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Feb 21, 2018, 08:37 AM
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Discussion

3dlab planes, best settings for non prusa printers


Well just doing some setup prints for my P47 from 3Dlabprint and having some problems. A trouble shared is a trouble halved as they say, so you're it
Printer CrealityCr-10 mini using Cura as a slicer.
3Dlab say you need to change print settings if not Prusa so thought I would start with what I have discovered and ask for other ideas. I have done a few test prints and am mainly having problems with latticed 'weetabix' sections in the print. Seems this is common enough and just much messing needed to fix it.
Best info so far came from https://community.ultimaker.com/topi...nting-in-cura/ which even has pictures of the problem. Same as mine ok for about 2-3% then goes screwy. Part is wing section 3, the one with the servo recess.

I tried basic supplied settings but this gave me a latticed section on the lower wing just below the leading edge and most internals. Changed the position on the print bed from left to right to corner to corner. This moved the latticed bit to part way down the top of the wing still with some but less latticing of the internals.
So started playing with settings, mainly retract rates and wall width. As somebody pointed out a 0.4 nozzle and 0.4 height would deposit a circular tube of plastic just touching the layer below.

So current settings (which still give lattice in various places as above)
Layer = 0.15 Initial layer = 0.3 Temp 205 (210 initial) and bed at 60c.
Wall thicknes 0.5 to allow squashing of filament Flow rate of 110
Z seam on a corner (but all looks ok no stepping)
Print speed 30 (initial 14) and travel speed 200.
Latest bits to play with Retract settings
Retract distance 0.7mm Rate retract 25 prime 25mm/s and extra prime amount 0.16

Getting better but still needs, perhaps, more extra prime amount and not sure whether to try more or less flow.
The bits that worked are pretty strong, I can break the layers digging in with my nails but (only 5mm height printed as a test) it can be bent and twisted with no damage. This is the original filament I got with the printer. I have some 'ice' filament which I will start using tomorrow as I want to buy a new piece of glass for the bed. Filament may make a difference but I will up the prime amount to 0.18 and nozzle temp to 220 and see what happens.

Any experiences that will help me appreciated, or maybe my blunderings will help others in the future.
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Feb 22, 2018, 03:29 AM
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Just my 2c worth, I used simplify3d and the factory files supplied by 3dlabprint, not a problem with my Anet A8
Feb 22, 2018, 10:16 AM
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I looked at simplify, not a bad price but cura should do for the moment. If I really struggle I may consider it.
I did consider trying their G-code files but I think they contain more than one part, based on 6 .stls and 2 g-codes, I guess I could try one and see what happens.
I will persevere, I am now going to be printing on glass/glue no tape. Also using the above settings for one more try with the free PLA, then I will load the new one and see if that is the problem. I am guessing most parts will be fine. Looking at the parts so far it is always the leading edge and the servo cable tube. Geting better though.
Last edited by charentejohn; Feb 22, 2018 at 10:17 AM. Reason: Spelling
Feb 23, 2018, 01:18 PM
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Latest update is I tried a few variations but decided to go back to original settings and much better. Main thing was temperature, I tried the 3Dlab g-codes but went to 230 and my printer didn't want to do it (firmware I think ?).
I went back to 205c print temp plate at 50c speed 40 retraction off 0.15 layer ht. Solid as a rock, I can just split layers with my nails but it won't tear further without effort so that will do.
Some stringing and non critical 'latticing', think I will drop the temp to what the PLA recommends and then play with retraction if necessary. I will change layer height temp and speed and see what happens.

Very good explanation with visuals here (for Ultimaker so not all features there for mine) https://support.3dverkstan.se/articl...underextrusion Pictures of problems at top of page, had good explanations and options. For me could just be the fact free spool running out but I will persevere with this till it is used as a better filament should improve more, I hope.....
Feb 24, 2018, 05:57 PM
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I think I know the problem, I misunderstood the slicer options in Cura.
For those who don't know what this makes me (not from UK) look up Dad's Army, you stupid boy on youtube. D-oh.
I still need to sort out stringing and retraction but I had the main speed set to 60. I looked at the settings while printing and it showed 100, so I dialled it down to 50 and the speed dropped and all was solid. In Cura it allows control of wall printing as well as other like supports etc. So it ignored my 60 until I set the walls to 50 and internals to 60, now all bonded fine.

Weight is down so I think I need to up extrusion percentage but getting there. Finish is good and the new filament also makes a difference. The problem explanation in the previous post was helpful in saying upping extrusion percent was not the answer, which is true it was going too fast for the filament feed rate, but seems extrusion percent is to add bulk/weight.
Still some playing around to do but I am learning, this is my first real print ever so starting at the sharp end with an actual plane. I will post any other lessons learned.
Mar 01, 2018, 06:16 AM
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Back again, with the help of the ultimaker forum I have made some improvements, no help from 3dlab forum or support whatsoever.
Speeds were actually ok it is the other settings topic here https://community.ultimaker.com/topi...orts-too-thin/
Ultimaker suggested setting Union overlapping volumes to none and merged meshes overlap to 0 (has a value so needs to be put on the profile list) anso enable Print thin walls.

Problem now is just the sloping thin internal walls which are just loads of strings and not stuck together.
Mar 01, 2018, 07:33 AM
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I have also the CR- 10 Mini, but i use only Simplify3D. I have quite good settings for the P47. I could send you a G-code file for a part so you can try it.
Mar 01, 2018, 06:02 PM
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Jan W, thanks please just Pm me with a sample part. I will be interested to see if it prints same as 3dlabs version.
I am off to bed leaving the 3dlab gcode print of the first two parts of my wing on the basis that I may as well give it a try, takes 7hrs it says so will see what I have in the morning.

I would buy simplify if it works, their but and we will refund if you don't like it seems strange, usually a few days free trial (in this case with a 30 min print limit would work) is normal. If it allows me to print individual 3dlab parts I will go for it.
The printer prints everything else perfectly, just not these ?
Mar 07, 2018, 06:02 PM
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Many thanks to Jan W for his help (via PM/E-mail) with gcode and settings, I think I have figured out what I was doing wrong.
I was starting to look at wall/shell settings and Jan's settings confirmed the problem was mainly there, I had Shell as 0.6 and walls at 0.4 so the layers, despite being 0.6 were not, so 'missed'. I have now set this to 0.48 as I think my printer needs that. Much improved fusilage prints, upward sloping walls now have no lamination or stringing. I have yet to try the dreaded L1 wing section of the P47 as it will take about 10 hrs so is an overnight job. I want to check a couple of prints before doing one. This part is a real challengs.

I have another problem, printer related which I have just sorted. at 12-15cm up the print I had one or two weak seams, can be cracked if pressed, all other parts very solid and flexible. Turns out the two scrwes that hold the connection to the Z axis screw thread were loose, coupled with a need to align the Z screw which meant it tightened up a bit at, you guessed, about 12cm high. So I think all was well till it tightened up, then the loose screws 'kicked' a bit then settled. My theory anyway, new tall piece to print tomorrow.
I deserve a slap as, as a retired electrician, I always made sure I checked the screws etc in fittings as often not fully tightened, cookers especially, so should have followed my own advice...

So with Jan's working settings as a base all should be well, my settings are currently-
Layer height 0.2 Shell 0.6 Line width and wall line width 0.48 Temp 215 bed 56 Flow 110
Retraction 4.5mm extra prime 0.2
Importantly I think slow speed Print 60 Outer and inner wall 30 Travel 180
Cura says 7h40 so will be about 9hrs I guess for the L1 part.

3dlab supplied settings are half that time but don't work on the CR-10 so I will go for the longer print. I tried their gcodes, which were meant for a prusa and looked ok but brittle, seams popped when pressed.

I have the printer in a makeshift, ply and towel covered box in a hallway, this ends up at about 26c inside when printing.

I will add some photos of results, and thanks again Jan much appreciated
Mar 08, 2018, 01:32 AM
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I'm glad to help!
Mar 08, 2018, 10:56 AM
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Thread OP
I noticed the 0.48 wall line width I am using was giving a heavy wing section so have gone to the 0.42 suggested and now weight is correct. Cura sometimes over estinates a little but tried it and weight seems ok.
I also tried the L1 wing section as a 0.5cm test piece and....... It printed the problem section with no problems, even the steep slope next to the aileron tunnel adhered ok, I can see the lines but they are stuck together, amazing such a small change made such a difference. I will do a full print overnight, fingers crossed as I am running out of grey filament, more on order
Mar 09, 2018, 11:04 PM
wrong descision, wrong time
I don't know if anyone else sees this issue, but if I try to add more than one of these parts to the build plate in cura 3.2.1, it doesn't create hardly of the internal structure? It would be nice to be able to print a few parts out at the same time on my CR-10.

EDIT: Nevermind I found it. I needed to set Merged Meshes Overlap to 0 (zero), also need to uncheck Union Overlapping Volumes. I found it in the linked forum post.
Mar 14, 2018, 11:50 AM
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armourgod's Avatar
Hi there!

I am trying to print the 3DLab Me109F but am having some problems.

My printer is a Creality CR-10s and I am using Cura as the slicer. I have only attempted one print so far, the forward fuselage section with the gun troughs, but already I see a problem. The outer skin is printing really well but there is no internal structure printing. Am I missing something here with the settings?!!! I plugged in all the ones mentioned previously.

Any help much appreciated,

John
Aug 20, 2019, 08:44 AM
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Did you actually got the rc plane in the air?


Hi Charentejohn, i also bought a cr10S, my 3Dlab plane (Nanzan) did not print on a borowed ultimaker 2, but now i am trying to get it do on my cr10S. Do you have suggestions on how to get the best results? kind regards. Paul
Aug 21, 2019, 02:49 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Yellfish
Hi Charentejohn, i also bought a cr10S, my 3Dlab plane (Nanzan) did not print on a borowed ultimaker 2, but now i am trying to get it do on my cr10S. Do you have suggestions on how to get the best results? kind regards. Paul
Like many, I struggled with making a 3DLabPrint plane using Cura. I gave up and put my first project on the back burner for a year and then I bought Simplify3D and instantly all was sweetness and light.

It really is worth the money. I don't know why, but S3D works where Cura doesn't. S3D is your best bet for a quick cure.

However, there is this: I'm now building a Shark Aero model. Interestingly the folks who make the real, full-sized airplane also give away the 3D recipes to make a model and it looks pretty good. I've printed the parts, but haven't assembled it yet. It looks to be well designed; i.e. it's strong enough and seems to be light too.

The item which might be of interest to you is the fact that they not only use Cura but they publish the Cura Profile files as well. They have several profiles, one for the fuselage, one for the wing, and so-on.

Even if you don't build the Shark Aero, you should try their Cura Profiles as a starting point in your search for good settings with your 3DLabPrint airplane.

Finally, I use eSun PLA Pro (aka PLA +) and it's great. I print at 245 degrees and get great layer adhesion. It is superior to ordinary PLA in every way, especially toughness. It also doesn't cost too much, around $25 per kilo.


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