F5D with Geared Folder Powertrains - Page 4 - RC Groups
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Mar 03, 2012, 02:42 PM
Livin it UP when Im goin DOWN
Arcteryxxx's Avatar
Need to carefully select the vehicle, I suppose;-)
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Mar 04, 2012, 12:03 AM
Carbon fiber is our friend
Steve C's Avatar
We got a bit of testing done with jetdryvr's (Erik) Cyclone today. My buddy Mark also flew his with a geared motor which was doing pretty well until the pinion came off.

Motor is Hyperion GS3032-6 on 4s TP3250 and CC125 ESC set to low timing. This is what CC recommended for these motors and I think it's wrong. Next time it will be set to a mid timing. Prop is 9.75 x 20

Speeds checked with radar were 186 and 190mph. I tried not to fly right at us, so these numbers are a bit conservative. The amp draw was 90 on the first full thottle hit and about 87 on the next one. Right after full throttle application, the amp draw dropped as the plane accelerated. It dropped all the way to 70 and sometimes below before I cut power. The voltage dropped right at first and recovered a little as the amps dropped.

Initial power drawn is 90A x 14.55V= 1309 watts, but then dropped to 70A x 14.7V = 1029 watts at speed.

If I knew how to clip out part of the Eagle Tree graph and zoom in on it, that would be really helpful since there's two flights on it and a bunch of dead time. The chart is too squished to fit on the page, so it needs to be cut, but I don't know if that's possible. As it is, I get more info out of watching the playback and that sucks.

I think we're pretty happy so far. My prop takes a while to grab some air, but launching has been easy anyway. After perhaps 8 seconds the prop gets quiet and then you're in business! Temps were all good so we're going ahead with 5s as soon as I pick one that fits with enough room for the ET and the mess of wires!

Steve C
Mar 04, 2012, 12:20 AM
jackosmeister's Avatar
Thats quick for the watts!
Mar 04, 2012, 12:31 AM
Registered User
Peter M's Avatar
Wow! That's great speed for a 160 buck motor without the complications of a gearbox!

Is Erik's Cyclon the 44 inch span moldie from Acme models????

Flying these high pitch props is a much different sensation with the much slower acceleration but much faster speed on so little watts. Still having a great glide speed due to the folding prop is just the icing on the cake.

How long do you think you could keep it WOT without cooking the motor?

The peak and unloaded data is very useful. What is your respective rpm's if you don't mind me asking please?

Congratulations on getting this performance on your own prop!
Mar 04, 2012, 02:21 AM
Registered User

rfm 14.5x14 mega 16-35-1

Hi Pete
I snuck down for a fly in the heli this arvo,and brought the plasma with the 14.5 x14.folder ,along for company.
I had dramas from word go, I think the low voltage cutout was kicking in. You could hear the CC100 lite beaping as it glided past, but couldnt count the number of beaps, so i dont know the fault. When i downloaded the data, the lowest voltage was 17.7 V(5S turnigy 1800, same as yours) the esc is set for 3.2V or 16 V total, The amps went to 110A, and the esc is set for 150A hard cutoff,so i cant see what the problem is? If 1 cell drops off, but toatalV is still above 16V, would the esc still sense this and cut out?, Remember this is the lipo that had one low cell as received, but came good on cycling, It was fine when i used your RFM 12.8x13 blades. Lipo was fully charged before theflight
Also the motor reached and possibly exceeded 60 degrees C, but definitely did not reach 100C, So for the 12 min flight , i would just give it 1/2 throttle bursts, for about 2 secs a pop.
Did some nice landings FOR A CHANGE. Beautiful weather also!
Any clues from those wiser than I?
Thanks Steve
Mar 04, 2012, 03:17 AM
jackosmeister's Avatar
Ive had the same thing with a CC100 lite, It may have something to do with the frequency the esc logs, its possible at some point it spiked over 150 for a ubermillisecond.

Turning all the protection off, and setting the LVC to 4V total fixed it
Mar 04, 2012, 03:35 AM
Registered User
Peter M's Avatar
I nearly when flying this afternoon too but ended up doing some study, glassing another Stryker Q and a bit of rhinophasty on an old but favourite C.

I'm with Jacko about the likelihood of overcurrent cutout. Counting the beeps is the easiest way to go though!

I'm keen to run my 16/35 with the 12.8x13 blades to see how mine compares to yours as I'm surprised how hot this motor runs. Maybe I've just been spoiled by a fan cooled Kira.......
Mar 04, 2012, 03:49 AM
jackosmeister's Avatar
Ive barely even noticed the 35/1 in my X getting hot, at lots more current, but in bursts

Ive also pushed smaller, lower kV megas harder, makes me think something is screwy. Id double check your esc settings too, just in case..
Mar 04, 2012, 12:21 PM
Carbon fiber is our friend
Steve C's Avatar
Thanks Peter

Yes, it's the Acme Flying Machines Cyclone. Always was a fast airplane and it's stable too. Mark has just made an all carbon wing so there wont be any problems if we push past 220 or so.

I finally figured out how to use the ET graph. Here's what the second flight looked like. The motor was running a little weird and even cut out a bit once, but I'm almost sure it's from the wrong timing.

On 4s, the motor is completely fine and could probably do the whole pack at full throttle. On 5s I think it's going to heat up a bit, so only a few speed runs and then land. I was surprised with the Hyperion motor. An older one I have was wound very well, but this one looks just like Turnigy motors. I will probably re wind it at some point.

Steve C
Mar 05, 2012, 02:39 AM
Registered User
Peter M's Avatar
Thank you for posting that graph Steve.

Looks about 205mph pitch speed for an actual (radar) airspeed of 186-190 mph. Good going!

Looking forward to 5 cells!
Mar 05, 2012, 03:15 AM
Registered User

Pete and Jacko

Hey fellas
Getting back to my problem, i reread the logging graph today( i wish i knew how to upload it for you guys to see!) and i noticed the rpm increased as amps and watts decreased, at the time of the "cutout" leading me to conclude i have a slipping pinion under HIGH load. Since i only have a 1/8'' diameter motor shaft, i think this is the problem> Do you guys run the 5mm shaft?( which would give a much larger surface area to grip) Yes i used a new bottle of 680 locktite.
Any thoughts on my theory?
Thanks for any input
Mar 05, 2012, 03:35 AM
jackosmeister's Avatar
Nope, very much doubt it at least. Its normal for the prop to unload, and gain rpm (as long as its not a major spike in the graph)

Not many gearboxes take 5mm input, 3.2mm is fine. If the pinion had let go you would know about it, as the prop stops spinning quick! (its also makes some screwy noises)

Ditch all the safety stuff on the CC esc, you dont need it, the esc will be fine, and I give ya a money back gaurantee the problem will go away (double check your esc settings timing low etc while there)
Mar 05, 2012, 10:48 AM
Carbon fiber is our friend
Steve C's Avatar
Yep, when the pinion comes loose, you'll know it because you'll be landing right away. I've seen it 4 times in the last couple weeks. Unless your pinion is press fit, then maybe it could slip and still keep flying.

Peter, when you motocalc this prop with a 36mm motor and gearbox, you get some pretty high numbers. I must do this! I have a couple boxes that fit 5mm shafts and the pinion has a setscrew so it should stay on.
Mar 05, 2012, 01:40 PM
Registered User
Peter M's Avatar
Remember if you put the curser over the red shaded area of your ICE logger graph it will show you exactly what the error message is. Doing this should save a lot of time and worry about figuring out what the issue and the fix is.

Mar 05, 2012, 08:20 PM
Carbon fiber is our friend
Steve C's Avatar
Thanks Peter, but I don't have an ICE controller. This was an old Phoenix 125 and I had to install an Eagle Tree eloggerV3 to get data back.

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