K-E-os at last - Page 6 - RC Groups
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Feb 02, 2013, 12:19 PM
Visitor from Reality
Originally Posted by Captain Dunsel
An appropriate pilot for a Kaos? How about Maxwell Smart...although Agent 99 would be a lot more photogenic

Hmmm... Wish I'd thought of this while the COTU Was honouring us with her presence - could have pulled off a visit to 'Buy Toys From Us' using herself as a smokescreen .

Spraying the canopy silver would do me, but one cannot buy spray paint in cans in Chicago so it would involve a 30-odd mile round trip to buy a rattlecan.

Oh well. Maybe I can turn up something other than a Chinese interpretation of a pop-eyed European?

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Feb 02, 2013, 07:35 PM
Registered User
Just as a matter of curiosity, can you mail-order spray paints into Chicago? Or, would you wind up having the ATF at your door?

Feb 03, 2013, 12:34 AM
Blew out my flip flop
David Hogue's Avatar
Dereck's been tagging anti-barf symbols downtown again, havent you?
Feb 03, 2013, 01:04 AM
Visitor from Reality
Originally Posted by Captain Dunsel
Just as a matter of curiosity, can you mail-order spray paints into Chicago? Or, would you wind up having the ATF at your door?

Now, that's getting complicated. With the Prius, a 60 mile drive is cheaper than MO, though sneaking something in past Illinois sales taxes can make for serious savings.

I have the can of red spray paint I bought outside of Chicago to do the cowl on my 4*20E and haven't seen the PATF as yet, so who knows?

Oddly enough, and with little effect on street trash spraying buildings, all fifty - yes, fifty - 'Alderpersons', as the Chicago government Minor IAms, are known, voted to ban those terrible sorry cans from this fine city. Maybe they should go to DC and do a presentation to the Mighty PooBahs and Great Iams up Capital Hill on how to agree on things and pass laws in unison?

In the meantime, I am poised to do Great Things to the K-E-OS wing in the name of progress, but am swithering between a complicated tailplane structure involving a 3/16" strip wood core capped in 1/16" balsa or just making the tailfeathers from 1/4" sheet balsa.

Decisions, decisions!

Feb 03, 2013, 04:57 PM
Visitor from Reality
Got the centre area pretty much fixed up bar some oddments, like support areas for the mounting bolts. Started on the interspar webbing - a little fussy perhaps, but it's centred on the spars inner faces to produce an I beam and the webs snug up to the ribs.

As it's only drawn in CAD, this means I have to make every webbing piece by hand to fit correctly.

Sometimes think that the concept of two wood skinned hotwire cut foam core panels glued and fibreglassed together has considerable attraction...

Feb 03, 2013, 05:06 PM
KOMET 44's Avatar
look GREAT as usual!!!!
Feb 03, 2013, 07:27 PM
Registered User
The foam core wings come out somewhat heavier. The will affect rolls due to their higher inertia, but only a serious aerobatic driver might notice it. Practice would cure it. You might like it.
Feb 03, 2013, 08:20 PM
Visitor from Reality
Hi Al
Back in Engand, in the last century, the majority of sports RC kits had hot-wired white foam wings covered in Obeche veneer. Builder got to stick the LE and TE on, then join the panels with epoxy and GF wrap the joint.

The weight difference between them and built-up is close to trivial, but I never got around to buying cutting gear to try it on an OD. CD gets up to such trickery, I believe

Now, what's going on? Spousal Unit is shouting at the Telly a lot. There's commercials between commercials, but every so often, two teams of aproximately two hundred huge millionaires wearing shoulder pads are trying to move an odd shaped ball around a rectangle of imitation grass using anything bar their feet.

Very odd!

Feb 04, 2013, 08:49 AM
Registered User

I stopped watching them after #2. A good and safe power supply for a hot wire cutter is an esc for brushed motors on 7 round ones. The best way to cut is by numbering the templates all around and using two people. A person on one end calling the numbers. You can never hesitate during the cut. We always went around the leading edge and covered it with precurved balsa or we used 1/64" ply wide enough to go all the way around. If you use the ply you MUST make sure the adhesive is really dry( not just on the surface ). Solvent fumes cannot pass through the glue layers of the ply and they will slowly disappear the foam.

Feb 04, 2013, 10:29 AM
Visitor from Reality
Hi Al
That lightens up the cost of the cutting bow power supply a lot. I recall back when US mags were actually mags and not mostly catalogues, some company sellling what looked like a very complicated rig for cutting wing cores. Took up most of a bench top and weights set at various distances and weight looked to drive the cutting bow ends at different speeds. Looked very complicated and expensive, especially compared to the route you describe.

Those English kits all had squared off LE and TE sections, you stuck balsa sheet, appropriate depth, onto them after, or before sometimes, joining the panels.

The really clever trick is that no balsa company in England made pre-shaped TE sections that matched anyone's wing kits... So ailerons inevitably were significantly skinnier than the wing TE.

Now, that thing on the telly last night - how did they score that bit when all the millionaires in shoulder pads were replaced on the pitch by three women wearing about enough leather to cover a cow's leg between them? And what about when the lights went out? Did whoever owns the stadium not have enough money saved up to pay the electric bill?

Feb 04, 2013, 10:42 AM
Registered User
Yes, I do still cut foam cores once in a while. The issue's come to be finding foam. Can't find it in the local DITY stores. I used to watch the side of the highway during my work commute for the odd blocks blown off trucks, but even that supply is beginning to dwindle now that I'm retired. No, I won't get a new job, just for the foam!

I have one of those "Hands-Off' cutters, complete with triac (?) gadgetry power supply. It worked okay for cutting tapered cores, up until the belts rotted about a dozen years ago (not suprising, since I bought the gizmo around 1985.). Now, I pull the cores through by hand, trusting on my judgement to pull them through evenly.

I use slow-curing epoxy for the wing sheeting. I've used wing sheeting tape (really light -- I can make a foam wing with it that's lighter than a built-up one, but hot sunny days wreak havoc with the adhesion!). I tried contact cement...once. Murphy makes sure someone always interrupts me when I'm doing a "you've only got one shot at it" chore, so I refuse to use it any more.

For most models bigger than about 2 lbs, I use 1/16" balsa; for smaller ships, I use 1/32" balsa. Since they're my own designs, there isn't anyone else I can blame when I wind up with a wood size I can't find for the LE or TE.

BTW, the Ulu Mk III is done. Power 15 on a 3S2200, it came in at a hair under 44 oz. for a 432 sq. inch fully-symmetrical foam wing. I'll post and send pictures in a bit -- my netbook's hard drive died, so I'm borrowing Micki's to do my socializing until my new HD comes in.

Feb 04, 2013, 12:41 PM
Visitor from Reality
Back in the day, most UK wings were skinned with a glue like a contact adhesive that could be found in most hardware stores, was pretty cheap and worked great.

Which likely meant that leaving the pot open too long could poison the entire state of California...

Looking forward to seeing Ulu. Sounds about the size of model I built back when I flew slimey things. Sometimes think that even the 4S 3600/OS30 combo is a tad too big for comfort for me.

I vaguely recall the idea of marking hot wiring templates with matched divisions so that the wire could be moved through the core at different speed s to cope with the taper. I think I'll stick with all wood structures and maybe revert to parallel chord wings

Never mind those toy airplane things. I now have to paint a door in the condo...

Feb 04, 2013, 04:57 PM
AMA # 75962
Jim Lee's Avatar

Around 1970 or 71 when I got my first Kaos, I flew it with the built up balsa wing for awhile. Then I saw a ad in either RC Modler or M.A.N. that showed a complete glass covered foam wing, I ordered one and when I got it, One of the wing panels was warped. I sent it back and the new one was perfectly straight.

I glued the wing joiners in and slapped some slow cure epoxy on it. Then when it dried. I glassed the center section and flew the Kaos. I seem to remember that it flew better with that glass covered foam wing . (I won my first pattern contest in class A with it) I often think about building another Kaos and probabley will some day when the mood strikes me.

I'm really enjoying reading about your build with the Kaos. It brings back fond memorys of when I was building my Kaos and chewing the ambroid off of my fingers, while I waited for the glue to dry.

Feb 04, 2013, 07:44 PM
Visitor from Reality
Hi Jim
If I'd been building around '70, it would have been with Humbrol balsa cement. Which, oddly enough, was made in my home town of Hull, on the east side of England.

Now I chew yellow wood glue off my fingers... Some things don't change!

Interesting concept of skinned foam wings being better than a semi-open wood frame. There's been many arguments about which is the 'best', for sure. Recall one mag article that touted the full open frame with turbulator spars, like the beloved Four Star series. Must confess to not having that many skinned foam wings, and one of them was a somewhat non-aerobatic parasol with a well engineered folding wing that was great for putting the model into the car.

The Kaos is a good looker that flies well too, as many owners like yourself tell. I hope mine gets up somewhere near it.

Feb 04, 2013, 07:50 PM
AMA 667982 KG7NKY
starcad's Avatar
Originally Posted by Dereck
And what about when the lights went out? Did whoever owns the stadium not have enough money saved up to pay the electric bill?

I'm helping my son spread the rumor that Anonymous hacked the power grid and tried to take out the lights at the Super Bowl!

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