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Jul 15, 2004, 09:39 PM
gpw
gpw
“There’s no place like Foam”
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RUMPLER TAUBE... COOP Design Project....


Had a request to design a parkflyer Rumpler Taube , that beautiful bird-like airplane from the past ... I just thought this would be a great project to "put our heads together and produce a unique FFF parkflyer....( Hey , it worked so great on the p-38 thread , and we got input from all over the world) ...FUN!!! Let's do it again .... any takers??? First we'll have to get some good 3 views ....Then some size parameters , schmaybe a couple different sizes too , for all kinds of motors... But we'll have to keep it simple enough for all of us to build .... no exotic exact scale projects , please .... All advice will be cheerfully welcomed ... thanks ...!!!!!!!!!
Latest blog entry: Lost plans
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Jul 15, 2004, 10:05 PM
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Johnnie_w2's Avatar
my only concern is that part of the beauty of the Taube (the structure visible under the canvas) will be lost in foam. The rest of it seems to be a rather simple design. But then I am still new at this
Jul 15, 2004, 10:07 PM
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Gene Bond's Avatar
http://www.ctie.monash.edu.au/hargra...taube_1911.jpg

http://www.leachintl.com/heritage/as...e-july1998.JPG


Hmmm... subtle differences.... Cool looking control rigging on the 1st one!
Last edited by Gene Bond; Jul 15, 2004 at 10:13 PM.
Jul 16, 2004, 01:59 AM
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flieslikeabeagle's Avatar
I'll chime in, since I had something to do with getting this thread started

Here are some links to original Taube pics and plans:

http://204.83.160.230/archive/b/ima...be_overhead.jpg

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Image:...eDesign1911.jpg

http://204.83.160.230/archive/b/ima...lertaube_27.jpg

http://204.83.160.230/archive/b/images3/Taube.jpg

And here are some other pics I found on the Web...


-Flieslikeabeagle
Jul 16, 2004, 02:11 AM
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And a few more of a *reconstruction*. Yup, some guy actually built a brand new Taube, circa 2003, in his backyard, and got it to fly!

Here are the pics:

-Flieslikeabeagle
Jul 17, 2004, 08:48 AM
gpw
gpw
“There’s no place like Foam”
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The Heck with this!!!!!


GEE!!! Why don't we just build a big one ???? Screw this little stuff!!!!!! ...... We'll all build a part or two , send it into a central building location , with volunteer assemblers... All put our names on a plaque on the side ....and then jump in and go fly .... I can see a PBS show out of this .."This Old Plane".....

IF we build it as a two place , those of us that are not Full scale pilots , will be able to "ride".... Cool Eh???? Now whose garage are we using for about the next three months .... Let's call Hippo .... he just added on ....
Latest blog entry: Lost plans
Jul 18, 2004, 11:35 PM
Crash Master
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I vote for the angle-cut ailerons or the wing warping! The cut-out ailerons just aren't cool enough.

Whadya say, pull-pull? How about some cool rigging for coupled ailerons and rudder?

I know... too complex... But would be fun to try!

I'll see if I can do some tracing to cad tomorrow, then we can scale it to whatever size we want...

Did anyone notice the shape of the side view? Look familiar?
Jul 19, 2004, 08:05 AM
gpw
gpw
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You're right about the aileron thing , the WW would be really cool , but would it be effective at our scale "flotah" speeds?????an easy fix would be use rudder and some dihedral to turn and don't bother with the ailerons ..... we could run some thread and BB skewers on the wing to "look" like WW...hahahahaha
The UF would be a natural for a smaller scale Taube, schmaybe' an ips powered version ....I think with FFF we just have to get the outline"thing" correct and the plane will look fine ...no amount of FFF will ever get us a scale rib and fabric thing , not without alot of work , anyway.... I vote for the easy one....hahahahaha...a Big one would be nice too, do we need a larger UF, what size?? I can "scale " the measurements off the Big Pete and see what approximate sizes we're dealing with for a big un'...
Latest blog entry: Lost plans
Jul 19, 2004, 09:03 AM
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Hmmm... rough tracings yeild some unexpected results....

If you start with a UniFuse... ?about 22" long?, you wind up with a wopping 41" wingspan!

A 30" winspan yeilds a 16" fuse, so maybe that's where we should start?

Here's some rough pdf's thus far...

Edit:
Here's links to the plans:

Single sheet plans, 41": https://www.rcgroups.com/forums/atta...hmentid=266719
Tiled plans, 41": https://www.rcgroups.com/forums/atta...hmentid=265432
DXF zipped plans, 41": https://www.rcgroups.com/forums/atta...hmentid=279210
Tiled 54" Plans: https://www.rcgroups.com/forums/atta...hmentid=312563
Last edited by Gene Bond; Jan 27, 2005 at 09:59 PM. Reason: Added links to plans
Jul 19, 2004, 02:03 PM
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I noticed that the uni-fuse would be a natural for the Taube, too

The original Taube was a floater (there are legends about the pilot crawling out on the wing to take photographs, with the plane flying straight and level with no one at the controls!). Mebbe a 41" wingspan would be appropriate? Get the wing loading down?

Speaking of wing loading, WebOCalc version 0.01 is ready for trial and feedback. It's a spreadsheet that helps estimate desired wing area and motor power, given equipment weights, desired wing loading, and desired power level. WebOCalc v .01 runs on the free, Open Source office suite, Open Office, available as a free download from www.openoffice.org for Windows, Linux, and Macs. Take a look at the last few posts on this thread for more: https://www.rcgroups.com/forums/show...79#post2407779

Gene, I sent you a couple of those All Electronics DCM-227 motors for testing a couple days ago. Did they get there yet?

-Flieslikeabeagle
Jul 19, 2004, 06:57 PM
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WebOCalc version .02 screenshot


GPW, is this something that would be helpful to you? (screenshot of WebOCalc v 0.02)

In particular, you can diddle the number in that orange "scale by %" cell to get the wing loading you want, then print out your plans enlarged or reduced by that same %, and it will fly as you designed it to...

-Flieslikeabeagle
Jul 20, 2004, 07:46 AM
gpw
gpw
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Beagl...How do you do that ???? , That's amazing!!!!! Sure , you bet it's Handy!!!!! That would make my guesstimating so much more accurate .....Thanks again!!!!!!
Gbond ... the UF/41" may be the hot ticket since we wanted a floater(scale-like)and the UF will make things so much easier....for me anyway( that's why I designed it !!!!) ..... but since there's some interest in the smaller version , I think we should have two ..... we had several versions of the P-38...????which by the way worked out to 41" and flew SUPER...and howz' about a profile version too ????
Latest blog entry: Lost plans
Jul 20, 2004, 12:43 PM
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GPW, how do I do that? Because I hate having to do the same chore over and over and over again, and whenever possible I try to get computers to take over the boring grunt-work, leaving us humans to do the creative stuff!

Actually spreadsheets are pretty darn easy to create, once somebody shows you how they work. Someone with your abilities would have no trouble learning, if you were ever interested. Or you can leave it to geekier types like me, and just make us all happy by spending your extra time turning out those beautiful FFF designs!

I'm starting work on a JavaScript version, got a nice $9.99 book on JavaScript at the local Borders bookstore.

The actual "webocalc" spreadsheet is quite small, about 6kB, and easy to download, even if you're on dial-up. But OpenOffice is huge (over 10 MB for sure, maybe twice that, don't recall) and would be a pain to get with dial-up internet access.

GPW, I would be glad to snail-mail you OpenOffice and the current version (0.02) of WebOCalc on a CD, if you like. But, in order to do that, I need to know two things: What version of Mac OS are you using? What is your snail-mail address?

Please contact me privately, you can send me email addressed to "flieslikeabeagle_AT_yahoo_DOT_com". (replace "_AT_" with "@", and "_DOT_" with "." , obviously! I won't write out the correct version because there are software spambots that crawl the Internet, harvesting anything that looks like a valid email address they find, so that spamers can send the owners spam). I give you my word I will never send anything to your snail-mail (or email) address without your advance permission.

I'll attach the spreadsheet here, just in case you have another way to get OpenOffice (you can buy a CD from www.openoffice.org, sometimes they give them away at computer fairs, etc). Unzip it and open with OpenOffice...

-Flieslikeabeagle
Jul 21, 2004, 03:22 AM
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WebOCalc - HTML/JavaScript version! Screenshots..


Okay, I did it! It took me all day, but I learned enough JavaScript to re-write WebOCalc as an interactive Web page. No more need for OpenOffice, now all you need is any JavaScript enabled modern browser. I tested on Mozilla and Konqueror; Mozilla is a kissing cousin to current versions of Netscape, and Konqueror is likewise related to Apple's Safari. I don't use Internet Explorer, so I didn't test with it.

WebOCalc, the JavaScript version, looks very much like WebOCalc, the Open Office spreadsheet version. Take a look at the screenshots:


-Flieslikeabeagle
Last edited by flieslikeabeagl; Jul 21, 2004 at 03:55 AM. Reason: add a title
Jul 21, 2004, 03:36 AM
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WebOCalc - JavaScript version, attached as a zip file


Here comes the actual web page, as a zip file attachement. Unzip this, and it will create a new folder called "webocalc_javascript_version", with some files inside. Use the Web browser of your choice to navigate to the file "webocalc.09.html" inside that folder, and you should see something very similar to the screenshot above (there will be slight differences as different browsers render HTML slightly differently).

Enter all your weights, the mean wing span and chord from your plan, and the motor voltage and current draw. Click on the "Go!" button to see the resulting wing-loading, power-loading, and some other info. You should see a small JavaScript alert box pop up with a summary of the results, as seen in the screenshot above. If the resulting wing loading is too high or too low, you can simply diddle the value in the "scale wing size by %" cell, and click "Go!" again. When you find the right wing-loading, print out your plans enlarged (or reduced, if you had to shrink it to get the wing loading high enough!) by the same percentage as the number in that "scale wing size by %" cell, and you're done!

Similarly, you can diddle the motor voltage and amps till you find the power level you are looking for. Obviously, you have to have a motor/gearbox/prop/battery combo that actually matches those numbers.

This version of WebOCalc is still somewhat raw (too many decimal places displayed in some cells, you can confuse it by entering nonsense values instead of numbers, etc). But if you play by its rules it works well.

If you find any bugs, please let me know!

-Flieslikeabeagle
Last edited by flieslikeabeagl; Jul 21, 2004 at 03:56 AM. Reason: added a title


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