Home Made Class - RC Groups
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Sep 12, 2012, 02:55 PM
NCSS / SVSS Flyer
Discussion

Home Made Class


The question was raised as to if we would could draw some interest and participants to a new contest class of "homebuilt only" sailplanes. The class would be for gliders that are NOT molded and could include built up and bagged sailplanes.
Last edited by SlopeRC; Sep 12, 2012 at 06:02 PM.
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Sep 12, 2012, 05:43 PM
Team Hello Kitty
SoaringDude's Avatar
I think this is a great idea and makes the competition much more fair for home-builts. Pretty sure this has minimal impact on scoring efforts. I vote yes.

Chris B.
Sep 12, 2012, 06:11 PM
Registered User
jtlsf5's Avatar
Is this to be a Woody class (no glass fuses, no composite D-tube LE's), or is this to be truly home built, ie scratch built? Its not clear if all wood kits would qualify as home built.

JT

OK, just read it a bit closer, looks like kits don't make it, only truly scratch built planes, regardless of construction technique. This class would then include Scott Meador's SS Eagle; after all, he home built the molds and home builds the planes. Just sayin...
Sep 12, 2012, 07:02 PM
Registered User
We need to hear from the fellows who proposed this class and would fly it.
If kits are not allowed I think there would not be enough interest to have a viable class.
Could you build scratch build a plane from kit plans??
I like Visalia's Woody Class. I think this would draw a few participants. I think the class allows for built-up wood flying surfaces but allows fiberglass fuselages. Eg. An Aquila with a Francis Products fuselage. Same for Sagitta's. Neither the wood or fiberglass fuselages provided an advantage over the other.
Mike Clancy
Sep 12, 2012, 07:26 PM
Registered User
I define "home built" plane as any plane built by the flyer, at home. It should not matter if the fuse is built of balsa, ply or fiberglass or any combination thereof, and the wing built of anything, even concrete. I believe the original concept was to get more flyers to enter the monthly contests, and not to worry about competing with pilots who fly the imported "glass slippers". Home built planes (except for Scott Meader's) are generally not competitive with the imports.
Weeds, aka Bill Rinkleib
Sep 12, 2012, 07:30 PM
Registered User
I would not exclude any kit built plane or fiberglass molded fuselage.
Weeds
Sep 13, 2012, 10:35 AM
NCSS / SVSS Flyer

Home Built


Jonathan's idea was for any plane built by a non manafacturer. I'll let him fill in the details as he envisioned it but I recall him saying fiberglas fuse and bagged wings would be OK , just no wings made in a mold. Open rib construction is OK but has to be built by a hobbyist and not an Ava, Pulsar or the like.
Sep 13, 2012, 07:13 PM
Axle209
This class should be for the home builder either wood kits or scratch build planes (wood or glass construction) The qualifier is you have to build it, Artf's would not compete in this class.

Speaking for me when I joined this club I thought I would go whole hog get into $$ glass slipper glider and start doing contest again. Well my contest experience has not been that enjoyabe for variety of reasons, having this class may motivate some of the older members like me who have no desire to try and compete once again.

Axle
Sep 13, 2012, 09:40 PM
Registered User
Folks,

I am the one who brought up this idea - sorry that I have been busy and unable to contribute until now.

I am motivated by my observation that there are a number of skilled flyers who have deliberately chosen to not participate in our contests owing mostly to the high costs of modern "red 4-meter competition sailplanes." We miss those folks and I think we need to find a way to get them to participate in our club contests.

To that end, I propose that we have a new class in our club contest. A class not based on performance, as our present three are, but based on flying equipment.

I called this idea "homebuilt" when I mentioned it at the club meeting Saturday. But more precisely, it is a class that accepts any plane that is NOT made as a substantially whole plane by a commercial manufacturer and most importantly, the wing can NOT come from a CNC mold.

What can be entered? Any Nostalgia or Woody of any description, kit or scratch,
with a "home style" built-up wing and any hot-wire cut bagged wing planes provided they are made a member or friend of the entrants who share the pleasure of constructing such planes; again, it must not be a substantially complete commercial product. I am not in favor of a "builder of the plane rule" - Heck, if you can pick up a nice kit built BOT on RC groups for a couple of hundred, fine. Also, fiberglass fuses are fine too. They don't add much to the cost of a plane.

This class would be just another club class and as such class members must fly the same tasks as all the other classes. This means that when a class member manages to beat an expensive moldie he can use that for his LSF 3 or 4 contest points. This is because our club contest will remain one contest, just divided internally for the club's awards purposes.

I also think that anybody can enter this class, provided he/she flies a suitable plane as allowed by the class definition. However, we should continue with the contests set up so that each member flies one class only (except for usual backups). By this I mean that if an Expert or Master wants to fly in this class, OK, but He/She gets a zero for that contest's points in his proficiency class. Heck, I think this will keep most super pilots out of the event without having to make a more restrictive rule while allowing a low ranking Expert (like me) to fly my Mirage once in a while against comparable planes.

I hope this has helped clarify my idea. What do you folks think?
Last edited by jpherit; Sep 13, 2012 at 11:11 PM.
Sep 13, 2012, 11:44 PM
Registered User
I support your concept!
Weeds
Sep 14, 2012, 01:39 PM
Registered User

What about a bashed arf?


I have recently taken an arf 2M glider made by Thunder Tiger that was in pretty bad shape (been through many crashes on slope and winch ups), stripped off the sticky back covering, replaced the plastic wing tips with balsa ones, plastic canopy replaced with one carved from balsa, new wing hold ons using 1/4-20 nylon bolts, extended the fuse, lightened the fuse, replaced the wood and wire connecting rods with nyrods, lightened the elevator and rudder and recovered in monokote. I also added spoilers. I have spent a lot of shop time on rebuilding.
Would this qualify for this category for the sake of argument?
I will bring the plane out to the field to fly soon and let everyone comment as to whether it meets the test.
Sep 14, 2012, 02:14 PM
Registered User
Quote:
Originally Posted by foxcraft
I have recently taken an arf 2M glider made by Thunder Tiger that was in pretty bad shape (been through many crashes on slope and winch ups), stripped off the sticky back covering, replaced the plastic wing tips with balsa ones, plastic canopy replaced with one carved from balsa, new wing hold ons using 1/4-20 nylon bolts, extended the fuse, lightened the fuse, replaced the wood and wire connecting rods with nyrods, lightened the elevator and rudder and recovered in monokote. I also added spoilers. I have spent a lot of shop time on rebuilding.
Would this qualify for this category for the sake of argument?
I will bring the plane out to the field to fly soon and let everyone comment as to whether it meets the test.
This should be discussed. In any such specification of what model types are allowed there will always be border line cases. My personal preference is towards the building and flying of models and that is probably why I failed to consider ARFs in my first proposal.

I looked up Thunder Power offerings and found only an e-sailplane. Clearly, my original intent for this class is for winch launched, non powered sailplanes so the e-sailplane is clearly out. But don't despair, the ALES crowd would allow it in their events. However, if there is an older 2 meter Thunder Power unpowered sailplane that you have then we need to consider it and other ARFs like it. How about a BoT Arf, for example? If the primary reason for this class is to have a low cost class, then I would guess your plane would meet the spirit of the proposed rules. Also, based on the fact that most ARFs are learner airplanes and not high performance then why not allow the the learner airplane?

Let's see what Weeds and Axel and others say about this.

By the way, if we introduce this class, then Sportsman class would continue to allow/encourage high performance planes and we could have more folks (like me) in that class as well as sailplane beginners such as Lou Fox who is an experienced rc power pilot.
Sep 14, 2012, 08:50 PM
Registered User

New Class


I would vote for builtup wings , wood or glass fuse , with ARFs like this but no bagged wings . I believe the original Thermal Eagles had bagged wings? would beat all others easily , they fly like Scotts eagles .. I believe the idea is to make all models competitive .Just follow rules of the Woody class which the Visilia Fall Festival uses .
BILL C.
Sep 14, 2012, 10:35 PM
Registered User
I like the idea. I am new to the hobby and have been building from scratch for about a year. I have been experimenting with various wing construction methods and expect to do vacuum bagging shortly, so I would like this method to be included. I am also a fan of speedsterden on You Tube and like to use his construction methods.

John
Sep 14, 2012, 10:52 PM
Registered User

Arf bashing contenders or beginner arfs to encourage beginners


Jonathan,
I was referring to the TT Windstar. a 2M beginner sailplane that you saw in my workroom that I was bashing/rebuilding/redesigning. It is now all wood and should land better with spoilers. It is an all around entry level glider.
Lou

TTR4102 THUNDER TIGER WINDSTAR
You can enjoy the quiet tranquility of silent flight with the Windstar. The nature of soaring makes it a perfect way to get started in R/C. Break the bounds of earth and soar with the eagles!
THUNDER TIGER WINDSTAR

Slow, graceful flight gives you more reaction time and is more forgiving than a 40 powered trainer, which is particularly important if you don't have an instructor. Also silent flight is more friendly to your neighbors and the environment.




Description Technical Specs Extended Information



TTR4102 THUNDER TIGER WINDSTAR

Features

The fastest building, best looking 2 meter sailplane
Proven airfoil and polyhedral wing design make it the ideal entry-level sailplane
Outstanding Slope or Thermal performance
Smooth, stable and forgiving flight characteristics along with low wing loading make it
exceptional competition machine in "light air"
Custom-built and covered by skilled craftsmen, allowing for quick and easy assembled.


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