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Oct 10, 2013, 02:02 AM
Design is everything.
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Discussion

Rubber Powered RTP (Round the Pole) Flight


The problem of limited flying space has now forced me to explore RTP controlled flying instead of RC.

I am sure the same RTP concept was used originally with rubber powered models, has anyone tried flying a rubber powered model round the pole, tied with a string, at least for testing?

It seems to be a great way to test rubber powered models with a lower risk of crashes or loss. I know that I wish I had used this with the rubber powered model that I first had, it would have changed everything.

With a RTP set up, you can test
  • If the model takes off under its own power
  • Endurance
  • Speed

In many if not all indoor rubber powered scale contests, the aircraft model is trimmed to take off and fly in circles, granted this is an fine art, however the same visual result can be achieved by beginners using a tether.

I myself have tried out a stick model RTP with encouraging results. It takes off, but has so much power if whizzes around in circles. Flight time is 7 seconds on 200 turns.

Some rubber powered RTP setups follow:

http://kidder.ca/education/flight/mo...ered-pole.html
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Oct 10, 2013, 06:23 AM
NSWFFS
Not sure about rubber RTP but I have certainly seen rubber control line.

What's wrong with electric RTP? Buy a cheap slot car set and you are halfway there.

Cheers,
Rob
Oct 10, 2013, 09:07 AM
Registered User
DeeBee1's Avatar
I only first heard about rubber RTP fairly recently. There are several rubber RTP plans on Outerzone, including some racers, for example:

http://www.outerzone.co.uk/plan_details.asp?ID=3515
Oct 10, 2013, 09:13 AM
Registered User
RTP rubber was very popular in the UK during the 40s and early 50s with SMAE-recognised events for classes of duration models, etc. - complete with record setting. In the latter years it progressed into both compressed air and electric RTP at club gatherings; even small diesels were so flown on occasion though usually discouraged by the hall janitor who objected to the ring of fuel spray around the walls...... Jetex speed, with tiny deltas, filled said hall with fumes whilst the model went almost invisible in flight, resembling one of Saturn's rings...

On those occasions the safest person in the hall was the junior delegated to sit in the centre and hold the pole steady.
Oct 14, 2013, 01:52 AM
Design is everything.
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Quote:
Originally Posted by McGiver
Not sure about rubber RTP but I have certainly seen rubber control line.

What's wrong with electric RTP? Buy a cheap slot car set and you are halfway there.

Cheers,
Rob
Rubber control line - that's one I have not heard of before. Any information on this?

Electric RTP is very much in the cards. That's another project.

I still like the simplicity of rubber powered models and I do not have much space for flight testing. Following some encouraging results, rubber powered RTP seems the best option to test out my attempts to build cardboard rubber powered designs - will they fly - will they take off under own power, how fast, can they be made to float slowly round and round constructed although constructed out of heavier materials and so on.

Once they fly properly I can just cut the chord and let them fly free.
Oct 14, 2013, 01:54 AM
Design is everything.
Thread OP
Quote:
Originally Posted by DeeBee1
I only first heard about rubber RTP fairly recently. There are several rubber RTP plans on Outerzone, including some racers, for example:

http://www.outerzone.co.uk/plan_details.asp?ID=3515
Thanks for the links. I never knew of this type of flying until I saw these links.

I wonder what their motivation was - ah yes safe indoor flying.
Oct 14, 2013, 02:04 AM
Design is everything.
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Applehoney
RTP rubber was very popular in the UK during the 40s and early 50s with SMAE-recognised events for classes of duration models, etc. - complete with record setting. In the latter years it progressed into both compressed air and electric RTP at club gatherings; even small diesels were so flown on occasion though usually discouraged by the hall janitor who objected to the ring of fuel spray around the walls...... Jetex speed, with tiny deltas, filled said hall with fumes whilst the model went almost invisible in flight, resembling one of Saturn's rings...

On those occasions the safest person in the hall was the junior delegated to sit in the centre and hold the pole steady.
Jim, thanks for the info.

I am slowly beginning to realize the depth and the breadth of aeromodelling history, I am sure it makes a fascinating subject.

Found some links here:

http://www.modelaircraft.org/museum/aerohistory.aspx

http://www.fai.org/ciam-about-us/cia...ears-1936-1949

Has anyone written a grand history of aeromodelling or the like? I would sure want to own such a book.
Oct 19, 2013, 07:52 AM
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Gluehand's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by Applehoney
RTP rubber was very popular in the UK during the 40s and early 50s
RTP rubber was popular here as well.
An eager spokesman was Sigurd Isacson, who used to enclose imformative and encouraging leaflets with his kits, sometimes printed on the plans....
As a young lad I toyed with this a lot at home, when weather didn't allow outdoor activities...

Last edited by Gluehand; Oct 19, 2013 at 08:48 AM.
Oct 19, 2013, 08:26 AM
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Gluehand's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by knlever
I am slowly beginning to realize the depth and the breadth of aeromodelling history, I am sure it makes a fascinating subject.
Here are a few links from the Swedish Aeromodelling Museum.
It is still not that old, but the exhibition & collection are constantly growing....

Museum, link 1
Museum, link 2
Museum, link 3

Oct 20, 2013, 06:02 AM
Design is everything.
Thread OP
Some great model there.

That Auster is a nice one.

Are any RTP models shown ?
Last edited by Designer2010; Oct 20, 2013 at 07:40 PM. Reason: Mistake
Oct 20, 2013, 07:40 PM
Design is everything.
Thread OP
RTP rubber power and for that matter Electric RTP will result in the model flying almost exactly as these beautiful scale models are doing - in circles - ( Miles sparrowhawk?) and much safer (to the model) as well.

BMFA FF Indoor Scale Nats 2012 (2 min 26 sec)
Last edited by Designer2010; Oct 20, 2013 at 07:42 PM. Reason: added text for clarity
Feb 07, 2014, 05:21 AM
Design is everything.
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More Experiments with Rubber Powered RTP continue


Tried another round of this:

The rubber powered stick plane was quite entertaining, and the kid loved it, but the rubber motor broke easily and flights are about two circles at most on 150+ turns.

I will have to go for electric. a motor costing less than half a US dollar... stay tuned

Quote:
What's wrong with electric RTP? Buy a cheap slot car set and you are halfway there.
Looks like McGiver was right all along.
Feb 08, 2014, 01:56 PM
Registered User
That event looks like chaos. Beautifully trimmed models though.
Feb 09, 2014, 04:11 AM
Registered User
Quote:
Originally Posted by knlever
Tried another round of this:

The rubber powered stick plane was quite entertaining, and the kid loved it, but the rubber motor broke easily and flights are about two circles at most on 150+ turns.

I will have to go for electric. a motor costing less than half a US dollar... stay tuned



Looks like McGiver was right all along.
Sounds like you were using rubber that was too short or not very good, or perhaps you didn't lube it? FAI tan ought to be able to take a lot of turns. I seem to recall using 0.100" rubber (say, 2.5mm) 18" (46cm) long and putting in close to 2,000 turns on a limited pennyplane I used to fly. I don't know what kind of stuff you have around, but you probably have something that can be used as a rubber lube.

Of course, electric is probably easy to do.
---------------
Our local club had a pylon race. It was kind of fun to watch. I've participated in similar events, some years ago, with Little Richard* models. I think we had a pylon race, and we had another event where you had to fly as long as possible within a 10 minute window, but when Little Richard stopped singing, that was it. We also did a balloon bust, penny loft, and toilet paper tow. Both of the latter were rather dangerous for the model, partly due to the load and partly due to the increased motor size used. It's possible to tow 22 squares of toilet paper with one of these things, at least for a short time. If you don't break the rubber or crush the fuselage while winding.

*Available as a kit from Easy Built
Last edited by lincoln; Feb 09, 2014 at 04:16 AM. Reason: added last paragraph
Feb 14, 2014, 08:09 PM
Design is everything.
Thread OP
Quote:
Originally Posted by TRuss
That event looks like chaos. Beautifully trimmed models though.
Sure looks like chaos, but I could not help wondering about all the effort required to trim the models to sly steadily under all conditions - climb, changes in torque etc, really great.


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