Now that's what I'm talking bout perfect landings! I can never get someone to film me when I have beautiful landigs like those. Those were some real cobra hovers, nice work!

Congrats man.. thats so sick... i'm jealous.. I can wait to get mine in the air.. still waiting on batts from HK.

So tell us when you can.. what is your set ups.. i.e. full throws or dual rates, expos... battery size and your cg... I want mine to fly just like yours..

Nice looking landings... looks like you had a nice low wind day too, that helps..

Amazing video, thanks for sharing!

And the pictures look so more real with the weathering!

Looks very nice TMSN. Good flying!
Very close to the real thing

Thanks guys

Wow Max, that is crazy. They really look almost identical. That's a really cool comparison!

Here's another pic I forgot to post earlier that I really like.

I'll post specs (CG etc.) later tonight when I get home.

Awesome pix guys.. so jealous...

Gee, those elevator MG servos on mine are notchy!! Almost like having 3deg steps of elevator control. I have to plug in another servo to test/compare, but I am pretty sure it is the servo quality itself. And on such a large all moving tailplane it seems it would be notable to control smoothness.

8 Channels 'not enough'..... sigh.
Can't have all stock abilities, with flaperons... or elevons. More interested in the flaperons, but that is that... can't have them.
I don't want any thrust verctors permanent.

Originally Posted by PeterVRC

Gee, those elevator MG servos on mine are notchy!! Almost like having 3deg steps of elevator control. I have to plug in another servo to test/compare, ....

That would depend on your radio, radio settings and the linkage setup to get your min 3 deg. I get less.

Regardless, the 17g servo still seems to fly well with the factory servo.

Well the 3deg is of course linked to the control horn points. But the servo itself is very 'stepped'. The ailerons etc are smooth.... same radio using 2048 resolution etc. And I have other aircraft with MG's and they are smooth too.
These ones have a distinct step and it is a notable deg of rotation per step.

The 3deg is a result of using maximum elevator travel (when on high rate).

All the servo holes, pushrod diameters, control horn holes, on this model are 100% slop-free (great!!), and the slightest bit of play in the system makes for a 'jittery' flying plane (in any plane), so you don't want anything introducing that play, or non-linear smoothness.
Even 1deg of play makes for a measurable flight path variation, of X frequency 'jitteriness'. So this servo 'stepping' is something outside of my tolerance range.

Originally Posted by PeterVRC

Well the 3deg is of course linked to the control horn points. But the servo itself is very 'stepped'. The ailerons etc are smooth.... same radio using 2048 resolution etc. And I have other aircraft with MG's and they are smooth too.
These ones have a distinct step and it is a notable deg of rotation per step.

The 3deg is a result of using maximum elevator travel (when on high rate).

All the servo holes, pushrod diameters, control horn holes, on this model are 100% slop-free (great!!), and the slightest bit of play in the system makes for a 'jittery' flying plane (in any plane), so you don't want anything introducing that play, or non-linear smoothness.
Even 1deg of play makes for a measurable flight path variation, of X frequency 'jitteriness'. So this servo 'stepping' is something outside of my tolerance range.

Which holes you choose to place the link to and expo completely changes your stick to surface movement. So you may be getting 3 degrees based on how you have it adjusted. In other words even 2048 res can easily be undone this by how you set it all up.

You may just have a dirty pot or recieved one that isn't adjusted well. But the videos of it in flight gives testimony as to how distinct an issue it may be;
Some flying them tail heavy which would make it even more pronounced and still make it look smooth as glass. When I see that, I'm then not so sure that it may be a crap servo.

For those who asked for the specs on my SU35:

- All stock everything.
- Spring mod on nose wheel, detachable nose, hinged raydome.
- Running Genesis 5000Mah 55C battery with EC5 connector (fits and balances perfectly)
- CG 170mm to 173mm
- Elevators on outer horn hole, Ailerons on inner horn hole, Rudders on middle hole
- I programmed dual rates but ended up flying at max rates all the time. Expo: Aileron 25%, Elevator 30%, Rudder 30% (Spektrum)
- I take off with vector thrust if there is no wind. No TV on take off if there is headwind.
- TV off on landing
- TV mixes are: Elevator mixing per nozzle is 125%, Aileron is 80%. Yaw is permanently Y'd to rudder (works great)

Also, I don't have the 3 degree notches you guys are describing. My elevators move very smoothly.

Well the videos I see all look fine. But then what detail can a video even show? Very little. Most are from 'miles' away... wind... pilot inputs... etc etc

What I do see, is in model aircraft - mine, and will apply to them all - every little discrepancy counts. eg a 2mm clevis pin in a control horn with 2.2mm hole.
This like like a huge 'slop' at a real aircraft scale. It would never be the case in a real plane, and would be unacceptable.
You will see the result of this in flight, if someone flies smoothly, as "jitter"... even in plain level flight. Slight yawing jitter, or pitch etc - wherever the play is involved. But you won't see it in a video very well, if at all. Most times the camera itself (or user) has more jitter than that!!

It is the MG servos - both identical - doing this. And as mentioned I have others that are dead perfect. It is coming from the gears... the meshing of them... a combination of the meshing and their freeplay/slop down in the drive-train somewhere. Basically they are a cheap MG servo.....
Totally adequate for the job, so it is going to fly fine still.... just not adequate for a precision job.
All planes (and cheap parts) from China have these issues and some parts you get lucky and they are made better than typical.
eg How every clevis and horn (they are all the same parts anyway) on the Su are perfect fits. And the other servos (non MG) are all tight and good too.

So far my 'less than perfect list" for the Su is:

Poor quality MG servos - both identical, but only a sample of two means there is some room that they are 'unique' to me. But unlikely really.

Poor quality retracts/trunions - they all have the same freeplay/slop - so that is obviously the low tolerance design they made. Not an individual issue.
I use the same size ones (other clones) from HobbyKing and they have no slop in any ever (12+ used), so this is a Freewing choice to use an even cheaper clone.

Poorly balanced fans... but this is not really something I would consider a shortfall, seeing all cheaper fans (typical in PNF/ARF) do need work. So it is expected anyway. Though it is still something 'amiss'.

And that was it.... a very SHORT list really!!
I have not seen a foam PNF/ARF that is better in terms of design intelligence, application in construction of that, assembly by the factory, finish, and apparently flight and performance (unseen by me in the flesh yet).
So even with those few "poor" mentions, I still end up at a score of 98/100. An AWESOME plane, and for its cost.

I checked inside a few servos and the wiring/solder was good...... shiny good looking solder joints.
I will not replace any for now - maybe the MG's if I see that the 'stepping' matters enough to me in flight. (Hmmm... I will change the aileron and elevator channels and check if it remains the MG's 'stepping' - just in case).

Front gear "Ram" needing a compression spring..... well, I will do that. But it is probably not a big enough deal to be required. 4mm of "ram" travel is not a huge deal to need to suppress.
The mains have the same, but there is no way to assist them without inventing some special method. And seeing it is not too critical, that is not worth doing.
Probably at best.... change over to metal trunions and there will be very little, or no, slop then.
Personally I would have LIKED 10mm front gear longitudal slop, so then a compression system can actually achieve something of use. Which gives me a little engineering idea.......

The trunion can be modified (ground down internally) to ADD longitudal freeplay. It would still hit the main retract body as it ends stop, like they do normally, but the extra forwards ability would allow a few more millimetres of motion for a decent compression system then. It would not affect correct retract operation either. Ideally you would then want the whole retract assembly inclined a bit, but that is too hard and it would be ok that the leg spent most of its time with a few degrees forward rake. The cost of getting useful compression longitudal.

Originally Posted by tmsn

.....
- Running Genesis 5000Mah 55C battery ...- CG 170mm to 173mm
...Also, I don't have the 3 degree notches you guys are describing. My elevators move very smoothly.

Great battery and nice to see that thats how well it flies especially at 173mm. My stab servos have been smooth also. In fact when I trim the stab servos they move in almost half degree increments so very very fine.
I just hope to grease my landings as well as yours Tmsn. Hopefully the flapperons will slow it down a touch even more.

Cheap servos can have poor resolution showing up as "steps"....If you are using a quality RX with 2048 resolution you shouldn't see "steps" no matter what servo arm you are using with good resolution servos...Change the servo out for a Hitec HS-82MG and I'll bet the steps go away...I'm NOT saying that the Hitec servo is the best servo to go with---It's just the best less expensive servo that won't exhibit "steps"...

Kevin

I have 18g $9 MG's I use in all planes that I think need them (eg 90mms), and they are fantastic... no stepping, no centering or buzzing (not quite finding a stable position) issues either.
https://www.hobbyking.com/hobbyking/s...idProduct=6608
But they are a FRACTION larger than the Freewing ones, so then it means modding the holders if I change them. sigh.

As I mentioned, it is not a critical ascpect that is amiss, so I will try the stock ones first. I would be tempted to change the aileron ones to those $9 MG's too really. The last thing you need is a loss of control to EVER occur....