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Aug 25, 2019, 01:28 PM
Just an earth-bound misfit
Quote:
Originally Posted by SoloProFan
Going to try build something "Toothpickish" with parts from the spare bin. I have a frame, some motors, board in transit, and have a nano camera. So looking for a light, no jello canopy, that accepts 14mm nano size cameras.
I just had to try a Toothpick type, instead of the L3. I thought about it a bit, but just felt I could fly a Toothpicky quad in more places comfortably than the larger Leader. They do give me awesome flight times, and on 2S, the Primo w/1102s and Pyro bi-blades are still faster than my 85 Whoops with the 802s and 1103s on 2S.

Whose frame, and why? Whose motors and size?? And which board did you end up choosing?

Geeze, those sound like review questions . . . ₿ↄ}
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Aug 25, 2019, 01:42 PM
Fan of just about anything RC
SoloProFan's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by Brian_OH
I just had to try a Toothpick type, instead of the L3. I thought about it a bit, but just felt I could fly a Toothpicky quad in more places comfortably than the larger Leader. They do give me awesome flight times, and on 2S, the Primo w/1102s and Pyro bi-blades are still faster than my 85 Whoops with the 802s and 1103s on 2S.

Whose frame, and why? Whose motors and size?? And which board did you end up choosing?

Geeze, those sound like review questions . . . ₿ↄ}

I got a Kabab frame, with all the screws, board is going to be from NamelessRC, and I was hoping to give some Revenger 55 motors a second life, these are 1103 11000kv. I was considering the Larva canopy, it seems light, no TPU, so possibly less prone to jello, and will be available from many sources. The Kabab frame, with shipping, already went quite a lot in the direction of a Sailfly-X, shipped. Frame and props was about 22 USD, shipping, cheapest option, about 11 USD. So I was hoping to source the remaining parts from somewhere else, and stop sponsoring shipping companies.
Latest blog entry: For the love of the hobby!
Aug 26, 2019, 02:07 AM
Just an earth-bound misfit
Quote:
Originally Posted by SoloProFan
I got a Kabab frame, with all the screws, board is going to be from NamelessRC, and I was hoping to give some Revenger 55 motors a second life, these are 1103 11000kv. I was considering the Larva canopy, it seems light, no TPU, so possibly less prone to jello, and will be available from many sources. The Kabab frame, with shipping, already went quite a lot in the direction of a Sailfly-X, shipped. Frame and props was about 22 USD, shipping, cheapest option, about 11 USD. So I was hoping to source the remaining parts from somewhere else, and stop sponsoring shipping companies.
I grabbed a Kabab Toothpick kit when I stumbled onto it in stock when I was checking out his site one night. I was also looking at the Gnarly Primo, and must have left a window up on the puter, my son saw it, and ordered me one for Dad's Day. Was the 110x version though for the 4 hole motors. I ordered a JMT T85 kit from Xinte to use those parts for a Primo, and pre-ordered an 080x Primo from Gnarly with the 3 holes for the HM motors. Saw it in stock at another US store before Gnarly got their own in, and ordered one from them too.

Not taking anything away from the dentist, but the Primo kit blows the Kababpick away . . . It is extremely well thought out, and all the parts and pieces are there to make a very well built "factory" looking Pick. I'll keep the Kapick frame, but am in no hurry to put one together. The one advantage I did see with it, it can mount a "regular" style Whoop canopy to it, so you do have a ton of options there. The Primo canopy mounts with two bolts into their "jelly" mount with brass looking inserts on the frame, front to back, just a little bigger than the board screws front to back, and no way to screw it down from the side to side.

Your 1103s should get that little lightweight cranking pretty good. Hope you're planning on posting some flight vids with that when you get it built, and if you have the time, about your build, and what you think about that too.
Aug 26, 2019, 03:11 AM
Fan of just about anything RC
SoloProFan's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by Brian_OH

Your 1103s should get that little lightweight cranking pretty good. Hope you're planning on posting some flight vids with that when you get it built, and if you have the time, about your build, and what you think about that too.

I will definitely document and make videos if there is some result worth reporting.

The KK canopy would be an option, though there is no option to tilt the camera, or fit a nano size.
Latest blog entry: For the love of the hobby!
Aug 26, 2019, 07:11 AM
Registered User
Quote:
Originally Posted by Brian_OH
I just had to try a Toothpick type, instead of the L3. I thought about it a bit, but just felt I could fly a Toothpicky quad in more places comfortably than the larger Leader. They do give me awesome flight times, and on 2S, the Primo w/1102s and Pyro bi-blades are still faster than my 85 Whoops with the 802s and 1103s on 2S.

Whose frame, and why? Whose motors and size?? And which board did you end up choosing?

Geeze, those sound like review questions . . . ₿ↄ}
I have a KabbobFPV Toothpick frame but honestly for a few extra bucks get the GnarlyFPV "Primo" frame. It's by far the best Toothpick frame out there. Better canopy protection, soft mounted FC, recessed holes for flush mounted motor screws antenna routing holes adjustable camera mount. It really is the best option available. I'm using the Nameless RC 12A board and it's been great so far. Happymodel 1103 8000kv motors on the Primo 80x frame. The happymodel motors 1103's are the worst performing in this class so you might consider some others. Regarding leads dont come pre-soldered on the AIO FCD's this is important if the leads are soldered on the topside of the board you wont be able to mount it flush on the bottom so you can access the FC USB port. Drawbacks of the Primo frame. Prone to Jello (probabbly due to props). Limited space. It's a tight squeeze so you will have to probabbly recut and solder your wires. I have two of them one was a trashcan swap very easy straight forward swap the other was all out micro beast. GEPRC 12a, Eachnine Nano VTX, RunCam Nano, 1104 6000kv.

Other note dont get the 802'-803 skip right to the 1102's 1103's. And Make sure you get motors that have a 1.5mm shaft the 1mm shaft bend and are not quite as durable.

With all that being said. This toothpick sits on the shelf because it's not nearly as much fun as my 3" Sanchez "Toothpick" It's night and day between the two. my 3" has way more power, more prop / battery options, better flying characteristics just more fun to fly. The Tootpick is really just great front yard, small park flyer. I think everyone needs one but it's WAY OVER HYPED! There are a bunch of AWESOME FLYING 2" Quads out there. The biggest benefit of these toothpicks are its ultralight, ultra nimble, very quite and performs exceptionally well for what it is.

Anyone have a recommendation on Toothpick Props? I have a LOT OF JELLO with the Pyrodrone blue/orange props and they seem to be a pretty loose fit. NOT recommended. Hoping to get rid of the jello.
Aug 26, 2019, 11:37 AM
aka KF7DS
Quote:
Originally Posted by Fidy$Trainer
I have a KabbobFPV Toothpick frame but honestly for a few extra bucks get the GnarlyFPV "Primo" frame. It's by far the best Toothpick frame out there. Better canopy protection, soft mounted FC, recessed holes for flush mounted motor screws antenna routing holes adjustable camera mount. It really is the best option available. I'm using the Nameless RC 12A board and it's been great so far. Happymodel 1103 8000kv motors on the Primo 80x frame. The happymodel motors 1103's are the worst performing in this class so you might consider some others. Regarding leads dont come pre-soldered on the AIO FCD's this is important if the leads are soldered on the topside of the board you wont be able to mount it flush on the bottom so you can access the FC USB port. Drawbacks of the Primo frame. Prone to Jello (probabbly due to props). Limited space. It's a tight squeeze so you will have to probabbly recut and solder your wires. I have two of them one was a trashcan swap very easy straight forward swap the other was all out micro beast. GEPRC 12a, Eachnine Nano VTX, RunCam Nano, 1104 6000kv.

Other note dont get the 802'-803 skip right to the 1102's 1103's. And Make sure you get motors that have a 1.5mm shaft the 1mm shaft bend and are not quite as durable.

With all that being said. This toothpick sits on the shelf because it's not nearly as much fun as my 3" Sanchez "Toothpick" It's night and day between the two. my 3" has way more power, more prop / battery options, better flying characteristics just more fun to fly. The Tootpick is really just great front yard, small park flyer. I think everyone needs one but it's WAY OVER HYPED! There are a bunch of AWESOME FLYING 2" Quads out there. The biggest benefit of these toothpicks are its ultralight, ultra nimble, very quite and performs exceptionally well for what it is.

Anyone have a recommendation on Toothpick Props? I have a LOT OF JELLO with the Pyrodrone blue/orange props and they seem to be a pretty loose fit. NOT recommended. Hoping to get rid of the jello.
Love my Primo builds but completely agree with you on their downsides....One other downside of the Primo frame is the battery holder...that has to be rethought as it comes apart too easily. With regard to props...try the HQ bi-blades.....I have had good luck with those.

Solo...do you have a 3D printer or a source? Here is a great tpu canopy that does not produce any jello....

https://www.thingiverse.com/thing:3640675/files

It's the 14mm pod in the list of files...

The best toothpick I have so far is a re-built Red Devil...put the above 14mm canopy on, a Runcam Nano2, and an AXII shorty antenna....get great range with the built in spi rx (150-200m).....it is a keeper as it has great video and flight characteristics.

My newest Toothpick will include the above canopy and video bits, 1102/8000kv motors (a 2s build), Crazybee 2s board (v 2.0) and a Calimero frame printed in PETG....never flown a 3D printed frame before
Aug 26, 2019, 12:15 PM
Just an earth-bound misfit
I didn't notice any "jello" effect with Pyro props on the pos Eos camera, and they fit pretty tight on the HM 1102 motors w/1.5mm shafts. It flies pretty fast for me, seems faster than my 85 Whoop with the Skystars 1103/11kvs. I get a solid 8+ minutes, pushing 9 on my 32g Gensace 520 2S, using a JST to XT30 adapter too. That's flying it faster than my Whoops, with a bunch of full throttle runs up & down the street a flight. It also takes off instantly when I nail the throttle . . .

I put together another 85 Whoop with the HM 802/16kvs. On 2S, there's not much difference in speed or punch compared to the bigger Skystars, at least with the Cyclone 4 blade props on that. Gets better flight times than the Mobula, noticeably faster too. The 802s have the 1mm shafts, but are protected by the ducts. It does OK on 1S, top end is still a bit faster, but doesn't have the instant punch like on 2S.

The 802s are almost double the kv of my 1102s, and are double your 1103s. They spin up the 4 blade KKs with no problem, and give me good flight times. I'm putting a set on my other Primo frame, and try them on both 1S & 2S. The 65mm props that came with the Primo are 1mm holes, so will try those first. I wouldn't think they'd have a problem spinning those up. I get great flight times on my Whoops running 802s, and am expecting even better on the Primo.

Quote:
Originally Posted by SoloProFan
I will definitely document and make videos if there is some result worth reporting.

The KK canopy would be an option, though there is no option to tilt the camera, or fit a nano size.
The KK canopy was the first one I grabbed to show a "standard" Whoop canopy will bolt right up on the Kababpick frame. I have a couple URUAV, Eachine Country type canopies that do have the adjustable camera angle, and the Mobula and Can canopies are adjustable too. That is one advantage of the Kabab frame, you have a ton of canopy choices to choose from.

One drawback with the Primo canopy. once you get the camera bolted on, there's not a lot of room for anything else. It is a perfect fit for the EOs, and the Nano, and the small size Mobula AIO cam is suppose to fit too. The canopy does have an easily adjustable tilt.

I've seen a lot of vids of people's Kababpicks, and the quad looks really good, and flies great, better than I can fly. I just like the Gnarly kit better, more complete right outta the package. I have no doubt yours will turn out fine. Thought I remember some flight vids of yours with a ?? Sailfly ?? so you already know how they fly. These seem pretty fast to me, but are probably pretty tame for you with all the review vids I've seen of yours with those 3" rockets you fly and have reviewed.
Aug 26, 2019, 12:55 PM
Fan of just about anything RC
SoloProFan's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by Brian_OH
The KK canopy was the first one I grabbed to show a "standard" Whoop canopy will bolt right up on the Kababpick frame. I have a couple URUAV, Eachine Country type canopies that do have the adjustable camera angle, and the Mobula and Can canopies are adjustable too. That is one advantage of the Kabab frame, you have a ton of canopy choices to choose from.

One drawback with the Primo canopy. once you get the camera bolted on, there's not a lot of room for anything else. It is a perfect fit for the EOs, and the Nano, and the small size Mobula AIO cam is suppose to fit too. The canopy does have an easily adjustable tilt.

I've seen a lot of vids of people's Kababpicks, and the quad looks really good, and flies great, better than I can fly. I just like the Gnarly kit better, more complete right outta the package. I have no doubt yours will turn out fine. Thought I remember some flight vids of yours with a ?? Sailfly ?? so you already know how they fly. These seem pretty fast to me, but are probably pretty tame for you with all the review vids I've seen of yours with those 3" rockets you fly and have reviewed.

Thanks for reminding me of the URUAV/Eachine series, I have a few of these brushed QX65, would like to keep one going just for nostalgia's sake, but I could take apart one for donating canopy and maybe even camera. Although I wonder if these would hold 14mm nano camera too.

I have a Sailfly-X, and it's really zippy, haven't seen anything corner that fast and solid, and still have 3 minutes on a 2S 300mAh going all out. Just looking for something that is similarly zippy, but a little better specs, like VTX and receiver wise. And re-use some parts from older quads that could work out well. Like the Revenger 55 motors, the quad was too heavy for it's props, but the 1103 motors run really smoothly, they just zing, no rattle or other rough sounds.
Latest blog entry: For the love of the hobby!
Aug 26, 2019, 01:59 PM
Registered User
quad66's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by Fidy$Trainer
Anyone have a recommendation on Toothpick Props? I have a LOT OF JELLO with the Pyrodrone blue/orange props and they seem to be a pretty loose fit. NOT recommended. Hoping to get rid of the jello.

Props: 65 mm bi-blades for 1S and ultra-light 2S (13 min 57 sec)


Iíve found the Whocares 65mm biblade pressons to be the smoothest followed by the HQ. Results vary though from prop to prop. I recommend spinning them up in beta flight one by one to find the offending prop and changing it out.
Aug 26, 2019, 02:16 PM
Registered User
I'm using the Hulky 2540 tri's on 1104's 6000kv and they are great prop on my other toothpick. Handles great and flight times are typically around 3m on 2s. But I think they are going to be way too aggressive on 1103 8000kv right on 2s?

I was looking at some reviews and it looks like the Whocare 65mm are a great option. I'll have to check those out.
Aug 26, 2019, 02:34 PM
Registered User
JustPlaneChris's Avatar
I run Hulky 2540 or Avan Rush (also a 2.5") on 1103 8000kv motors without issue.
The biggest differences you will find when going from a good 65mm prop like the Whocares to a 3 blade are:

1. Flight time. The 65mm will get much longer flights
2. Noise. The 65mm props are noisy little buggers
3. Handling feel. It's hard to describe, but if I had to use a word for the way the 65mm props handle it's "greasy", and the quad seems to slide through turns and have a more flowy feel. The 3 blade props are more locked in, with a rigid "right now" feeling to it. Like I say, it's hard to describe but very noticeable.

I have a couple of otherwise identical quads that I keep 65mm on one, Avans on the other and fly whichever one suits my mood at the time.

Chris
Aug 26, 2019, 06:56 PM
sircrashalot
Finished up my printed Microblivion2 . It is a lot heavier than I initially expected but flies really good with the Hypetrain Dab's on 3s. It does have a fatal flaw though, the jello is horrible. I'm using a micro swift and a canopy that I think is the culprit. I am going to try to print the canopy out of petg and see if I can get rid of it.
Aug 27, 2019, 01:22 AM
Just an earth-bound misfit
Quote:
Originally Posted by SoloProFan
Thanks for reminding me of the URUAV/Eachine series, I have a few of these brushed QX65, would like to keep one going just for nostalgia's sake, but I could take apart one for donating canopy and maybe even camera. Although I wonder if these would hold 14mm nano camera too.

I have a Sailfly-X, and it's really zippy, haven't seen anything corner that fast and solid, and still have 3 minutes on a 2S 300mAh going all out. Just looking for something that is similarly zippy, but a little better specs, like VTX and receiver wise. And re-use some parts from older quads that could work out well. Like the Revenger 55 motors, the quad was too heavy for it's props, but the 1103 motors run really smoothly, they just zing, no rattle or other rough sounds.
Was that your vid with the Sailfly doing slaloms through a parking lot, pretty quick too???

I haven't used the URUAV/Snapper canopies yet. Originally got them to try to fit an AKK AIO, but just messin with it and the cam, it wouldn't fit. The AKKs are 19/20mm wide though. That separate front nose piece looks like it would fit a 14x14. . .

Your 1103 motors should do great on the Kababpick. I put together an 85 Whoop with Skystars 1103/11kvs that are 1,2 & 3S. I got my 5 pack of 2" Avan Blur tri-blades in too. Those are a really wide and aggressive looking prop. It flew great on those, a ton of punch and Toothpicky flight times on 2S. A bush stole one when I flew by, just got one set to try, and switched it to Cyclone 2" 4 blades. Those motors have no problem spinning up either of them, but the Avans just blow away every other prop I've tried on it.

The HM 1102/9kvs on the Primo are good and fast, like your Sailfly, but do have a different feel than the 1103s. Yea, I know it's a Whoop vs a Pick, but the 1103s feel different, smooth is a good description. That little bit bigger seems to make a major difference. I think the Whoop with the Avans is as fast as the lighter Primo. You should get awesome flight times with your 1103s too, and have enough power to run any prop you want on that frame. That setup seems like it will be noticeably different than your Sailfly, and also be what you're looking to build.
Aug 27, 2019, 08:22 AM
Registered User
Quote:
Originally Posted by JustPlaneChris
I run Hulky 2540 or Avan Rush (also a 2.5") on 1103 8000kv motors without issue.
The biggest differences you will find when going from a good 65mm prop like the Whocares to a 3 blade are:

1. Flight time. The 65mm will get much longer flights
2. Noise. The 65mm props are noisy little buggers
3. Handling feel. It's hard to describe, but if I had to use a word for the way the 65mm props handle it's "greasy", and the quad seems to slide through turns and have a more flowy feel. The 3 blade props are more locked in, with a rigid "right now" feeling to it. Like I say, it's hard to describe but very noticeable.

I have a couple of otherwise identical quads that I keep 65mm on one, Avans on the other and fly whichever one suits my mood at the time.

Chris
That's good to know. I know exactly what you mean about the bi blades compared to tri's . I just swapped over on my 3" from the HQ's 3x2 to the HQ 3x3x3 and it flies much mored dialed in.

I'm going to swap over to the 2540's then on my Primo with 1103's 8000kv. I have no idea how many amps it's going to draw though sounds pretty aggressive. I dont want to burn anything out. Which FC are you using and what batteries? I'm assuming a 12a FC with 2S only. Do the motor's get hot?


Can someone share their PID's on BF 4.x I was using Kababa's PID's but I dont think he was running BF 4.x and my motors were getting pretty hot then I swapped over to the BF Community tunes which are worse. I'm running a pretty typical TP Build. GnarlyFPV Primo frame, 1103's 8000kv , Nameless RC 12a FC BF 4.0.4 65mm pyrodrone props but going to swap to Hulky 2540's.

I had a flyaway yesterday:
This was a first for me. I typically fly the 2S GNB 450's on 65mm props but I had a couple of 3s GNB 350's. So I put them on my Primo and once I armed it took off like a bat of out hell. I had to hit the disarm switch when it was about 50ft while trying to figure out what was going on. First time that's happened but have heard about it running BF4.0 . Obviously those pre-configured tunes arnt all that great for 3S 2" Toothpick. What's weird is the the NamelessRC 12A FC it comes with BF 4.0.4 which is pretty current and the fly away issues I believe was supposed to be resolved in 4.0.2
Aug 27, 2019, 08:41 AM
Registered User
All these newer versions of betaflight have always enable air mode turned on by default. Make sure your turn that bs off and assign it to a switch because itll cause some weird issues too when arming / taking off if youre not careful.


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