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Nov 19, 2018, 12:53 AM
Flying Models Plans
Shaggy, that really looks grand! You now have me thinking overlapping sails again.
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Nov 19, 2018, 07:02 AM
Registered User
Very cool set up Saggy, but is there no way to incorporate the flying jib with the rest of the sail on one winch?

Bill
Nov 19, 2018, 11:51 AM
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Zbip57's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by Shaggy_From_NZ
short video of Ketty Jay doing a Few Tacks to show her flying jib in action
Brilliant!
Nov 19, 2018, 03:58 PM
Mad on modding
robcrusoe's Avatar
Nicely done and executed Shaggy.
Last edited by robcrusoe; Nov 19, 2018 at 04:04 PM.
Nov 19, 2018, 04:38 PM
Registered User

skiff


Message deleted wrong thread
Last edited by ourbluehorizon; Nov 19, 2018 at 04:47 PM. Reason: wrong post
Nov 21, 2018, 03:26 AM
Mad on modding
robcrusoe's Avatar

Easy As Index well adavanced


I've finally plowed through some 1,325 posts and have extracted 86 of the most likely to be of help to newcomers.
I came into it much further along since Paul's Post #1 and sSo some of the oldest posts were really new reading for me.

As a consequence it has become very clear that getting into either of the boats would have to be a lot easier than for those hardy souls who blazed the trail. A good number of names no longer showing up.

If an award were possible for the most frequent, comprehensive, well presented and definitely thought provoking series of contributions it would have to go to Paul (gns). Did you ever sleep?

Paul, you must have awoken one morning to a whole new meaning in your life, and prime reason to keep getting up early to pursue it.

As we say down here "Ya blood's worth bottling "

I certainly agree with the shoreline popularity thing.

Now I have the rest of the Emmas to go through and this project wont be too long finishing.

And after that? well, there is always something else, hey?
Nov 21, 2018, 10:53 AM
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Zbip57's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by robcrusoe
I've finally plowed through some 1,325 posts and have extracted 86 of the most likely to be of help to newcomers.
http://rcplyboats.pw/2018/11/17/new-...g-forum-index/
That is super helpful!

There is a ton of useful information stored in this forum. But unless you've read through all 1326 posts over 89 pages (and counting), you'd never know where all the good nuggets are buried, let alone know what precise search terms to use to find whatever you're looking for.

RobCrusoe has sifted through the entire pile and indexed a comprehensive list of useful posts, a list that can be alphabetically sorted in several different ways! This is awesome!
Nov 21, 2018, 11:22 AM
Registered User
Thread OP

Aw, shucks😁


Quote:
Originally Posted by robcrusoe
I

Paul, you must have awoken one morning to a whole new meaning in your life, and prime reason to keep getting up early to pursue it.

As we say down here "Ya blood's worth bottling "
The bears are so friendly, inventive, energetic, inviting, and FUN!! I just got swept up in the boat building
Also, living with my wife Deborah is inspiring.
Yours, Paul
Nov 22, 2018, 03:10 AM
Mad on modding
robcrusoe's Avatar

The Easy As index is up to date


(Copy on Emma thread)

At last

Finished up with 115 "nuggets" by my reckoning, not necessarily 100% but close enough.

I'll keep it up to date as new posts of the kind it uses comes along.

A very battered bottle just washed up on my beach. Seems Gary is once again back in Sparkle which is back on the water.
Last edited by robcrusoe; Nov 22, 2018 at 02:27 PM.
Nov 23, 2018, 03:07 AM
Mad on modding
robcrusoe's Avatar

Now there is an Easy As Video Indexer


Had to happen

http://rcplyboats.pw/2018/11/23/new-...video-indexer/

I'll maintain it as new videos are posted.

Hopefully there are no typos or bugs.
Nov 23, 2018, 05:29 PM
Registered User
Zbip57's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by Zbip57
The flying jib is twice as complicated as all the other sails, as the sails with booms will swing from one side to the other all by themselves only needing to be trimmed out loose or in tight regardless of which tack you're on. An overlapping flying jib also needs to be capable of trimming out loose or in tight, plus needs the capability of being drawn forward from one side of the boat across to the other whenever changing tack.
Alright all you yachting experts, here are some questions for y'all to chew on.

I'm still toying with the idea of adding flying jibs and topsails to my Kamanik. But the more I think about it the more complicated it becomes, not least of which is the question of whether it will still fit through doorways with extra topmasts fitted.

Below are five photos to help illustrate my questions.

Photo #1:
In the first photo on the left of the white schooner, you can see the three overlapping jibsails. Obviously, whenever changing tack, those need to be pulled forward and across to overlap onto the opposite side. And, as Shaggy_From_NZ has shown, a separate winch servo is required to accomplish that function.

But now I'm wondering about the gaff topsails, indicated by the red arrows in that first photo. As seen in this image, the gaffs holding up the mainsail and foresail are each suspended aloft by their throat halyards and peak halyards and blocks, just as they are on the Irene model. And, in this image, the two topsails are "flying" curved out nicely on the leeward side of all that rigging.

Photo #2:
In the second photo, the one of the single-masted cutter, the gaff topsail is all distorted as it is bent out of shape draped over the gaff rigging. That can't be right, no? My question is, whenever changing tack, shouldn't the foot of that topsail also be pulled up and over the gaff's peak halyard rigging, and sheeted down the opposite side of the mainsail so the topsail can fly free on the leeward side filled in a smooth curve?

Photo #3:
The three-masted schooner in the third photo is sporting four jibs. That looks awesome. Note that the topsails on the forward and middle masts are both rigged to fly freely on the leeward side of the gaff rigging. But see how the topsail on the mainmast, the rearmost, is being pressed against the blocks and halyards of the mainsail gaff rigging. Is that normal? Obviously it's a chore to have to re-rig those sails each time the boat changes tack, but doesn't the topsail lose efficiency when rigged to the wrong side like this?

Photo #4:
What's the name of this extra sail? It's some sort of a staysail suspended from and hung between both masts. In this photo you see it bowed out in a nice smooth curve, flying outboard on the leeward side of the foresail.

Photo #5:
The black schooner in the fifth photo has the forward gaff topsail (#1) properly rigged to fly out in a smooth curve on the leeward side of the gaff halyards. But the main topsail (#2) is set on the windward side of its gaff halyards, and you can see how that sail is distorted when pressed against the rigging behind it.

The staysail (#3) between the two masts is clearly wrong, and there are two guys at the top of the foremast already working to correct that.

I suppose on a working model one could suspend the gaffs directly from the topsails, and just do away with the gaff halyards altogether or leave them loose. And a staysail between the masts could be rigged so it flies freely to either side above and not overlapping the gaff. For that matter, multiple jibs could be rigged each with short booms and then all sails operated from a single drum winch as long as none of the sails overlap.

But that ain't nearly as pretty, and where's the challenge in doing it that way?
Nov 24, 2018, 01:04 PM
sailtails - YouTube
Gary Webb's Avatar

Hi to All - Jibs & Topsails


Hi Everybody,
I've been out of touch for a short while, but gotta say I'm thrilled to see the quality input lately!
Shaggy's 3/4 size schooner with the overlapping Jib is a delight to see!
and Thanks Zbip57 for addressing the tough realities of properly using overlapping Jibs and Topsails. Unlike our models, full size boats have busy crew aboard to handle things. A challenge for sure on the model!
I am prone to opt for simplicity on my own boats (see the self tending topsails on my gaff schooner "Tramp") but I do applaud those who might tackle the more demanding projects.

In response to Zbip's photos/questions -

Photo #2 & #3 Believe it or not, this situation is generally accepted in the case of the Topsail on this cutter. Same goes for the Main Topsail on a schooner, however the Foremast Topsail on the schooner cannot get away with this if there is a Stay rigged between the masts such as on “Irene”. In this case the crew would need to reset the topsail during each tack.

Photo #4 This sail, in the USA, would be called a “Fisherman Staysail”. Don’t ask me why.

Photo #5 Indeed, hard working crew have plenty to do, including dealing with overlapping jibs. The extra work, is justified because the overlapping jibs are much more powerful than non-overlapping (self tending) sails with booms.

Cheers, Gary
Nov 24, 2018, 01:05 PM
sailtails - YouTube
Gary Webb's Avatar

Hi to All - plus - Jibs & Topsails


deleted duplicate post, can anyone explain a way to actually Delete a boo-boo post ???
Last edited by Gary Webb; Nov 24, 2018 at 01:12 PM. Reason: ooops
Nov 24, 2018, 04:08 PM
Mad on modding
robcrusoe's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by Gary Webb
deleted duplicate post, can anyone explain a way to actually Delete a boo-boo post ???

Welcome back!


Been there , done that, only way is to do what you have, edit to something else.



Another irksome shortfall in the RCG software, but I hasten to say, pretty good otherwise.


No being able to remove an outdated Poll is another. Not being able to create more than one? well, understandable, I guess as they can get overdone.
Nov 26, 2018, 03:13 PM
Recent Convert
Quote:
Originally Posted by tigman
Very cool set up Saggy, but is there no way to incorporate the flying jib with the rest of the sail on one winch?

Bill
Hi Bill
zBip posed a Solution on Page 71 of this forum, but it relies on a arm for the main sheets not a pulley, might work on emma with her smaller sheet travel.

I find the extra winch is not a problem, although I did purchase a over speeced transmitter, I got a Futaba T6K transmitter. it has a Dial on it which i use to control the flying jib drum winch during a tack or gybe i spin this to the appropriate side as required , i did think about using a standard 4 channel and using the same joystick for main and jib but it would have meant opening up the transmitter and removing the spring return so the Joystick was not self centering in either axis which i didnt want to do in case i broke someting. I also liked the futaba transmitter for its future proofing. Might use one of the other channels to drive a Flag Halyard , run up the jolly rodger or similar .

I went for the Flying Jib as i really like the look , i did toy with the idea of adding the Topsails as per garys Modification but I like the Classic look of the standard gaff rig. also i prefer to minimise the setup time on shore to maximise the sailing time and thought it would add too much complexity to the setup.

cheers

shaggy


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