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Nov 22, 2018, 05:07 AM
TBY
TBY
Registered User
Thread OP
Question

Mystique elevator


Hi,
Got a vintage sailplane missing an elevator.
I would like to check the option to use Mystique elevator.
Can anyone share Mystique elevator drawings/ size / metal rods size and location ?
Thanks
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Nov 22, 2018, 12:18 PM
B for Bruce
BMatthews's Avatar
Likely easier to post a picture of your vintage sailplane if you don't know what it is. With a name for it you could do a search for the actual plan at Outerzone or generally online.
Nov 25, 2018, 10:30 AM
TBY
TBY
Registered User
Thread OP
Thanks,
My vintage glider is Simprop Optima F3B and I know its elevator size/drawing.
I'm trying to find an existing sailplane monoblock elevator spare part with a similar size.
Nov 25, 2018, 03:33 PM
B for Bruce
BMatthews's Avatar
You're making it hard for anyone to help you though. Only those who may have or had an Optima would know the shape and size. And only those with both an Optima AND a Mystique would be able to tell you if the monoblock would be suitable. That's likely to be a pretty small group.

If you give us pics of the unit and key sizes for parts those with something similar can measure what they have and offer it up if it's something that seems like it would fit or is close and could be easily modified.

When I do a search for images for the Optima I get back a T tail model. When I do the same for the Mystique I get back that it's from E-Flite and is a mid fin mounted stabilizer. So unless this is the wrong result I really can't see the tail from one fitting the mounts for the other.
Nov 26, 2018, 01:50 AM
Registered User
scirocco's Avatar
Hope these help
Nov 26, 2018, 04:31 AM
TBY
TBY
Registered User
Thread OP
Thanks all,
I wasnt looking for FFF (form fit function), just a shortcut for building from scratch.
SCIROCCO, is the front rod is 5mm diameter?
Thanks again
Nov 26, 2018, 06:10 AM
Registered User
scirocco's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by TBY
Thanks all,
I wasnt looking for FFF (form fit function), just a shortcut for building from scratch.
SCIROCCO, is the front rod is 5mm diameter?
Thanks again
Not sure. I'll check next time in the shed tomorrow
Nov 26, 2018, 06:29 AM
TBY
TBY
Registered User
Thread OP
Tnx
Nov 26, 2018, 03:46 PM
B for Bruce
BMatthews's Avatar
It could have saved some time if you had simply asked for ideas for plans for new surfaces in the first place.

My first thought was to suggest you just build the stabilator surfaces from a Sagitta 900. But that one has swept surfaces. So instead you may want to find a stabilator plan for guidance from a list which you can shop through to find something suitable that you like.

https://outerzone.co.uk/advanced/sea...dex.asp?page=1

That SHOULD take you to the Outerzone tag search page with the left hand boxes in green for "rc" and "glider". If it goes to the default for you then click on the left hand boxes for RC and Glider to make them green and click on the middle boxes for anything else that is green or red. You will get back 476 plans which you can scan through rapidly by looking at the thumbnails. Find one with a similar shape tail to what you're after. Note that there are also a fair number of similar size T tail gliders in the listings if you search through the whole lot of them.

Just one more hint. Since the Optima is a T tail any excess weight up high can put a lot of whipping loads into the fin. It's a stout model for sure. But it would not hurt to stack the deck in your favor by selecting a build option that is going to come out fairly light. And that means you should skip right past any all sheet options and go for the built up versions. Built up and sheeted is OK if you use lighter wood. But any of the simple ones with solid sheet surfaces is going to come out fairly heavy unless you use VERY carefully chosen light stock.

Best of luck with this restoration.
Nov 26, 2018, 06:34 PM
Sagitta Fanboy
Quote:
Originally Posted by BMatthews
It could have saved some time if you had simply asked for ideas for plans for new surfaces in the first place.

My first thought was to suggest you just build the stabilator surfaces from a Sagitta 900. But that one has swept surfaces. So instead you may want to find a stabilator plan for guidance from a list which you can shop through to find something suitable that you like.

https://outerzone.co.uk/advanced/sea...dex.asp?page=1

That SHOULD take you to the Outerzone tag search page with the left hand boxes in green for "rc" and "glider". If it goes to the default for you then click on the left hand boxes for RC and Glider to make them green and click on the middle boxes for anything else that is green or red. You will get back 476 plans which you can scan through rapidly by looking at the thumbnails. Find one with a similar shape tail to what you're after. Note that there are also a fair number of similar size T tail gliders in the listings if you search through the whole lot of them.

Just one more hint. Since the Optima is a T tail any excess weight up high can put a lot of whipping loads into the fin. It's a stout model for sure. But it would not hurt to stack the deck in your favor by selecting a build option that is going to come out fairly light. And that means you should skip right past any all sheet options and go for the built up versions. Built up and sheeted is OK if you use lighter wood. But any of the simple ones with solid sheet surfaces is going to come out fairly heavy unless you use VERY carefully chosen light stock.

Best of luck with this restoration.
I'd suggest the tail surfaces for the Cumic Plus, Adante or Sapphire. They're basically the same design, improved over the Sagitta 900 and very readily adaptable to span/area and rod spacing requirements. Unlike the Sagitta 900 they're also intended for a forward pivot (on the Sagitta the tail surfaces are an unusual rear-pivot design required by the sweepback).

I know the Cumic & Adante drawings are on Outerzone.
Nov 28, 2018, 10:02 AM
TBY
TBY
Registered User
Thread OP
Thanks a lot for your detailed replies.
I'm looking for a glider elevator that I can buy online (replacement part).
It's characters: monoblock, around or above 550 cm^2 (85 in^2), forward pivot, and preferably 3mm diameter front rod (pivot).
I was hoping mystique elevator will fit.
The size is OK, the front rod seems to be larger.
If I won't find something else, I'll modify this elevator to fit my needs.
Tal
Nov 28, 2018, 10:47 AM
Sagitta Fanboy
Quote:
Originally Posted by TBY
Thanks a lot for your detailed replies.
I'm looking for a glider elevator that I can buy online (replacement part).
It's characters: monoblock, around or above 550 cm^2 (85 in^2), forward pivot, and preferably 3mm diameter front rod (pivot).
I was hoping mystique elevator will fit.
The size is OK, the front rod seems to be larger.
If I won't find something else, I'll modify this elevator to fit my needs.
Tal
I'd just build one based on the construction of the Cumic/Adante stab.

It'll be a quick build, probably as fast as modifying.
Nov 29, 2018, 02:51 AM
B for Bruce
BMatthews's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by TBY
Thanks a lot for your detailed replies.
I'm looking for a glider elevator that I can buy online (replacement part).
It's characters: monoblock, around or above 550 cm^2 (85 in^2), forward pivot, and preferably 3mm diameter front rod (pivot).
I was hoping mystique elevator will fit.
The size is OK, the front rod seems to be larger.
If I won't find something else, I'll modify this elevator to fit my needs.
Tal
There is absolutely no standard for spacing between the pivot rod and the actuating rod or rod sizes out there. And on top of that to find a stabilator that is also the same root chord. So the chances of finding a replacement that directly fits is somewhere between slim to nil.

Just build one based on the plans or try to advertise for someone's stabilators off a crashed Optima. That's really your only chance.
Nov 29, 2018, 03:12 AM
Registered User
scirocco's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by TBY
Thanks all,
I wasnt looking for FFF (form fit function), just a shortcut for building from scratch.
SCIROCCO, is the front rod is 5mm diameter?
Thanks again
Yes, 5mm
Nov 29, 2018, 03:13 AM
TBY
TBY
Registered User
Thread OP
Thanks
Good idea, looking for a "survivor" elevator ..


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