Taranis X9D Plus, new EU rules, D8 not legal, what's up? - RC Groups
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Jan 23, 2017, 08:07 AM
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Taranis X9D Plus, new EU rules, D8 not legal, what's up?


Hi!
Been away from the RC hobby a few years, and I want to get back again.
To start with, I thought updating my Taranis X9D Plus from HobbyKing, about 2015, to the latest OpenTX version would be a good idea. It has been updated to 2.1.* I think.

Now, already here I'm getting very confused. I use D8-receivers, mainly (D8R-XP and D6FR being my favourites) and now I'm reading that these are illegal to use, and not even possible with the new EU versions of Taranis?!

And then I read about downloading EU or Non-EU firmware to get around it etc. Are we talking something else than OpenTX fw? I want to have my Taranis updated to everything as recent as possible, I'm going to start from scratch anyways. I think the only thing I had to do when updating was to add some files to update Amber sound pack. I think there was some new additions from 2.1, I don't remember the details.

Anyways, I want everything updated, but I also want to be able to use my D8-receivers. What do I do?
Is there a firmware to be updated in addition to OpenTX? How about the receivers?

Last time I just connected OpenTX Companion, chose X9D Plus as transmitter, and I automatically got prompted for firmware. Made sure the transmitter was off, and it updated both bootloader and software without any issues.

What has changed? What's the status of the whole D8 and EU-deal?

I cannot think of any receiver more perfect than my D6FR's, it's super tiny, and I can monitor my battery + receiver voltage in addition to RSSI. Perfect for any kind of 4-6ch park flyers etc.
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Jan 23, 2017, 08:14 AM
Registered User
Still legal to use and sell but a TX sold in the EU after 2015 must be sold with EU compliant firmware. You can still flash non EU firmware yourself. With OpenTX firmware without the EU checked when downloading you can still use D8 mode even with EU-LBT firmware in the TX and RX.

So don't worry and enjoy
Jan 23, 2017, 08:15 AM
Taranis Tyro...
MattyB's Avatar
Here is the big thread on this topic - get yourself a beverage of your choice and sit down for a bit of light reading...

https://www.rcgroups.com/forums/show...-EU-and-EU-LBT
Jan 23, 2017, 08:23 AM
Registered User
EU-LBT?
So... there is another firmware in addition to OpenTX? Or... Sorry, I'm a bit confused here.
I did buy another receiver last year,( V8R4-II?) I don't remember, anyways I haven't tested that one.
But I do see some warnings on f.ex X4R on HobbyKing, saying you need to update the firmware of the Taranis to use it.

Guess I'll just have to read through that massive thread...

And I just wanted to update my Taranis :P

The firmware from Frsky seems to have an old version of OpenTx, so does this mean that I cannot update to newer ones?..
Last edited by nordemoniac; Jan 23, 2017 at 08:28 AM.
Jan 23, 2017, 08:30 AM
Registered User
EU-LBT is the RF module firmware, not the os (OpenTX). With D8 mode receivers there is no difference since they are all non EU. Only the X receivers with D16 mode have an option for EU-LBT or FCC firmware. That must match your XJT module in the Taranis.
Jan 23, 2017, 11:46 AM
Registered User
Aha, I see. For the internal RF module. I get it, so typically you don't update the FW on the module itself, just OpenTx "firmware", or the OS.

I'm getting there after reading through a bunch of these. But what I get from it, is that it's mostly considered negatively? Don't update, but rather "downgrade" the Rx's to non-EU for best performance.

I can't find it now of course, but I saw that some are experiencing problems, and less power with the EU-firmwares for their receivers?

FrSky lists some info under "XJT Firmware":
Quote:
FrSky has improved the performance of the BK-RF board of Taranis X9D Plus since Nov. 15th, 2016. For those with production dates between Nov. 15th, 2016 to Dec. 23rd, 2016, if you’d like to use with LR12 mode (L9R receiver), pls flash the firmware to Ver161214. For those with production dates earlier than Nov. 15th, 2016, no need to flash the firmware. For those with production dates later than Dec. 23rd, 2016, Ver161214 firmware will be as default.
Mine was bought early 2015, so I guess I shouldn't do anything?

But then there's this info further below:
Quote:
Firmware for Europe version of XJT module, Built-in XJT of X9D/X9D Plus. Bug fixed on D8 mode. Unnecessary do firmware upgrade for Non-European version. Important: 1. For old customer(Non-EU firmware devices) when flash to this firmware, must let Module in BIND mode at first to active EU firmware. 2. New CE certification can downloard here: XJT-EU-V1.8.1-CE certificate.
Which seems like if you're in EU with a non-EU firmware, you should update?

AFAIK for the EU-fw to make sense, both receiver and transmitter needs a EU-compatible fw, but none of my receivers have new firmware?
My receivers:
- D8R XP
- D6FR
- D4R-II
- V8R7-II

So - what do I do? Sorry if I missed it from the links, I'm just a bit lost with what the pros/cons are. Does it only make sense if I want newer receivers like X4R/X8R etc?

I like these old ones because of the analog telemetry, and how light-weight they are.
Jan 23, 2017, 02:01 PM
Taranis Tyro...
MattyB's Avatar
If you only want to use D series RXs you don't need to do anything at all.
Jan 24, 2017, 02:17 AM
Registered User
Atm. I don't have any other receivers, so I guess it doesn't matter yet.

Quote:
With OpenTX firmware without the EU checked when downloading you can still use D8 mode even with EU-LBT firmware in the TX and RX.
If I understand this correctly, the different firmwares are:
- International (Old)
- EU (2015)
- EU-LBT (2016)

Then there are some different versions of the international, which I linked to from FrSky, where they recommend some do update, while some don't need to.

The EU 2015 FW has poor performance, and people have experienced signal going from 2KM to 300m!

International and EU-LBT are similar in performance, but requires the receiver to support LBT, meaning the post-2015 receivers should work OOB. D8-based receivers are not supported and will not work - but they are disabled by OS, and not by firmware?
Which is why un-checking "EU" when updating OpenTX will make D8-receivers work as before, even with EU-LBT firmware?

Is this correct?

If so - should I just wait with updating the firmware until there actually is a point doing so, or could the EU-LBT FW + D8 be better in any way?

And how can the OS decide if it will work with D8 or not...? The only thing that makes sense is that the new FW disables it completely...

And btw, could FrSky have released a FW update for their D8's to be supported, or is the protocol too old?

And how do I know which firmware I have? Mine is from early 2015, but I'm not sure exactly when it was produced, but it was bought from the international store at HobbyKing.
Last edited by nordemoniac; Jan 24, 2017 at 02:33 AM.
Jan 24, 2017, 05:00 AM
Taranis Tyro...
MattyB's Avatar
Comments and corrections embedded below in blue...

Quote:
Originally Posted by nordemoniac
If I understand this correctly, the different firmwares are:
- International (Old)
- EU (2015)
- EU-LBT (2016)
Correct.

Then there are some different versions of the international, which I linked to from FrSky, where they recommend some do update, while some don't need to.

The EU 2015 FW has poor performance, and people have experienced signal going from 2KM to 300m! Correct - the EU v1 firmware had issues and has been superseded. It should not be used under any circumstances.

International and EU-LBT are similar in performance, but requires the receiver to support LBT, meaning the post-2015 receivers should work OOB. D8-based receivers are not supported and will not work - but they are disabled by OS OpenTX, and not by the internal module (RF) firmware? - Corrected.
Which is why un-checking "EU" when updating OpenTX will make D8-receivers work as before, even with EU-LBT firmware? Correct.

If so - should I just wait with updating the firmware until there actually is a point doing so, or could the EU-LBT FW + D8 be better in any way? It is not any better in terms of performance, it just means you can by new RXs in the EU and they will work out of the box.

And how can the OS decide if it will work with D8 or not...? The only thing that makes sense is that the new FW disables it completely... OpenTX simply removes the menu option allowing you to select D8, but D8 mode still resides in the internal XJT module.

And btw, could FrSky have released a FW update for their D8's to be supported, or is the protocol too old? If they were going to do this they would have done so by now, but (cynically in my view) they have made the commercial decision they are not going to. They just want people to buy more X series RXs as the margins are clearly better for them (we know it is technically possible to write EU compliant firmware for them as other brands using exactly the same chipset have done so).

And how do I know which firmware I have? Mine is from early 2015, but I'm not sure exactly when it was produced, but it was bought from the international store at HobbyKing. The only way to tell is to flash a known version to your TX, then see if it works. If it doesn't, try the other version! Based on the date and location of purchase however it is 99% certain you are on the International (or FCC as FrSky sometimes call it) RF firmware.
Jan 25, 2017, 02:50 AM
Registered User
@MattyB
Thank you so much for your replies! It really clears up my confusion here.

Btw. by this:
Quote:
And how can the OS decide if it will work with D8 or not...? The only thing that makes sense is that the new FW disables it completely...
OpenTX simply removes the menu option allowing you to select D8, but D8 mode still resides in the internal XJT module.
What I meant is that seen from FrSky and the new regulations, having the possibility to just not check "eu" when updating OpenTX doesn't make sense. This is a very simple loophole for any OpenTX user, surely FrSky will want to make a new XJT firmware that disables D8 fully to comply with the regulations?
Otherwise this only solves the issue for new receivers, but it has full backwards compatibility, only limited by the case of buyers not choosing D8 receivers, when they are easily acquired through f.ex. HobbyKing. Or are the D8's considered "illegal" now, as long as you didn't have them before 2015?
Jan 25, 2017, 04:13 AM
Registered User
You can flash FCC FW for any EU TX so why should FrSky want to disable D8? At least now the user uses EU-LBT D16 and D8 for some older legacy receivers.....

This is the reason why i ditched Spektrum because it was impossible to work around regulations and use old receivers.

So let's fight EU regulations instead of asking companies to be more compliant.....
Feb 05, 2018, 11:15 AM
Registered User
In open tx 2.2.1 go to settings make sure box eu is NOT ticked ,click ok
save firmware to tx in normal way should now have D8
Feb 09, 2018, 05:14 PM
Registered User
I bought qx7 when they came out new to frsky. I tried updating lost everything , freaked out ended up flashing eu lbt on radio. I have about 9 recievers that I had to flash new to lbt. Been thinking about flashing the fcc non eu firmware to interact xjt then I will have to flash nine receivers all in quad. Is this worth it? Am I lossing alot of performance?

Thanks for help
Feb 24, 2018, 05:25 AM
Registered User
Quote:
Originally Posted by normant
In open tx 2.2.1 go to settings make sure box eu is NOT ticked ,click ok
save firmware to tx in normal way should now have D8
This may be daft but if I update open tx with non EU will my quads with EU D16 in them work or would I need to update them as well?


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