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Jun 13, 2016, 01:31 PM
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That is really nice, would you interested in building and selling me a frame?
Jun 14, 2016, 05:27 AM
Registered User
Thread OP
Thanks for the offer Ari, but sorry, I don't want to get into building and selling frames.
However, if you have the time, I'd really recommend having a bash at building one yourself.

One important point with these 1 piece bonded frames is what is an acceptable strength, far more of an issue as a broken arm will effectively write the frame off. Personally I'd rather fly a frame where I'm not carrying too much excess strength (weight) and put up with the fact I'll have to make another in a very heavy crash. With a spare frame, it's pretty quick - 12 bolts and some tape to sort out, to switch everything over to a new frame.
The strength required varies hugely, depending on specific power setup, flying style and location. A 5” frame for 14 gram 1804s is very different from 30 gram 2206 motors. I fly over farm type fields with longish grass, its always raining in Wales so the ground is generally soft. Crashing here is very different to say, Californian sun baked dirt with little grass. Building it yourself you can cater exactly for your strength needs.

Just talking generally, if you get into building them yourself, you develop the building skills needed. Choose the direction you want to go with, in a frame and then refine the design along with your building skills and speed over further iterations. Once you've got the frame honed down to exactly what you want, make a few spares.

Would anyone like more detailed info on the processes/tools used/instructions/photos etc of the build process of these frames? I could post a more detailed build of my next frame. I guess there's a lot of detail which may be simple and obvious to some but not so to others. I’ve only built a few frames so the info would be half random musings from my limited experience anyway. Likewise, I'd love to have some tips and advice from others with experience from similar frames they've made, there has to be some out there….
Jun 14, 2016, 07:57 AM
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http://diydrones.com/group/arducopte...Group%3A394475


Tube building tips, but not micro...
Jun 14, 2016, 05:05 PM
Registered User
Quote:
Originally Posted by TimR74
Thanks for the offer Ari, but sorry, I don't want to get into building and selling frames.
However, if you have the time, I'd really recommend having a bash at building one yourself..

I thought that might be your answer but thanks anyway.

I would love to build one, just need to find the time, make a few decisions on frame size, motor choice and take it from there.

Trying to decide between 4" or 5". My other component choices may decide that for me.

FC- Furious FPV Piko BLX F3 FC
http://flightcontrollers.furiousfpv.com



RX- Furious FPV Frsky micro Sbus Rx
http://furiousfpv.com/product_info.php?products_id=50




Escs- Thinking of a 4 in 1 esc, there is the littlebee 4 in 1 and Flyduino are also working on one.

Any other component options that might work well with a superlight acro build?


More info into your build/construction methods would be fantastic. How do you cut out the section where both the tubes cross/join each other?_
Last edited by Ari33; Jun 14, 2016 at 05:17 PM.
Jun 14, 2016, 05:44 PM
Forward ever, backward never!
Brainstorm's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by TimR74
Brainstorm - Going back to your point about lightweight 2204 motors, I've ditched the idea of higher kV 1806 motors now for the heavy 5” quad. Just ordered some Gen 2 2204 Sunnyskys you'll be pleased to hear
That's brilliant, Tim! I guarantee you'll be happy with the Sunnies. They will be a perfect fit for your lightweight, scratch-built frame.

Quote:
Constantly keep changing my mind about different setups.
I can empathize. I like to call my condition "analysis paralysis."

Quote:
After further research, I'm going to try some 5x4x3 props on the 2204s on 3S.
The tri-blades have been getting a lot of love recently. And now there are quad-blades too, incl. new ones from Lumenier today. Given how well the SS2204 push the 6045 dual-blades, they should make easy work of 5x4x3 on your lightweight frame.

Quote:
Secondary benefit of this, to me, is the lower rpms and hence audible pitch. Love the ‘whoop whoop’ sound of 6x4.5s at low rpm when blipping the throttle. When small props start spinning north of 20k rpm I find the ‘scream’ gets a little irritating
Agree 100 percent! Love the low roar of the 6045, as opposed to the maddening din of the little screamers.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ari33
Escs- Thinking of a 4 in 1 esc, there is the littlebee 4 in 1 and Flyduino are also working on one.
Ari33: It might be somewhat redundant to use a 4-in-1 ESC, which includes a PDB, with the Piko BLX, which also includes a PDB. My recommendation would for Piko BLX would be 4x 12A KISS. If you want a 4-in-1 ESC, I'd just get a regular 30x30 FC.

Some things to consider with 4-in-1 ESCs:
  • Make sure the 4-in-1 has a built-in BEC (to supply FC), and/or your FC can take straight LiPo voltage.
  • The newer LittleBee Pro models with F396 (?) processor apparently do better with high-KV motors.
  • Some of the 4-in-1 have limited or no space for standoffs. So they require extra care with mounting.
  • If you wait for the KISS AIO, it apparently will incorporate 4-in-1 ESC as well as FC!?! But it's been delayed.
Jun 14, 2016, 05:48 PM
Forward ever, backward never!
Brainstorm's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by TimR74
Few photos of the finished X4 frame.....
That is just stunning, Tim! And 18.4g for a frame that'll fit 5" props? Your 5" frame weight is comparable to a beefy 3" frame. That's truly unbelievable. Kudos!

Jun 15, 2016, 07:35 AM
Registered User
Thread OP
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ari33
FC- Furious FPV Piko BLX F3 FC
http://flightcontrollers.furiousfpv.com

Escs- Thinking of a 4 in 1 esc, there is the littlebee 4 in 1 and Flyduino are also working on one.

Any other component options that might work well with a superlight acro build?

More info into your build/construction methods would be fantastic. How do you cut out the section where both the tubes cross/join each other?_
Six of one, half a dozen of another whether you go the route of a Piko BLX or a 4in1 ESC. Weight wise, I think they'd come out very similar. The BLX will give you a nice low profile build but with ESCs out on the arms. The 4in1 ESC keeps all the components centralised, nice clean arms but taller.

I've been burning the midnight oil and almost finished the X4 frame now with the BLX. Will post some photos when it's done.
I cut the notches by hacksaw either side, down to the centre of the tubes, and then grind out the middle with the dremel. I'll get stuck into the detail with more explanation and photos for the next one....


Quote:
Originally Posted by Brainstorm
I can empathize. I like to call my condition "analysis paralysis."
I'm def guilty of that, sometimes you just need to get on and try stuff out.
Jun 15, 2016, 09:55 AM
Forward ever, backward never!
Brainstorm's Avatar
That exploded view is super cool!

How did you get the electronics to levitate, esp. the RX on top?
Jun 15, 2016, 12:00 PM
Registered User
Thanks Tim, really looking forward to learning more about your construction methods.




Quote:
Originally Posted by Brainstorm


Ari33: It might be somewhat redundant to use a 4-in-1 ESC, which includes a PDB, with the Piko BLX, which also includes a PDB. My recommendation would for Piko BLX would be 4x 12A KISS. If you want a 4-in-1 ESC, I'd just get a regular 30x30 FC.

Some things to consider with 4-in-1 ESCs:
  • Make sure the 4-in-1 has a built-in BEC (to supply FC), and/or your FC can take straight LiPo voltage.
  • The newer LittleBee Pro models with F396 (?) processor apparently do better with high-KV motors.
  • Some of the 4-in-1 have limited or no space for standoffs. So they require extra care with mounting.
  • If you wait for the KISS AIO, it apparently will incorporate 4-in-1 ESC as well as FC!?! But it's been delayed.



Brainstorm, that is very helpful, makes a lot of sense.

Thanks for the info. I wasn't aware that the Kiss AIO might include an FC, that's maybe a bit too much integration for me, we'll see.
.
Last edited by Ari33; Jun 15, 2016 at 12:12 PM.
Jun 15, 2016, 12:29 PM
Registered User
Thread OP
Quote:
Originally Posted by Brainstorm
That exploded view is super cool!

How did you get the electronics to levitate, esp. the RX on top?
Just stiff wires, there's no magic involved

I was pulling them up to waterproof the electronics.
Jun 16, 2016, 04:12 AM
Forward ever, backward never!
Brainstorm's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ari33
Brainstorm, that is very helpful, makes a lot of sense.
Glad it was helpful, Ari. There are so many parts, it's hard to know who has already figured out what. I'm still constantly learning new bits, so try to err on the side of repeating things others might know already.

Quote:
Originally Posted by TimR74
Just stiff wires, there's no magic involved

I was pulling them up to waterproof the electronics.
LOL, Tim. I try to use the super soft silicone wire whenever possible. So I'm not sure whether your trick would work on my builds. I'll have to try it. Seems like a brilliant way to apply waterproofing (conformal coating?) after everything is assembled and proven working.
Jun 16, 2016, 11:36 AM
Registered User
Looks great Tim, what is the overall weight difference?
Jun 16, 2016, 11:54 AM
Registered User
Thread OP
AUW without LiPo is 113 grams.

X2 is 146 grms.


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