"Drone Operators Are Not Pilots" - RC Groups
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Dec 06, 2017, 10:30 AM
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"Drone Operators Are Not Pilots"


Research paper by an Embry-Riddle Student.


Descriptive article
https://www.suasnews.com/2017/12/14-...rs-not-pilots/


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Dec 06, 2017, 11:12 AM
Commander, U.S. Navy (Ret.)
franklin_m's Avatar
So far as I could tell, there was but one part 107 event listed. From a pure research standpoint, one data point does not make a curve. He wants to make it more difficult to get a 107, but is conflating recreational and non-US events as the reason why?

Also, if 107 operators are not "pilots," despite actually being required to pass an FAA test, what does that make 101 fliers ... who do even less in order to "fly?"
Dec 06, 2017, 11:47 AM
RAF 001
KMK001's Avatar
Numerous writing errors. Several points made in a single paragraph. Acronyms used without first defining them. I could go on but I do hope this is not an example of what is acceptable and considered quality at Embry Riddle.
Dec 06, 2017, 03:56 PM
Registered User
The author states "A pilot is one that flies an airplane or helicopter and is licensed to do so." and "What does it mean to be a pilot. To the author, it means to be in control of a machine that moves through the air much like a car moves on the ground."

Ignoring the fact aircraft move in 3 dimensions and not "like a car moves on the ground.", ultralight aircraft and rotorcraft are piloted by operators who are not required to be licensed.
Dec 06, 2017, 08:25 PM
RAF 001
KMK001's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by ssobol
The author states "A pilot is one that flies an airplane or helicopter and is licensed to do so." and "What does it mean to be a pilot. To the author, it means to be in control of a machine that moves through the air much like a car moves on the ground."

Ignoring the fact aircraft move in 3 dimensions and not "like a car moves on the ground.", ultralight aircraft and rotorcraft are piloted by operators who are not required to be licensed.
Correct me if I'm wrong (Franklin_M), but if I recall correctly, Military Pilots are not licensed by the FAA. Exceptions are when one wants his private and advanced tickets. But for military flight, I believe there are no FAA licenses.
Dec 06, 2017, 11:26 PM
Registered User
Atomic Skull's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by KMK001
Correct me if I'm wrong (Franklin_M), but if I recall correctly, Military Pilots are not licensed by the FAA. Exceptions are when one wants his private and advanced tickets. But for military flight, I believe there are no FAA licenses.
That's because the FAA has no jurisdiction over military aircraft anyway and the Air Force can basically fly anywhere they want whenever they want and however they want and tell the FAA to go pee up a rope if they don't like it.
Dec 07, 2017, 12:53 AM
Commander, U.S. Navy (Ret.)
franklin_m's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by KMK001
Correct me if I'm wrong (Franklin_M), but if I recall correctly, Military Pilots are not licensed by the FAA. Exceptions are when one wants his private and advanced tickets. But for military flight, I believe there are no FAA licenses.

That is correct. They are not licensed.
Dec 07, 2017, 12:56 AM
Commander, U.S. Navy (Ret.)
franklin_m's Avatar

"Drone Operators Are Not Pilots"


Quote:
Originally Posted by Atomic Skull
That's because the FAA has no jurisdiction over military aircraft anyway and the Air Force can basically fly anywhere they want whenever they want and however they want and tell the FAA to go pee up a rope if they don't like it.


Not entirely true. Military pilots comply with the FARs just like everyone else. That said, there are specific but limited carve outs for certain operations. For example, speed below 10,000 MSL. When operating on defined Military Training Route, the normal 250 KIAS may be exceeded per the route limits.

Another exception would be operations in other special use airspace (MOAs, Restricted Areas, etc)

Yet another could be something as simple as lighting. KA-6D were permitted to have green anti-collision lights instead of red.
Last edited by franklin_m; Dec 08, 2017 at 09:04 AM.
Dec 07, 2017, 09:07 AM
RAF 001
KMK001's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by franklin_m
That is correct. They are not licensed.
Then this author is wrong on another count. Or, according to him, Military are NOT Pilots.

Think I'll go out and non fly for a while.
Dec 08, 2017, 05:24 PM
BFMAC Member #13
mongo's Avatar
just my personal view, but if yer but aint in the object yer trying to "pilot' then yer not a pilot, yer an operator.
Dec 09, 2017, 08:15 AM
RAF 001
KMK001's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by mongo
just my personal view, but if yer but aint in the object yer trying to "pilot' then yer not a pilot, yer an operator.
I can see your point but, how do you explain the difference between someone flying a basic 4 channel fixed wing with no extras. i.e. no gyros, auto pilot, GPS, FPV etc. And someone flying their Multi from their I-Phone. i.e. go here, go there, climb to XXX and so on?

I'd say the second one is more operator while the first is flying. Or at least directly controlling that which is flying.
Dec 09, 2017, 03:28 PM
LSF303-AMA Fellow
tkallev's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by KMK001
I'd say the second one is more operator while the first is flying. Or at least directly controlling that which is flying.
Pilot IN control loop vs. operator ON control loop ...
Dec 09, 2017, 07:39 PM
Lost Realist
Quote:
Originally Posted by KMK001
Numerous writing errors. Several points made in a single paragraph. Acronyms used without first defining them. I could go on but I do hope this is not an example of what is acceptable and considered quality at Embry Riddle.
It's fine to point out writing errors. Hopefully everyone understands, although many certainly don't, that writing errors have no bearing on the validity of the author's argument. You didn't explicitly make that claim but I think it's important to remind people of this fact.
Dec 10, 2017, 06:30 AM
RAF 001
KMK001's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by LyonNightroad
It's fine to point out writing errors. Hopefully everyone understands, although many certainly don't, that writing errors have no bearing on the validity of the author's argument. You didn't explicitly make that claim but I think it's important to remind people of this fact.
I think it can say a lot about the validity of the argument. He couldn't be bothered to put in the effort to correct his use of the language. What makes you think he bothered to put in the necessary effort on his argument?

He made the claim that real pilots are licensed by the FAA. To which I asked, what about Military pilots? They hold no tickets from the FAA unless they themselves pursue such tickets on their own. So according to this author, Military are NOT real pilots.

Were I his instructor I would have thrown it back to him and told him to fix it. The fact that this apparently did not happen tells me something about the instructor too. But, I would ask questions before settling on a conclusion.

Maybe you don't think language is so important. But I find it is the glue that holds a culture together and in so doing becomes significant in the survival of that culture. Now, show me where the American culture is today? I submit there isn't one. Thank your teachers!
Dec 11, 2017, 10:10 AM
Registered User
I flew a model airplane for a number of years, but NEVER considered myself a "pilot". Sorry, but I was remotely operating the model, not flying it. Same as if I was operating a back hoe or microwave oven. So "operator" is a more proper term here. At least, in my opinion.


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