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Nov 18, 2012, 02:29 PM
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Suppo/BP A2217/4... Anyone seen/tested it?


I just spotted a four-turn, 2200Kv version of the venerable Suppo 2217 motor. I've never seen it before and there doesn't look to be a whole lot of info out there about it. Anyone know anything? This seems like a logical step up from the popular 2212/6 motor that's used in a lot of parkjets and wings... Seems like it would be a good candidate for an APC 6x5.5 on 3S or maybe a 5.25x6.25 on 4S for some decent speed.
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Nov 18, 2012, 06:48 PM
Jack
jackerbes's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by C₄H₁₀
I just spotted a four-turn, 2200Kv version of the venerable Suppo 2217 motor. I've never seen it before and there doesn't look to be a whole lot of info out there about it. Anyone know anything? This seems like a logical step up from the popular 2212/6 motor that's used in a lot of parkjets and wings... Seems like it would be a good candidate for an APC 6x5.5 on 3S or maybe a 5.25x6.25 on 4S for some decent speed.
It might be listed here under either BP or Suppo and the model number might only be similar, not exactly the same:

http://www.flybrushless.com/search

Jack
Nov 18, 2012, 10:38 PM
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Dr Kiwi's Avatar
Jack, I've never before seen listed, nor have I tested, a Suppo 2217/4. It is not even listed on the main Suppo site: http://www.suppomodel.com/. Having tested almost every small and medium Suppo motor, I would be interested to see how well it performs.

www.lightflightrc.com lists a Suppo 2217/4 as a heli motor.. but it's 3300Kv.. not 2200Kv, as listed for the 2217/4 listed by BP.
Last edited by Dr Kiwi; Nov 18, 2012 at 10:46 PM.
Nov 19, 2012, 01:11 AM
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Phil, it looks like the heli one is a 10-pole motor, which explains the higher Kv. By my math, the 2217/4 listed on BP's site falls neatly in line with the other "normal" 2217 motors' Kvs and turn counts. It looks like a bone-stock 12N14P 2217 chassis with the hottest wind so far... Hmmm.

If nobody else picks one up by the time I get home over Christmas, I might snag one and do some tests.
Nov 19, 2012, 08:17 AM
Jack
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Changing the 3300 Kv four turn motor from a Delta termination to a Wye would, in theory, drop the Kv from 3300 to 1905 or so. And kicking the turn count up to 6 from 4 would give you the 2200 Kv with the Delta term.

I sort of wonder if maybe the change to 10 poies and maybe a termination change might not account for the 3300 Kv (not 2200 as I said originally) motor.

Phil, maybe you also need to do an autopsy on each motor you test. Including the turn count and termination in your test data would be helpful for the guys that see any motor as a rewind project...

Jack
Last edited by jackerbes; Nov 19, 2012 at 06:27 PM.
Nov 19, 2012, 10:48 AM
Wake up, feel pulse, be happy!
Piece's Avatar
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Quote:
I sort of wonder if maybe the change to 10 poies and maybe a termination change might not account for the 2200 Kv motor.
Jack, consider this:

The stock 2217/8 is an 1100Kv, delta-terminated motor. The "8" denotes the turn count. 2200Kv/8T = 1100Kv/4T, so we see that the two motors (/8 and /4) are mathematically level with each other if both have fourteen poles and delta termination. Further, if we mathematically rewind the 2217/6, which is a six-turn, fourteen-pole, delta-terminated 1500Kv motor, we get a result of 2250Kv. Without even needing to change terminations or pole counts, we've just produced a ~2200Kv motor from all-stock parts (these motors' ends are keyed for 14 magnets, so changing to 10 would require a different piece).

LightFlight's example looks like somewhat of a quirky outlier with its funky flat endbell, and one listed on BP's site is just another step up the Kv chain in the standard 2217 family... Why hasn't it appeared sooner? I'd expect it to be quite popular
Nov 19, 2012, 10:55 AM
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Dr Kiwi's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by jackerbes
Phil, maybe you also need to do an autopsy on each motor you test. Including the turn count and termination in your test data would be helpful for the guys that see any motor as a rewind project...

Jack
I'm not sure that would go down well with the owners of the many motors I borrow for testing! Getting a bag of parts + a bunch of wire back might not be well received by the generous loaners!
Nov 19, 2012, 03:50 PM
Jack
jackerbes's Avatar
Loaners? I thought you got to keep them all...

Jack
Nov 19, 2012, 06:13 PM
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Dr Kiwi's Avatar
No such luck...quite a few guys want a specific motor tested and they lend me one for a week or two.. then I send the motor and test results back.
Nov 19, 2012, 06:26 PM
Jack
jackerbes's Avatar
I know that part works, I got mine back.

I ran that 8 turn 2217 through Turn Calculator 5 and can see the permutations on the turns and Kv's. But I don't see any way to get a 3300 Kv out of four turns with the dLRK wind on a 12 arm motor.

(I noticed I said 2200 above, I meant to say 3300 as that is the Kv that is a little mysterious).

That is why I was wondering if maybe the 10 pole magnet housing changed the Kv and got it out of "rhythm" or if maybe even a 8 pole housing and an ABC wind was used.

Jack
Nov 20, 2012, 07:34 PM
Registered User
manuel v's Avatar
Jack.
Check weight.
A2217-4= 73.1g vs H2217-4= 66.2g.

maybe only 8 magnets.

Manuel V.
Nov 20, 2012, 09:05 PM
Jack
jackerbes's Avatar
That's right, and 8 magnets would be an ABC wind too, right? And who know what kv that would produce.

Does the Kv change when the magnet count is changed? Or would the 12N14P and 12N10P with the 8 turn dLRK wind be about the same?

Jack
Nov 21, 2012, 07:47 PM
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manuel v's Avatar
Definitely not.
A motor X of 2200 Kv, to put half magnets, the resultant Kv will be double.

Now if the Kv is the direct result of an equation, then a 14 magnets, 2200 Kv motor, will have:
a 10 magnets, = 3082.
a 8 magnets = 3903

I've proven you just half of magnets, but not with any other relationship.

Manuel V.
Nov 21, 2012, 08:37 PM
Jack
jackerbes's Avatar
Wow! You guys know everything!

Thanks for that, Manuel!

Jack
Nov 22, 2012, 01:21 AM
Registered User
manuel v's Avatar
Verifying this subject, I remember that that was the perception of the days of CD motors.
Half of turns, double Kv.
Half of magnetos, dual Kv.
I remember having made engines with a certain number of turns, the half and the Kv is practically double.

But I never tried the same engine with 12 and 6 magnets.

Reviewing my data of motors Blue wonder, meeting that if hise tests with 14 and 10 magnets.

The above equation tells us that from 14 to 10 magnets, the kv is increased by 40%.
But in my data I have the following:

With 14 magnets. 1070, 1198, 2150.
With 10 magnets. 1362, 1537, 2791,.

These three engines the approximate increase was 29%.

I am sure that there is a forum, where show us numbers to make conversion more precise.

Manuel V.


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