E-Flite UMX ASK-21 glider - Page 81 - RC Groups
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Nov 18, 2012, 06:27 PM
Way to many airplanes!
Originally Posted by PeteSchug
...and if the local athletic field is free of an excess of curious urchins who want to "help" as in retrieve the airplane. Too high risk for my taste!

I would definitely have been one of the urchins when I was a kid.
That's the only way to think about that problem! Once you do, you cannot get mad at them anymore.
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Nov 18, 2012, 06:52 PM
Registered User
PeteSchug's Avatar
I like talking to kids who like airplanes and if there are only a couple I might let them take turns retrieving but if there is a small herd of kids they get competitive and then your risk level goes WAY up.

Once had a class of inner city kids show up for tennis lessons while I was flying my Pico Tiger Moth. I flew a few circles over the tennis court with forty or fifty kids running around under the plane, I looped it etc. and entertained for about twenty minutes. (3S 450 mAh batt.) the kids never stopped running after the plane. If I'd have come down there would have been nothing left of it!

The teachers knew they were outclassed and didn't complain. I think they might have enjoyed it as much as the kids. Teaching anything about tennis would have required some discipline so it was probably better to just let them run in circles.

It was great fun for me too but I have no doubt that the plane would have looked like a scattered bag of popcorn if the kids got hold of it.

Nov 19, 2012, 03:48 PM
Have fun
airpower's Avatar
Anybody make the tow line shorter? Did three unsuccesful tows with the beast today, felt that the tow line is just too long, you have to make really wide turns so that there is no slack, i know that's just part of towing, but wondering it would help to shorten it.
Nov 19, 2012, 04:29 PM
Chesapeake Bay RC Club
Gary Hoorn's Avatar
When being towed you must remain above the tow plane and make skidding turns using the rudder instead of the ailerons. Once you bank the glider it turns sharper than the tow plane and thing begin to go asunder. The tow plane should climb gently and make only shallow turns. You in the glider follow the tow plane using only the rudder and always remain above the tow plane. All of this needs to be coordinated between the tow plane and glider pilot before flying.
Nov 19, 2012, 04:57 PM
Registered User
PeteSchug's Avatar
I will add what should be obvious. The tow plane makes only very slow turns!

In full scale you seldom see a tow plane bank more than about twenty degrees. With models you should probably try for less.

In the few tries I had with my quarter scale ASW-28 I made every mistake possible thinking I knew more than everyone since I was a "real" glider pilot. In the final analysis if you keep your wings level and let the tow plane drag you around the turns it works well.

As Gary says, use rudder! Why? Because with AS3X the glider will try to use opposite rudder when the tug tries to drag it around the turn, once you use rudder you negate the effect of the AS3X.

Nice and easy does it every time.

As for shortening the tow line. NO!

In full scale we used 200 foot lines. The longer the line the less likely you are to have problems as long as you stick to gentle turns. Yeah, in full scale we did do things like go through the slipstream from high tow to low tow position and fly around the slipstream as a learning exercise but nobody ever did steep banked turns on tow for practice.

Last edited by PeteSchug; Nov 19, 2012 at 05:03 PM.
Nov 19, 2012, 05:49 PM
Have fun
airpower's Avatar
Alright, i actually wasnt giving any input except for making sure the nose stays level, but next time ill add a little rudder and tell my dad to bank extremely slowly.

I have been pretty lukewarm to the high start performance, and doubtful of any thermal performance from it.

However, today i tried it on a slope in long beach, winds 15-25 mph, with other people flying 30-40 inch wingspan wings. Now I expected it to be FAR too much for this little plane, but i was wrong. Slope performance was absolutely outstanding. the AS3X almost adds artificial ballast, it was wonderfull. Very fun and i enjoyed every second and was finally wishing i had more batteries. Now im sold on the plane. I was absolutely blown away that this could handle a serious slope with serious winds and be PERFECT.
Now i love this plane.
Nov 19, 2012, 06:04 PM
Tassie Electric, Heli, Glider
ChrisJ800's Avatar
We did have at least one full size tug pilot that used to crank it round when in a thermal and you could release when you were established and keep the aerotow cost down!

Nice to hear others are enjoying slope soaring. Its got a nice wing section for a small foam wing. I've got 4 batteries for mine and the charger that you can charge 4 together from my Blade MSX which helps.
Nov 19, 2012, 09:58 PM
Registered User
PeteSchug's Avatar
Originally Posted by ChrisJ800
We did have at least one full size tug pilot that used to crank it round when in a thermal and you could release when you were established and keep the aerotow cost down!
Back in the day (I'm seventy-four now) I knew the rate of climb of all our tugs (450 Stearman, L-19's, Supercubs, Extra span Citabria and maybe one or two I've forgotten) and would often get off tow early If I saw a reasonable amount of lift. All I wanted was enough seconds of lift to be convinced it was not just a bump.

We were allowed to take back seat rides in our L-19's to see what the other end of the tow line felt like. I never saw a tug pilot bank anything close to steep with a glider on tow, but the ride down began with a left turn that felt close to being a split S. these guys logged ten minutes a tow regardless of actual time so they wanted to get as many tows in as possible. Most were doing it to build hours while looking for jobs in aviation. I think they also just plain liked racing to the ground. (And flying in general)

I can't tell you how much I miss those days, but hanging around an airport all weekend just isn't possible for me any more, and the atmosphere is not the same either. On the other hand, there is a private strip less than thirty miles from my old haunts, owned by an ex crop duster. It's full of old crocks who maintain their own planes and build live steam engines and RC planes. I think I'll hang out there when I can. There is so little full scale activity that I can fly RC all day long and everyone comes out to watch every flight!

If anyone had a tug there I'd buy a glider and move in full time.

Hey! I'm way O.T.

Okay! On the way up gentle banks and no surprises. Glider flies high tow, meaning above the slipstream but not much above it. Glider flies "flat" and lets tug initiate turns. On release glider does a climbing right turn to convert excess speed to alt and avoid tug. Tug does a diving left turn and demonstrates just how fast he can get down and hook up to the next glider.

There, back on topic!

BTW, playing the steep banked turn scenario in my mind's eye I think you could do it more safely in low tow. You'd pick up speed rather than have to fly slower than the tug and that would be the safety factor.

The other old time glider field in my neighborhood only flies low tow. The field was owned by an ex navy pilot and apparently that's the way the navy flew. The still only fly low tow there. Very weird looking at the bottom of your tug for a whole flight. Yup, the angle up looking at the tug is surprising.

Oops back O.T.

Bye now,

Nov 20, 2012, 07:39 AM
Way to many airplanes!
Not sure if that was posted or not, but here's a video from Youtube, showing a perfect tow. (Blue shirts behind the Txs....)

Eflite UMX Carbon Cub towing UMX ASK21 Glider at JR Indoor Festival 2012 (1 min 19 sec)
Nov 20, 2012, 07:46 AM
BMFA 190658
SilentPilot's Avatar
I've seen powered planes with a better glide angle than that!
Nov 20, 2012, 08:10 AM
Registered User
ducatirdr's Avatar
My RC field is the top of a town dump that was capped. It looks like a hill with a good slope about 50 feet higher than the bottom with a flat top. All of it is a hay field to hold back erosion. We fly off the top. The small slope off the side was getting hit with a light wind about 5-10mph the other day and I tried to slope the ASK off of it. During one of the gusts over 10mph the little thing actually was getting lift and stayed at the same height for a good 15 seconds before the wind dipped down. This had me wish for wind at the field. True to form the wind died down and went calm as the day wore on.

Second use for the ASK now is a good luck charm for still air.

The little slope and the lift I saw had me thinking about other tiny slope offerings. I have seen steeper slopes on the sides of highways that were graded through a valley. Also we have some earthen dry dams in the area to cover the max overflow of the local rivers. I will be scouting more local micro slopes for this bird. It being so small allows for some creative options where 2 meter birds would not be welcome.
Nov 20, 2012, 05:58 PM
Have fun
airpower's Avatar
Sloped her again at the long beach bluffs, winds were about 10 mph. The usual fliers dont even bother to come until the wind is above 15-20 mph, and she flew great, except for birds i was the only one up, absolute peace. She does have the glide to thermal, but that big wing and small weight allow her to slope in very meager wind conditions. AS3X is a huge advantage here, you get the stability of ballast without any of the weight, and despite it's small size kept it just as stable as she was without wind. I finally see the value in this plane, in love.
Nov 20, 2012, 06:37 PM
Tassie Electric, Heli, Glider
ChrisJ800's Avatar
Nice, we need more slope pics and vids. its good to have a model that will handle light stuff that bigger models struggle with. Thats the main reason i bought it. Be nice to have flaps or spoilerons to get it down from height. i just fly out over the sea to lose height at moment and hope i dont lose rc signal!
Nov 21, 2012, 01:54 AM
Tassie Electric, Heli, Glider
ChrisJ800's Avatar
Just found this new slope vid:
Kerr Scott Dam Ask21 (0 min 49 sec)
Nov 21, 2012, 06:41 PM
Electric Coolhunter
Thomas B's Avatar
Did not get to fly the little ASK last weekend....new plan is to try it on Saturday, both piggyback and high start, plus perhaps aero tow.
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