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Feb 18, 2017, 09:39 PM
Registered User
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Trump quotes Jefferson


Donald Trump quoted Thomas Jefferson at a campaign rally today, commiserating with Jefferson for his belief the news is all fake. It turns out the Washington Post had done a story that day and so the two are an interesting contrast to each other.

Trump quoted:
Quote:
Nothing can now be believed which is seen in a newspaper.
Which is certainly a quote that Jefferson made, talking about the ability for the news organizations of the day to get the details right. Jefferson argued that it was better to not read the papers at all if they couldn't get the fine details right. That makes a certain amount of sense if the newspapers are getting the details wrong all the time. Trump wants you to think that's what's happening today. And he's completely wrong about that. The newspapers of today get the vast majority of details correct, and only get the occasional fact wrong, as opposed to Trump, who spreads falsehoods nearly every time he opens his mouth. At the very least, nearly every time he's posting FAKE NEWS he's fitting the model of truth that Jefferson was complaining about. Getting a few major facts correct, and missing all the fine details in between.


https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/...aper-lies-too/

Quote:
Originally Posted by Thomas Jefferson
To your request of my opinion of the manner in which a newspaper should be conducted, so as to be most useful, I should answer, "by restraining it to true facts & sound principles only." Yet I fear such a paper would find few subscribers. It is a melancholy truth, that a suppression of the press could not more compleatly deprive the nation of it's benefits, than is done by it's abandoned prostitution to falsehood. Nothing can now be believed which is seen in a newspaper. Truth itself becomes suspicious by being put into that polluted vehicle. The real extent of this state of misinformation is known only to those who are in situations to confront facts within their knolege with the lies of the day. I really look with commiseration over the great body of my fellow citizens, who, reading newspapers, live & die in the belief, that they have known something of what has been passing in the world in their time; whereas the accounts they have read in newspapers are just as true a history of any other period of the world as of the present, except that the real names of the day are affixed to their fables. General facts may indeed be collected from them, such as that Europe is now at war, that Bonaparte has been a successful warrior, that he has subjected a great portion of Europe to his will, &c., &c.; but no details can be relied on. I will add, that the man who never looks into a newspaper is better informed than he who reads them; inasmuch as he who knows nothing is nearer to truth than he whose mind is filled with falsehoods & errors. He who reads nothing will still learn the great facts, and the details are all false.
http://press-pubs.uchicago.edu/found...speechs29.html
Feb 19, 2017, 12:03 AM
whiirrrrrr
srt8madness's Avatar
Consider this. When a news report on RC aircraft comes on, how often do they completely botch all or nearly all of the info? Damn near every one I've seen. We know that because we have first hand knowledge.

Now consider things we don't have first hand knowledge of. You think they get it right all of the sudden?

Just a couple of examples of the media getting the details wrong.

1. Muslim ban
2. Trump says mexicans are criminals and rapist.
3. Trump asked Russia to hack Hillarys server (this "comment" was long after her server was offline. Fyi)

That's just off the top of my head.

That Jefferson quote seems to be accurate after all.
Feb 19, 2017, 12:08 AM
Usual Suspect
RCWorks's Avatar
So Trump has seen the L.A. Times and the N.Y Times ehh?
Feb 19, 2017, 12:29 AM
Registered User
Fake news?????????? What a bunch of propaganda. Trump can't stay on message or remain factual long enough to finish a sentence. I don't need anyone or the media to tell me what he says or to describe his demeanor or to tell me that he is ignorant of civics and constitutional law.
Folks need only to watch his live performances and see for themselves. If they fail to see or comprehend then they are blind or in denial.
What he is doing is a blatant attack on the First Amendment to the Constitution which protects free speech and the free press; a tactic used early on by all dictators to squash all dissent.
Wake up folks. It's time to put America before party.
Feb 19, 2017, 02:52 AM
Suspended Account
Quote:
Originally Posted by Stinkey Propwash
Fake news?????????? What a bunch of propaganda. Trump can't stay on message or remain factual long enough to finish a sentence. I don't need anyone or the media to tell me what he says or to describe his demeanor or to tell me that he is ignorant of civics and constitutional law.
Folks need only to watch his live performances and see for themselves. If they fail to see or comprehend then they are blind or in denial.
What he is doing is a blatant attack on the First Amendment to the Constitution which protects free speech and the free press; a tactic used early on by all dictators to squash all dissent.
Wake up folks. It's time to put America before party.
LOL you crack me up...

Trump doesn't attack the right of anyone to say what they want... He just says things as they are.. The press and the medias are in bed with one party mostly and instead of reporting things and remain factual have an agenda and work that way.. Trump just reminds you that...

Now, when Facebook of Twitter censor certain type of conservative opinions , or decide to tell you what is fake news and what is not, this is an attack on the first amendment... But of course, people like you, at this point don't feel the need to protect the first amendment because the first amendment only matters when it is your side that is threatened..

I would ask you to wake up but I won't. You are wide awake. Just totally endoctrinated.
Feb 19, 2017, 03:01 AM
Registered User
Quote:
Originally Posted by srt8madness
Consider this. When a news report on RC aircraft comes on, how often do they completely botch all or nearly all of the info? Damn near every one I've seen. We know that because we have first hand knowledge.

Now consider things we don't have first hand knowledge of. You think they get it right all of the sudden?

Just a couple of examples of the media getting the details wrong.

1. Muslim ban
2. Trump says mexicans are criminals and rapist.
3. Trump asked Russia to hack Hillarys server (this "comment" was long after her server was offline. Fyi)

That's just off the top of my head.

That Jefferson quote seems to be accurate after all.
That doesn't even begin to meet Jefferson's description of what he's talking about. He's not talking about a few slanted stories, he's talking about the press making up the details by themselves to fill the page. That's simply not happening.
Feb 19, 2017, 04:00 AM
the great Gassif´er
It is also a fact that Jefferson said something along the lines of
If given the choice between a country with a government and no free press, or a country with free press and no government, he preferred the latter...
Feb 19, 2017, 05:14 AM
whiirrrrrr
srt8madness's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by thunder1
That doesn't even begin to meet Jefferson's description of what he's talking about. He's not talking about a few slanted stories, he's talking about the press making up the details by themselves to fill the page. That's simply not happening.
That is absolutely what has happened, maybe not as blatant as back then, but just as false.
Feb 19, 2017, 07:36 AM
the great Gassif´er
Quote:
Originally Posted by Brutus1967
It is also a fact that Jefferson said something along the lines of
If given the choice between a country with a government and no free press, or a country with free press and no government, he preferred the latter...
Found it:

Quote:
"The basis of our governments being the opinion of the people, the very first object should be to keep that right; and were it left to me to decide whether we should have a government without newspapers or newspapers without a government, I should not hesitate a moment to prefer the latter. But I should mean that every man should receive those papers and be capable of reading them." --Thomas Jefferson to Edward Carrington, 1787. ME 6:57
From: http://famguardian.org/subjects/poli...n/jeff1600.htm
Feb 19, 2017, 07:38 AM
the great Gassif´er
Quote:
Originally Posted by srt8madness
That is absolutely what has happened, maybe not as blatant as back then, but just as false.
No it is NOT...

All video fragments clearly PROOVE, it is not....

Maybe the written press dramatizes here and there, but you can NOT ignore the video's of a president outright lying....
Feb 19, 2017, 08:56 AM
Registered User
Douwe's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by brutus1967
it is also a fact that jefferson said something along the lines of
if given the choice between a country with a government and no free press, or a country with free press and no government, he preferred the latter...
^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^ This ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^ ^^^^