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Nov 30, 2004, 06:23 AM
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alangorham's Avatar
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Peter Rake Isaac's Fury build thread


I have recently started on my build of this under-modelled little bipe.
Unfortunately I have brain-fade when it comes to taking good digital pics of a model on the building board, but I am trying hard, so there'll be something here soon...

In the meantime I'd like to share a picture with you all of how I hope she'll look.
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Nov 30, 2004, 08:56 AM
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portablevcb's Avatar
Am glad this one is started! I always like Isaac's little Fury and Spit. Almost went for the full size ones at one time. Can hardly wait to see how this one turns out.

charlie
Nov 30, 2004, 09:50 AM
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Peter's plan hints at the use of a GWS EPS 350 and Pete recommended a gear ratio of around 6:1. I think that makes it the EPS 'D' drive. I was wondering if anyone had any thoughts on the use of this motor with a 3S 1500 Kokam Lipo?

I have seen some tables on aircraft-world that give figures for prop size and current draw up to 8 Ni cells. I'm concerned about a good prop size and motor life on 11.1V...
Nov 30, 2004, 04:08 PM
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I have also started building this liitle bipe but progress has slowed a little as I am trying to get our new house finished and ready to move into before xmas.
So far I have the horiz stab, wings, fuse sides and formers made, so hopefully it will not take to much more effort to get the framework finished as it is a relatively simple plan.
I was planning on powering mine with a Himax 2025-4200 I have in a GWS D gearbox using 3S Etec 1200 batteries. I have been using this combination in a number of 400 size models I have and seems quite successful. Probably a little heavier than some other motor/gearbox combos but relatively cheap and performs well enough for my liking.

Here are a couple of photos of progress so far.
(wings are actually finished now but haven't taken any more photos)

Peter
Dec 01, 2004, 05:53 AM
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alangorham's Avatar
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Hi!

Looking good.....
I've built the fuselage so far and cut out the wing ribs.
My building room is too shadowy for pictures, so I'm going to bring it to work tomorrow.
Very interesting feedback on the powerplant - thanks for that.
Dec 01, 2004, 08:36 AM
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portablevcb's Avatar
Since Pete designed this for the EPS300 that little Himax combo will be overkill Kinda like a 300hp full size.

I have run 3s LiPo with the GWS setup. It runs, but, is a bit much for the motor. You really have to restrain yourself on the sticks or live with short motor life. You might be able to under prop it to keep the current draw down and get a bit longer life.

With those ailerons it should be a good aerobatic bird.

charlie
Dec 01, 2004, 08:40 AM
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Thanks for the advice about the EPS on 3S Lipo!
At the moment this is an extremely light build, so I'm hopeful I can be restrained as you say and only use lots of power for vertical manouvres.

I've had lots of fun with aerobatic biplanes before and I've got high hopes for this one :-)
Dec 01, 2004, 09:44 AM
Trampling out the vintage
Is this the same plane as a Hawker Fury? I hope so, and your photo sure looks like one. The Fury has been on my build list almost since I've had a list.

There was a plan by Chris Golds in FSM not too long ago. Nice outlines but weighed 34 oz at 36" span. IMO that is a flying brick.

What is the span of planned model?
Dec 01, 2004, 10:40 AM
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Greg

It's not identical. It's a 7/10 replica of a Hawker Fury designed by John Isaacs as a homebuilt. It was originally intended to be powered by an inline engine, but many (like the one in my photo) have been converted to run on flat fours such as Continental or even Lycoming.

IIRC, Chris Golds model of the Fury was designed to have much more "fighter-like" performance. There was a lot more building in it, too!

Pete's website lists the Isaacs Fury at 33" wingspan.
Dec 01, 2004, 10:59 AM
Trampling out the vintage
Interesting history on the Issacs. I have three Fury plans - Chris's plan, one by Dennis Bryant, and one by Brian Brassey. The Bryant and Brassey plans are both 60" span, a tad too big - I don't like to rig biplanes at the field, I like to carry them in my "boot" ready to go. So I've been thinking of a 50" span Fury.

I agree that the Chris Gold plan is also complex in addition to being heavy. It may dive faster with all that weight, but a lighter design will out-perform it in all other areas. Chris is a distinguished modeler and designer and I respect him greatly. However I disagree with the weight and complex approach he used on his Fury plan. I understand he is working on a bigger Fury plan and I hope it is proportionally simpler and lighter. I am certain however it will look great.
Dec 01, 2004, 11:40 AM
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I am lucky in that I can fit 60" biplanes fully rigged in the back of my car. I have a Graupner Bucker Jungmann (powered by an infernal combustion device) that always confounds people when they see me take it straight out of the back of the car.

However, my house is too small to house many fully rigged models, hence the smaller approach with the Fury.

The good thing about the Isaac's compared with the Hawker design is that it doesn't require lots of polished alloy effect finish on the nose to simulate the cowling of the fullsize.

Peter mentioned that he is able to scale the CAD-drawn plan up or down as necessary. A 50" model sounds tasty...
Last edited by alangorham; Dec 01, 2004 at 11:41 AM. Reason: finger trouble!
Dec 01, 2004, 12:25 PM
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vintage1's Avatar
If you want a bit more pep than the 350 on 2s LIPO, go to a 6v 400 on 3s LIPO.

I posted up the best props/gear ratios for this before.

1.85:1 6x4
2.33:1 7x5
3:1 8x6
3.5:1 9x6
4:1 10x7

For a 33" span model I';d go for something like 8x6 or 9x6.

Pick the prop/ratio nearest to scale. All these will have good thrust and pitch speed somewher in the 40mph region from memory.

The 350 is too high revving to be safe from brush bounce on 3s LIPO.

OTOH you MAY get away with it. Knock two inches of prop diameter as compared with 3s LIPO and hold it to no more than 8A.

8x6 or 9x7 I think should be OK on D gearing

Motocalc reckons about 35K shaft RPM on that. Maye be OK, I reckon 40K is the bleeding edge really.

If you have teh motor - try it out? If there are signs of heavy arcing developing as you approah max throttle, stop and think a again. If not =why not?

I hae a C geared 350 I keep meaning to bench test on 3s LIPO and an 8x6...
Dec 01, 2004, 12:31 PM
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Vintage1 to the rescue!

The nose design of this model has a hardwood motor post integral in it. Since I'm not so well up on GWS products (more familiar with the Mini-Oly and Graupner gearboxes) is there a geared 400 with this type of mount? If so, I know that I'd be on safer ground with the speed 400, because I have other models with similar (or identical) setup to the ones you describe.

I was looking at an 8x6 on the D ratio with 3s Lipo, so thanks for giving me a bit of backup on that....

I don't have the motor yet, progress on the model was a spur to make a choice on ratio/motor/prop/batts. I'm a great fan of a bit of empirical testing, but I can't yet!
Dec 01, 2004, 12:41 PM
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vintage1's Avatar
If you have the 350, why not bench run it? If run in carefully, and not normally flown WOT in a dive (highest RPM) it may survive...funnily enough, when limited by RPM rather than current, the bigger prop MAY be safer.

The GWS 400 box WOULD work, but I don't think there is a UK source. Aircraft world has them though. http://www.aircraft-world.com/shopexd.asp?id=2475

Should be a straight swap I think.

I always mod up pete's designs for the MPjet boxes from Fanfare...
Dec 01, 2004, 01:19 PM
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This is what JIMA had to say about the GWS 350 in his Strutter.

For the initial test flight Jim used the GWS 350C with 5.33:1 gearing, a GWS 10x4.7 prop and a 7 cell pack of 1100 mAh, 2/3C NiMHs. All up weight was 20.25 oz. Since then, a variety of battery and prop combinations have been tried, each improving the flight performance slightly as Jim got used to her and required more of her. The GWS 10x6 prop improved her performance, but the APC 10x7 improved it even more. Loops from level flight, consecutive loops and a flick roll have all been performed with ease.

This is on a 36" models without ailerons. Okay, not much help if you want to use Lipos, but a good indication of what can be expected. Afterall, the Isaacs Fury isn't the most aerobatic aircraft in the world.

Greg,
This design is based on the Mk 1, with a much boxier front end than in the photo. Basically, it looks more like a slightly streamlined Currie Wot than a Hawker Fury.

Pete


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