Following on from the success of Gary's schooner Irene there is now enough action taking place on work benches around the globe to give this sister model it's own berth.
This new thread is intended to make searching on Emma topics a lot easier, even though much of Emma is covered by Irene anyway.
New readers interested in Emma should also frequent https://www.rcgroups.com/forums/edit...ost&p=38657763 and follow the Irene thread for a variety of input on all the various topics.
If you haven't done so already, Check out

http://www.bearospaceindustries.com/boats2.html

for pricing and content of the plans on offer. With a special pricing for both plans now on offer it is highly recommended that anyone looking towards building one or the other, or both, should avail themselves of the bundled deal.
Please continue to use the Irene thread for Irene specific discussions but reference to Irene features common to both might be included here.

Perhaps those of you who have either built the Emma, or are actually doing so, or are intending to, might like to let us know here even if it's only a future project.
Put me down as "doing so"

I am so glad you did this. I am in the process of building EMMA here in now sunny South Africa. I did battle to find the "door skins" and then found that it is called "commercial ply" here. From what Gary explained it must be the same stuff as it splinters like anything. With very limited tools available I am doing this using my trusty rotary tool (Dremil like tool). I have now got most of the bits cut out and just need to bring the cut lines down to the required lines. Will post some pics when some more is done.
I have a question here. Can I use an old IOM keel and rudder for her?

Originally Posted by SA/RCFlyer

I have a question here. Can I use an old IOM keel and rudder for her?

Can't think of a good reason to do so, really. Gary's keel was designed to suit this boat specifically. If it is anything like the Irene in performance it is the optimum. Rudders are really easy to make but so long as the surface area is approximate to his specs

Doesn't mean you can't do it anyway , but it would be taking a huge punt on it being as a good as. I guess you might settle for it sailing. Cutting the aluminium with a metal bladed jigsaw is easy, really is, but I guess you have access to one. A Dremel will NOT do!
But just my opinion, maybe someone else more familiar with I.O.M.s might be able to tell you how to do it.

Thanks anyway for using this thread, you are the first.

In regards to using door skins a.k.a commercial ply, as you say, it is indeed not as high a quality as pine ply. Adhesion tests I carried out on both materials has shown poorer adhesion if applied to the patterned surface of door skins. It works a lot better on the other side and particularly on pine ply (either side).

For anyone else who has struggled with the link in the first post, this one may well work better.

http://www.bearospaceindustries.com/boats2.html

Thayer

Thanks Thayer, my fault for not checking the link first. For some reason it used to work and was maybe before Gary and Spike redid the boat section recently.

I've corrected that error now.

Hi the Robcrusoe, thought I may as well join in on the dedicated blog relating to Gary’s sloop EMMA.
To anyone out there interested, Robcrusoe and myself have taken up the challenge to construct a pair of Emma’s (our respective boat names being ANNA and NELL) so as to have a bit of fun on sailing days with a bit of non competitive match racing. I will take the opportunity to post a few photos of progress during construction. We have both had a couple of workshops together printing off Gary’s plans, cutting out the required plywood panels and setting about firstly the construction of the fin box, which is critical to the successful assembly of the hull. I hope to be able to post a photo record of how things progress.
Cheers. CBS

CB, how exactly did you join the ends of the boat? Building Irene one side would fight hard to overlap the other and I didn't get them joined perfectly. I would like to do better on my Emma.

This seems a good time to mention the epoxy paste fillets. The hull can go together quickly and easily because the fit of the joints doesn't really matter. My Irene had gaps between the deck and hull and gaps in the chines but the filler took care of them. Fitting the rudder post block and mast step to the hull can be quick and dirty. I simply set them into blobs of filler.
Gary mentions Smith epoxy products but where I live something called PC-7 is available at Ace Hardware.
Learning to apply, spread, smooth, mold, and shape the filler would have saved me a lot of work and produced a much nicer looking result. Simply smoothing it with alcohol and a gloved fingertip works great.

Yours, Paul

G’day Glidin........
In reference to the bow and stern connections I drilled 2mm holes in both sides and tied the 2 together with an epoxy bead between. Once set I removed the ties and applied SikaFlex sealer adhesive. All of my joints between sides, bottom and bulkheads we’re done firstly using a bead of epoxy glue and then the SikaFlex applied with disposable gloves and smoothed over using my index finger. So far it seams to be working great, exceptionally strong.
Regarding the deck fitting, I too have a small gap (approx 1 or 2mm ) between that and the hull but thought of using a small bead of colored flexible gap sealant and finish again with glove and finger.

This whole thing is a huge learning curve for me, have been able to pick Robcrusoe’s brains when I get into hot water.

Hope you have success and I am really interested to see how your Emma turns out.

Cheers. CBS

Hey Glidin.....
Have attached a couple more photos showing what I meant by the the SikaFlex joints.

Hey, this thread is coming along nicely, precisely what most of us have experienced with work-arounds.

Both my Irene and Emma has minimal gaps around th edeck perimeter since I just can't face having glued the deck to th ehull only to come to a possible point later where I might want to access the inner hull for modifications or repairs. Have to say though, at this point, a couple of months into sailing Molly G, do not expect to ever do it. But, nice to know I can as the windows gap filler never really hardens and it would be easy to apply some gentle heat either from a blower or just leaving it the sun.. I use small round head stainless steel self tappers into each of the deck support blocks.

Anna is coming along nicely after several, well, "misadventures" in technique and is now ready to attach the sails. But first I need to install those sheet travellers, something I've wondered about leaving out. However it is something different so in they go.

I'll post some photos soon.

Anyway, here's how I drew up the shape of the mainsail. While it isn't necessary I also recorded the corner angles afterwards. Would certainly save time getting the edges and diagonal in harmony. I've always made a timber paneling template of any sails I received in a kit, bought over the 'net or made up according to instructions. not just for me but to help out anyone getting into the same project.
For me, at least, and no doubt for most, succeeding in a new boat project is paramount, but being able to encourage and support others following the same path is a close second.

Gary can't you please put all the pictures of Emma here? Especially the one that was built in the bakery.

I wonder what length Emma would be, maybe around 25 feet or 8 meters ?

Originally Posted by SA/RCFlyer

Gary can't you please put all the pictures of Emma here? Especially the one that was built in the bakery.

Happily - Here are a few photos of the "Emma" which was built at the Bakery Boat Yard by our friend Russ in California. He is a prolific builder, having since built a schooner "Irene" as well, and is currently building a model of a French gaff rigged fishing boat. He's also a swell guy and has kindly given me permission to share his photos. You'll note he added a great amount of detail to his "Emma".
Cheers and Thanks Russ for these photos -
Gary

A few pictures of the original Emma - Worth thousands of words (maybe)
Also wish to say I am DELIGHTED to see this thread underway, and Thanks to all who join in.
Cheers, Gary

Originally Posted by glidin'n'slidin'

I wonder what length Emma would be, maybe around 25 feet or 8 meters ?

Thanks for that bit of thoughtful curiosity Paul.
Emma's design is, and always has been, imaginary, but I could imagine her to be anywhere from 25 to 35 feet (8 to 10 meters) -
Just my own imagination of course, I hope others will indulge in the fantasy as they like. Another photo, just for fun.
Cheers, Gary

And might we all say thanks to you for the concept and the way to go about it.

Scuttlebutt The two Aussie Emmas are likely to debut together on December 20th at Lake Neangar in Bendigo Victoria.

Hi there Gary, great photos of the Emma. I have a few more to add relating to my build. Have been working thru the stages, getting a few tips along the way from Robcrusoe. Really enjoying the experience and can’t wait for our inaugural match race in a couple of weeks. This weekend for me is making cotton sails, have watched your YouTube presentation several times so hopefully right to go. Anyway enough said see photos below.

Cheers CBS.

Hi Crossbones - You and Robcrusoe Rock! - I'll be looking forward to the upcoming match race, have ordered extra popcorn!
Sailmaking this weekend -
Let me slip in a Hot Tip about making Emma's mainsail - At the peak of the sail, I leave extra length of bolt rope to form a loop which will engage the sprit. Simple & easy, see photo
Cheers, Gary

Hey Gary, thanks for the hot tip, will be sure to leave enough bolt rope to do that.
Cheers CBS.

Ah, Gary.. Too late for me.. mine are made,, CB is doing his early next week,

However, I have a plan.. sort of.

Just set up rigging to test the fit and operation, but at least it looks fairly complete. Bulb to be cast shortly for both boats.

Well, after approx 6 weeks of construction and some specific lessons on the art of sewing cotton sails, I think I am finally complete, excepting for the pouring and fitting of the lead ballast to the keel. It has been a fantastic experience and has prompted me to start my next project - THE IRENE. This one will take a while longer but having now built the EMMA, I am definitely more confident to undertake a bigger project. I have attached a couple of photos of the final product, but I will also have a few more shots when Robcrusoe and I match race the pair in Bendigo in a couple of weeks.

:Well done CB, been great watching you not making all the mistakes I had to , particularly because I did the Irene first.
There is no question about it, if anyone is more than just interested in doing this, then build the Emma first and really excel with the Irene.

You can expect the Irene to take twice as long, not for the the main construction but all the fiddley bits. and the additional rigging, etc.

It would be helpful to describe a good antenna arrangement for the split 2.4 gHz units.

Also, do sailors use the rubber grommet airplane style servo hardware or something more solid?
This sailwinch servo is pretty big

I've started Emma by cutting smaller parts from leftover plywood. I've got the radio setup built. Once again I'm using doubled plywood for things like the radio 1/4 x 1/2 x 9 inch pieces.
I need a sheet of plywood for Emma. Home Depot around here advertises lauan plywood for $10 per sheet.

Here's a sprit rigged double ender looking good

Sailing the "Oselvar" - Oselvarseiling (8 min 8 sec)

Here's another one

Swedish pilot sailboat replica based on a boat from 1914 (2 min 43 sec)

Intersting how the Star45 has similar construction as the Emma and Irene ...
Not double ended - but still hard chind.

I still like the look of Emma and Irene - since they both look more traditional - especially Gaff Rigged ... looking more like a Gaff Rigged schooner.

Note: updated comment as to Gaff Rigged ... which are - in my opinion - some of the most classic looking yachts

https://static.rcgroups.net/forums/a...%5B4394%5D.jpg

G&S

There is no point fitting rudder absorbent grommets in the winch servo mounting holes, unlike a model plane the Emma will not have a wildly vibrating engine to be allowed for. you would easily get away with just two diagonal mounting screws. But use them by all means if you prefer.

As for the dual antenna on 2.4Ghz, so long as one is above the waterline it really doesn't matter how they are placed. Having said that, the normal way is to mount one vertical, the other horizontally. But believe me, in one of these boats it wont ever matter.

Nice videos, by the way.

Slo.. The link shows what to me is a bermuda rig Aren't you talking about schooners? Nice boat anyway!

As CB has reported, I'm about to cast a bulb for each of our Emmas.
I'm doing it the Irene method, which how I've been doing it the past two years, but casting two halves that will be fixed both sides of the keel and secured with screws or thin bolts.

In our eagerness to cut out the two keel both CB and I forgot that we were going to widen the foot of the keel somewhat like an Irene to facilitate the fixing of these two halves. It wont really matter but we would have preferred some more area to attach it to.

Anyway, today I made up a slug (3D pattern) out of scrap balsa. Balsa because it is easy to build up with and shape. I just keep super gluing any thickness together, rather roughly, until, with sanding, it takes on the desired shape. I fill in any spaces with more slivers of balsa until it's reasonable smooth. I few imperfections is not an issue as the final cast lead will be "finished" off anyway.
The completed slug is going to be surely a bit oversized that is by design since it's easier to remove excess lead off the flat sides.
It measures 180 x 50 x60 mm
Will lbe interesting to see how our math worked out on the first half casting.
I will be doing the casting solo, simply so I can keep my attention focused on the job and stay out of trouble. All safety gear will be employed.
As Gary says, it is very hazardous stuff. If you are unsure, don't even attempt it, there are other ways of doing it without casting.

I've made the blocks from brush handle wood as in Gary's video.
The drill size is tiny and I found that a 1 inch piece of stainless 1/32" wire made a good drill bit using the snipped end.
For the wire strap I'm using the multi-strand stainless steel leader material from Eagle Claw fishing tackle Heavy Duty Leaders 45 pound. It has worked fine on my other blocks.

As to the ballast bulb, some may be uncomfortable with the idea of heating and pouring lead (for good reason). I tried another way for a smaller boat with good success. PC-7 epoxy paste was mixed with lead shot (mine was 1/8 inch diameter hemispheres) and packed into a simple wood mold. The fin was then pushed into the stuff. It takes overnight to harden. The bulb was then filed to rough shape and covered with a thin coat of PC-7, sanded, and painted. Since it's less dense than solid lead it will be a bit bigger but not to worry.

Hello all you Emma builders.
I've just started on a build of this lovely little boat-I cut out the bulkheads this week.
Any advice for a beginner would be very welcome !

Originally Posted by Tango22

Hello all you Emma builders.
I've just started on a build of this lovely little boat-I cut out the bulkheads this week.
Any advice for a beginner would be very welcome !

Hi Tango22,
Happy to know you have started building. If you come up with questions, post them here and you are bound to receive advice. The crowd here on the forum has been a great bunch. We'd love to see some photos as your project moves along.
Cheers, Gary

Thanks, Gary - I'll keep in touch.

Made my blocks, made my booms, but didn't assemble them together before gluing everything.
I'll make two more blocks.
Oops, Paul

Greetings, I built the rudder and will redo it. Oops
I used brass because I had some and silver-soldered it together. Then the 1/8 inch plywood was fitted and layered both sides with 1/16 inch balsa. I used Gorilla Glue, laid the assembly on waxed paper, covered it with waxed paper, and clamped between pieces of wood.
It's a mess. Some of the balsa moved and gaps filled with urethane foam. If I'd used epoxy or epoxy paste it would have been fine. Now I'll cut and grind the wood and glue away and rebuild.
Your Gorilla Glue Newbie, Paul

Tearing this apart the glue hardly held to the metal. Another oops

Balsa is best not used in rudders. Should moisture get in around the rudder shaft, in time, it opens up and generally destroys the rudder.
Use 6ply 4mm model ply and don't bother about foil profiles, flat is functional enough.. You can use 30 minutes epoxy to glue in the shaft but there is glue around called epoxy steel that does a long term job.

Because there was only a slight breeze we still went ahead, even though the sails barely filled out at times, it gave us a chance to inspect the boat positioning on the water. It also predicts that tomorrow's race day debut will be more active and interesting as both boats were very close matched in today's very mild conditions. So, what will happen when they lift their respective skirts ?, Stay tuned.

Originally Posted by robcrusoe

Balsa is best not used in rudders. Should moisture get in around th erudder shaf\t, in time, it opens up and generally destroys the rudder.
Use 6ply 4mm model ply and don't bother about foil profiles, flat is functional enough.. You can use 30 minutes epoxy to glue in th eshaft but there is glue around called epoxy steel that does a long term job.

All my rudders are balsa, covered with a layer of fiberglass cloth and resin. No problems ever.

Sorry, but I did say "best", not, "never", as a caution. Your method is certainly practical but also not easy for a novice FG user. The finish and durability of yours would be significantly better.

Maybe the traveler could be a bolt with a self-locking nut. This would allow quick sheeting, the bowline knot could be glued and left alone.
I doubt I'd get it tied "just right" over and over.

Merry Christmas, everybody! Paul

The traveler connection needs to be very light and as friction free as possible to allow the booms to swing right over in very light conditions. These is very evident as soon as you put your new boat on the water and under way. I'm using a brass tube (with SS inner rod) although I doubt it has any real advantage other than maybe appearances. But for general cruising Gary's method and construction seems to me to be fine, once you set the respective booms then in this boat particularly, you should never need to make any adjustments.
What I'm doing is leaving a couple of inches or so of cord hanging loose after the loop is in place (it won’t get in the way, even if looking a bit "odd") and use a pin to open the knot to make any further adjustments. Then trim it off, or hitch to the sheet above the bar but before the block.
If the Emma continues to sail anything like the Irene then the amount of sheet travel, and the boom positions most of the time, makes very little difference.
Gary can best explain this, as he has to me, but right now I think he must be away loading Sparkle up with Christmas gifts for his Mexican friends as he has gone very quiet.

Originally Posted by glidin'n'slidin'

Maybe the traveler could be a bolt with a self-locking nut. This would allow quick sheeting, the bowline knot could be glued and left alone.
I doubt I'd get it tied "just right" over and over.

Nice idea Paul, I reckon you will need to make such a bolt, but that surely would make for easy set up.
I manage to tie "just right" each time with help from an ink mark on the line.

With about 10 knots the ladies really got right down and into it.

Can't wait for heavier going, they will definitely handle twice that. (He thinks )

BearOSpace rc sloop Emmas in first match racing down under. (4 min 14 sec)

We both agree, sailing as a duo beats the heck out of solo, so when building, try to interest a sailing partner.

And yes, we are working on those sail creases. and yes, the video is bit jerky, hard to manage both at once, but.

Hi all.

I've added these beautiful designs here : http://www.allradiosailboats.com/designer/garyWebb

Do you know about any other designs by Gary Webb?

Thanks Thomas..
Those are the only two designs he has offered plans for. Both have variations in his own personal fleet, the plans representing the current version . We can only hope that he'll add to the range but it is a big task to do even one plan package.

While plan printing is under current discussion on the Irene thread I thought I’d add this in.

Needing a couple of copies of page 11 of Gary’s Emma plans I head doff to where I had them done before, but the store was closed for holidays. Fair enough. A few doors away is Officeworks (Australia) who I knew did general copying. Turns out they also do the A0 format which the Emma drawings will fit nicely into. They use 80 gsm paper which is durable enough to last the project through.

I got 2 perfect (100% to scale) copies done for a total of $9.

Why two copies? Well, I find tracing outlines from the plan onto pine ply using carbon paper a little indistinct for me. So one sheet will have everything cut out approx. to the outside of the line with an additional margin, then lightly tacked (not stuck) to the ply just enough to allow precise cutting and sanding. I found it wise not to use a strong adhesive as some, if not water soluble, hard to remove from the finished hull section component and ply is best not wetted, ever, unless on purpose (like sealing).

Note: the Irene plan is a tad too large across the page for A0, but I had it done and just added the missing bits off the bow and stern of the deck and main strakes. Finished boat looks just like any other!

How are others doing it?

Hi guys,

The schooner ‘Irene’ caught my eye very early in its’ blog on RCGroups. Not being one to rush into things, I watched the progress of glidin’n’slidin’ for a while so that he could have a chance to find the pitfalls etc. of the build. In June 2016 I bought the plans for ‘Irene’ and in December of the same year I bought the plans for ‘Emma’.

Did I mention that I am not one to rush into things? Well I am. No snide comments from ‘gp.’ thanks. I’ve decided that it is about time that I started building. I have a plan of attack devised. It runs as thus:

1. Clear a path through my shed so that I can get to the workbench. (shut up gp.)
2. Clean up the workbench so that I have room to build.
3. Build ‘Emma’ as a work-up.
4. Build ‘Irene’.
5. Travel to Bendigo to skirmish with robcrusoe and Crossbones06589 for the inaugural Aussie Title. I already have the apparently obligatory beard prepared.
6. Make sure that the inaugural Aussie Title is not scheduled too soon. Ref ‘Not being one to rush into things’. Did I mention that I also have about 7 or 8 A Class yachts to restore? Can I have a year or two warning on the race schedule please?

It’s only a seven hour drive to Bendigo. Unless I go via Melbourne, because I’ve always wanted to visit Adrian Brewer at Float a Boat.

Cheers,

Terry Smith

I am retired.
I have nothing to do and all day to do it.
Why don't I have any spare time?

Hey Terry

Hope you post photos of your build ...

Would also be nice to see you start a separate forum blog for the "A Class Yacht Restoration" you mentioned - especially since you said you were RETIRED