to charge and the average daily use of power used for a typical commute. I drive 90 miles per day for work. My Tesla uses 17 Kwh of electricity for this. This is just over half a gallon of gas equivalent. List any other non EV vehicle that even comes close to this.

I take back "cities" and replace it with "homes" as that is how they typically list stats of solar projects.

255k homes powered, during the day, purely by solar power is not viable?

https://albaenergy.com/biggest-solar...ts-in-america/

Now hold on a second, you keep moving the goal posts.

If you want to drive a EV off grid, then the expense changes quite a bit as you need a large solar array and battery storage. Few people do this because of the cost. Is it impossible? Not at all.

The efficiency argument, on or off grid, you made is still garbage.


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