Vertigo II (#4) Build Thread - RC Groups
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Feb 06, 2014, 12:11 AM
West Coast Director, CPA
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Vertigo II (#4) Build Thread


Back in day days before Classic Pattern was classic, I built two Vertigo II aircraft. This was circa 1977-1978. Fast forward about 30 years or so, I discovered that folks were again building our beloved pattern designs of the past. This ignited my passion for fast, track-on-rails airplane and the quest was on to duplicate my favorite design, the Vertigo II.
Vertigo #3 was completed in October of 2010, and flew on November 6th of the same year. It was built from an original Skyglass kit. 96 flights and 14 hours flight time later, it rolled over onto it's back and died on the desert floor at Lancaster, Ca. after the receiver called it quits.
This new aircraft (#4) features a new fuselage and bellypan molded by Tim Reed. Tim's glasswork is a welcome advance forward from the sketchy Skyglass stuff of yesterday. I have a set of wing cores CNC cut by FlyingFoam.com from my own plans. Power this time will be a NovaRossi Speed 13 mounted upright with the pipe running through the canopy. Guidance will be a new Futaba 14 channel radio, and it will sport Spring-Air retracts this time in a proper nose-dragger configuration. #3 was built as a taildragger, and it just didn't pan out the way that I expected.
The finish has been graciously sponsored by Kevin Gribben at wingswestrc.com. Kevin has some exciting products that we will put to the test on this project.
I am going to recycle several parts from #3 in the interest of time savings and the fact that they are awesome and unscathed. I am quite interested in getting to know the NovaRossi, the examples that I have seen run are amazing. Now time to get started.

-Robert
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Feb 06, 2014, 12:23 AM
Registered User
I like the fact that you are recycling the good parts of #3 to make #4 happen. Been there myself. I must admit though..... that tail section would look good mounted on a plaque, hanging on a wall.
Feb 06, 2014, 06:47 AM
Chess club geek with wings
blunight's Avatar
Subscribed - looks like a great project
Feb 06, 2014, 10:44 AM
DavidsPlanes
doxilia's Avatar
Robert,

I look forward to your new build. You're going to love that engine. Look for a review of it in the April issue of FlyRC by yours truly.

It'll be very cool to see the V2 back on trike gear with a RE engine. The engine just seems to call for a different colour scheme though. I like the base yellow of your original. With metallic purple for accents (matching the engine anodizing) and gun metal for canopy and maybe other trim. I call it painting vicariously!

I think Mark's comment merits a thought - mounted on a plaque, that tail would make for great shop conversation!

David
Feb 06, 2014, 06:16 PM
West Coast Director, CPA
Vertigo II's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by tiporare
I must admit though..... that tail section would look good mounted on a plaque, hanging on a wall.
Did that once. I splashed a North Star (seaplane) into Lake Tahoe. The engine mounted in a pod on the tail. Well it was the only part that did not sink. The fuel tank was empty, so it floated. So I got my Rossi back. All the rest of the plane, including brand new JR radio gear- right to the bottom.
I mounted that pod to my shop wall on a plaque where it stayed until I moved.
-Robert
Feb 07, 2014, 12:54 AM
Registered User
Tri-gear Vertigo II ....Robert....Nice.. Like the thread....Looking forward to your rebuild..

B
Feb 07, 2014, 12:56 AM
Raised on 80's Pattern
Fatherof4's Avatar
I could NOT be happier!!!!

Kicking back waiting for the show.

I have a feeling this V2 is going to kick a$$ over the last one. It will certainly sit prettier on three wheels.

.........

Doug
Feb 08, 2014, 11:43 AM
DavidsPlanes
doxilia's Avatar
Robert,

I'm in need of picking up some retracts for a DB60 I'd like to start a build on next month. I'm deciding between Spring-Air and B&D but I will likely be using a FW mount since there are some blind nuts already installed in the FW which I understand should be for SA units. There's a little problem with the install so I might have to redo it which will be fun with the FW already in place...

Anyhow, I was just wondering what units you have in this picture. I find the SA web site a little confusing as the 100, 200 and 300 units all seem to be identical to one another. At least the pictures are. Low draft & weight is preferable obviously if there are such differences. For a change I'd also like to use 3/16" struts (front & back) but I don't believe there are any axles (DB or GP) that are made for 3/16" wire (I usually use 5/32" struts). I guess the units can be drilled out. I prefer the DB units but they will require a drill press to get it right which I don't have. I'll sort it out one way or another.

I've added the pictures provided on the SA site - perhaps they can shed some light on the subject. I take it the HD refers to 3/16" struts which otherwise are 5/32" (except the 600 mini series which use 1/8"). But, there is no difference between the 101HD and 301 - it is the same exact picture so it's hard to know what difference there is between the two. Anyone know?

Anyhow, don't mean to detour your thread - just a quick chat on retracts while you build. I appreciate your advice.

David
Last edited by doxilia; Feb 08, 2014 at 12:03 PM.
Feb 08, 2014, 11:42 PM
West Coast Director, CPA
Vertigo II's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by doxilia
Robert,

I'm in need of picking up some retracts for a DB60 I'd like to start a build on next month. I'm deciding between Spring-Air and B&D but I will likely be using a FW mount since there are some blind nuts already installed in the FW which I understand should be for SA units. There's a little problem with the install so I might have to redo it which will be fun with the FW already in place...

Anyhow, I was just wondering what units you have in this picture. I find the SA web site a little confusing as the 100, 200 and 300 units all seem to be identical to one another. At least the pictures are. Low draft & weight is preferable obviously if there are such differences. For a change I'd also like to use 3/16" struts (front & back) but I don't believe there are any axles (DB or GP) that are made for 3/16" wire (I usually use 5/32" struts). I guess the units can be drilled out. I prefer the DB units but they will require a drill press to get it right which I don't have. I'll sort it out one way or another.

I've added the pictures provided on the SA site - perhaps they can shed some light on the subject. I take it the HD refers to 3/16" struts which otherwise are 5/32" (except the 600 mini series which use 1/8"). But, there is no difference between the 101HD and 301 - it is the same exact picture so it's hard to know what difference there is between the two. Anyone know?

Anyhow, don't mean to detour your thread - just a quick chat on retracts while you build. I appreciate your advice.

David
David,
I do not know which units are in the bag, I bought the entire system brand new from a guy at a swap meet for $50. Could not pass up that deal. I will have to identify which model they correspond with.

You are correct, the SA website is a bit nebulous. The only difference that I can tell is if you look at the dimensioned pics at the top of each page, you will notice that the 300 series is 15/16" deep vs. 1-1/8" deep for the 100 and 200 series.
IIRC, I bought the 100 series for Vertigo #3, and the 300 series for my P-7. The odd thing was that the gear that they sent for #3 was bored for the oleo struts, and has a cylindrical bushing adapter for 5/32" wire. Weird. Regardless of type, the SA gear have given me great service. The only weak link has been the fill valves. I had two of them blow out, but it turned out to be operator error on my part. When I reduced the fill pressure from 100 PSI to the recommended 80 PSI, there have been no further fill valve failures.

As far as 5/32" struts vs. 3/16" struts, my personal preference is for 5/32". I use straight 5/32" struts with no coil spring. The coil spring winding seems to de-temper the wire somehow, and leaves you with a model that waddles down the runway side to side. The straight struts are less flexy and greatly improves the ground handling. I once calculated the weight of a given strut with and without the coil spring bend, and it was substantial. I no longer have those figures, but you are a guy that likes that kind of math. Check it out for yourself.

Along that same school for thought, I also feel that given the weight range of (a properly constructed) .61 size classic model that 3/16" struts are once again just so much dead weight. It has been my experience that if I have a mishap and bend a 5/32" strut, I can simply grab hold of it and bend it back into shape. (If you do this and the retract breaks out of the wing, you did a poor job of mounting your gear).

A 5/32" straight strut seems to be the right balance of rigidity, ability to yield under mishap and reasonable weight.

Axles- Check Central Hobbies, they offer aluminum axles for both 5/32 and 3/16 struts. They have a claimed weight of 2 grams per piece, and have served me for 20 hours of flight time on my P-7. The steel Du-Bro equivalent weigh a claimed 7 grams apiece for a total of 1/2 oz. 4 grams vs. 14 grams. Seems like a no-brainer to me.

-Robert
Feb 09, 2014, 01:55 AM
CPA #100
flyonenow's Avatar
Robert,
Good luck with your build. I'm subscribed and

Paul
Feb 11, 2014, 09:44 PM
CPA 30, SPA 523
Timthetoolman's Avatar
Very cool, I was wondering when this would happen. I'll have to kick mine back in gear soon (I got derailed on making some wishes come true for some Tiger Tail fans and a new job).

Looking forward to your build.

Tim
Feb 11, 2014, 11:56 PM
West Coast Director, CPA
Vertigo II's Avatar
Hey all,
Thanks for the support! The project is in a lull at the moment. I ordered wing sheeting from National Balsa. Waiting for the big brown truck to deliver.
Meanwhile, I have made some servo selections:
Spektrum A5030 Mini Digitals (plastic gears) for the ailerons and elevators
http://www.spektrumrc.com/Products/D...odID=SPMSA5030
Spektrum A5040 Metal gear Digital servo for the rudder.
http://www.spektrumrc.com/Products/D...odID=SPMSA5040
Coreless double ball bearing servos with far excess torque than the job requires. And the price is right.
For the nose gear steering: Spektrum A3040 Sub micro Digital Metal Gear.
http://www.spektrumrc.com/Products/D...odID=SPMSA3040
I have a buddy who is running the Spektrum digitals is various aircraft with impressive results. I think that they will be well suited for this application.

The rest of the week will be taken up with contest preparation. The first West Coast classic contest is this Sunday at Lancaster, Ca. YIPPEE!!!!!
-Robert
Feb 12, 2014, 12:00 AM
West Coast Director, CPA
Vertigo II's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by Timthetoolman
Very cool, I was wondering when this would happen. I'll have to kick mine back in gear soon (I got derailed on making some wishes come true for some Tiger Tail fans and a new job).

Looking forward to your build.

Tim
Hey Tim,
I am looking forward to you resuming work on your Vertigo.

Parallel Vertigo Builds- it doesn't get much better than that!

-Robert
Feb 13, 2014, 12:08 PM
Registered User
jhaywood's Avatar
Central hobbies also has the titanium struts that are lighter than the steel.


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