Freewing Su-35 (Vendor-independent; please read 1st post and stay on-topic) - Page 331 - RC Groups
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Nov 19, 2012, 05:31 PM
Should've, Would've, Could've
v8truckin's Avatar

I had similar problems after I repaired my SU. It was dropping its wings in banking turns making flying it very nervousness for me, like you said not fun at all. Then I found that my TV units were getting stuck and not lined up correctly. After adjusting em and playing with my servo travels everything was back to normal flying like day 1. Give it a try, I know you messed with you tv back a few pages, but maybe you need a lil more.
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Nov 19, 2012, 05:51 PM
Registered User
Pete, thank you for the flight report on the flaperon characteristics! It answered my earlier questions.

On my side, I got a new gear door sequencer (thank you Urrl, you rock) and have the gear system tested and functioning properly. I'm going to run a static test on each EDF unit in the fuselage to see if my CC Phoenix ICE Lite 50s are adequate for the job. If they are, I'm going to do the ESC vent-into-theEDF-intake mod someone described earlier in this thread.
Nov 19, 2012, 06:05 PM
Registered User
I guess so V8....
I did align them to their neutrals, but a bit of thrust-line 'error' could be involved too! Thanks for pointing that out, I didn't think of it at all !!
It might have been Max that mentioned he set his with a bit of up thrust?

Once I check the CofG (I was definitely too slack in not checking it at all!!) to confirm that aspect, I will check the TV thrust angles. I can throw them onto a TX Pot so that I can adjust and test angles in flight too. (could be a scarey, dangerous, thing to have! hehe).

It could very well have been correct CofG, but TV down to cause the need for up elevator. (Even though I supposedly set the TV's to neutral)

As for the Flaperons (and Spoilerons) I will leave that testing until the plan flies "properly" first!
I don't have the "Take-off mode" mix set up, that I suggested a while back, so that is another thing I want to implement and test soon. By the way it took off these two flights I would say a take-off mix will work perfectly.... you just steer (as you do now) but "hands off" attitude sticks, and just switch the take-off mode switch at "point X", or speed X, as it runs out and that will rotate it out to a shallow climb.
It would just need a bit of tuning to get the values right - Elevator, TV, and possibly Flaperon or Spoileron.... whatever is required to give the best result.
Nov 19, 2012, 06:15 PM
Registered User
Received my Hitex 85mg today. Removed one of the boxes the elevator servos go in (did not have a lot glue holding it) A little sanding and the servo went right in. I am now concerned about the glue holding the elevator rod in plastic part to fuselage. Remember someone had trouble with it.
Nov 19, 2012, 06:18 PM
Registered User
I worry about ALL their fittings!! LOL
Nov 19, 2012, 06:39 PM
Registered User
acesimmer's Avatar
Peter... I also fly mine with about 2 mm positive TV. This way it flies with the correct pitch angle. Also... For an experienced pilot I think you need to eat your weaties in the mornings. You seem to be forgetting all your basic checks.... Smile or is it that negative G effect that the blood rushes to you head seeing that you live down under?
Nov 19, 2012, 07:16 PM
I didn't do it...
av8ersteve's Avatar
Hey all, getting ready to order. I have one question though. I was watching the product review video on BH and I saw the elevator servos seeking center like crazy and he said it was normal. I have been flying for a LONG time. I have put some expensive servos in my heli's, and I have played around with some very cheap ones as well. I have never seen this. If I was to have a servo start doing this, I would replace it. Are they ok if they do this? Have they changed servos, and is it really "OK" to use them? Just wondering.
Nov 19, 2012, 07:17 PM
Registered User
Yeah, I checked over the plane last night, aiming to take it out this morning. The weather was perfect - sunny and dead calm, at 7am....
I put the battery where I normally put it, though it has had the rebuild with ply 'box' nose area now and the BECs/RXes shifted a bit. So it is probably nose heavy really. Which I didn't think about checking for that evening before.
And then in the morning I must have been half asleep still, seeing I didn't even notice the Flaperons! LOL

I will make more effort next time... tomorrow?

I have a sheet made up with all the TX setup details, seeing there is so much it has programmed for it! But I forgot to take that anyway.....
I sort of close my eyes and think "Su" for one second or so, when first grabbing the TX, and visualise all the Switches/Pots and what they all do on it. But it is my most complex mixing setup of any plane, and that method is fraught with possibility of not quite getting everything right! Memory lapse - even though you THINK you know. (Thus the flight sheet I have).
eg I have the "Rudder brakes" (Switch) which move both rudders to full inboard, but I have not remembered to test those ever so far!

Hopefully three batteries (tomorrow?) will be enough to have sorted it all out !
(And a proper pre-flight check!!)
Nov 19, 2012, 07:21 PM
Registered User
I don't like that "Flutter is fine" idea either!! None of my other planes do that either!
So I replaced those stock Su elevator servos!

Even if "resistance" stops them fluttering... at some eventual level of resistance (via airflow).... what about UNTIL then? That means there would have to be X amount of area they can still be wishy washy first. Maybe only 0.5mm.... but that is enough to mean 'slight wavering' of a flight path. Which some small cheapie planes do.
So whilst I can see it could end up they all work fine, it can't be as good as non-fluttering servos! (But possible they are 99.7% as good. Who knows.).

It doesn't seem to me that they would truly "OK" !!! hehe

Oh yeah.... a bigger reason that I changed them was because they were not 'even'. One side 'stepped' more than the other and thus has a bigger initial dead-zone than the other!
So one elevator could move mm's before the other started! Plus they were very 'steppy' servos too!
With better servos it is all linear, smooth..... much nicer operation!
Nov 19, 2012, 07:34 PM
I didn't do it...
av8ersteve's Avatar
Would Hitec 65MG's be good here or do I need something else? My front canards on my Eurofighter did that same thing, (one starting to move before the other ), and I replaced them with Hitec 65HB's (karbonite gears) and now they move precisely with each other and smooth as silk.
Nov 19, 2012, 08:16 PM
You are a "go" for reentry
Maxthrottle's Avatar
Pete; nice to hear you are in the air again. A lot of what you're describing will happen flying flapperons too fast or through out the flight as you mentioned and nose heavy would only exacerbate it even more.
It hard to tell since you have a lot of different things happening at the same time to get a base line.

Sure you'll figure it out. As V8 mentioned the nozzles could be off. Did you have them active during any of your flights. To confirm its not the nozzles I'd put a screw through both of them to lock them and see if it flies consistently.

All in all it sounds to be a different experience than mine w/w/o flapperons.

Av8r; the 65 for the stabs are too small a servo; especially if you do any speed fly bys you need above 40oz/in. Remember the canards are not the primary flight surface on the Euro.
Hunting on a digital is common but it can be for bad reasons also. If you put a penny or a quarter on the TE of the stab and it stops, its usually fine. I see it all the time at the field on all the larger 35%+. But as I posted in the past from the manufacturer if its having an inconsistent center it indicates a bad pot where they may dial up the sensitivity to mask it on a cheaper digital servo.

As I posted before the 85 is the closest I've found to the stock servo dimensions. I have tried 85s on my F-35 with them programmed to max res and they hunt when sitting still but hold once the slightest of pressure is applied; even blowing on it. When I program more dead ban to default the hunting goes away.
Nov 19, 2012, 08:55 PM
Registered User
+1 for Hitec HS-85MG & one servo reverser for replacing elevator servos.
Nov 19, 2012, 09:04 PM
I didn't do it...
av8ersteve's Avatar
Thanks Max.
Nov 19, 2012, 09:44 PM
Registered User
acesimmer's Avatar
I used Hitec HS81MG on the SU35 elevators and they work like a champ with minimum fitting issues. You will need a single reverser for one side.
Nov 19, 2012, 10:07 PM
I didn't do it...
av8ersteve's Avatar
Can I swap the brown and orange wire in the plug or is a reverser necessary? If so, what do you guys use?

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