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May 04, 2019, 08:32 PM
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On a whim, impulse, boredom, I was killing time, I had 3 1/2 hours to wait. Went by a not so local, but on the way hobby shop, wondered around, picked up a few small things, props, glue, saw this on the shelf, hmm, nah, walked around some more, looked at the rockets, balsa planes, covering. Talked to the guy behind the counter. Asked if it was the same crappy assed toy from wally world. He chuckled a bit, said, no way, this is a great little flyer. So much better than the $20.00 junk toys.

UGH, damn, do I, yes, no, maybe, damn, yes, maybe, yes, yes, checked out with it.

So, it was late when I got home. It was one of those 24 plus hour days. I was tired, yet could not go to sleep after driving for an hour and a half. So to unwind, I opened the box, plugged in the charger, battery, opened the book. Read a bit, found this thread. Noticed the charger showed green. Hmm do I try as I am dead tired. Well YEAH!!

Plugged the battery in, struggled to get the canopy on. Got it all set, put it on the desk, gave a tiny bit of power, rotors started spinning, bit more power sliding sideways, gave more power and off she climbed.

Thumbs have been getting time on a sim lately. Trying to get them back up to where they were 12 years ago is not east. So I am hovering and it is just drifting a bit here and there, couple clicks of left, forward trim and sitting right there. I do a little side in, left, then right, climb a bit, do a right hand piro, oh crap, sticks going every where, woo hoo got it back. Thumbs are real rusty.

I think I will enjoy hovering around the room. I did find I was right side in hovering and I was all over the place. So lots more time needed. Left was not happening. I was just way of of control. If this little guy helps with just orientation, will be well worth the cost.

as this is a re-stickered Esky, are there more than 1 Esky radio protocol? I have a few others that have different protocols and am thinking of getting one of those multi protocol Tx's. Any one flying it with a different Tx?

Now to order the 5 pack of batteries and a micro USB charger.

Thanks. Buzz.
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May 05, 2019, 08:19 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by blvdbuzzard
.... as this is a re-stickered Esky, are there more than 1 Esky radio protocol? I have a few others that have different protocols and am thinking of getting one of those multi protocol Tx's. Any one flying it with a different Tx?
Actually the Tx works very well, much better than what might be expected. The flybarless stabilization, which should be working like a physical flybar to make the heli act as if it is heavier (more mass) and thus larger and not so twitchy. For whatever reason it seems adjusted for a kid used to bang-bang as in video games, AND it is not clear to me how much of this is in the Tx and how much in the heli itself.

It took me some time to sort this all out and get fairly precise control, even in ground-effect. There are 2 main exercises that work really well. The first is MOST important, to learn how to save the heli from walls, obstacles and yourself (don't ask).

1. Practice knocking (brief FULL right stick movement, then reverse past neutral to the opposite stick side to stop it! and back to neutral) with the heli going away at a good speed about 1 - 1.5 m/yard then back to start point. Do this tail-in, going in 45░ segments around the compass: N, NE, E, SE, S, etc. During each segment the heli should NOT change its yaw heading, nose still pointed AWAY from you, but making various slanted moves (1st below attachment). Then the same nose in. This teaches how to SAVE the heli from any position, how to suddenly start and suddenly stop various movements. You will note that subtle and slow stick movements around neutral do NOTHING. The exercise is to solidly learn how to get the heli to respond to you, NOT the built-in stabilization. Think 737 MAX smashes.

2. Practice making forward-going tightly banked (ca. 25░) fast circles, ca. 1 - 1.5 sec/circumference to the right (easy) and to the left (harder, since the rotor is tilted for hover-trim to compensate for sideways tail-rotor thrust). Do a series of circles in each direction and do not try to link them into "8"'s until you are sure (2nd attachment below). Do NOT try doing REVERSE (tail-first) banked circles in small places indoors, though outside with a lot of room this is easy! Trust me on this (I think it has to do with the effect of the rotorwash on the canopy).

To make all of thus easier, make sure everything moving is lubed and especially that the blade grips are equally tightened (NOT loose as when out-of-the-box) EXACTLY as in P 9 "Rotors" in the Manual. Doing those 2 things will give you more control and effective power AND stabilization as well as prolonging the life of the heli.

If you are interested, you can also try learning the good old 2-finger method on each Tx stick: thumb on top and index finger on the side just under it. That gives much more precision!
May 05, 2019, 11:43 AM
Registered User
Thank you for the great information. I had gone through the thread, read a page, jump 5 pages, read a page, jump 5 and so on until the end. I have to do the blade grip adjustment, lube job.

I have flown thumbs for way to long to make the two finger grip work. I have tried and it just does not "feel" right. but when I fly helicopters, I fly the right stick with thumb on top, left stick my index finger is wrapped around the front, top of the stick, thumb pressing the stick into the notch of the first knuckle locking it in place.

When I started learning to fly helicopters in 2000-2001 on my Nexus 30 and Raptor 30, I had some costly crashes. What do you do when something happens when flying a plane, chop throttle, pull full up, well what happens when you do that with a helicopter 5 feet off the ground? You drive the tail into the ground and blade strike the boom causing maximum damage.

So I came up with that way of holding the throttle stick to keep me from chopping the throttle. Plus it give very good rudder and collective control. I was not the best stick banging 3D flippy guy at the field, as I flew mostly sport style and pattern style. One thing the guy who taught me to fly said, I had the best turns. The helicopter did not gain or loose altitude, tail followed the nose.

I have been doing my hover training. I hover just to the side of me on take off, move to the right about 2 feet, move to the left so I am 3 feet to the left yet I make sure the nose is still pointing in the direction it was on take off. Not like the hands of a clock, but the three lines would be parallel.

On the third flight I did find if I tapped, or banged the stick, it would move a tiny bit where as if I tried to do it by moving the stick a tiny bit, nothing happened. Almost like the expo is WAY up there and the center 10% of the stick movement means nothing.

I did try to do a pirouette, first one was so sloppy and all over the place Second one, not to bad, kept it in a 2 foot circle.

I have to say I am having fun with this little helicopter. As it is blowing about 25-30 mph out side, not really interested in trying to fly in that.

"MOST important, to learn how to save the heli from walls, obstacles and yourself (don't ask)."

Yeah, I have a serious of red marks on my ankle. Little rotor blades are spinning pretty fast when they smack your ankle. Lucky that is my only miss hap. I have one of those plastic divided trays for fishing, I use for small parts. That is my take off and landing spot. I just tap the sticks as it descends, then just as it hit the ground I cut throttle, so far 5 times I was able to land on the tray.

I am thinking of getting one of those Xk K110, 120, or the 130. As they use a RTF radio on Futaba, I was thinking of getting a multi protocol radio so I could use it for that, my micro airplanes and this little guy.

Thanks.

Buzz.
May 05, 2019, 03:48 PM
Regexistentialist
ridgerunr's Avatar

1st CP micro? The K110!


Quote:
Originally Posted by blvdbuzzard
... I have to say I am having fun with this little helicopter. ...
Welocme back! But be careful, these things can be very addicting!

Regarding your next move (up to CP) - that would be the XK K110 hands down (you've probably already seen the RCG thread which is always on page 1). But don't take my word for it - be sure to ask around first. The best (only) source for XK stuff in the US is MotionRC. Be sure to get spare main gears - that is the pretty much the only thing that wears out (it usually just pops off then you simply push it back on and you're good to go - but the hole does round out after a while and so needs replacement.) Also extra main and tail rotor blades are good items to keep handy.

The Tx that comes with the RTF version is actually a pretty capable computer radio with ten memories - its only real deficiency is a lack of a timer (and it is limited to the Futaba S-FHSS protocol). Personally I use a Taranis with a multi-protocol module - with that I can fly pretty much anything (Blades, WLToys, XK, FrSky, FlySky, etc). Your only big decision if you go down that road is which Open Source firmware you want to go with: OpenTx, Ersky9x or Deviation. I prefer FrSky hardware with OpenTx firmware myself and there a lot of us using this combination. Jumper makes some pretty economical compact radios that do the multi-protocol thing the T8SG (Deviation) and T12 (JumperTX- a fork of OpenTX) and the newest T16 (JumperTX).

Once again, welcome back to the heli craze!
May 05, 2019, 05:34 PM
Registered User
I have read the K110 thread, well read a page jump ahead some read again. I have also posted in the K130 thread. They to said if I get one, the 130, I would end up with a 110 sooner or later. Seems the micro helicopter breed like rabbits in the dark

My brother and I have gone to FlySky i10's after Airtronics went down the drain. Flown Airtronics since the early 80's. I have a 9x, smartie parts board, flashed ER9x about 10 years ago, never flash since. Was thinking about the irange multi module for it. I was trying to setup a Dynam Grand Cruiser on my 9x, had some issues, frustrations, in a fit if rage, instead of trowing the 9x, I bought the i10. Don't think I have turned the 9x on since then.

Have the Jumper in the cart an Bangggod, 105 for it, is not bad. As my brother and I have a few BNF Spectrum planes, brother bought a DX6E after seeing the micro Edge at the hobby shop. So I have an Inductix and he has the Edge. We do like t e BNF easy of but we both have 15 plus Rx's for the i10.

That is what made me look at the jumper. I could fly everything and then some.

I checked the blade tension, broke out the large T-pin, my bottle of turbine oil, put tiny little drops where ever I could. Spun everything to get the oil moved around. Put in a new battery, powered up and almost bounced off the ceiling. Seems to have a whole lot more power then out of the box.

Need to get more batteries. Are there any other brands that have the wires or is there a place to get the little pig tails to fit the other batteries on this little guy?

I have been looking at the 4, 5, 6 bank chargers. I have 1 in my cart that does all the micro sized ones I can think of, 6 bank and it is 20 bucks. Just need to know what other batteries fit?

I feel like the tin man, oooooiiiiilll cccccannnnn. Thumbs squeak, crack, pop, moan they are so rusty and crusty. This one flies so well compared to the toys I have tried. I have a tiny toy grade Mom bought me 15 years ago or so. Uses the 4 AA batteries in the Tx, charge the battery from the Tx too. Total toy but I had fun with it as I could fly in the living room.


Thanks.

Buzz.
May 12, 2019, 09:43 PM
Registered User
I have gone back through this thread. I do not see any one talking about the aluminum parts? Are they worth, not needed, only shiny bits, stay with plastic?

Was curious if they had a bit better fit and finish. Something like they help to make the blades the same tension, hold up better, cause less friction so longer flight times?


Buzz.
May 14, 2019, 07:03 AM
Registered User

getting a grip on it ....


The plastic grip and corresponding blade parts are close to perfect .... but after putting on a micro-amount of lube on the top & bottom of the blade end and wiping almost ALL off!, getting the tightness the same for both blades is problematic but easily solved:

Simply remove the grip bolt and put a drop of good lube on the in-going end and reinsert!


If a micro-bit too LOOSE after re-insertion and attempted perfect adjustment the technique often requires backing the bolt out a lot, because tightening the bolt a micro-part turn tighter can make the grip even LOOSER. Strange. Anyway just unscrew some more and try again. Once properly adjusted I have found, noting that one side may SEEM looser by finger-feel when the blade goes fwd or back .... when properly adjusted the observed effect is the only important factor! > both blades drop fwd fairly equally, also when the hub rotated 180░.

I have found that when adjusted the blades will keep the same setting for at least a month, with the following important proviso:

If the blades touch anything, including paper, your clothes or the heli even rolls over sideways when landing (i.e., not even a slightly hard smack) .... the ENTIRE above adjustment is usually required. That's why I have learned and put in a great effort NOT to let the blades touch anything and have been successful at this since since after Christmas: blades have not touched anything but air! Have come close, but the only bounces have so far luckily (or skillfully?) only been vertically on the skids, sometimes even jarring the LIPO loose on one side. I used to work on Ski Patrol and have learned it is possible, with concentration, NEVER to fall (in the case of Ski Patrol, only important image-wise, eh?). Also have heard several very 8th+ month pregnant skiing women respond to an onlooker's question, "What happens when you fall?" with the answer, "You DON'T fall!".
May 14, 2019, 10:32 AM
Regexistentialist
ridgerunr's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by blvdbuzzard
... Flown Airtronics since the early 80's. I have a 9x, smartie parts board, flashed ER9x about 10 years ago, never flash since. ...
Same here - a 4-ch AM Airtronics in the 80s, a 7-ch FM/PCM Futaba in the 90s, and a 9X with Er9x and the Smartieparts and LCD upgrades about ten years ago. I went with the Taranis X9D in Oct 2013 and have never looked back (I now have five of them! Don't ask - I collect transmitters and calculators). Once Pascal's Multi-protocol modules came out, (this is whats inside the IRX4 and Jumpers), I started using those for all my Blade BNFs and my other micros (GW9958 Xiedas and WLToys V911s). OpenTX and Ersky9x provide a native high-speed serial interface to the module for minimal latency (faster than the standard PPM interface - it may even work on your 9X, you'd want to ask Mike Blandford about that possibility).

Quote:
Originally Posted by blvdbuzzard
... Have the Jumper in the cart an Bangggod, 105 for it, is not bad. ...
I purchased both the Jumper T8SG (Deviation) and the T12 (JumperTX) when they first came out because I am looking for a good compact stowable radio for my "Adventure Chopper" plans. Unfortunately, I am still looking because the quality of the Jumper products leaves much to be desired - the T8SG has no speaker and the speaker on the T12 is just terrible - i.e. both pathetically weak and horribly distorted - basically unusable. I haven't even used them as I have grown accustomed to having voice alerts. And with thier T12 and T16 models, Jumper failed to cooperate with the OpenTX devs and were forced to go it alone and fork off the OpenTX firmware (and create JumperTX, which has a couple implementation bugs).

I would strongly recommend FrSky hardware over Jumper every day of the week. If money is tight, their QX7 with an IRX4 module would be a good way to go. If you eventually do acquire any big, expensive, dangerous craft, I would also strongly recommend using the well proven, bulletproof FrSky ACCST protocol - I would never trust the IRX4 (or a Jumper) to fly a big heli - but for micros, they are fine.

Don't dump a lot of $$ into the FP micros - aluminum parts just add weight and weight is the enemy of these tiny little guys. And move up to a K110 as soon as you can (NOT the K130 - that one is NOT a good CP trainer - (with its 2S battery, it is much too agile and powerful and will easily break when you crash it, and you will) - to learn CP, you want an indestructable 1S heli like the K100, K110 or I've heard good things about Blade's latest nano.) But the K110 is still the one I'd recommend as a CP trainer.

Have fun!
Last edited by ridgerunr; May 14, 2019 at 10:38 AM. Reason: spelling corrections
May 15, 2019, 02:54 PM
Registered User
Right now I am flying most of my stuff on my FrySky i10. Never a glitch, hiccup or brown out. I have it in my Blade 550x helicopter so I would trust it to fly anything. If not, I would just drop back to my Airtronics RD8000.

This jumper would be for the small BNF, stuff. I have the 9x, with the smartie parts board too and flashed er9x. Was looking to flash with a newer firmware but could not find one? So I must have been looking in the wrong place. I am looking at the 900mahz modules for the 9x for longer range FPV. Having a module bay makes it nice. Just pop them in.

Was just wondering if the aluminum lasted longer, survived crashes more. I am long past "OH" I have shiny parts on my toys now.


Thanks.

Buzz
May 17, 2019, 06:23 PM
Registered User
Has anyone got into the CC3D settings on this? I bought an ESKY 150xp2 thinking it would be the same thing but I can only get it to fly correctly in auto level mode, and even then it is pretty terrible. I would love if someone could screen shot all the CC3D settings on the blade 70s so I can match them and get this flying correctly.
May 17, 2019, 11:43 PM
Registered User
If anybody here is interested, I have a brand new 70s in the original box with the factory cellophane. I had bought this last Christmas for my daughters fiancÚ, but he never even took it home and now they are not getting married anyways, so I'm just going to sell this as I have to need of it.
May 23, 2019, 07:44 PM
Registered User
I was flying and the Tx batteries died. They are the stock ones. I looked for the AA's on hand and the store is 45 minutes away. So I broke out the knife and soldering iron. I cut out a slot in the battery compartment and dropped in a 2s 450mah lipo. works great. wonder how long it will last?

Buzz.
May 24, 2019, 07:02 AM
Registered User
The nice thing about alkalines is that they don't have a drastic LV drop-off cliff like LIPOs! So the Tx-LV cutoff (flashing Tx LED plus beeping) should be gentler coming on (flatter curve) and thus be safer with alkalines. Mine always gave me plenty of slack re: LV warning.

Anyway, to be safe just fly over grass, that thing is robust.


I ALWAYS keep a bunch of low-cost but quality alkalines in the fridge! They "keep" for YEARS that way!
Last edited by xlcrlee; May 24, 2019 at 07:13 AM.
May 24, 2019, 08:12 PM
Registered User
I had a 24 pack of budget AA's. Went from working great, to flashing to dead faster than a lipo it seemed. I tried the rechargeable AA's. Just did not seem to last that long. They last for months in the TV remote, night lights, but for what ever reason they did not like this Tx. Plus I am on vacation and the store is 45 miles each way. Not sure I would be willing to spend the cash to get a 4 pack from the gas station near me. I have 5 or 6 of the 2s 450's as I use them in my mini foamy planes and now for my jumper T8SG. I have over 2 hours on it with the 450 so should last long enough.


Buzz.
May 25, 2019, 05:09 AM
Registered User
Need to be very specific here:

1. High-quality ALKALINE batts (not other types of non-rechargeables) have the unique property of fairly long-term storage for several YEARS ....

2. IFF (if and ONLY if) kept cold in fridge!

Fairly sure that low-quality "budget" non-alkalines not kept in fridge do NOT have this long-term storage ability.

Am lucky that there is a low-cost grocery/super-market chain here (owned by a major super-mkt chain, goes in direction of Aldi) that often carries packs of high-quality SONY alkalines at ca. 1/3 normal price. In the "normal" super-mkts they have CRAP-quality "budget" batts at 2x that cost. Have worked for GD/DoD where a main development criterion was Cost/Effectiveness.

Means you need to get what you pay for. And on top of that ... must use it properly and take good care of it. Gotta do both.


Above is only general info on the topic of non-rechargeable batts


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