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1 - Modded F45 Rx, ADH300XL main motor, Brushed tail 2 - 6ch Rx, Align 430X main motor, 3s battery, Belt tail 3 - 6ch Rx, 2211 Turnigy tail - and also a pretty standard HK/Align CP 450. Where I fly (a southern trades seaside area) the prevailing winds year round are gusty 10 to 20 knots - so (unless I want to get up at 5am!) have been concentrating most of my R&D into getting the best wind authority and easy recoverability from gusts. On this basis, and in my own experience, they are ranked pretty well as above - with the CP sort of between 1 and 2. However, the best all rounder seems to be the FP belt tail (getting the most flight time!) - except in 20 knot + winds. Bear in mind, this is from the 'fun flying' pov, not looking for really challenging flying at the end of a day's work. Or repair bills. I'm still waiting on feedback from some more experienced CP guys, to see if my ranking on the CP is due to my lack of CP skills, and if more practice would also give a 'fun flying' label to a 450 CP in a 20 knot wind. But the only competent local flyer I know says to get his tick of approval under these conditions would have to be flying his 550 (or bigger). TL, DR? - Best (IME, so far) - 6ch Rx, FP 450 with belt tail. Thanks, Arrowshooter! (wasted weeks trying to get BL tail exactly right). |
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Last edited by OldOz; Feb 22, 2013 at 06:24 PM.
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Yea that's the sort of thing I had in mind.
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My MJX is still in testing, so I am undecided on the tail so far. |
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90 deg flybar and 45 deg flybar are different animals altogether. BThirsk knows the technicalities far better than I, but IME the 45's handle more forgivingly but with less precision. Yes, have personally flown a 450CP with pitch set to 6, 6, 6, 6, 6 : (and seven deg also). the handling seemed a bit easier but pretty mushy. Others have commented similarly on helifreak. To my mind, you lose all the advantages of CP, but gain few of the FP: however, YMMV of course with different CPs (and pilots!). Any FB CP I have flown WILL require constant attention, regardless of setup. All my FP 450s will hover hands off (for a reasonable while, anyway). And go like a bat out of hell when it's needed . Hope this helps John. |
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Locking the pitch on a conventional CP head accomplishes nothing, other than rob it of a lot of stability and wind handling capability. You still have the same head that is subject to the same damage potential. Likewise, there is no advantage to making a flybarless CP head act as FP, for the same reasons. |
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Last edited by Balr14; Feb 22, 2013 at 11:07 PM.
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Thread OP
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Someone on another thread asked for a more detail parts list so here it is. I have purchased everything off eBay except for the Transmitter which I got from Wow. I don’t think I forgot anything.
FBL FP 450 Parts List: -Trex 450 Clone kit Doesn’t have to be a clone either. -Align DFC Flybarless head assembly On my first conversion I used the Hobbymate DFC Clone but I prefer the Align now as I have explained previously. There are others like Tarot that should work but they have the swashplate followers. These are probably stronger units then the DFC, but might not give you enough room for the spacers to allow complete swash movement. The DFC head conversions come with DFC Main Shafts that will not work on the 450SEV2. The Hobbymate comes with Thrust Bearings and most Align DFC conversion kits do not. Be sure you know what you are buying. -Align DFC Feathering shaft H45021A -90 degree swash plate I just found out that if you are crafty enough, you can convert a 120 degree swash to 90. -2 - Align 1-way Bearing shafts AGNH1130 This is the sleeve in the main gear’s 1-way bearing and is used to make the swash spacers. I cut the lower spacer at 8mm and the upper one is 12mm and used blade grip thrust bearing spacers to take up the slack on the top swash spacer to get the 5 degree pitch. This way the length of the top spacer does not have to be exact and I have to option to go to 6 or 7 degrees pitch. -Extra Main Shaft adjustable collar. This is used below the bottom swash spacer for adjustment. You will need to grind flat spots on the main shaft for the grub screws. -Longer aileron servo arm -Suitable servo linkages The Electronics that I am using: -Walkera 2403 Tx -Walkera 2437V Rx w/3-axis gyro -Tail Servo Walkera and Hobby King digitals -Hobbymate 3800kv motor w/13T pinion -Hobbywing Pentium 40A ESC -Tower Pro cyclic servos (current) -ZOP Power 2s and 3s lipos |
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You can go all the way from my 'minimal' approach (post 48) to his fully BL (and FBL) solution: and all the steps along the way, each of which might be the best for some pilots/flying environments. By and large, it all depends on what you were wanting it for, and what your flying environment was. Even then, your needs could change with your skill level. But - as I said in an earlier post - probably IMO the 'best' compromise solution is a F45 head, a 6ch Tx/Rx, a HK (or other) FB clone frame, and a belt tail. Seems pretty bombproof, and flies well in a big backyard or small park. And could be easily upgraded to CP if you decided later to go down that road. If you've a much bigger area, Arrow's FBL solution just above would have to be a winner. Think all helis will be FBL in a couple of years, anyway. Cheers John |
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Thanks, a f45 head looks very easy to do, all i am worried is how easy/hard for the f45 head assembly to be mounted on say example hk450 GT (i thinks its belt driven). |
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There are only three basic problems with mounting the F45 head on an Align 450 compatible body. 1) The shaft adaptor. The standard Align main shaft is 5mm: the F45 is 6mm. You'll need an appropriate sleeve approx 4cm long 2) The antirotation bracket. Again, the one I linked works well (anchored with epoxy glue and hot glue). 3) IF using F45 Rx/Tx and servos: a) The linkages have to be extended (but plenty of bits in the clone kits), and b) the ali/roll servo will be reversed in function, when mounted in the only sensible place. This is no biggie, you can reverse 2 wires in the Tx: or use an Align servo, which is reversed anyway. A minor problem also to mount the tail rotor - just use about 3 cm of the existing boom wrapped in tape inserted into the (shortened) 450 boom. If using a 6ch Rx/Tx, can reverse in the Tx, so np there: and use the tail rotor that came with the kit. Have to disable swash mixing, of course. It's not a trivial project, but well documented now. There's also pictures of various 450 conversions through this thread, and also on the main F45 thread. Cheers John. |
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Last edited by OldOz; Feb 23, 2013 at 06:02 AM.
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