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Apr 13, 2018, 07:15 PM
The Detritus of Rcgroups
rdwoebke's Avatar
Alert

AMA is again encouraging us to write/call our congressional representatives


http://www.modelaircraft.org/aboutama/protect336.aspx


Ryan
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Apr 13, 2018, 08:42 PM
I'm not the pivot man
So .... if 336 is repealed will we need AMA at all?
Last edited by FusterCluck; Apr 13, 2018 at 09:01 PM. Reason: word correction
Apr 13, 2018, 08:54 PM
The Detritus of Rcgroups
rdwoebke's Avatar
Not sure what you are asking, mr Cluck. By appealed do you mean repealed/removed?


Ryan
Apr 13, 2018, 09:00 PM
I'm not the pivot man
Crap ... sorry, yeah I meant repealed or basically nulled and removed from the FARs.
Apr 13, 2018, 09:07 PM
Sagitta Fanboy
Quote:
Originally Posted by FusterCluck
So .... if 336 is repealed will we need AMA at all?
That would depend on the FAA. They could require Part 107, they could treat like an ultralight, they could go forward with the current ruleset.
Apr 13, 2018, 09:08 PM
The Detritus of Rcgroups
rdwoebke's Avatar
“Need” is a strong word. I believe the AMA will be important to us model aviation enthusiasts regardless of how this particular situation turns out.


Ryan
Apr 14, 2018, 08:54 AM
I'm not the pivot man
Ryan ... actually I think that AMA will become even less relevant. Remember it is only relevant to those that want to compete or those that have no choice and must join in order to have a place to fly. AMA members have a habit of believing the hobby revolves around AMA and this simply is not correct. Only a very small section of the hobby pilots in this country have anything to do with AMA and the bulk of them belong for the above two listed reasons. I drive past several houses weekly that have parents and kids flying HH products in their fields. I guarantee you, they will likely never be AMA members. No value in it for them and that is the case for the bulk of the hobby pilots in this country.

In the end, the regulations and technologies will be such that CBO membership will be unnecessary. We will all be defined as hobby use ( us ), private use ( farmer with MR ) or commercial use ( Amazon ). What creates that definition to a great degree will be the technology used and how it is used.

What is a bit of a gray area at present is how to deal with FPV and its ilk and when does FPV move from hobby to 107. That is the clincher and it may well be in the future FPV technology will be used to determine this. As a hobbyist there would be an altitude and range limit set for FPV via onboard technology. Go to the next step and you are in perhaps Private use or Commercial use and would require some form of testing and licensing.
Last edited by FusterCluck; Apr 14, 2018 at 09:02 AM. Reason: wording
Apr 14, 2018, 10:16 AM
Windy City Flyer
Brian Kloft's Avatar
I think it would be great if there was sepration between FPV (drones, quadcopters) and the rest of the hobby population. However that has not happened and I see nothing headed in that direction. That means we will be sucked in to the same dark hole... We need the AMA and all they provide to keep 336 and everythng else we enjoy.

If not then that innocent family in the park will be arrested in the future for thier activities, and we will all be looking for a new hobby...

Brian
Apr 14, 2018, 11:37 AM
Registered User

petition


Presumably, all you guys have signed, as I did.

JDK
Apr 14, 2018, 12:00 PM
The Detritus of Rcgroups
rdwoebke's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by FusterCluck
Only a very small section of the hobby pilots in this country have anything to do with AMA
It has always been that way and in my opinion should be that way/that is OK. The AMA at its most basic level is a member driven service and education organization. All AMA members serve differently of course.

Quote:
Originally Posted by FusterCluck
I drive past several houses weekly that have parents and kids flying HH products in their fields. I guarantee you, they will likely never be AMA members. No value in it for them and that is the case for the bulk of the hobby pilots in this country.
You should stop and talk to visit with them. If they actually are kids then there is a big value for them in the AMA. AMA membership is free for kids 18 or younger and as members they get the full access to AMA resources (sans the magazine for the free membership) and would have opportunity to apply for AMA junior member scholarships when they are ready to go to college. My daughter has been a member since she was 5.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Brian Kloft
If not then that innocent family in the park will be arrested in the future for thier activities, and we will all be looking for a new hobby...
That would be a great example to use when you write your elected representatives.

Quote:
Originally Posted by JerryK
Presumably, all you guys have signed, as I did.
Yesterday I emailed all 3 of my congress representatives, tweeted at all 3, and in the next few days plan to visit at least one of them in person to urge them to vote to protect model aviation


Ryan
Apr 14, 2018, 03:54 PM
I'm not the pivot man
Quote:
Originally Posted by rdwoebke


You should stop and talk to visit with them. If they actually are kids then there is a big value for them in the AMA. AMA membership is free for kids 18 or younger and as members they get the full access to AMA resources (sans the magazine for the free membership) and would have opportunity to apply for AMA junior member scholarships when they are ready to go to college. My daughter has been a member since she was 5.


Ryan
You've missed the point and the reality of the situation Ryan. They find no value in AMA at 75 dollars a year just to fly at a club that has rules. This is inherently the problem with many AMA members in that they refuse to see the reality of why a family does not join. They don't need to and will not, regardless of the law. These people can fly on their property, stay under 400 and be happy and 75 dollars richer and not have to drive 15 miles to a field.

That is why thousands upon thousands of MR/drone operators/UAV operators have not joined the AMA. There is no value in it for them.

336 may or may not go away, it may be rewritten and very possibly there will be changes to hobby requirements for certain aspects of the hobby such as FPV. As technology permits, there will be re-writes in 336 or any appropriate regulation or code.
Apr 14, 2018, 04:36 PM
who has rabbit ears down
Captain Canardly's Avatar
Thanks for those links! I did a 2 year license, '17 & '18, and digiital mag, and haven't even gone to AMA site till now!
Apr 14, 2018, 05:17 PM
The Detritus of Rcgroups
rdwoebke's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by FusterCluck
You've missed the point and the reality of the situation Ryan. They find no value in AMA at 75 dollars a year just to fly at a club that has rules.
Fluster,

I think you missed my point. I think it is fine that there are aeromodellers that chose to not join the AMA. I know there are lots that don't and that is fine. I have flown with lots of folks that are not AMA members and that is fine with me. I want the AMA leadership to advocate for all safe flyers of models regardless of if they are members or not (and I think for the most part they do although that said they obviously should put most of their resources to actual members).

That said if the folks you see flying are actually kids then the membership isn't $75 a year for them. It is free.

Regardless of if a person is an AMA member or not, I would still encourage folks reading this to reach out to your elected representatives now with your thoughts on the pending legislation.


Ryan
Apr 14, 2018, 05:45 PM
Registered User
I signed on to the petition as soon as I got the notice .
I couldn't agree more with Brian about dumping / separating the quad clowns from the rest of us . Let's be honest with ourselves here , they've been nothing but a problem since day one . The AMA did us no favor by trying to associate and integrate them .
Personally , I think they were just fishing for dues revenue . How did that work out ?
Apr 14, 2018, 06:55 PM
I'm not the pivot man
Quote:
Originally Posted by rdwoebke
Fluster,

I think you missed my point. I think it is fine that there are aeromodellers that chose to not join the AMA. I know there are lots that don't and that is fine. I have flown with lots of folks that are not AMA members and that is fine with me. I want the AMA leadership to advocate for all safe flyers of models regardless of if they are members or not (and I think for the most part they do although that said they obviously should put most of their resources to actual members).

That said if the folks you see flying are actually kids then the membership isn't $75 a year for them. It is free.

Regardless of if a person is an AMA member or not, I would still encourage folks reading this to reach out to your elected representatives now with your thoughts on the pending legislation.


Ryan

Nope ... I never miss the point with you. You have a habit of playing both sides of the fence to see what falls out. Bottom line, the kids don't have a drivers license; bottom line their parents are not going to drive them 15 miles to a club field; bottom line they have no need for AMA; bottom line you and others simply refuse to acknowledge that AMA offers nothing to anyone unless they compete or have no place to fly.

The scholarship means zero to someone unless they are an avid hobbyist and belong to AMA. Insurance is near useless as it pays after homeowners. No amount of 'I love AMA' takes away from the fact it actually offers very little to the average hobby pilot.

The bottom line is that many AMA members and AMA itself simply do not understand that they offer nothing of value to the average American unless they are a competitor or simply have no place to fly.

Bottom line is my club lost getting a new member because he is 19, has a HH plane with AS3X and SAFE but is unwilling to pay the foolishly high 75 dollars worthless AMA dues and the 50 dollar dues for the field. Have not seen the kid back. Bottom line is that AMA proved again they are irrelevant to the average American that is a hobby pilot.


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