Thread Tools
Nov 28, 2017, 01:56 PM
Registered User
pentium's Avatar
Thanks for the tip on reprap.me, its just a few blocks down the road for me, how did I miss it ? Now I have no excuses anymore...

Converting plans to 3d designs will take a while to learn, but I have made some progress with Autodesk already. For the moment I have one plan that I want to make flyable, I just don't want to start totally from scratch. Your design gives me a baseline to go after.

Yes it will take time to develop the first model, but as you enhance your skills and learn you will progress faster. It's like learning to build again.
Sign up now
to remove ads between posts
Nov 30, 2017, 11:26 AM
FDF - Front Door Flyer
derfred's Avatar
Thread OP
Iīve just updated the mail package file on thingiverse and on my website.

https://www.thingiverse.com/thing:2663805

https://aerofred.com/details.php?image_id=99742

New motor mount with torque compensation, wing tongue reinforcement and a few other minor improvements.
Nov 30, 2017, 02:29 PM
Retired CAD guy
birdofplay's Avatar
I DL'd from Thingie have the Wing parts all printed in CLEAR PLA + .

No problems as I simply used your factory files on my Folger FT-5.

I was amazed to actually SEE the internal sparlike parts printing.
I am referring to those spar like "plates" going from Top to Bottom scattered around inside the wings.
I was expecting big messes with them but they all managed to work quite well.

By SEE ,
I mean that the PLA+ string was dragged/extruded from side to side across a large chasm
then as it Cooled down it contracted and pulled itself straight !
Worked every time - wow-

I just never expected that to work as a design feature !
Bravo !

I may do the fuse in Orange.

Thanks for these files and design ideas !
Nov 30, 2017, 02:55 PM
FDF - Front Door Flyer
derfred's Avatar
Thread OP
Iīm glad it worked out fine, the retraction is important to get that right.

The inner structure should be stuck to the wall, if you could see an open space between them wile printing be careful, I think Iīve never seen that on my printer.

Please add some pictures of your build, Iīm really curious to see how you guys print your planes.

Some time ago I had an ft5 and to be able to use prusa gcodes straight I made a simple mod for it. The stl file attached replaces the X carriage and it has holes to fix a prusa extruder (mk2 type) you will need an mk9 filament gear and you will need to tune the steps per unit in the firmware but you will be able to use gcode files meant for the prusa i3 mk2 like those from 3dlabprint.

The prusa extruder stl files you can find on the prusa3d.com website.

The wing section1 on the previous file package has an issue near the tongue, the new version fixes this. Better download the whole package, the zip file from thingiverse or my website. The stl files I put there just to show people what to expect. Iīll delete most of them to avoid confusion.
Last edited by derfred; Nov 30, 2017 at 05:46 PM.
Nov 30, 2017, 08:31 PM
Retired CAD guy
birdofplay's Avatar
Not quite sure what you mean in some of the above discussion.

It just put everything in the same 0,0 corner so it fit easily on my Larger 300x300 platform.

Like I said it seemed to work just fine as is on mine.

I'll take a look at you new files however.

Thanks for the input tho :>}
Dec 01, 2017, 03:59 AM
FDF - Front Door Flyer
derfred's Avatar
Thread OP
From your description it seamed that your extruder was under extruding but if the print its strong and good looking the above suggestion is not necessary.

Is your ft5 extruder and x carriage stock?
Last edited by derfred; Dec 01, 2017 at 04:32 AM.
Dec 01, 2017, 09:29 AM
Retired CAD guy
birdofplay's Avatar
YES it is. I bought it in March2017 and had it working by early April.

I HAVE exchanged a few HOT END Parts for others as I had not assembled the
originals correctly which resulted in leaks and drooling PLA.

It's been Fine for months now and I never have clogs or difficulty exchanging spools.

Most of my slicer settings are similar or very close to what the 3dlabs guys are using.

As far as the FT-5 go's ..
I DO Have a plan to upgrade the X and Y Axis and use T8 acme screws.
Using the SAME motors and slides but removing all the belts and
adding very few extra or custom parts to remount the motors and shafts.

I am only stalled as I am UNSURE if the Motors and SW can be configured to
accommodate the T8 movement.
Motor configurations will need to be set to accommodate the T8 thread ratio.
Likely a MARLIN config, but not sure or how.

I am slightly worried that the motors will not be able to step fast
enough to maintain the current high speeds of 3dprinting.
Last edited by birdofplay; Dec 04, 2017 at 08:33 PM.
Dec 01, 2017, 10:09 AM
FDF - Front Door Flyer
derfred's Avatar
Thread OP
On mine I never used the original hotend or x carriage, I used that mount I sent you before and a prusa extruder with an e3dv6 hotend.

The picture above shows a d-bot but the extruder its the same as the one I used in the ft5.

I doubt that replacing the belts with leadscrews will make the printer better and you will have to deal with backlash, I wouldnīt do it but I would replace the flanged bearings with proper idler bearings in the X and Y, I did it on mine and the belts started to behave much better.

Yes, to do this mod you would have to configure the steps per unit parameter:
https://www.matterhackers.com/news/3...-configuration

This is basically how many steps the motor has to advance per length unit.

Then you have to configure the accelerations too, probably increase the values a bit, it would probably be a mater of trial and error.

That stl part above is the white part in the picture and the prusa extruder is the silver part.
Last edited by derfred; Dec 01, 2017 at 01:18 PM.
Dec 01, 2017, 03:52 PM
Destroyer of airframes
RTRyder's Avatar
So far I've finished printing the fuselage and elevator, working on the wing now. Mine is being printed 100% in ABS. Why? Well, a few reasons, one, ABS is 20% lighter than PLA per cubic cm of material, two, I can leave ABS sitting out on the bench at the field all day and it won't deform into some sort of modern art sculpture, and third, because I can!

Of course using ABS wouldn't be possible without a commercial grade printer with enclosed and heated build chamber which is what I'm using, so don't try this at home if you can't keep the ambient build temperature up around 70 degrees C for the entire duration of the print...
Dec 01, 2017, 04:21 PM
FDF - Front Door Flyer
derfred's Avatar
Thread OP
Looks very good, congratulations

Absolutely, I would use abs if I had a proper machine for that, itīs nice to see that your prints are coming out so well.

The inner structure is more visible than on PLA, that may have to do with the retraction setting or may just be the picture.

And you have an impressive setup there... Do you have any electronics inside the printing space?

The new zip package I added yesterday has a fixed wing section1 with a reinforced tongue, the wing servo covers and a motor mount with torque compensation, 2.5š right and 2.5š down.
Last edited by derfred; Dec 01, 2017 at 04:45 PM.
Dec 01, 2017, 04:46 PM
Destroyer of airframes
RTRyder's Avatar
The only electronics inside the chamber are the stepper motors and chamber heaters, the main electronics are in an external enclosure connected to the printer cabinet by three large cable bundles. The steppers and hotends are water cooled which allow printing at hotend temps up to 400 degrees C, maybe next time around I'll try polycarbonate!

Going to download the updated files when I get to the middle wing pieces, should have everything finished tomorrow or Sunday provided I don't run out of red filament first or decide to go fly my other sticks tomorrow and Sunday. Looks like the total print time is going to be around 20 hours or a bit less, haven't really been keeping track so not sure of exact time for all the pieces.
Dec 01, 2017, 04:57 PM
FDF - Front Door Flyer
derfred's Avatar
Thread OP
Thatīs good, the board would be easy to keep out of the heat, the steppers were my concern but thatīs a good solution. Have you built it yourself?

Never used polycarbonate, what would be the advantage for a plane in comparison to abs? Impact resistance?

I think the new wing section1 from the new file package will work fine with sections 2, 3 and 4 from the old, I sliced them in the same place.

Print weight on pla its about 850grams, I think I took about 40 something hours to print one plane on a prusa i3 mk2.
Dec 04, 2017, 04:52 PM
Registered User
pentium's Avatar
I am printing one right now. Bought some "DEVIL" PLA from reprap.me.

It takes a long time to print, but parts are just as fine as a design from 3dlabprint. I would say that this design is almost as printing one of 3dlabprints models.

Factory files and .gcode just ready to print, of course it helps to have a Prusa MK2

The design is a little different than 3dlabprints, but the model is also not as curvy as a Spitfire or even a Me 109.

The skin is supported by a thin honeycomb structure all over, which makes the skin stiff. Very interesting. I also like the possibility of using a carbon tube as main spar.

I have no doubt about flying this one. It will go like a glow-powered traditional fun-flyer, not like a slow flyer. I would maybe use a 4-500w drive for this one. The airfoils is thick and should be able to carry a heavy powerdrive in spite of having a span of just 115 cm.


Aerofred: When you draw a model, do you first design a full model with structural support and then split it up afterwards, and how ? I have designed a model in one piece but I don't know if I've drawn things in the wrong order..
Last edited by pentium; Dec 04, 2017 at 04:57 PM.
Dec 04, 2017, 06:12 PM
FDF - Front Door Flyer
derfred's Avatar
Thread OP
Wow, its starting to look like a plane

From the picture seams that your belts could be a little tighter,there is a little shadowing and the inner structure is too visible, that is usually a symptom on loose belts.

That PLA is good I used it for 6 months or so with great results.

Yes, this plane on a Prusa MK2 takes about 48 hours to print. It is basically the same as printing the 3d labprint qtrainer, its the same type of structure just the angle is different.

There are things I did that are closer to the old school model planes we are used, for me its a bit difficult to get away of it, I like the way wood planes are designed, there are things I consider important like having a strong front section and a firewall, fixing the wings with a tongue and nylon screws and like you noticed, the wing main spar...

Agree, it will fly like a glow plane, possibly a little lighter, I remember back in the day we had these 1.2 meter span models flying with a .25fp and 4 40 grams standard servos, 300ml fuel tanks and 4 AA batteries for the radio, the receiver alone weighted 60 grams or so! And the planes flew so well... This one will fly at least as well as those planes from 20 years ago.

I use fusion360, its all done there. You use the patch workspace for some things, the model workspace for other and the mesh workspace for other, the slicing is done on the mesh workspace.
Last edited by derfred; Dec 04, 2017 at 06:25 PM.
Dec 04, 2017, 09:12 PM
Retired CAD guy
birdofplay's Avatar
Fred,
Getting my fuse parts printed
You wanted some pix so here they are.

I suspect that if your FT-5 was several yrs old that it was different
than the one I got earlier this yr.
I used stock assy, Hot end et al.
It was my second 3DPrinter but the 1st one was a disaster and was returned for refund.

Mine HAD an Extruder Blower but it was not effective and caused more issues
than I wanted deal with so It's Gone now.
I Am considering a Rework of the X carriage.

I have already replaced all the turnarounds with Large Flange pulleys ( no more bearing sets !)
and WHITE belts with stainless steel embedded cables.

I use Rhino when I do 3D designs.

As far as my ACME X&Y conversion, I'm still on the fence.
I would use Anti backlash nuts&Springs and just start out by setting the steps to
exactly what the FT-5 is using for the Z axis acme screws - it's a Marlin Front panel setting.

I agree with you're Flyability assessment.
It should be as good as OR Better than the older heavier Ply&Wood versions !

This is a Big plane !

Bob @ Hoosier Cutout Service


Quick Reply
Message:

Thread Tools

Similar Threads
Category Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Discussion Das Mini Stik build bobbyblank 1/2A Planes 43 Jul 10, 2019 09:17 AM
Build Log Das Liddle Stick: Build from available plans yashodhanp Balsa Builders 14 Aug 14, 2017 09:19 PM
Discussion Installing Floats on Hobby King Das Ugly Stik lvflyer Waterplanes 3 Mar 03, 2016 08:39 AM
Gallery AquaStar-GWS Pico Stick-F - My Design Stik- Das Ugl-E Stik Videos **neons** Waterplanes 0 Sep 14, 2008 05:28 PM