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Apr 16, 2018, 11:51 PM
That thing almost hit me
Tahoed's Avatar
Elevator 12mm high rate 8mm low rate
Rudder 12 mm
Ailerons 12-14mm high rate 10 mm low rate
These should give you a pretty good starting point.

Can you take a flashlight and look down the fuse with the radio on and see if the rudder cable is flexing? If it's not glued in back there, you can just stuff a piece of styrofoam down the fuse with a small wooden dowel to hold it in place. (There's a couple other ways to stabilize that cable too)
Last edited by Tahoed; Apr 17, 2018 at 12:02 AM.
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Apr 17, 2018, 01:06 AM
Faster is Better
Slopemaster's Avatar
Thanks Tahoe,

Unfortunately I have to start over on the rudder elevator installation.

I thought I could reuse the tray but it was to short to install servos in tandem.

So when I offset servos everything was great till I tried to put the nose cone on

So I ripped out the old tray and I'm starting from scratch.

Should have from the beginning.
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Apr 17, 2018, 03:56 PM
Registered User
fly2bob's Avatar
One thing I remember is that you are suppose to program the crow after the basics BUT before the rest of the stuff or else it will change other settings. Don't remember what it will change or by how much, but that it did.

Here is my setup for a F3F I had. It should get you going. Values are positive unless noted otherwise. Your values may need to be different and you may like less expo.
Basically it's;
SET UP MENU;
name, glider, modulation, trim setup for ail ele rud all 4, v-tail inh, dual flap act, flap ch input flap sw+P6,
MAIN MENU; (PROGRAM THESE BELOW IN ORDER, other than ail to flap 100% & flap to ail 100% - values for you may need to be A LITTLE different)
servo rev, sub trim,
travel adj; SPOI +81%, - 100%; AIL 1 L 100%, R 127%; ELEV U/D 100%; RUDD U/D 100%; Ail 2 L 132%, R 150%; FLAP U 6%, D 11%, AUX 2 100%, AUX 3 100%
D/R & expo; AILE pos 0, D/R 95%, expo 70%, pos 1, D/R 51%, expo 44%
ELEV pos 0 D/R 115%, expo 65%, pos 1 D/R 60%, expo 30
RUDD pos 0 D/R 125%, expo 60%, pos 1 D/R 100%, expo 40
ail to flap 100%, flap to ail 100%, differ 35%,
Butterfly; ( THERE IS A POSITION ZERO AND POSITION ONE FOR ELEV, AILE, & FLAP. HAVING ZERO FOR POSITION ONE FOR AILE, and FLAP DEACTIVATES CROW VIA THE GEAR SW )
spoi > ele: 0: + 19%
1: +4% (this +4% vs ZERO was to get rid of the change that was happening on the elevator by flipping the sw)
spoi > aile 0: +25%
1: 0%
spoi > flap 0: -72%
spoi offet: -170%
PROG MIX 2 (A CURVE MIX & ASSIGNS SPOiLER or CROW TO THE THROTTLE STICK); spoi > spoi
point-L
0
sw:
on (all the time)
WITH THIS PORTIONTIONAL MIX along the bottom left of the screen it says;
with the spoi stick down; IN says 5 & OUT says 0
with the spoi stick 1/2 way up; IN says 50 & OUT says 1
with the spoi stick all the way up; both say 100%
PROG MIX 3 (YOU MIGHT NOT WANT TO DO THIS. I did to disable crow with the gear sw so it's only active when I want to land)
spoi > spoi
Rate:
-125%
-125%
SW: (select) BTFYO
Offset 169
OTHER MIXES
ele > flap mix: Rate: D +15%, U +20%, sw. MIX
flap > ele mix: Rate: U+ 22%, D 0%, sw. ON, offset flap 0
ali > rudd mix: Rate: +31%, sw. MIX
POT KNOBS
D/FLAP T: pots 5 through 7 INH

Let me know if need any more help programming the 8103 when it comes time.

Bob
Last edited by fly2bob; Apr 27, 2018 at 04:28 PM.
Apr 17, 2018, 08:29 PM
Faster is Better
Slopemaster's Avatar
Thanks Bob,

I appreciate you guys taking the time to assist me with the radio/glider setup.

I'm brainstorming the servo installation. Considering bolting the two servos together with a locking 4-40 set up.

Yes, with the servo tab overlap, the aft servo will be about a 1/16" higher. Doesn't matter both servos will sit low enough.

Then a couple of cross rails on each end.

That's the beauty of this hobby, no rules, at least for now.
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Apr 17, 2018, 09:24 PM
That thing almost hit me
Tahoed's Avatar
Could also do something like this. a plywood tray will help strengthen the fuse. The two cross rails could pop loose pretty easy on just a slightly rough landing.
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Apr 17, 2018, 11:24 PM
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Slopemaster's Avatar
Good points. Thanks
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Apr 18, 2018, 03:06 PM
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fly2bob's Avatar
agreed
Apr 21, 2018, 07:31 PM
Faster is Better
Slopemaster's Avatar
Servo rails are in.

Used epoxy for rail and supports. Then I will add fillets using Goop.

Goop holds really well but offers flexibility under loads.

1/32" ply rail supports will help with downward/forward forces.

I didn't do the math but the rail supports should be about the same glue surface are as a conventional 1/8" tray.

The nose cone should transfer most impact loads aft of radio compartment.

If not then I suspect I will have bigger problems than loose servos.
Last edited by Slopemaster; Apr 21, 2018 at 07:39 PM.
Apr 21, 2018, 10:58 PM
Registered User
fly2bob's Avatar
Interesting. I like the idea and shape of the supports, and that you used thick ply for the rails, but uneasy about the servos bolted together with no support in the middle. But you are there and have felt it, so if it's solid enough for you, it must be okay I guess. I would have made the supports out of 1/16"th and still put something for the middle, but congrats on those supports. I've never seen that, it's a great idea/design. You could still put a balsa block on each side, between the servos and fuse. it's still bugging me, haha.
Apr 21, 2018, 11:26 PM
Faster is Better
Slopemaster's Avatar
Thanks,

I would never consider bolting regular plastic servos together but with these aluminum case servos, they are rock solid. There is zero give.

I admit, I sometimes have an unorthodox approach to building, but I figure that's how we discover new techniques.

If it works great, if it doesn't, I will post the results so that others may learn.

I appreciate you guys hanging with me and having an interest in the project.

Makes it fun for me.

Ken
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Apr 22, 2018, 12:16 AM
Faster is Better
Slopemaster's Avatar
Pushrods are hooked up. Works well.

One thing I forgot to mention, the forward (elevator) servo rests on the radio compartment floor. So that supports it vertically. Not that it's needed.

Also I noted your suggested deflections. 12 mm for elevator makes sense, but only 12 mm for rudder? Doesn't seem like much.
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Apr 22, 2018, 12:26 AM
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Slopemaster's Avatar
Nose cone fits now with room to spare.
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Apr 22, 2018, 05:24 AM
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fly2bob's Avatar
Looks nice!!

Yeah I would go for as much throw on the rud as you can get.

Personally, I would go for more on the ele too. Better to have too much than not enough. You could program the lower part of dual rates to be 12mm, then adjust it later if need be.
Apr 22, 2018, 10:22 AM
Mark LSF # 3792
Looks good Slopemaster. I come to this late in the thread. I had an original 2M Spectrum with the "T" tail and the bagged 3012 wings back when they were hot, great flying airplane. It was demolished, nothing salvageable of the air frame, on the slope (Smashed Lost Or Pulverized Eventually).

I then built up a "newer" one from parts in the day. It's a 2M Spectrum fuselage, NSP spyder foam bagged "V" tail and Fred Sage triple taper carbon over foam 7037 wings. It weighed just over 42 oz. and was a great thermal ship at the time.

A few years back I refurbished it when I purchased my SD-10G radio. Went to all digital servos, JR DS368BB on flaps and Hitec HS-A5076HB servos for the V's and ailerons. Put in a 850 mah LiFe battery at the same time too. It now weighs sub 40 oz. (still unpainted) and is a hoot to fly! May never sell it. Launches to the moon and thermals even better than the original...so far as this old guy can remember.

Hope you enjoy yours as much as I have mine. BTW, I seem to recall seeing the original manual in my shop data somewhere. I might could make a copy of it if you're interested and I can find it, most of it is assembly instructions, but there was some set up instructions IIRC.

Mark
Apr 22, 2018, 01:44 PM
Faster is Better
Slopemaster's Avatar
Mark,

That's for the input. I agree it's a beautiful looking glider. The fuselage is sleek but still has personality unlike today's designs that just look like a javelin with a wing bolted on.

Bob,

Thanks, I agree with the rudder deflection. Right now I've got about 1.5" each way. I did set the elevator deflection per your recommended 12mm.

Of course this is a good starting point. After I fly it, it may change.

Next I need to check cg with battery/ receiver installed. If I remember correctly, it required additional lead to balance. The new servos together weigh an additional 0.5 oz than the old ones.

Since the new servos are located a bit aft of old servo tray, I can shift the battery back about a 0.5" and put extra lead in front.
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