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Mar 05, 2019, 05:57 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by brokenenglish
Howard, I think that's why Pat used the term "modified", which I took to mean an approximation to allow hexadecimal counting.
Mind you, it could be that I just didn't understand (again...).
That's exactly it, BE.
I did consider taking it one stage further with 16 stones per CWT (For the colonials & younger Brits - CWT is the abbreviation for hundredweight which is 7 stones or 112lb ) but decided that once my colleagues sussed converting stages they would progress to the 4th if they really grasped the principle - which I was pleased to see they did. In fact they were took octal in their stride in a later part of the course.
BTW this was a telecoms course in the late '70's or early '80's as the old electro-mechanical Strowger switching systems were being replaced by processor controlled ones.
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Mar 05, 2019, 07:06 AM
I like real wooden aeroplanes!
Sundancer's Avatar
Er - 2 stones = 1 quarter, 4 quarters (i.e. 8 stones) = 112 pounds = 1 cwt. Sorry Pat, couldn't resist that!
Mar 05, 2019, 07:29 AM
So I'M meant to be in control?
Colonel Blink's Avatar
Ah, but don't forget that 24 newpapers = 1 quire.......
Mar 05, 2019, 07:44 AM
'Douglas' to his friends.
Thread OP
Almost.! 24 sheets of newspaper (or any other format...). Twenty quires make up one ream (of paper...).
Mar 05, 2019, 08:33 AM
I like real wooden aeroplanes!
Sundancer's Avatar
I think it might be time to offer a course in "Traditional units of Measurement" guys in view of the fact we seem to be suffering from the "minus one" syndrome. 20 quires = 1 ream is OK, but back in pre-history when I was at school a quire had 25 sheets not 24 so a ream is 500 sheets. Or was the Colonel trying to wind us up and succeeded in blind siding Douglas?
Mar 05, 2019, 08:37 AM
So I'M meant to be in control?
Colonel Blink's Avatar
Nope - 24 newspapers. Newspapers use 24 to a quire, whereas 'flat' paper is 25 to a quire.

The reason I am so certain is that I am the first generation in 4 of Blinks not to work in the print - in fact Blink Snr was Father of the Chapel* for the Sunday Telegraph in Fleet Street for over 30 years. I occasionally used to do a Saturday night delivery round to some of the London mainline stations in the 1980s; the papers were always measured in quires of 24 and half quires of 12.




*SoGAT shop steward
Last edited by Colonel Blink; Mar 05, 2019 at 01:21 PM. Reason: Added footnote
Mar 05, 2019, 08:46 AM
I like real wooden aeroplanes!
Sundancer's Avatar
Now there you are, you see how much useful (-less) information one can pick up here! So the newspaper quire was different from the normal quire of paper in the same way - but opposite direction - as the baker's dozen differed from the normal dozen. It also turns out that a quire of hand made paper can be 24 sheets. Just shows how quaint and fascinating this stuff is, much more interesting than boring old "everything is 10 times the last thing"! But maybe we should stop now before Gene becomes really confused!
Mar 05, 2019, 01:57 PM
Registered User
Coming back to toy planes;
wing spans are in ...inches
diesel engine capacity is in CC (! not very British)
glo' (American) engine capacity is in cubic inches ...
Anyway, I agree with Sundancer. The decimalisation was the beginning of the decline (in Britain) for several reasons:
1. One 'new penny' was equivalent to 2.4 'old pennies'. So within no time at all we had had a price inflation of 240% for small puchases, i.e. yer bag of sweets cost yer 6 new pence instead of 6d! (6 old pennies)
2. The old system was more practical; The pound (20 shillings)could be divided by 2, 4, 5 ( two shillings or one florin, an early attempt at decimalisation) or 20. The shilling ( 12 pennies) could be divided by 2, 3, 4 and 6. Since we had coins for all most of values the weight of the lucre in your pocket was much reduced. The present Euro decimal system weighs a ton in small change and is horrible to use and all my pockets have holes!!!
3. Old counting and measurement systems were not haphazard; they where based on practical usage and often on geometrical proportions found in 'nature'.
The decimal system is digital, i.e. "fingers"...
Mar 05, 2019, 02:27 PM
'Douglas' to his friends.
Thread OP
Quote:
Originally Posted by nickharp
...The decimal system is digital, i.e. "fingers"...
Digital, but doesn't have to be decimal. If binary had been adoted, one could count up to 1024 with just fingers and thumbs..! As for airplane measures... I often see folks asking for plans for a '60' sized 'plane or similar. I've come to understand (I think, and it took a long time...) that this refers to an engine size (in whatever units engines are sized...), but, as an electric 'flyer', it doesn't tell me much about how big or small a 'plane is, when using these terms. Wingspan, yes (in inches or cms; I can take either...), but '60' sized (or '25', or '15' or...)..? Head-scratching time.
Mar 07, 2019, 03:17 AM
Registered User
While reading the last dozen or score (of) posts, I forgot which thread I was on (in)...
Mar 07, 2019, 03:54 AM
I like real wooden aeroplanes!
Sundancer's Avatar
Well yes kk, that's true, but look how much wiser (or, to quote Churchill, "vastly better informed") you are - I bet you didn't know that there were 24 not 25 in a quire of newspapers! Any way, it is all part of a cunning plan to deflect attention from Dad's progress with the Motor Tutor so that we will all be amazed when he suddenly reveals an almost complete model!
Mar 07, 2019, 05:28 AM
'Douglas' to his friends.
Thread OP
Would that it be so..! No, I'm plodding along, but slowly; oh, so slowly. Nevertheless, here's 'progress' so far...
The first longerons are pinned in place...



... and preparations for a wing layout are ongoing, with 3mm hardwood spars...



The 'soldiers' are waiting patiently their turn to spring into action. Meanwhile, a pair of root ribs have been formed, using the same 'printed' templates...



They're very thick. I don't know why, but I'm doing what it says on the plan just the same. Normally I'd have made 'em from ply, but I had the balsa on hand, so...
The red template has been 'printed' so as to make the series of ribs for the outer panels, which taper. I have to liberate the root ribs first, though, to re-use one of the blue templates. I still have the LE 'fish-mouth' notches to cut, probably this afternoon.
There, now we're all up to date. More later, I hope, as the fuselage sticks get glued up...
Mar 07, 2019, 08:37 PM
'Douglas' to his friends.
Thread OP

... and here they are ...


Almost a 'blow by blow' account. The flank uprights are cut and glued in...



... then, when the Titebond is set, the diagonals put in place ...



Leaving those to set, I turn to a wing panel. The TE is notched, with a 'Bruce' saw, after a guide cut is made, for better accuracy.. Here's the saw in place, with a rib to illustrate the nice fit of the notch. My 'Bruce' saw has two blades at one end, and three at t'other, to be able to notch two different widths. This is the 'two-blade' cut, for 1.5mm ribs...



A dry fitting session, to be sure it'll all go together ...



... followed by 'the real thing', with the 'soldiers doing a fine job of holding the ribs true...



I must say that I'm modestly pleased with these 'soldiers', as well as the rib templates. Much better than the Lego bricks, which are fine in themselves, but the clamping has always been an opportunity for extra clumsiness, as they need manipulation in a tight space, not my speciality. These 'soldiers' are simply placed over the rib, and do the same job.
Meanwhile, the first fuselage flank is ready for duplication. A transparent film is carefully put in place, without disturbing the first part, and a second pair of longerons pinned down. The uprights follow, over the lower flank ...



I'll leave that to set overnight, and add the diagonals to the upper flank tomorrow. I shall also see about making the tapered ribs; that'll be fun.
More tomorrow then, hopefully ...
Mar 08, 2019, 04:00 AM
I like real wooden aeroplanes!
Sundancer's Avatar
Good session there Douglas, lots of progress achieved!
Mar 09, 2019, 04:33 AM
Registered User
rchopper56's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sundancer
Now there you are, you see how much useful (-less) information one can pick up here! So the newspaper quire was different from the normal quire of paper in the same way - but opposite direction - as the baker's dozen differed from the normal dozen. It also turns out that a quire of hand made paper can be 24 sheets. Just shows how quaint and fascinating this stuff is, much more interesting than boring old "everything is 10 times the last thing"! But maybe we should stop now before Gene becomes really confused!
You British are a funny lot and make for great entertainment.
Gene


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