Thread Tools
May 23, 2016, 04:41 PM
Dance the skies...
Tom Frank's Avatar
Discussion

The Mobius 2 ActionCam Support Thread (Key Info in Posts 1-7)!


Thread Usage Protocol

This thread is hosted by M2 users, not the camera developer, and is part of a radio controlled model web site in a Forum dedicated to Aerial Photography. As such, the content of this thread is intended to focus on the topic of the Mobius 2 Actioncam (NOT the original Mobius (1) which has it's own thread) and it's operation and capabilities for aerial video purposes.

That said, the Mobius 2 (a.k.a. M2) is unique in it's small size, weight, capabilities, and price point, making it ideal for many other uses to capture action video. There will be persons interested in the M2 for purposes other than aerial video directed here for camera support by various vendors, and you are welcome here for the purpose of helping you with the camera's operation.

Issues with adapting the camera to uses other than aerial video are considered off topic, and should be discussed in other forums or threads, e.g.:Video links posted here should relate to the RC aerial video topic area. Examples of off topic videos are:
  • Car driving recorder videos
  • Biking videos
  • Video of RC cars and boats
  • Routine ground scene videos to show off your new camera (I know you're excited, but...)

    Exceptions: Any video that shows a specific problem with the camera's operation or a solution for those problems are desired and will help others regardless of how they might use their Mobius.
Suggestions for camera feature improvements should be well thought out as having broad appeal, and realistic within the bounds of this camera's uniqueness for size, weight, and price point. Most of these will be firmware related, not physical redesign. The camera developer monitors this thread and has implemented many features from user input. But lets stay realistic. Complaint posts about the M2 not meeting your every need or do what much more expensive cameras can do have no place here.

Finally, this thread is a "self-help" thread! The 6 "info posts" following this one contain much information that can answer many user questions. These info posts will be updated as needed with new information. It is my intent and expectation that thread posters will "do their homework" and access these posts before posting new questions. If you still have questions, the advanced thread search function should be used to help find posts that relate to your issue. This will not only help keep the thread from becoming bloated with redundant questions that have been asked and answered many times, it will also keep the thread more interesting to the target audience.

If this is your first time reading this thread, please read the next 6 posts now to familiarize yourself with this thread's structure and resources.

Thanks in advance for your cooperation!
Last edited by Tom Frank; Nov 20, 2016 at 12:14 PM. Reason: Slight change to indicate thread hosting and support by users, not the camera developer
Sign up now
to remove ads between posts
May 23, 2016, 04:42 PM
Dance the skies...
Tom Frank's Avatar

M2 ActionCam Vendors and Specs


M2 ActionCam Vendors and Specs

The M2, by the developer of the highly successful original Mobius ActionCam and the #16HD "808-style" keychain camera, is a logical progression to the more capable 1080p-60 fps level of video hardware. The features that made the M1 such a hit, namely small, light, configurable, great video, and low cost have been retained to match the capability of the new hardware. The firmware will take many months to mature and incorporate all the capabilities of the new hardware, but the developer is actively pursuing this goal while watching this thread for user feedback on the camera's functionality..

Verified Vendors

[B]You are advised to only buy your M2 from a developer-verified source. Verified vendors not only sell the real M2 camera, accessories, and some replacement parts, they have pledged a commitment to customer satisfaction, both before and after a sale, and are your first contact if any early problems are found and not caused by user abuse, crash damage, etc. If parts are not listed on their sites, use their web site email contact link to request what you need. Payment via PayPal is usually available. The developer's China eBay seller will usually have the lowest delivered prices. The other re-sellers may offer quicker delivery depending on your location. Prices can vary from one vendor to the other and depends on what is included in different accessory packages. The cost from the China direct seller eBay outlets will be nominally about US$89 with free shipping.

Direct Sellers:
China: eletoponline365;
Re-sellers:
China: BangGood;
U.S.: BuyMobius.com, a.k.a. novotm (MA); SPYTEC (NY); BangGood-US warehouse (CA)
Europe: Mobius-cam (English),(Dutch); BangGood (UK warehouse); Webbex (UK); StudioSPORT (FR); Mobiuscam (RU); Revotech (CZ)
Non-verified sellers may be selling fake imitation cameras at seemingly bargain prices, and you should be wary of buying from them.

NOTE: Both users and vendors are expected to abide by this forum and thread vendor communication protocol.

Memory Cards

Standard Class 10 or UHS-1 microSDHC cards from popular manufacturers should be used for the high data rate recording of this camera. Currently, cards with a capacity up to 200GB can be used, but they MUST be formatted as FAT32. ALL MEMORY CARDS should be formatted using the camera's internal formatting routine for best compatibility!
. If you are uncertain about what kind of memory card to buy, order one from the camera vendor when you place your order.

Case Design



The camera has a modern case design precision molded of rugged high-density plastic to house the circuit board and LiPo cell battery. Three buttons (power, mode, and shutter) are provided to toggle various functions, with 4 colored LEDs for visible feedback on the cameras operation via an internal "light-pipe" to make the LEDs visible on both the top and side of the case where the buttons are located. The bottom of the case has 6 small ventilation slots to allow internal heat to escape. A metal heat sink plate is inside with 4 brass screw studs protruding through the case to accept mounting screws. A brass tripod mount piece is included which attaches with the 4 screws. It also gives added heat dissipation, though it is NOT necessary for cooling with proper mounting of the case.

The basic camera weighs approximately 45 grams (without lens cap) and measures nominally 59mm (case body) and 64mm (at lens protrusion) (L) x 36mm (W) x18mm (H).

The inside of the case top and bottom has precision molded rib structures to accurately position and securely hold the CMOS/lens module. Embedded into the case bottom is the aluminum heat sink plate with 4 brass screw inserts for attaching the tri-pod mounting piece. A clear plastic "light-pipe" insert in the case top is positioned over the 4 circuit board function LEDS to channel the light to the top and side LED view ports.


Circuit Board and Battery

The circuit board has a reset button and easy disconnects for the battery and CMOS ribbon cable. The charging and external communication port is a standard 10 pin mini-USB socket. An over-voltage protection IC on the USB external power input which will disconnect the external power and protect the camera if the voltage is between 5.6V to 28V. The CMOS imager and DSP chips used in the camera are confidential at this point at the developer's request. The stock 820 mAH battery can power the camera for at least 2 hours of full HD recording.



Lens Module

The CMOS imager is on a thin circuit board attached to the back of the lens module with two screws. It's ribbon cable is secured via a clamping socket making it possible to replace just the CMOS imager if necessary. The M2 CMOS imager and ribbon cable are NOT compatible with the original Mobius (M1) CMOS or ribbon cable due to a different number of traces. But a #16 808-style camera lens extension cable WILL work with the M2 module, but only the very short one (6cm / 2.5"). A longer cable will attenuate the signal too much and will NOT work. The CMOS has an active pixel array of 1920 x 1080 (16:9 aspect ratio) for full HD video recording. The standard lens is a wide angle design with a HFOV of 130 deg. FOV in 1080p mode. Other lens options will be offered as the camera matures. The module has an M12 thread and can accept other lenses with matching threads, though 3rd party lenses may or may not have the necessary focal plane diameter or distance from the back of the lens to properly focus and cover the CMOS array to avoid vignetting or cropped corners.


Approximate Weight of Basic Components

Stock camera (with battery & memory card).. 45 gms.
Case with heat sink.................................... 13 gms.
Battery (820 mAH)..................................... 16 gms.
Circuit board ............................................. 9 gms.
Lens module and ribbon cable....................... 7 gms.
Tripod mounting piece and screws................. 7 gms.
Mounting base plate with screw stud............ 10 gms.

Mounting Options

The case bottom has 4 M2 screw studs molded into it and anchored in the heat sink inside. These can be used to attach the camera to a flat plate for a mount of your own design. Those studs also accept the stock tri-pod attachment piece (standard 1/4-20 thread) and will mate with a variety of heavy duty mounting accessories. Three of these are a flat surface adhesive pad mount, a bike handlebar mount (accommodates oversize bars), and a lever-actuated suction mount for smooth surfaces such as a car windshield. Each of these specific mounting options use an adjustable articulating ball piece that screws into the base plate, making very minute changes in alignment possible.


The optional helmet mount has both a slightly flexible adhesive pad plus a retaining strap for rugged use. The screw attachment point has only two rotation axes available for aiming the camera.


Another option is a mini-tripod bolt mount for use as a web cam or other use on any level surface.


User Toggled Functions

Under construction
Last edited by Tom Frank; Feb 14, 2017 at 09:37 AM. Reason: add #16 lens extension cable compatibility comment
May 23, 2016, 04:42 PM
Dance the skies...
Tom Frank's Avatar

Camera Configuration and Firmware


Camera Configuration and Firmware Information

It is strongly recommended that users with Windows PCs always use the mSetup graphical user interface (GUI) program to change camera settings and update firmware.

This post by Isoprop has a link to download his free Windows GUI (mSetup.exe) for easy configuration of the M2 settings, and also his M2 User Manual.

This post by Thomas has links to his Mobius 2 Android configuration application.

New firmware and user settings can be loaded into the camera manually as a last resort (see below), but it requires specific file editing and handling procedures as well as multiple button press sequences on the camera. It is easy for user errors to cause these updates to fail! Also, there are numerous camera settings, some of which conflict with each other if both are toggled on at the same time. The GUI program will not permit these conflicting settings to be set so will eliminate all of these user error possibilities, so please do yourself a favor and use the GUI if available for your computer or handheld device.


Optional Manual User Configuration Setting Procedure

If a GUI tool is not available for your computer or you would rather just edit the configuration text file manually, it's easy to do, just follow these steps exactly:

1. Download the camera's configuration file to the flash card in the camera (HOLD DOWN MODE BUTTON, THEN ALSO HOLD DOWN POWER BUTTON UNTIL THE RED LED BLINKS 3 TIMES THEN TURNS OFF).

2. Turn the camera on, connect it to your PC, and access the camera root directory when it goes into the "removable disk mode". You should see three system folders on the card MOVIE, VIDEO, Syscfg, and also the camera configuration file, syscfg2.txt. Do not confuse this with the syscfg folder which is explained below in the Firmware section.

3. Open the "syscfg2.txt" config text file with a simple (ASCII) text editor (e.g. the familiar "Notepad" text editor for Windows users). The file will look similar to this:
Date format=[2];set date format,0:YYYY/MM/DD, 1:DD/MM/YYYY, 2:MM/DD/YYYY
/**Note: "Date time" must be in accordance with the date format specified otherwise unable to set the date**/
Date time=[11/11/2016-11:52:44];date time setting,yyyy/mm/dd-hh:mm:ss,dd/mm/yyyy-hh:mm:ss, mm/dd/yyyy-hh:mm:ss
Modify datetime=[0];date time setting comfirm,0:not set 1: modify

Default Mode=[0];set power-on default mode,0:Video Mode 1, 1:Video Mode 2, 2:Photo Mode

VIDEO MODE 1
Movie Resolution=[0];0:1080p,1:720p,2:wvga
Movie Frame Rate=[1];0:120fps,1:60fps,2:30fps,3:100fps,4:50fps,5:25fps ,Note:120fps and 100fps only for 720P and WVGA.
Movie Sound=[2];set movie sound,0:Mute,1:Low,2:Medium,3:High
Movie Cycle time=[2];movie cycle time,0:3 minutes,1:5 minutes,2:10 minutes,3:20 minutes
Movie Loop Recording=[0];set loop recording on or off, 0:off, 1:on
Movie Rotate=[0];set movie rotate,0:No,1:Inverted,2:90 degrees Right,3:90 degrees Left
Movie Time stamp=[1];set date/time stamp on or off,0:off,1:on
Movie Bitstream Algorithm=[1];set video bitstream,constant-bit-rate(CBR) or variable-bit-rate(VBR),0:CBR,1:VBR
Movie quality=[0];set movie quality,0:Highest,1:Higher,2:High,3:Standard,4:Low ,5:Lower,6:Lowest
Movie Codec=[1];set video codec,0:H265 HEVC,1:H264 AVC
Movie WDR =[0];set Wide Dynamic Range,0:Off,1:On

VIDEO MODE 2
Movie Resolution=[1];0:1080p,1:720p,2:wvga
Movie Frame Rate=[0];0:120fps,1:60fps,2:30fps,3:100fps,4:50fps,5:25fps ,Note:120fps and 100fps only for 720P and WVGA.
Movie Sound=[2];set movie sound,0:Mute,1:Low,2:Medium,3:High
Movie Cycle time=[2];movie cycle time,0:3 minutes,1:5 minutes,2:10 minutes,3:20 minutes
Movie Loop Recording=[0];set loop recording on or off, 0:off, 1:on
Movie Rotate=[0];set movie rotate,0:No,1:Inverted,2:90 degrees Right,3:90 degrees Left
Movie Time stamp=[1];set date/time stamp on or off,0:off,1:on
Movie Bitstream Algorithm=[1];set video bitstream,constant-bit-rate(CBR) or variable-bit-rate(VBR),0:CBR,1:VBR
Movie quality=[0];set movie quality,0:Highest,1:Higher,2:High,3:Standard,4:Low ,5:Lower,6:Lowest
Movie Codec=[1];set video codec,0:H265 HEVC,1:H264 AVC
Movie WDR =[0];set Wide Dynamic Range,0:Off,1:On

PHOTO MODE
Photo Mode Capture Size=[0];set photo size,0:1920x1080,1:1280x720,2:848x480
Photo Rotate=[0];set Photo rotate,0:No,1:Inverted,2:90 degrees Right,3:90 degrees Left
Photo Time stamp=[1];set date/time stamp on or off,0:off,1:on
Set Time Lapse Shooting=[0];0:off,1:0.25s,2:0.5s,3:1s,4:2s,5:5s,6:10s,7:30s,8 :60s

SYSTEM SETTING
Auto Power off=[1];set system auto power off time when system pending,0:off,1:30 seconds,2:1 minutes,3:2 minutes
Power off=[1];set system power off time,0:delay,1:fast
Power on=[1];set system power on time,0:delay,1:fast
Auto Record with External Power=[0];set connect with power to start video recording automatically,0:off,1:on
One Power Button to Auto Record=[0];set press power key to start video recording automatically,0:off,1:on
LED=[1];set LED flicker when recording,0:off,1:on
Charge from USB Host=[0];when connecting with USB host, charge camera or not,0:on,1:off
Light frequency=[1];set light source frequency,0:50 HZ,1:60 HZ
TV out=[0];set Tv out,0:NTSC,1:PAL

Motion Detect=[0];set motion detect,0:off,1:on
Motion Detect Timeout=[0];set motion detect timeout,0:5s,1:15s,2:30s,3:60s
Motion Detect Sensitivity=[0];set motion detect Sensitivity,0:high,1:nomal,2:low

IMAGE QUALITY SETTINGS
Enable Manual AE Lock or AWB Lock = [3]; 0: Not enabled; 1: AE Lock and AWB Lock; 2: AE Lock only; 3: AWB Lock only.
(Long 3 sec. Mode button press required to turn AEL or AWBL on)
White Balance=[0];Set White Balance,0:Auto,1:Sunny,2:Cloudy,3:Tungsten,4:Fluor escent,5:Snow,6:Diving,7:Custom WB1,8:Custom WB2,9:Custom WB3
Sunny(4800-5500K) used for sunny with clear sky(Rgain=484,Ggain=256,Bgain=416);
Cloudy(7000-9000K) used for shade or heavily overcast sky(Rgain=484,Ggain=256,Bgain=341);
Tungsten(2500-3200K) used for Tungsten bulb (or called Incandescent light)(Rgain=332,Ggain=256,Bgain=627);
Fluorescent(3800-4500K) used for fluorescent lamps(Rgain=370,Ggain=256,Bgain=577);
Snow used for snow day(Rgain=476,Ggain=256,Bgain=406)
Diving used for dive water(Rgain=495,Ggain=256,Bgain=368)
Customized White Balance 1 Red Gain=[256],Green Gain=[256],Blue Gain=[256];
Customized White Balance 2 Red Gain=[256],Green Gain=[256],Blue Gain=[256];
Customized White Balance 3 Red Gain=[256],Green Gain=[256],Blue Gain=[256];
Set red ,green,blue gain,256 is 1x gain,value from 100 to 999;

Exposure Value=[0];Exposure compensation,values from -128 to +128,In 1 increments,default value is 0
Exposure Strategy Mode=[0];set exposure strategy mode,0:exposure high light prior,1:exposure low light prior
Exposure Metering=[2];set exposure Metering,0:center weighted,1:center spot,2:multi-spot,3:upper weighted,4:down weighted

Color Effect=[0];Set Color Effect,0:Standard,1:Mono,2:Cool,3:Cooler,4:Warm,5: Warmer,6:Vivid
Contrast=[0];Set Contrast,values from -128 to +128,In 1 increments,default value is 0
Saturation=[0];Set Image Saturation,values from -128 to +128,In 1 increments,default value is 0
Sharpness=[0];Set Image Sharpness,values from -128 to +128,In 1 increments,default value is 0

kernel version:1.0.6
rootfs version:1.10
software version: 2.02
Note: User-variable function key values the camera uses are shown bolded in the square brackets. Functions shown may vary with firmware updates, but manual editing is similar.
4. Replace any number(s) in the square brackets with any valid alternate setting number, shown highlighted to the right of each function. At the bottom the version numbers of three important system files are identified. which can be important when manually updating the FW (more on that below).
NOTE: Except for certain functions which cannot co-exist, invalid numbers or other characters in the square brackets has not shown to cause serious problems since the camera should ignore them or use default values.
5. Save the revised file back to the memory card root directory, but do not change the file name.

6. Upload the revised configuration back into the camera using the same key-press sequence used to download the configuration. The red LED will turn on, then blink while the config file is loading. Keep both camera pressed down during this process.

7. When the LED turns off, you're done! The new configuration will be in the camera and the config file will be automatically deleted from the flash card. You may check the flash card to confirm this if you wish.


Firmware Firmware updates will contain bug fixes, new or improved features, or both. You are advised to always update the firmware if you want your Mobius to give you all it can. You are strongly advise to ALWAYS use the GUI tool for all camera firmware changes (see above). The GUI will determine if your camera firmware is out of date and download the latest firmware if you agree choose for you to install.

The firmware development and refinement is a continuing process, and the most recent OFFICIALLY RELEASED version will be linked at the bottom of this post. I keep old, obsolete firmware in case anyone needs a copy (PM me with your email address).

The M2 FW uses a LINUX OS, with three files necessary for proper operation, named:
  1. kernel - the Linux core code
  2. rootfs - Linux OS support files
  3. TLC.S001.MB00100000 - the FW function code

The FW file will always be needed for updates, but the other two files will only be changed infrequently. All three files, however, will be included in every new FW download to be sure the camera has the necessary code to function. A manual download will retrieve a zipped archive file named "M2 APP FW X.YY.zip", where "X.YY" will be the FW number. Unzipping the archive will produce three separate folders containing the above three system files, with the folders named to clearly indicate what they contain, e.g.:
  1. M2 kernel VA.BB - where "A.BB" is the kernel version number, with the file inside ALWAYS just named "kernel"
  2. M2 rootfs VC.DD - where "C.DD is the rootfs version number, with the file inside ALWAYS just named "rootfs"
  3. M2 FW VX.YY - where "X.YY" is the version of the FW file inside, which is ALWAYS named "TLC.S001.MB00100000".
NOTE: The names of the files must not be changed or the camera will not be able to load them, so it's necessary to keep each file in it's own folder to identify its version number.


Optional Manual Firmware Update Procedure

The following procedure is for manually updating your camera firmware. It is not necessary to do this if you can use the Windows GUI configuration tool (see above). It will determine if your camera firmware is out of date, download the latest firmware if you agree, and install it for you, taking all the potential for user error out of it. You are strongly advised to ALWAYS use the mSetup GUI tool for all camera firmware changes.

The updated FW file (TLC.S001.MB00100000) will always need to be loaded. The kernel and rootfs file required by the FW may already be in your camera and would not need to be loaded again. It is safe to reload them, but it will increase the updating time, especially the rootfs file which is quite large.[/B] You can easily check to see which versions of the three system files are in the camera by two different ways. The first was given above where extracting the configuration text file manually to change settings is explained. The kernel, rootfs, and FW (called "software" in that file) are clearly shown at the end of the configuration file. A second way is to simply turn on the camera on and open the "syscfg" folder in the memory card root directory. This folder is created every time the camera is booted. In there is a file named "DvConfig.bin, which is a hex dump of the configuration from the camera memory. Opening that with a simple text editor will show something like this:
2.02 1.10 1.0.6 2016/11/11-11:27:47
. The first three sets of numbers are the FW, rootfs, and kernel versions, respectively. If the rootfs or kernel file versions from either of these methods match the same version numbers for those files in the FW download archive, you do NOT need to load in those files again, and only the newly downloaded FW file (TLC.S001.MB00100000) needs to be copied to the memory card for uploading into the camera. It does not hurt to reload all the files, but it can take a lot longer (about 2-1/2 min. to load all three files).

ALERT:
  • READ THE UPDATING INSTRUCTIONS FULLY BEFORE STARTING
  • DO NOT BEGIN UNTIL YOU UNDERSTAND EACH STEP
  • DO NOT SKIP ANY STEPS
1. [B]Download the "M2 APP FW x.yy.zip" firmware archive file and un-zip it. Copy the necessary system files (see above) from their identifying folders to the camera's memory card root directory. This can be done with the card in the camera connected to the computer as a Removable Drive, or externally in a card reader. But do NOT copy the folder(s) containing the file(s) and do NOT rename the file(s). If you do, the camera will not install the system file!

2. Disconnect the camera from the PC, but make sure the camera battery is well charged, or better yet, connect an external USB power source to make sure the camera does not lose power during the upload.. Don't worry, a failure to complete uploading of the system files cannot brick the camera since the boot loader file is not affected by this process. You can always do another upload by repeating this process. If you have an external USB power source connected, the GREEN LED charging indicator may be lit, which is OK. It doesn't impact the upload process, but be sure the camera is turned off before starting.

3. Insert the flash card containing the new firmware file(s) into the camera (if not already in the camera).

4. Press the Power button briefly and the RED LED will begin blinking. RELEASE THE POWER BUTTON AS SOON AS LED FLASHING BEGINS! If you keep pressing it longer, you may turn off the camera before the update process is done. DO NOT PRESS ANY BUTTONS WHILE THE INSTALLATION IS IN PROGRESS . The upload can take as little as about 10 seconds if only the FW file is being loaded, or as long as 2:15 minutes if all three files are being loaded!

5. To confirm the system files are being uploaded, the RED LED will continue to blink at different rates with possible off periods of a couple seconds during the upload process.

6. When the FW installation is complete, the RED LED will turn off and the camera will shut down after deleting the system files from the memory card. The process is pretty fool proof, if you follow the instructions explicitly, take your time, do not press any camera buttons, and wait for at least 15 seconds with no LED activity before trying to turn on the camera.

7. You're done! Turn on the camera... the RED LED will stay solid for about 5-6 seconds the first time it is booted after an update while it reconfigures the card folders. You should check that the system files were deleted from the card, and I recommend also checking the DvConfigs.bin file in the syscfg folder to confirm the version numbers of the installed system files are correct.


Firmware Download Site

Click on this link to download the latest FW (V2.08 and support files).
.
Last edited by Tom Frank; Apr 12, 2017 at 02:00 PM. Reason: Update with new FW v2.08
May 23, 2016, 04:43 PM
Dance the skies...
Tom Frank's Avatar

M2 User Maintenance


UNDER CONSTRUCTION
The images shown may be for the M1 camera, but are similar to the M2.

BATTERY AND CMOS/LENS MAINTENANCE

1. Opening the case

The case has a top and bottom piece held together by two screws on the bottom front corners and two interlocking tabs/lugs on the back. Remove the two screws, lift the front of the case slightly, and pull it towards the front (towards the lens) to remove the bottom piece and expose the circuit board.

(images to be provided)

There are three tiny screws securing the circuit board to the case top, but you will never need to remove these for normal maintenance.

(image to be provided)

2. Replacing the battery

The battery simply plugs into socket on the circuit board, and it has a key on the plug so it cannot be plugged in with wires reversed. The plug can be quite hard to remove, so a slight side-to-side rocking action with a thumb nail or NON-METALLIC tool in the gap between the plug and circuit board socket can help free it without exerting excessive force on the circuit board. NEVER PULL ON THE BATTERY WIRES to remove the plug! Plug in the new battery, re-position the cell and battery wires, and replace the case top when done. Note that the M2 stock batteries have a small circuit board soldered to the battery tabs. This board has an IC chip that protects the cell from being over-charged or over-discharged. While this protection is redundant and a back-up to similar protection circuits in the camera itself, use of stock batteries is highly recommended to assure this added level of battery protection.

(image to be added)

3. Replacing the CMOS imager module

NOTE: The camera battery should be removed before doing this (see item 2., above)! The pictures referenced below incorrectly show the battery still connected!

The CMOS module is press fit into a ribbed securement structure on the case. Because the CMOS ribbon cable is very short and can be damaged easily, it's advisable to first slide the ribbon cable from it's socket before the module is extracted. The ribbon cable slides into a socket on the circuit board and is clamped in place by a hinged clamping tab.



The cable is released for removal by gently lifting up on the aft edge of the clamping tab with a thumb nail or NON-METALLIC tool, such as a toothpick.



Gently slide the ribbon cable out of the socket with a NON-METALLIC tool such as a toothpick.


Now the CMOS module can be extracted from the case, but it is a very tight fit and should be done carefully. I find the best method is to use a tool as a lever to just slightly lift one side of the module at the screw lug A strong (e.g. metallic) tool may be needed for this, and can be used without getting close to any circuitry if applied at the side of the module near the edge of the case. Once the edge of the module is lifted, the module can be easily removed with your fingers. Just be careful to not twist or over-extend the ribbon cable.



Replacing a module is slightly different.


With the locking tab lifted, gently insert the ribbon cable into the circuit board connector, making sure it is fully inserted. It's a snug fit and needs to be inserted straight with maybe a slight side-to-side rocking motion. DO NOT force it. When in place, close the locking tab to secure the ribbon.


Now position the module over it's seat in the case, allowing the ribbon cable to bend naturally. DO NOT force a sharp bend in it. When in place, push the module into the case slot by pressing on the side lugs. It's a very snug fit, and a slight rocking side-to-side rocking motion may be needed. Make sure the lens is centered in the case opening and replace the case top.


4. Refocusing or Replacing the Lens in the CMOS module

This is not an easy task. The threaded lens may NOT be secured in the module with a tiny set screw like the M1, but the hole for the screw is in the module which looks to be identical to the M1 module. If yours has a set screw, it requires a 1MM hex Allen wrench to loosen it. The lens may be glued in place and the glue must be chipped out of the lens threads with a hobby knife where it enters the module before it can be rotate, and this can be very difficult or even impossible!



To refocus the lens, simply remove the case bottom, mark the initial position of the lens with a thin line of paint across the lens threads and module base (optional-for future reference only), then remove the glue (or loosen the set screw) until the lens can be rotated in the housing. When facing the front of the lens, turning it to the left will move it further away from the CMOS and move the prime focus closer to the camera. The reverse will do the opposite. The lens should turn easily once the set screw is loosened enough, but there are small notches in the lens front rim to aid in turning the lens if needed. There should be enough room in the case to make moderate focusing adjustments without having to remove the module or circuit board from the case. Focusing can be done in web cam mode while viewing the image on a monitor, or by trial and error still or video shots noting the lens position for each and comparing afterwards. Its been claimed that still images of the same scene will have the largest file size when the camera is in best focus, though I prefer a visual indicator and have not tried to confirm this. The standard lens has a large depth of field, and images should appear as sharp as the lens is capable of from about 2 ft. out to infinity when in good focus. When the lens is focused to your requirements, simply re-tighten the set screw and replace the case bottom.

To completely replace the lens, you will need to remove the module from the case (see item 3., above) to allow enough room to completely unscrew the lens from the module. NOTE: If the lens appears to "jam" and not unscrew easily, see this post for a possible reason and solution. Then replace the lens, reseat the module, and replace the case bottom.
Last edited by Tom Frank; Sep 16, 2016 at 05:40 PM.
May 23, 2016, 04:44 PM
Dance the skies...
Tom Frank's Avatar

Faqs


(under construction)


Camera Operation


Video Issues



Audio Issues



Editing Issues
Last edited by Tom Frank; Jul 21, 2016 at 01:41 PM.
May 24, 2016, 07:19 AM
Registered User

Mobius2 Windows Setup program and Manual


This is the original Mobius GUI which was created in co-operation with the developer and Tom.
The program supports all Mobius cameras (Mobius, Mobius2, Mobius Mini) as well as the #16, which was also developed by the Mobius team.
mSetup is backward compatible to all Mobius firmware versions and all firmware versions for the #16 808 cameras that support USB communication.
Click HERE to download the GUI and/or User Guide.

The program is a native Windows application specifically written for the Windows operating system (XP and above) and does not require any 3rd party runtime system, for example Java or .NET, to be installed. The simple and extremely user-friendly program is fully plug-and-play and includes an integrated User Manual.

The software will also identify all unknown USB cameras and devices with a capacity of 200GB or less. So, if the GUI doesn't recognize your camera, you don't have a #16 or a camera from the Mobius family!

If you don't yet have the camera you may want to take a short peek at the integrated help, available by clicking the 'Help' button.

Remember you can resize the dialog by dragging the gripper at the bottom right corner if you prefer a smaller image. The dialog fonts will automatically be resized to fit.

The latest GUI software configuration tool together with the latest instruction manual (User Guide) may be downloaded by clicking on the link above or on one of the images below.

It is strongly recommended that you enable automatic program and firmware updates which will allow you to always benefit from the latest available tools. This is specially worthwhile during the first few weeks after the initial release.

Here are some screenshots of the GUI (Graphical User Interface)










... there's always an online user guide (manual) at your fingertips


... you can set your own parameters and download new versions


...and of course you can set your own colors for the program


... There's also a function where you can increase or decrease the playback speed of any .mov or .mp4 media files


...and lots of useful information too


To date, mSetup has been translated into 13 different languages:
Traditional Chinese, Czech, Dutch, French, German, Hindi, Hungarian, Japanese, Polish, Portuguese, Russian, Spanish and Turkish.
Many, many thanks to all translators for your hard work!
Here's an example:



mSetup is guaranteed 100% Clean, which means it does not contain any form of malware, including but not limited to: spyware, viruses, trojans and backdoors.

Click the image below for more information.
Last edited by Isoprop; Jan 17, 2017 at 08:02 AM.
May 24, 2016, 07:19 AM
Registered User
I will update this post with more information when time permits.

The Mobius 2 (M2) uses the same cable as the Mobius Mini

Last edited by Isoprop; Aug 25, 2016 at 11:56 AM.
Old May 25, 2016, 12:17 AM
flyflysky
A moderator felt this post violated the following rule: Trolling (Obnoxious behavior). It is temporarily hidden while flyflysky edits it.
May 25, 2016, 05:51 AM
Registered User

Android application


Android application Mobius ActionCam now supports also Mobius 2.
You can change configuration and manage files in the camera. Live video is not supported by the camera at the moment.

If you have any questions, please look at this thread.
Last edited by Thomas.; Jul 26, 2016 at 11:14 AM.
May 25, 2016, 05:58 AM
Registered User

Android apps


Mobius USB Tools
This app now supports the new Mobius-2 ActionCam, all Firmware versions ever released, with the same super smooth User interface that automatically matches camera mode without any User intervention. See Features Web Page for more information.

OTG Status
This app now supports the new Mobius-2 ActionCam and tells you if your phone/tablet provides basic, limited, or full USB OTG support.
It also tells you if your phone/tablet can run the app listed above; if not, it tells you exactly why.

Support Web Page
My Support Web Page contains a lot of useful information and is updated from time to time; it also contains details about special offers when available. Make sure to refresh page to get the most recent version.

Available video:
See Play Store for available app names and descriptions.
Last edited by therau2000; Nov 22, 2016 at 06:44 AM. Reason: Mobius-2
Jul 22, 2016, 03:53 AM
Registered User
I think this thread needs a little bump...
Jul 22, 2016, 04:52 AM
aRCee Moloko [YT]
Justapoke's Avatar
So who's gonna post the first sample videos ?

Jul 22, 2016, 04:53 AM
Just say "No, it's under 250g"
scottyo's Avatar
Very glad to see 90 degree rotation in firmware!!
Jul 22, 2016, 05:06 AM
Registered User
Cant wait to receive mine!
Jul 22, 2016, 05:12 AM
A man with too many toys
Anyone seen it in US stores?
Jul 22, 2016, 05:13 AM
Registered User
Bill Glover's Avatar
Thanks Tom. USB pinouts (when known) would be very useful.
Jul 22, 2016, 06:05 AM
"long stretch of water..."
coongoola's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by scottyo
Very glad to see 90 degree rotation in firmware!!
It's always been available in the Mobius.

Pat
Jul 22, 2016, 06:17 AM
Multirotors are models too!
Quote:
Originally Posted by coongoola
It's always been available in the Mobius.

Pat
I think 180° was available. Didn't see 90°

Rusty
Jul 22, 2016, 08:28 AM
Registered User
There is firmware, a manual and a setup utility and even a list of trusted sellers but there is no camera for sale! Is it a joke or what? Maybe the producers found serious bugs and stopped selling it until all required improvements are made?
Jul 22, 2016, 08:33 AM
Registered User
ukbren's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by acritum
There is firmware, a manual and a setup utility and even a list of trusted sellers but there is no camera for sale! Is it a joke or what? Maybe the producers found serious bugs and stopped selling it until all required improvements are made?
how hard did you look?
http://www.ebay.com/itm/152173086360
(from one of the vendors listed in post #2 of this thread)
Jul 22, 2016, 10:07 AM
Dance the skies...
Tom Frank's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by coongoola
It's always been available in the Mobius.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rusty105
I think 180° was available. Didn't see 90°
Rusty
Pat
The original Mobius could do 90 deg. rotation, but required a special version of the CMOS module which has the CMOS rotated 90 deg., so it could only do 90 deg. rotations. The M2 can rotate the video in the camera with a FW setting, so it's not necessary to buy a special 90 deg. CMOS module.
Jul 22, 2016, 10:11 AM
Registered User
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rusty105
I think 180° was available. Didn't see 90°

Rusty
there is an M1 CAMERA with the lens rotated 90°, not by software...
http://www.ebay.com/itm/Mobius-Actio...0AAOSwEeFVUcwu

"The lens is 90 degree rotated, and you can mount the camera sideway. This package is using Lens A, standard lens with minimum fisheye distortion."

EDIT: Tom already answered...but hey, if is it rotated 90°, which resolution is supported?
Jul 22, 2016, 10:14 AM
Dance the skies...
Tom Frank's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by RC Man
Anyone seen it in US stores?
There are two US re-sellers listed in the up front list of verified vendors. I update the first 5 InfoPosts with any important new information, which is why going there first is recommended.
Jul 22, 2016, 10:25 AM
Dance the skies...
Tom Frank's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by Matt_V939
there is an M1 CAMERA with the lens rotated 90°, not by software...
http://www.ebay.com/itm/Mobius-Actio...0AAOSwEeFVUcwu

"The lens is 90 degree rotated, and you can mount the camera sideway. This package is using Lens A, standard lens with minimum fisheye distortion."

EDIT: Tom already answered...but hey, if is it rotated 90°, which resolution is supported?
All resolutions are supported! But what you get is a tall, narrow "portrait" version, e.g. 9:16 aspect ratio instead of a "landscape 16:9 image. Note that most monitors (e.g. 1080p resolution) will not have enough vertical pixel count to display the full sized height of a 90 deg. rotated 1080p video (1920 pixels) or even a 720p video (1280 pixels), so the video will either play in a down-scaled size to fully fit the monitor display, or be cropped or scrollable in a window to view the entire height, depending on what software is being used to display the video. WMP and VLC default to a down-scaled image that fits the monitor height on my system, but MPC-HC defaults to a cropped image (appears to be from the middle of the full height frame) and is not scrollable, but the frame size can be set in the software user settings to display like the other two.
Last edited by Tom Frank; Jul 22, 2016 at 10:42 AM. Reason: add more info on players
Jul 22, 2016, 10:34 AM
Registered User
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tom Frank
All resolutions are supported! But what you get is a tall, narrow "portrait" version, e.g. 9:16 aspect ratio instead of a "landscape 16:9 image. Note that most monitors (e.g. 1080p resolution) will not have enough vertical pixel count to display the full sized height of a 90 deg. rotated 1080p video (1920 pixels) or even a 720p video (1280 pixels), so the video will either play in a down-scaled size to fully fit the monitor display, or be in a scrollable window to view the entire height, depending on what software is being used to display the video.
Gotcha, like those cellphone video....which then IMHO is rather useless (could do that in post, the only difference would be to have the time&date in the right orientation...)
Jul 22, 2016, 02:28 PM
"long stretch of water..."
coongoola's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rusty105
I think 180° was available. Didn't see 90°

Rusty
Oops. My mistake, I thought it was referring to 180°

Pat
Jul 22, 2016, 07:40 PM
Beating air into submission!
GrahamWilson's Avatar
Is this on sale now?
Jul 22, 2016, 07:48 PM
Dance the skies...
Tom Frank's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by GrahamWilson
Is this on sale now?
Yes, read the first several info-posts, please.
Jul 22, 2016, 09:32 PM
Registered User
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tom Frank
All resolutions are supported! But what you get is a tall, narrow "portrait" version, e.g. 9:16 aspect ratio instead of a "landscape 16:9 image. Note that most monitors (e.g. 1080p resolution) will not have enough vertical pixel count to display the full sized height of a 90 deg. rotated 1080p video (1920 pixels) or even a 720p video (1280 pixels), so the video will either play in a down-scaled size to fully fit the monitor display, or be cropped or scrollable in a window to view the entire height, depending on what software is being used to display the video. WMP and VLC default to a down-scaled image that fits the monitor height on my system, but MPC-HC defaults to a cropped image (appears to be from the middle of the full height frame) and is not scrollable, but the frame size can be set in the software user settings to display like the other two.
The advantage is that this function gives the option of having a landscape video while allowing the camera to be mounted portrait if I have understood correctly.
Jul 22, 2016, 09:50 PM
Dance the skies...
Tom Frank's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by Fbtsomp
The advantage is that this function gives the option of having a landscape video while allowing the camera to be mounted portrait if I have understood correctly.
No, that is not correct. With the M1 camera that had the special 90 deg. module with the CMOS rotated 90 deg., what you described is what you will get. You get a normal 16:9 "landscape" image with the long dimension still horizontal with the camera rotated 90 deg. because the CMOS is still oriented with it's wide dimension horizontal.

But that is not possible when the rotation is done in FW with the CMOS imager rotated 90 deg. such as is the case when the M2 is rotated 90 deg. When rotating with FW in the camera, what you get is an upright image, but it is tall and skinny because the CMOS imager is in a "portrait" orientation. The normal wide dimension is now vertical rather than horizontal, but the image will appear upright, not sideways.
Jul 22, 2016, 10:14 PM
Registered User
DaneLaw's Avatar
No sample clips at all..have schimmed the first posts but didnt took notice of any, or on yt..


*an picture (from the otherwise respectable Ebay seller) that more looks like photoshopped image' ref blurriness around the hub, - that doesnt inspire confidence on a 90US purchase..
sure the videosamples will come when people starting to get there hands on one, but I guess its more me' that havent foud any clips yet, any familiar with some,?-and a indication of the result it performs.

http://imgs.inkfrog.com/pix/kdataonl...s_Plus-015.jpg

http://www.ebay.com/itm/152173086360?rmvSB=true
Last edited by DaneLaw; Jul 22, 2016 at 10:28 PM.
Jul 22, 2016, 11:28 PM
Registered User
Quote:
Originally Posted by ukbren
how hard did you look?
http://www.ebay.com/itm/152173086360
(from one of the vendors listed in post #2 of this thread)
Does not ship to my country


To all M2 owners: The only thing that I hate in my Mobius is the exposure calculation and it feels that Mobius development was stopped after M2 was released. Can anyone try M2 with a "lamp test" that I've made with Mobius here to see how M2 calculates exposure. Just record a lamp against some poorly lit background in different places of the frame (sides, 1/3, the center) and see what will remain visible: the lamp or the background. Please use default settings (no manual exposure compensation!).
Jul 23, 2016, 02:26 AM
Registered User
Firebird_PL's Avatar
What should convince me to buy a Mobius 2?
Only one poor comparative photo-edited picture, which is not a raw file?
There are no sample clips. Was the camera even be beta-tested by trusted testers?
Jul 23, 2016, 02:55 AM
Registered User
Quote:
Originally Posted by acritum
To all M2 owners: The only thing that I hate in my Mobius is the exposure calculation and it feels that Mobius development was stopped after M2 was released. Can anyone try M2 with a "lamp test" that I've made with Mobius here to see how M2 calculates exposure. Just record a lamp against some poorly lit background in different places of the frame (sides, 1/3, the center) and see what will remain visible: the lamp or the background. Please use default settings (no manual exposure compensation!).
Back when you posted that, I tested the 0.57 version versus the latest 2.41 on a Mobius with a standard A lens, and I found that the 2.41 version gives better low-light results. If the change that was made between 0.57 and 0.59 affected how the camera behaves with no IR filter but improved how it behaves with an IR filter, I don't think most Mobius users would call that a "bug."
Jul 23, 2016, 04:09 AM
Just say "No, it's under 250g"
scottyo's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by Firebird_PL
What should convince me to buy a Mobius 2?
Only one poor comparative photo-edited picture, which is not a raw file?
There are no sample clips. Was the camera even be beta-tested by trusted testers?
There are some sample raw clips at this pre-release feedback thread (now closed): https://www.rcgroups.com/forums/show....php?t=2670643 (see posts 146 and 279) Note: These clips were shot with different versions of firmware prior to release.

Someone posted the unboxing clip (shot with an M2) to youtube:
Mobius V2 Unboxing (9 min 28 sec)


The camera was only released on Tuesday. Many of us are waiting for shipments to arrive. I am sure there will be more video (and reviews) once people start receiving their cams. This thread is actually a support thread and it's purpose is not to convince you to buy one (although you may be convinced to at some point). Hang on.
Last edited by scottyo; Jul 23, 2016 at 04:26 AM.
Jul 23, 2016, 11:35 AM
Registered User
I have Mobius 2 couple of months, maybe I can upload some short clips
Jul 23, 2016, 01:16 PM
Registered User
Quote:
Originally Posted by RogerDH
Back when you posted that, I tested the 0.57 version versus the latest 2.41 on a Mobius with a standard A lens, and I found that the 2.41 version gives better low-light results. If the change that was made between 0.57 and 0.59 affected how the camera behaves with no IR filter but improved how it behaves with an IR filter, I don't think most Mobius users would call that a "bug."
I've recorded a lot with an IR filter and without it using 2.41 and I don't like it. The problem is not in low-light conditions which may be recorded pretty fine, but in the light that may appear there even in small amounts and darken the whole image to complete black. If you can repeat my lamp test (in public or PM) with any lens that you like using 2.41 and it will give acceptable results (not worse than 0.57 firmware), well, maybe I'm a stupid idiot who missed something. But now I use older firmware. Maybe it blinks sometimes but at least it doesn't darken the picture when I record windows or other light sources. Anyway, this is for another Mobius1 thread where people were also tired of this exposure discussion so maybe PM is better
Jul 23, 2016, 01:20 PM
Dance the skies...
Tom Frank's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by Thomas.
I have Mobius 2 couple of months, maybe I can upload some short clips
Hi Thomas.,

What FW is in yours?

I've shot clips with the release FW v1.36, but it needs more reduction in sharpening for best results. Sharpening was even higher and WB less stable in FW prior. I'm holding off posting more samples again until an updated FW with less sharpening is available as a minimum.

The release FW is in it's infancy, and needed improvements and new functions are being incorporated as fast as practical. I expect to see FW updates released in the coming weeks/months.

FWIW, the clip linked above is AVC encoded and native from the camera (not re-encoded) and shot with the Standard default bit rate (32.5 MB/s), with 3 other rates higher and lower than that available. The sound is also at the Standard default setting, with one level higher and lower available. The many Image Quality user options found in the M1 are not yet implemented, but are planned along with some new ones.
Jul 23, 2016, 02:12 PM
A man with too many toys
Tom, do you have any still photos you can upload?

.
Jul 23, 2016, 04:20 PM
Regurgitation Utensil.
xanuser's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by DaneLaw
No sample clips at all..have schimmed the first posts but didnt took notice of any, or on yt..


*an picture (from the otherwise respectable Ebay seller) that more looks like photoshopped image' ref blurriness around the hub, - that doesnt inspire confidence on a 90US purchase..
sure the videosamples will come when people starting to get there hands on one, but I guess its more me' that havent foud any clips yet, any familiar with some,?-and a indication of the result it performs.
yeah. it seems odd that all these new cams never want to post videos of actual action footage. all we get for about 3-4+ weeks is the odd streetscape shot. if these guys wanted to really sell these things, all they'd need to do is strap it to a plane or quad, put it though its paces , and post some vids.... i know the first thing i do once i had one in my hands, is burn some packs thrashing the thing around and upload the video of it!
Jul 23, 2016, 04:25 PM
Beating air into submission!
GrahamWilson's Avatar
RCG really needs a like button.
Jul 23, 2016, 04:30 PM
Dance the skies...
Tom Frank's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by RC Man
Tom, do you have any still photos you can upload?

.
The attached zipped folder has in it:
1. a "one frame video" .mp4 file from the M2 - this shows a single HEVC encoded frame from the M2 save as an .mp4 "video"

2. A .jpg frame grab from the same clip via Avidemux

3. A .jpg frame grab from the same clip via MAGIX Movie Edit Pro X editor

4. A native .jpg photo from the M2

The one frame movie shows what the native video colors look like. The two frame grabs show that these two editors, one free and one quite $$, can't render a frame with .jpg compression and keep the same color fidelity as the native video. And finally, the native photo from the M2 shows that photos have not been given a lot of priority yet when it comes to matching the color WB, exposure, contrast, etc. of the video... still a work in progress for photos. I expect that will be corrected in due time, but this is, after all, meant to be an action camera for video. Since the CMOS is 1920 x1080 in size, it may be better to just shoot video and pic the frame(s) that looks best to you? It depends on how you use the camera and what you are trying to capture, I guess.
Jul 23, 2016, 04:42 PM
Dance the skies...
Tom Frank's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by xanuser
yeah. it seems odd that all these new cams never want to post videos of actual action footage. all we get for about 3-4+ weeks is the odd streetscape shot. if these guys wanted to really sell these things, all they'd need to do is strap it to a plane or quad, put it though its paces , and post some vids.... i know the first thing i do once i had one in my hands, is burn some packs thrashing the thing around and upload the video of it!
The guys who are developing these cameras are not necessarily RC modellers, so they can't do what you do. They are just trying to refine the camera. Now if I were a re-seller, I'd do what you suggest. I do like to fly my RC models, but I'm not in the business of selling the cameras. I'd fly more if I spent a LOT less time with these forums, that's for sure.
Jul 23, 2016, 05:26 PM
A man with too many toys
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tom Frank
The attached zipped folder has in it:
1. a "one frame video" .mp4 file from the M2 - this shows a single HEVC encoded frame from the M2 save as an .mp4 "video"

2. A .jpg frame grab from the same clip via Avidemux

3. A .jpg frame grab from the same clip via MAGIX Movie Edit Pro X editor

4. A native .jpg photo from the M2

The one frame movie shows what the native video colors look like. The two frame grabs show that these two editors, one free and one quite $$, can't render a frame with .jpg compression and keep the same color fidelity as the native video. And finally, the native photo from the M2 shows that photos have not been given a lot of priority yet when it comes to matching the color WB, exposure, contrast, etc. of the video... still a work in progress for photos. I expect that will be corrected in due time, but this is, after all, meant to be an action camera for video. Since the CMOS is 1920 x1080 in size, it may be better to just shoot video and pic the frame(s) that looks best to you? It depends on how you use the camera and what you are trying to capture, I guess.


Thanks, the native M2 .jpg is far superior. If you want a good photo you have to take it as a still photo.

Is it the video data compression that makes the frame grab lower quality or what?


.
Jul 23, 2016, 05:41 PM
Registered User
wkf94025's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by xanuser
if these guys wanted to really sell these things, all they'd need to do is strap it to a plane or quad, put it though its paces , and post some vids....
+1!
Jul 23, 2016, 06:27 PM
Dance the skies...
Tom Frank's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by RC Man
Thanks, the native M2 .jpg is far superior. If you want a good photo you have to take it as a still photo.

Is it the video data compression that makes the frame grab lower quality or what?
Hmmm.... aside from the yellow hue of the WB and exposure differences, I see it the other way around. In the lower lit shade of the evergreen shrubs, especially on the left, there is blurred mush. Switching quickly to one of the frame grabs instantly reveals a lot of detail that is not visible in the regular still photo.

But, beauty is in the eye of the beholder, and why all the IQ controls will be added in the near future.
Jul 23, 2016, 07:51 PM
Regurgitation Utensil.
xanuser's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tom Frank
The guys who are developing these cameras are not necessarily RC modellers, so they can't do what you do. They are just trying to refine the camera. Now if I were a re-seller, I'd do what you suggest. I do like to fly my RC models, but I'm not in the business of selling the cameras. I'd fly more if I spent a LOT less time with these forums, that's for sure.
BUT aren't they're trying to sell an ACTION cam.???

strap it to a bike, a motorcycle, a dog, or a cat, shoot - toss it out a 5+ story window and let it swing from a piece of string... i dont care.

JUST SHOW SOME ACTUAL ACTION FOOTAGE IF YOU WANT TO SELL AN ACTION CAM!!!
Jul 23, 2016, 10:07 PM
Beating air into submission!
GrahamWilson's Avatar
Strap the camera to a helmet and go for a bike ride
Jul 24, 2016, 01:27 AM
Registered User
Firebird_PL's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tom Frank
The guys who are developing these cameras are not necessarily RC modellers, so they can't do what you do. They are just trying to refine the camera.
So that's why developer should have a group of volunteer beta-testers, who can test the camera in different activities.
Dev could easily find them here, on rcgroups.
Jul 24, 2016, 02:06 AM
Beating air into submission!
GrahamWilson's Avatar
I would be happy to strap to my quad and my fixed wing and fly some sorties with it. But I am not ordering a new one until I have seen some actual footage.
Jul 24, 2016, 03:48 AM
"long stretch of water..."
coongoola's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by Firebird_PL
So that's why developer should have a group of volunteer beta-testers, who can test the camera in different activities.
Dev could easily find them here, on rcgroups.
Quote:
Originally Posted by GrahamWilson
I would be happy to strap to my quad and my fixed wing and fly some sorties with it. But I am not ordering a new one until I have seen some actual footage.
Mine will be here soon and I'll upload videos from my hat and my Bix3 within a couple of hours of receiving the camera.
I'm confident that the developer has got the firmware right for the initial release and I'm sure there will be updates to follow soon. Just like the M1 😊

Bring it on... ✊

Pat in Oz
Jul 24, 2016, 07:24 AM
Just say "No, it's under 250g"
scottyo's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by GrahamWilson
I would be happy to strap to my quad and my fixed wing and fly some sorties with it. But I am not ordering a new one until I have seen some actual footage.
Mine should be here soon too. I will also shoot some video and upload shortly after I get it.

I'm not sure how you can strap one to your quad and fly sorties though without ordering one. (I'm sure not gonna give you mine... )
Jul 24, 2016, 07:46 AM
Registered User
wkf94025's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by xanuser
BUT aren't they're trying to sell an ACTION cam.???

strap it to a bike, a motorcycle, a dog, or a cat, shoot - toss it out a 5+ story window and let it swing from a piece of string... i dont care.
Don't have and of these, but I do have a couple kids, a dozen gliders, a quad or two, and multiple dashboards. Ordered mine first hour of first day, and will affix to several of the above, and post real life footage and stills here, shortly after it arrives.

Kelly
Jul 24, 2016, 09:09 PM
Beating air into submission!
GrahamWilson's Avatar
Thanks Guys looking forward to seeing the images and video. Plus reviews.
Jul 25, 2016, 12:21 AM
Registered User
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tom Frank
Hi Thomas.,

What FW is in yours?

I've shot clips with the release FW v1.36, but it needs more reduction in sharpening for best results. Sharpening was even higher and WB less stable in FW prior. I'm holding off posting more samples again until an updated FW with less sharpening is available as a minimum.

The release FW is in it's infancy, and needed improvements and new functions are being incorporated as fast as practical. I expect to see FW updates released in the coming weeks/months.

FWIW, the clip linked above is AVC encoded and native from the camera (not re-encoded) and shot with the Standard default bit rate (32.5 MB/s), with 3 other rates higher and lower than that available. The sound is also at the Standard default setting, with one level higher and lower available. The many Image Quality user options found in the M1 are not yet implemented, but are planned along with some new ones.
I have the latest one and I agree in sharpness reduction. I will wait for next FW.
Jul 25, 2016, 12:24 AM
Registered User
New version of Android application support Mobius 2 camera!
Jul 25, 2016, 02:58 AM
Registered User
None of the listed sellers ships to me

Banggood just listed the Mobius 2, Yey
http://www.banggood.com/Mobius-2-ActionCam-1080P-130-Degree-Wide-Angle-Mini-Sports-Camera-FPV-DashCam-H_265-HEVC-H_264-AVC-p-1070626.html
Jul 25, 2016, 05:52 AM
Registered User
Quote:
Originally Posted by Justapoke
So who's gonna post the first sample videos ?

http://www.mediafire.com/download/ed...fternoon_2.zip

just a small grab, (files are huge) some others still uploading

http://www.mediafire.com/download/vr...fternoon_1.zip

http://www.mediafire.com/download/2s...fternoon_3.zip
Last edited by jokiin; Jul 25, 2016 at 08:15 AM.
Jul 25, 2016, 06:47 AM
Registered User
DaneLaw's Avatar
thanks guys for putting up vid & picture-samples..(highly appreciated)

looking forward to see how it compares with the other RC-actioncam around same formfactor that are hitting the market these weeks "Legend2", at least in a beta version.. the Legend 2 is promoted under1080p/96fps, ewen thow the Beta version seems at release limited to 60fps, but should be only FW-limited according to Foxeer so a chance that an sooner FW that will carry the 96fps option when the retail version gets release..

Took the plunge on the Legend2 a few days ago where an betaprice of 59.99US shipped where quite attractive.(according to Foxeer it should be shipped out today25 ewen thow an limited beta-sale and out-of-stock atm)
Maybe mobius should have gone the same way, with an thought on its an work in progress, and lowered the price for the early birds..

will be interesting to see how these two-compares when reaching the market around the same time.. judging from videos.. - the in and out of dark-areas and handling the skybalance ' seems decent..
Test video of the Foxeer LEGEND 2 20160718 (4 min 7 sec)
Last edited by DaneLaw; Jul 25, 2016 at 07:11 AM.
Jul 25, 2016, 08:30 AM
Crash me if you can
JustMeandMyself's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tom Frank
The guys who are developing these cameras are not necessarily RC modellers, so they can't do what you do. They are just trying to refine the camera. Now if I were a re-seller, I'd do what you suggest. I do like to fly my RC models, but I'm not in the business of selling the cameras. I'd fly more if I spent a LOT less time with these forums, that's for sure.
But Mobius dev guys should realize that a non-negligible part of their sales is from the RC market and then should act accordingly to address this market.
I was also waiting impatiently for M2 to be released but was also following the Legend 2 development.
Finally, I've choosen the later.
Jul 25, 2016, 09:52 AM
Registered User
Hi Sevet,

FYI, we do in fact ship to Israel.

SpyTec
Jul 25, 2016, 10:14 AM
Registered User
Thank you @jokiin for uploading these! They have made my choice much easier. I think currently the M2 is a step backwards from the M1 currently. The colouring is not good and in the second clip the quality with oncoming traffic looks worse than a cheap 20usd camera and it's not really dark! The sharpness is ugly and so grainy - improved from the first clip...what improvement!

Secondly, it's worrying that the lens flares are so apparent. To me that says cheap lens and little testing. Lens flares are so easy to test yourself as well...Tom did you not think to test this? Did the developers not think to test this?

Thirdly, in your first clip Jokiin the camera loses focus when you go round the first corner at the light. This seems to be because the cameras AWB changes but the camera seems to lose focus for a second or so with a significant drop in detail and sharpness. Was your lens loose and this was just a coincidence or does this seem to be a software issue?

I know Tom and the developers keep stating image quality will be improved but unfortunately I don't want to buy a product that after being delayed and delayed and delayed for improvements can only produce quality that is worse than the M1 it seems.

We'll have to wait for comparissons but at the moment I does not seem like a good camera. Maybe it will improve but if it has taken this long to get to this standard you are going to have a long wait until it gets much better.

Back to my M1 I go.
Jul 25, 2016, 10:57 AM
Registered User
Race Miata's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by DaneLaw
Took the plunge on the Legend2 a few days ago where an betaprice of 59.99US shipped where quite attractive.
Quote:
Originally Posted by JustMeandMyself
But Mobius dev guys should realize that a non-negligible part of their sales is from the RC market and then should act accordingly to address this market.
I was also waiting impatiently for M2 to be released but was also following the Legend 2 development.
Finally, I've choosen the later.
I was going to post these earlier but I knew Tom would've responded "off-topic". I'm surprised he didn't with your posts. Now I know he just doesn't like whatever I said even though they were the truth. I went from a hardcore #11/#16/Mobius fan to totally lost hope.
Jul 25, 2016, 11:34 AM
Who is John Powers ?
Any option for remote trigger of pictures or recording via the usb plug to be controlled by a flight controller ?
Jul 25, 2016, 11:39 AM
Registered User
ukbren's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by Race Miata
I was going to post these earlier but I knew Tom would've responded "off-topic". I'm surprised he didn't with your posts. Now I know he just doesn't like whatever I said even though they were the truth. I went from a hardcore #11/#16/Mobius fan to totally lost hope.
they are off-topic. of course - this is a Mobius2 support thread! maybe tom is just AFK today, or maybe he's "lost hope" of battling such posts.
Jul 25, 2016, 12:47 PM
Just say "No, it's under 250g"
scottyo's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by Race Miata
I was going to post these earlier but I knew Tom would've responded "off-topic". I'm surprised he didn't with your posts. Now I know he just doesn't like whatever I said even though they were the truth. I went from a hardcore #11/#16/Mobius fan to totally lost hope.
The Mobius 2 may not be for you anyway...

To add something that is at least a little on-topic: My camera arrives tomorrow or Wednesday. I will shoot some video as soon as possible and post it on youtube, with links provided here.
Last edited by scottyo; Jul 25, 2016 at 01:25 PM. Reason: Reworded.
Jul 25, 2016, 02:16 PM
Registered User
DaneLaw's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by Race Miata
I was going to post these earlier but I knew Tom would've responded "off-topic". I'm surprised he didn't with your posts. Now I know he just doesn't like whatever I said even though they were the truth. I went from a hardcore #11/#16/Mobius fan to totally lost hope.
I would more assume its something like this..that are off-topic, and posts abut bxxching with theories of personal grudge ' that are not relevant..

anyway HEVC265 (M2) certainly got its forces if Mobius2 can take advantage of High Efficiency Video Coding format..
around half the bitrate, with same quality compared to the 264*peloton..
but unsure what depth-profile that are in play in M2s HEVC265..
Last edited by DaneLaw; Jul 25, 2016 at 03:00 PM.
Jul 25, 2016, 05:22 PM
Registered User
Quote:
Originally Posted by DaneLaw

anyway HEVC265 (M2) certainly got its forces if Mobius2 can take advantage of High Efficiency Video Coding format..
around half the bitrate, with same quality compared to the 264*peloton..
but unsure what depth-profile that are in play in M2s HEVC265..
maybe I misinterpreted things, I kept reading about H.265 offering the same quality at half the bitrate so was expecting to see more efficient file sizes when set to H.265 but the camera uses the same bitrate for H.264 or H.265, is the idea then that the bitrate is the same but using H.265 should be equivalent to using a much higher bitrate with H.264?
Jul 25, 2016, 05:42 PM
Dance the skies...
Tom Frank's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by DaneLaw
I would more assume its something like this..that are off-topic, and posts abut bxxching with theories of personal grudge ' that are not relevant..

anyway HEVC265 (M2) certainly got its forces if Mobius2 can take advantage of High Efficiency Video Coding format..
around half the bitrate, with same quality compared to the 264*peloton..
but unsure what depth-profile that are in play in M2s HEVC265..
You're right on both accounts!

The Mobius HEVC codec uses the Main Profile (L4.1), just right for it's 1080p-60fps video. It seems the value of this codec has not yet sunk in, with many just saying memory is cheap, who needs it. Some of the same people are screaming for 4K as well. Good luck to them with AVC codec at that resolution. For me, being able to copy files twice as fast, taking up only about 1/2 the space on my hard drive with equal quality trumps the "memory is cheap mantra".
Jul 25, 2016, 06:02 PM
Registered User
Well after waiting so long I don't think I'll be buying the Mobius 2. It's not any better than the competition and if anything looks worst than the Mobius 1 which I love. It's a great shame and I'm glad I'm not the only one who feels let down and disappointed at the quality. I love my Mobius so I'll be sticking with it, but I would like an upgrade and I don't think the Mobius 2 will be it.

The video clips jokiin posted show numerous problems
- Bad white balance
- So much sharpening
- Bad colouring
- Lens flare

And the worst of all
- OUT OF FOCUS WHEN CHANGING WHITE BALANCE

Something I have never seen before.

Tom can phrase it how he wants but for the camera to be delayed this much and for this quality is a joke and an insult to the people who have supported Mobius. Yeah image quality may get better, yeah H265 but looking at that quality that looks like it's a first alpha version.

Off to Foxeer I go.
Jul 25, 2016, 06:12 PM
Dance the skies...
Tom Frank's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by jokiin
maybe I misinterpreted things, I kept reading about H.265 offering the same quality at half the bitrate so was expecting to see more efficient file sizes when set to H.265 but the camera uses the same bitrate for H.264 or H.265, is the idea then that the bitrate is the same but using H.265 should be equivalent to using a much higher bitrate with H.264?
The M2 has 7 bit rate options for each resolution and frame rate, with rates somewhat proportional to the amount of data flow for a given frame resolution and frame rate. You have the option to record at the same bit rate with either codec, or chose a lower one when using HEVC to get smaller files while not giving up any video quality. I think the specific bit rates for each resolution need some tuning to better accommodate the HEVC "1/2 the bit rate with equal quality" ability, but that is something to be addressed as the FW matures. In theory, HEVC can also give better quality at the same bit rate as AVC, but I question whether that will produce any significant visible difference when the video capture is limited to 1080p-60 in the CMOS imager, as well as the video playback display for most of the users at this point in time. Maybe recording with HEVC at the higher bit rates will produce some visible improvement when it's 1080p video is up-scaled on a 4k monitor, but I don't have a 4K monitor to test it.
Jul 25, 2016, 06:13 PM
Registered User
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tom Frank
You're right on both accounts!

The Mobius HEVC codec uses the Main Profile (L4.1), just right for it's 1080p-60fps video. It seems the value of this codec has not yet sunk in, with many just saying memory is cheap, who needs it. Some of the same people are screaming for 4K as well. Good luck to them with AVC codec at that resolution. For me, being able to copy files twice as fast, taking up only about 1/2 the space on my hard drive with equal quality trumps the "memory is cheap mantra".
I didn't see this post but I would just like to clarify some things Tom:

1) My understanding is that H265 is really for 4K simply because it's meant for high bitrates of data (60mb or more)? 1080P does not really hold enough data and as such H265 is sort of wasted on 1080. I believe the American equivalent would be going to McDonalds and getting a King Size meal but only a small coke to save on calories - the point being it doesn't really do much.

2) Why is AVC a problem for 4K? Large file size...if that's the only problem but I know I won't come across any problems in my editing software then that's a small price to pay.

3) You're clearly a Mobius fanboy (no insult meant just a statement) but you do not seem to acknowledge any weaknesses the camera has in comparisson to other cameras currently on the market? Why is this? You constantly state the Mobius 2 will get better but when? It was delayed by 4 or so weeks to 'improve' and the posted clips since then look just as bad. Maybe it's time to stop defending and listen to the criticism like lots of other manufacturers did.

4) Why do the clips posted by Jokiin look so bad if H265 is so good?

Thank you
Jul 25, 2016, 06:28 PM
Dance the skies...
Tom Frank's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by bournetofly
Well after waiting so long I don't think I'll be buying the Mobius 2. It's not any better than the competition and if anything looks worst than the Mobius 1 which I love. It's a great shame and I'm glad I'm not the only one who feels let down and disappointed at the quality. I love my Mobius so I'll be sticking with it, but I would like an upgrade and I don't think the Mobius 2 will be it.

The video clips jokiin posted show numerous problems
- Bad white balance
- So much sharpening
- Bad colouring
- Lens flare

And the worst of all
- OUT OF FOCUS WHEN CHANGING WHITE BALANCE

Something I have never seen before.

Tom can phrase it how he wants but for the camera to be delayed this much and for this quality is a joke and an insult to the people who have supported Mobius. Yeah image quality may get better, yeah H265 but looking at that quality that looks like it's a first alpha version.

Off to Foxeer I go.
I have no idea what FW was in use for those sample videos, but even if it is the release V1.36, out of date. I received three new FW versions for evaluation today that address much lower sharpening, WB stability and low light improvement. I don't recall seeing the "out of focus" issue you mention, but it cannot be a focus issue per se since the lens and CMOS aren't moving to go out of focus... maybe a compression "breathing" artifact or something, I don't know exactly what you are referring to.

At any rate, I have no quarrel with anyone who chooses to go with a different product. I'm only doing testing for the Mobius2 developer and am not selling them. Enjoy you Foxeer!
Jul 25, 2016, 06:45 PM
Registered User
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tom Frank
I have no idea what FW was in use for those sample videos, but even if it is the release V1.36, out of date.
V1.36, it is the latest according to the GUI setup program, those were recorded in H.264, will try H.265 next to see if any improvement
Jul 25, 2016, 06:50 PM
Registered User
Quote:
Originally Posted by bournetofly

4) Why do the clips posted by Jokiin look so bad if H265 is so good?

Thank you
they were H.264, I tried that first so I could make a fairer comparison to the Mobius 1, also seems some people have trouble playing high bitrate H.265 files, will be trying H.265 out today though to see if it offers any improvement, Tom mentioned the release firmware being out of date already but there's no newer version offered so can only test with what's available at this stage, I'm sure as more people get theirs there will be many more samples to look at
Jul 25, 2016, 07:33 PM
Dance the skies...
Tom Frank's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by jokiin
they were H.264, I tried that first so I could make a fairer comparison to the Mobius 1, also seems some people have trouble playing high bitrate H.265 files, will be trying H.265 out today though to see if it offers any improvement, Tom mentioned the release firmware being out of date already but there's no newer version offered so can only test with what's available at this stage, I'm sure as more people get theirs there will be many more samples to look at
H.265 does not of necessity have higher bit rates that H.264. It should be quite the opposite. If you set a given bit rate for a video, you can use either codec. But with H.265 codec, the bit rate can be about 1/2 of what the H.264 sample uses and still get the same quality! But you have to manually pick a lower setting in the configuration to do that, and it's not clear from the settings right now what bit rates they produce until you shoot some clips. I'm developing a table with these values, but it's not complete. At any rate, you won't improve on the original using H.265 vs H.264, so you might as well save yourself some time. The original must be improved, and we already know the release FW has some issues. I hope to post an updated FW for download in the next day or two.
Jul 25, 2016, 07:42 PM
Dance the skies...
Tom Frank's Avatar
Brief comments...
Quote:
Originally Posted by bournetofly
I didn't see this post but I would just like to clarify some things Tom:

1) My understanding is that H265 is really for 4K simply because it's meant for high bitrates of data (60mb or more)? 1080P does not really hold enough data and as such H265 is sort of wasted on 1080. I believe the American equivalent would be going to McDonalds and getting a King Size meal but only a small coke to save on calories - the point being it doesn't really do much.
You have the wrong understanding! H.265 has just as much application to 1080p as 4K. With 4K it's going to be pretty much mandatory, where as with 1080p it's optional. Google up some of the many sites that go into the H.265 codec and you'll see. I'm not going to try to explain the codecs complexity here.
2) Why is AVC a problem for 4K? Large file size...if that's the only problem but I know I won't come across any problems in my editing software then that's a small price to pay.
Try playing the MUCH higher bit rate rates that H.264 requires to get the same quality with a 4K video. It's not just about file size... it's about encoding efficiency. Many video players and editors support H.265 already... WMP, VLC, MPC-HC, AviDemux to name several free ones.
3)
You're clearly a Mobius fanboy (no insult meant just a statement) but you do not seem to acknowledge any weaknesses the camera has in comparisson to other cameras currently on the market? Why is this? You constantly state the Mobius 2 will get better but when? It was delayed by 4 or so weeks to 'improve' and the posted clips since then look just as bad. Maybe it's time to stop defending and listen to the criticism like lots of other manufacturers did.
I acknowledged the need for less sharpening. I saw WB balance instability issues, I mentioned lens flare issues, and low light issues. And they have already been improved somewhat... I've tested 3 FW updates since the release and got three more today. I don't go and post look at all the deficiencies with this clip, if that's what you mean. That's not my style, and not my purpose in running this thread. I don't try to compare the Mobius 2 here with other cameras. This thread is to try to support users who may have the camera by posting key information, FW updates, etc. and help if they have problems. FW changes are hit and miss when dealing with self-written FW written from the ground up and it takes a lot more time to make changes that produce the desired improvement. I am not involved in that work, but I do test each beta version I'm sent for evaluation, and have gone through many dozens of variations during the camera development. That's what most posting here about the delay don't seem to understand at all.

4) Why do the clips posted by Jokiin look so bad if H265 is so good?H.265, and H.264 for that matter, can only compress the original, and hopefully not produce much loss of quality in the process. There is no doubt whatsoever that H.265 can do that better and more efficiently than H.264 with the same quality. So that is off the table (read the web resources for confirmation). The clips you mentioned were made with the release FW, which we know still has problems that need correcting. that's why I just received three more beta versions to test. I see posts here saying why not release the camera so we can play with it, and then install the release FW when it's better. Then others post it's an insult to take so long to develop a camera (from scratch), with imperfect FW. It's a no win situation for the developer, and also for me since I seem to be the target for it by hosting this thread. That I do not understand at all!


Thank you
Jul 25, 2016, 10:52 PM
Flying Zayin
Cathay Stray's Avatar
Just a brief on the fly thought: locating buttons on the side doesn't look a good idea at all. Now the users need to be XXXtra careful every time they take the cam and I believe pretty soon we will hear a lot of screaming from those who accidentally and unwillingly turned the thing on or off, or changed the settings, or whatever. Having buttons on the top was not all that idiotic, and perhaps was done for a reason. Changing things that were not asking for change is not always good.
I'm not saying the cam is bad though. Let us wait for some more reliable reviews.
Jul 25, 2016, 11:09 PM
Registered User
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tom Frank
H.265 does not of necessity have higher bit rates that H.264. It should be quite the opposite. If you set a given bit rate for a video, you can use either codec. But with H.265 codec, the bit rate can be about 1/2 of what the H.264 sample uses and still get the same quality! .
so H.265 at 20mbit will deliver the same sort of results as H.264 at 40mbit, I think that's what you're saying


Quote:
Originally Posted by Tom Frank
At any rate, you won't improve on the original using H.265 vs H.264, so you might as well save yourself some time. .
so H.265 at 40mbit won't look any better than it did at 20mbit, and won't look any better than H.264 at 40mbit either?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Tom Frank
The original must be improved, and we already know the release FW has some issues. I hope to post an updated FW for download in the next day or two.
Look forward to see it improve
Jul 26, 2016, 01:05 AM
animator in Helsinki, Finland
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tom Frank
It's a no win situation for the developer, and also for me since I seem to be the target for it by hosting this thread. That I do not understand at all!
The problem seems to be that many posters here don't know the background, they think you are the developer, or more closely associated than you actually are... when in fact, you're basically only a "Beta Tester", right? (Or even Alpha? )

We who do understand your "status", really appreciate the amount of work you do for this group! You spend hours and hours of volunteer work for the benefit of the users (not for the manufacturer), so a BIG THANKS for your efforts.
Jul 26, 2016, 01:12 AM
"long stretch of water..."
coongoola's Avatar
Well mine arrived quite fast to Australia.

I've done a couple of quick recordings on 120 & 60 which are the defaults as I received it.

I am having issues with the HEVC 265 playing on my Acer laptop, (see image attached ). If I slow down the speed to say 1/3 then it plays fine on the screen.

I'm using VLC version 2.2.4 Weatherwax

Any suggestions at all ?

Pat in Oz
Jul 26, 2016, 01:50 AM
Registered User
Quote:
Originally Posted by coongoola

Any suggestions at all ?
hardware upgrade time, the downside of the latest codec, high bitrate etc is the resources required
Jul 26, 2016, 03:22 AM
ptg
ptg
#1
Yes,
"slow" hardware (PC, notebook...) will be one of major problems
because of gluttonous H.265...
Last edited by ptg; Jul 26, 2016 at 03:35 AM.
Jul 26, 2016, 03:40 AM
Supersonic Engineering
GordonTarling's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by Cathay Stray
Just a brief on the fly thought: locating buttons on the side doesn't look a good idea at all. Now the users need to be XXXtra careful every time they take the cam and I believe pretty soon we will hear a lot of screaming from those who accidentally and unwillingly turned the thing on or off, or changed the settings, or whatever. Having buttons on the top was not all that idiotic, and perhaps was done for a reason. Changing things that were not asking for change is not always good.
I'm not saying the cam is bad though. Let us wait for some more reliable reviews.
I tend to agree about the position of the buttons - they really restrict use of this camera in many gimbals.
Jul 26, 2016, 05:06 AM
Registered User
Bill Glover's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tom Frank
I don't recall seeing the "out of focus" issue you mention, but it cannot be a focus issue per se since the lens and CMOS aren't moving to go out of focus... maybe a compression "breathing" artifact or something, I don't know exactly what you are referring to.
Coincidentally both the #16 keyfob cameras I have give slightly 'out of focus' footage occasionally. I've never got to the bottom of it - comes and goes when the cameras are left running for 2-3 hours (on external power @ 10fps). Out of interest I'll have a look next time and see if it appears to coincide with WB changes (or I'll try turning AWB off to see if that makes any difference). If it was heat-related (thermal expansion somewhere causing a tiny physical movement) the camera would go slightly out of focus and stay that way, but that's not what happens. Very odd!
Jul 26, 2016, 05:08 AM
Registered User
Quote:
Originally Posted by GordonTarling
I tend to agree about the position of the buttons - they really restrict use of this camera in many gimbals.
Why? iF you flip it you will have those buttons on the other side...
Jul 26, 2016, 06:11 AM
Camera Reseller.
In Jokiins first clip between 3-7 seconds you will see it when he goes around the corner first time at the lights
Jul 26, 2016, 06:23 AM
Registered User
VideoKing's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by JooVuu
In Jokiins first clip between 3-7 seconds you will see it when he goes around the corner first time at the lights
That looked to me like the WDR kicking in and out.
Mobius 1 did that occasionally with WDR tuned on.
Its not a fault, just a feature...
Jul 26, 2016, 06:25 AM
Camera Reseller.
Quote:
Originally Posted by VideoKing
That looked to me like the WDR kicking in and out.
Mobius 1 did that occasionally with WDR tuned on.
Its not a fault, just a feature...
It goes blurry and reduces the quality pretty far. I've never experienced that with the Mobius nor any other camera with WDR? I've got a fair few lying around - when I have some times I'll give it ago and see if it is that.
Jul 26, 2016, 06:59 AM
Registered User
wkf94025's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by Matt_V939
Why? iF you flip it you will have those buttons on the other side...
Or just strip off case and battery and you have even more options...
Jul 26, 2016, 07:05 AM
"long stretch of water..."
coongoola's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by coongoola
Well mine arrived quite fast to Australia.

I've done a couple of quick recordings on 120 & 60 which are the defaults as I received it.

I am having issues with the HEVC 265 playing on my Acer laptop, (see image attached ). If I slow down the speed to say 1/3 then it plays fine on the screen.

I'm using VLC version 2.2.4 Weatherwax

Any suggestions at all ?

Pat in Oz
Works well now using MPC-HC, and plays the files very well with the 265 HEVC. Must be a bug with the latest VLC player.

Cheers

Pat
(short video coming soon)
Jul 26, 2016, 08:42 AM
Dance the skies...
Tom Frank's Avatar
Comments...
Quote:
Originally Posted by jokiin
so H.265 at 20mbit will deliver the same sort of results as H.264 at 40mbit, I think that's what you're saying
The quality of the two clips (all other things being equal, e.g. cameras, settings, scene, resolution, frame rate, etc.) will be virtually identical, BUT the H.265 file will be approximately 1/2 as large!

so H.265 at 40mbit won't look any better than it did at 20mbit
NO, it has the potential to look better (as does H.264), as the bit rate increases, but it depends on how much detail and motion are in a scene.

, and won't look any better than H.264 at 40mbit either?
H.265 has the potential to look better than H.264 at any given bit rate, but again it depends on many things (e.g. cameras, settings, scene, resolution, frame rate, etc.). For 1080p-60fps video, you may or may not see a visual improvement. I suggest doing a google search on "H.265" or "HEVC" for MANY hits that go into this a lot deeper than I can do here, some have image samples.

Look forward to see it improve
Jul 26, 2016, 09:11 AM
Dance the skies...
Tom Frank's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by coongoola
Well mine arrived quite fast to Australia.

I've done a couple of quick recordings on 120 & 60 which are the defaults as I received it.

I am having issues with the HEVC 265 playing on my Acer laptop, (see image attached ). If I slow down the speed to say 1/3 then it plays fine on the screen.

I'm using VLC version 2.2.4 Weatherwax

Any suggestions at all ?
Pat in Oz
As someone else mentioned, your laptop is lacking in processing power, BUT first try using WMP or MPC-HC players. I have a pretty high end PC, and VLC begins to falter with H.265 as you showed with the camera set to it's highest bit rate at 1080-60 or 720-120. MPC-HC does considerably better, but WMP (latest version) version is the best of the bunch for smooth H.265 playback on my system.

Also, lower the bit rate if you have it set on HIGHEST (which gives about 41 MB/s at 1080p-60). You may find it plays OK at the Higher or High settings and you may not notice much, if any, any quality differences as it plays on your display. With H.265 you should be able to set the bit rate to Low setting (about 24 MB/s at 1080-60) and get the equal or slightly better quality as H.264 at the Highest setting!

Take a look at the (incomplete) table I made showing the camera bit rates at various camera config settings versus the various resolution and frame rate options. With H.265, you can shoot at 1/2 the bit rate as H.264 for a given resolution and frame rate and get the same quality as H.264. The camera's settings could benefit from being tweaked so that the low settings are 1/2 the high settings to benefit the capability of H.265. And also the higher settings could benefit from being tweaked so the bit rates are scaled better for the frame sizes and rates. Something that may be done down the road.
Last edited by Tom Frank; Jul 26, 2016 at 09:24 AM.
Jul 26, 2016, 10:26 AM
Registered User
Hi Tom!

We are a verified Mobius 2 reseller for europe, just as we are for over 2 years for the Mobius 1. Could you add our website to the 2nd post?

English page: http://www.mobius-cam.com/en/mobius-...-cam-set-p-138
Dutch page: http://www.mobius-cam.com/nl/mobius-...-cam-set-p-138

Thanks already!

We've been already experimenting for about a month with the beta releases of the Mobius 2 to get familiar with the new camera.
Last edited by Maarten112; Jul 26, 2016 at 10:33 AM.
Jul 26, 2016, 12:02 PM
Just say "No, it's under 250g"
scottyo's Avatar
Mobius 2 arrived today. Just to verify: It does come with a lens cap.

(Video at 11...)
Jul 26, 2016, 01:59 PM
Supersonic Engineering
GordonTarling's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by Matt_V939
Why? iF you flip it you will have those buttons on the other side...
And then the mount plate is on top? How does that work?
Jul 26, 2016, 03:09 PM
Registered User
Quote:
Originally Posted by Cathay Stray
Just a brief on the fly thought: locating buttons on the side doesn't look a good idea at all. Now the users need to be XXXtra careful every time they take the cam and I believe pretty soon we will hear a lot of screaming from those who accidentally and unwillingly turned the thing on or off, or changed the settings, or whatever. Having buttons on the top was not all that idiotic, and perhaps was done for a reason. Changing things that were not asking for change is not always good.
I'm not saying the cam is bad though. Let us wait for some more reliable reviews.
I also don't like the buttons being at the side, but you get used to them being there. I always set the 'Power Button On' parameter to 'Delayed' to prevent the camera inadvertently turning itself on when picked up or when in your pocket.

I tested the M2 as a dash cam comparing it to the Mobius (M1). For my comparison tests I had both the M1 and the M2 mounted on a metal 'platform' behind the driving mirror. To my surprise it was much easier for me to observe the recording LED and manually start/stop the M2 than the M1.

According to the developer it was not possible to locate the buttons on the top of the camera while keeping the same compact size. The button design in the M2 should also be more reliable than those used in the M1.

So, having used the M2 for almost a year, and weighing the pros and cons, I no longer consider the side-mounted buttons a major inconvenience - but I definitely recommend setting the 'Power Button On' parameter to 'Delayed'.

The three LEDs (top, side, back) are certainly an improvement over the M1.
Jul 26, 2016, 04:44 PM
"long stretch of water..."
coongoola's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by GordonTarling
And then the mount plate is on top? How does that work?
Here's what I did.

Put a strip of velcro on the top of the M2, just enough so it doesn't cover the led.

Mount the round heat sink with the four screws. If required.

Use the software to flip the video 180°.
Presto, job done and works just like the old mobius.

Incidentally I've never had a Mobius come off any of my planes in two years using the velcro method.

Pat in Oz
Jul 26, 2016, 05:07 PM
"long stretch of water..."
coongoola's Avatar
Here's a link to a short video in my garden of a Kookaburra flying away. It's not much at this stage but I needed to check the 60fps settings with the H264 settings.

Youtube and Wondershare Filmora really remove a lot of the detail. Watching on youtube is nothing like the raw footage.

Pat in Oz

Mobius M2 test (0 min 25 sec)
Jul 26, 2016, 06:11 PM
Registered User

Received new Mobius 2


I thought this purchase was going to be very expensive as I could not get it to play with VLC. I thought that a new PC order was in the works.

PC Intel Xeon W3530 @ 2.8GHz with 12GB RAM this is a few years old but is no slouch and VLC would not work.

Be prepared to load MPC-HC, that works fine.

I am very satisfied at this point. I will start experimenting, used standard video data rate, 1080-60 and 720-120 so far. No complaints

It seems to be smoother than my other cameras but that could be the newly installed MPC-HC player.

Weight 46 grams


Thread Tools