K-E-os at last - Page 4 - RC Groups
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Jan 21, 2013, 07:27 PM
Old Crow
hammiller's Avatar


FRED was the nickname for the C-5a when it first came out and it probably had the same meaning.
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Jan 22, 2013, 11:11 AM
Registered User
Finally dug out the photo album, so here are some shots of the Kaos we had, starting with a Super Kaos .60, two Kaos .40's (built a third, but sold it when I got orders to move before it'd been finished), and a Sun Fli 4-20.

Also found two shots of the first Kaos being built. The wing is on a home-made version of a Bridi wing jig. It guaranteed a straight wing panel and was pretty easy to make.

Please forgive the pictures. My wife took them with her old clack-a-matic camera, between 1978 and 1984, long before she got a really good camera.

Jan 22, 2013, 11:13 AM
Registered User
And, since I brought it up, here at the two previous Ulu's, both with Astro .40 direct drive motors and big, round cells. Whilst the wings aren't quite Kaos wings, I did borrow from the Kaos design for the tail feathers.

Jan 22, 2013, 12:17 PM
Visitor from Reality
Lovely round of photos - far better than what I can manage right now! At least the condo is quiet for a while, though fortunately, SU has taken the car to move the COTU to a shopping region so I can't go out flying. Which means I can avoid hypothermia for another day. Chicago might be setting records for snow-less-ness (???) but it just scored one for being b!@@#y cold today.

That Bridi jig is fascinating - wasn't something similar available until fairly recently? It would go down real well with CAD drawn/cut wing ribs, though with the number of builders vs hobby buyers, the only way to get a jig like that would be to build your own now.

The thought of an Astro 40 direct compared to the OS 30 intended for my K-E-os fair makes me shudder too. I just missed that route to serious wattage, as Tom Cimato invented the geared brushless just in time for my arrival on the big watts stage.

Suspect that most of the models of that era were pretty much the same thing, with minor personal variances to suit individual tastes. At least it was better than today, when models are mostly exactly the same...

K-E-os will go with minimal effort put into the top decking - just some thick-ish balsa sheet, rounded off on the corners and a boring old electric style cowling shaped around the motor with cooling as fancied necessary. Despite that I like the forward tailplane/rearward rudder look, it would involve a lot of work so I'll stick with my boring old look. Wish I'd noticed that before!

Jan 22, 2013, 01:42 PM
Registered User
Hello, Dereck

Agree with the cold bit. No way I'd want to stand outside for long today, not without being next to a roaring fire. It didn't stop Micki from dragging me off to the Community College pool for our regular exercise session, though. Not that it was bad in the pool, but stepping back out into single-digit wind chills with damp hair is not fun.

The wing jig was commercially available, I believe, but I built my own from pine, particle board, and steel dowels, all from a (then) local DITY store. Bridi included the jig holes in the wings, but when GP assimilated Bridi, they dropped the holes (although they might be back, but it's been years). I don't know if washout was included in the jigging, though. The holes had another use, later on, for pegs aligning the wing halves when they were joined.

Those big motors and their pallets of big, heavy cells were why I wound up going to smaller models. I built a few big ships, like a 72" span PT-19 for Micki and a big geared 40 Waco YKS-6 for me, but wound up not liking having to deal with the size and complexity. If you hit something with a model that size, the batteries were going to go wherever they wanted to. Such as when Micki clipped the tops of some soybeans whilst landing the PT-19. The battery tray slid out (as designed), but instead of sliding forward and down, it just went forwards...cleaning off the entire nose, motor and all. That was not a quick rebuild!

I suspect the nose of the new Ulu will look more as you describe, to fit the outrunner stuck in it. Sleek spinners are nice, but I need airflow over the motor and ESC.

Jan 22, 2013, 03:55 PM
Registered User
Hey Dereck. Have not been visiting this section with any regularity lately, and sadly missed your thread. I will now again be a regular. Glad to see you're underway. As too the question about whether Bridi/Bluejay Kits have added back jig holes, having just built their Utter Chaos kit I can say they have not.
Jan 22, 2013, 04:05 PM
Visitor from Reality

Any use to anyone?

I 'fondly' remember the back-up to my 20 and 16 BRJ powered models. Three or four packs, a 100AH deep cycle lead acid battery, two chargers... Much easier when the buggy is parked right outside the house/garage. I never got to models over 60" span though - but they were fun to play with

Ten cell packs back of a geared Astro 35 with a fudged ratio were nearly as much fun, but far more practical on the whole. They were still pretty good at demolishing anything in their path, but at least didn't catch fire at any opportunity.

In the meantime, Granny has returned from shopping, the noise level has rocketed and all is another form of chaos.

Jan 22, 2013, 05:37 PM
Visitor from Reality

And the subsequent five episodes, a good read that I intend to print out when I get the plastic imitation babies off the printer. A little old (not my printer) but still valid.

Anyone tried those new fancy e-power spinners with air vents? True-Turn?

Jan 22, 2013, 07:27 PM
Wanted for breaking Ohm's Law
Dennis Sumner's Avatar

I have been searching to see articles like the link you attached. Where did you go to find it? I have done a google search and would be great to read some if these old classic issues. I did find one for Don Dewey's New Era III that I downloaded. I remember when I started in the hobby in 1971 every issue of most magizines had 2-3 plans/construction articles. I miss those days! I think the English magazines still have that magic although pricey for the shipped paper issues. I know I have told you that I have a electronic subscription to Quiet and Electric Flight the only thing I miss with the iPad version is the free plans....to bad there isn't a way to download the PDF's....

Oh well, I did get my RCM plans for the New Era III on Saturday....maybe next fall I'll start a thread here for it.....

I know Model Builder out out a DVD set of all issues (I think).

Latest blog entry: RC Throw Gauge
Jan 22, 2013, 07:36 PM
Registered User
Thanks, Arniebud, I expected as much (although I did have hopes!).

I have to admit my Bridi wing jig was done on the cheap, but it worked well for several years! I wound up buying and Ajusto-Jig around 1982, and it's been my primary wing (and occasional fuselage) jig since then.

After the Astro 40 epoch (never made it to the 60 size), I went to geared 05's and 035's, with more cells than conventional wisdom said to use (I know that Dereck's familiar with that concept!). It was fun to have people tell me my model couldn't fly or that the motor would melt...then stand open-mouthed as it flew (and didn't burn).

But, I went through lugging that RV battery, too. Folks who weren't flying E-power back then don't realize that the batteries self-discharged within minutes, so you couldn't charge the batteries very long before flying without losing significant power. Lipos have been a blessing to my bad back!

No VSPs around here, but it's been pretty cold in the workshop (i.e., the garage). I had Micki's truck as a space heater this morning, but that only lasted so long (How cold is it? Cold enough to make the flourescent lights flicker annoyingly). So, only got a little more done on the Ulu, specifically, installing the rudder & elevator servos and molding a canopy.

Jan 23, 2013, 08:54 AM
Registered User
Ken Myers's Avatar

Model Builder DVDs

Here's the info on the Model Builder DVDs in the Feb. 2011 issue of the Ampeer.

Jan 23, 2013, 11:46 AM
Visitor from Reality
Denny - getting to the articles and columns on the RCM site is not that clear. Go to the home page:

Scroll down the page looking for a box on the left edge labled 'Important Links'. Click on 'Requested Articles'. To the right of that, you get three icons labled 'columns', 'features' and 'reviews'. For the series on aerobatics above, you want 'columns' - click on it and you'll get a long list of copied columns in no particular order, though multiple months are in blocks.

Don't quote me in any bars over this, but full sized freeby plans in QEFI will be somewhat rarer in the near future... I suspect that though the UK mags still do aeromodelling as opposed to becoming magalogues, the hobby is shifting and magazines are actually made to make money

New Era III is a real cute model that electrocutes well now.

I blame Uncle Ken for winding me up to use ten BRJs on a geared 035 running a higher gear ratio than the standard 'box and thus being able to build an electric model that behaved just like my glow birds of the time.

Jan 24, 2013, 01:07 AM
AMA 667982 KG7NKY
starcad's Avatar
Wow Dereck you had to bring up that article by Ben Herman. Very nice person I happened to met and talk with so many years ago. Just after our move back to Tucson I drove out to TRCC one Sunday morning. He and several others were there just jackbating around the sky. Most of them ignored me as was the way with that club back in those days. However Ben came over to me and introduced himself and we started talking models and model design. For a little young 16 year old it inspired me designing models from then until now. I've read his and Chuck Cunningham's articles at least 50 times over all these years. Thanks for the memories, those truly were golden years.
Jan 24, 2013, 01:35 AM
Registered User
Mendo's Avatar
Somewhere in my stash I have a 25in span laser cut micro kaos kit, I also gave one to my father. Park 250 on 2s for decent performance and a park 280 or hacker a10 series motor on 3s for serious scoot. If I get a chance I will have to dig it out and give some more details.

Jan 24, 2013, 12:43 PM
Visitor from Reality
Not surprisingly, I only know those icons of US RC aeromodelling through their writings, but their skills are remarkable. I have Chuck Cunningham's design series on file at last and once normalcy returns, a lot more will join it now RCM is uploading them. For anyone who wants to start designing their own models, Chuck's articles are the place to start from.

Mendo - a 25" Kaos sounds fascinating. Would love to see more.


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