Li'l Satan build - part kit, part scratch - Page 11 - RC Groups
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Sep 28, 2011, 04:34 PM
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Nice bit o' woodwork there Andrew 8020.
Foam and electrics are easier/faster/simpler... but Balsa builds, like the smells of castor laced glo fuel are difficult to leave behind entirely.
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Sep 28, 2011, 05:18 PM
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Bare -

Thank you. I enjoy the design/drawing/building phase as much as flying.

Here are some other pics of that plane and a couple of a Mini-Mambo in the bones. You can see the general layout of the plans (drawn on freezer paper) in the stab/rudder pic.

My apology to Rusty for treading on his thread.

Sep 28, 2011, 06:45 PM
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Originally Posted by CZ10
<snip>......Which now has me wondering how we did it back then with silkspan and dope...
It couldn't have been easily done without either extending the center section sheeting or gluing directly to the silkspan. Keep in mind that when a wing like this was covered, the silkspan was probably doped down only on the LE, TE and wingtips. The center section would have been free to move until the silkspan dried and shrunk. Silkspan is pretty porous, so it would have been possible to glue the booms and mount on using either Ambroid or Elmer's wood glue -- the glue quite possibly penetrated and soaked thru to the underlying wood making a fairly good joint. After the glue dried, everything could have been given a sealing coat of dope.

I expect if the plane mid-aired or dirtnapped, the boom and mount joints would not have been the single point of failure.

Just a guess.

Sep 28, 2011, 07:50 PM
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Maybe you could glue right to the silkspan and it would soak through? I don't know, but here's the beginning of my patchwork:
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I cut out a piece to add on th the top. It isn't glued in place yet. You can see where I put a smudge of CA so I don't fumble and break it. I'll have to make another piece to bridge that spar without making an unsightly lump.

I haven't decided about the bottom, but the spar isn't in the way down there.
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Sep 28, 2011, 07:51 PM
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Oh, I didn't see all those posts, there was a new page. I'll read it after supper.
__________________________________________________ ____________________

Since this post was basically wasted space, I'll put some entertainment in it. I'll cross post this link because it's great stuff. Click up 720 dpi and watch it full screen.
I would love to have been there to watch when these guys built a huge scale model Douglass DC-10 and flew it all during a model jet event.
Last edited by RknRusty; Sep 29, 2011 at 12:11 PM.
Sep 29, 2011, 12:02 AM
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I can live with that... Breast enlargement...

And it feels so real, smooth and seamless.
After seeing Andrew's work, mine looks like an amateur did it... wait, that would be me.

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I think I did it without making it ugly once the cover is on it. All the joints are smooth and tight and follow the curves. And I didn't glue up the bellcrank either. I still need to put a strip on each side of the bottom, but that should be simple enough. It won't take a bunch of carving and gouging and fitting. I used regular airplane glue so I could fiddle with it as it dried. I didn't want to have to chisel it apart because CA set before I was ready.

Maybe I should mention this to Brodak.

Flying this thing by Sunday is pretty iffy now. All parts are made and I have to build the nacelle and firewall; smear filler in any cracks and gaps; sand it; paint the tail and the nose; cover the wing, mount the tail and nose, pick an engine and tune it up; watch football on Saturday... nnnnnaaah, probably not going to happen.
Oh well another step backward, but I'm getting there.
See y'all in the funny papers.
Sep 29, 2011, 10:35 PM
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Originally Posted by Andrew0820
Bare -

Thank you. I enjoy the design/drawing/building phase as much as flying.

IF that's the case I might humbly suggest that you Build a Free flight model every couple of years.
I do and it's Hugely rewarding. More so the building as craftsmanship IS expected /required.
Sig sells some very nice rubber powered kits, inexpensively as well (I've built most of them over the years:-)
Nothing like a rubber freeflight model to bring back the little boy.
Ever seen Freeflighters? Despite the appearance/stigma of being time warpers.. these guys Always have a smile on ... for good reason.
I have built a Me163 Aerographics kit 16" span ..lovely model/fun to build (eventually going to slope it :-) it was intended as a Rapier Rocket powered model
Built a BD5 From Dave Blums' free plan (have a copy IF you want it, via Email)
Beautiful build, EVERY part fits 'perfectly' and it's scale.
You do have to cut them out tho. It's a 3/ 4 oz airframe model intended for a mid mounted inrunner. Hunt for it in RC groups lotsa photos/postings.
Just a thought, if building is every bit as fulfilling as flying (is for me :-)
Sep 30, 2011, 08:57 AM
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Originally Posted by RknRusty
And it feels so real, smooth and seamless.

Isn't that a great feeling?!

Rusty, you took a building problem, came up with a workable solution and implemented it --- and it will look good. Give yourself a hardy pat on the back from me.

Waiting for the next set of pics.

Sep 30, 2011, 08:38 PM
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Looking good and getting there.
Sep 30, 2011, 11:43 PM
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Thanks for the back pat, Andrew. Y'all will make a builder out of me yet.
I haven't got a lot to show for today. I used Dap lightweight filler to cover any gaps, like where the ribs join the spars and a couple of fillets on the wingtips. The wing is all sanded now and ready for the covering. The twist is pretty well straightened out.

The tail is shiny black and I'm fitting the nacelle and motor mount pieces. I'll glue it up and give it an epoxy coating tomorrow.

I never showed the underside of the breast enlargement mod, so here's one last look at the naked wing skeleton, with the added strips on the underside and their braces:
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Hopefully the next time you see the wing it will be perfectly covered. I've only done that once, on the Jumpin Bean but it came out really good, even without a practice run. Hope this job goes as well. The wingtips are the most tedious part to do neatly.

While I'm waiting for the paint to cure, I'm going to take the Li'l Jumpin bean out for an exhibition a time or two to get the dizzies out and polish my stunt skills. Maybe I can get a video of that to entertain y'all with.

Got some football watching to do Saturday too. Go South Carolina Gamecocks, whip Auburn!

Bye for now,
Oct 01, 2011, 07:08 PM
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Got the wing covered

Started before the football game and finished at halftime.
This is my review tutorial before I covered it. I found it when I built the Bean.
It came out pretty good. Here are some views:

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The reflections in the first pic make it look like larger dips between the ribs, but there is hardly any. Those turbulator spars do a great job of holding the form of the airfoil.

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The control rod hole.

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This is the underside. You can hardly see the overlap. I got almost all of the little wrinkles out. That line between the leadouts must be one of my gray hairs, not a botch.I used the iron to shrink the whole thing. No heat gun this time. When I got it wrapped it didn't need much shrinking. I did it without the heat sock and left some telltale marking over the sheeting of the center housing. Other than that I like the way the iron works. I'use the sock over sheeting next time.
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This is the top side.

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I threw in the picture with the tail stuck on it just for wishful thinking. I'll be glad when I finish this project.

Not bad for only my second wing job. Thank goodness I'm finally out of the red. What color do y'all think my next batch of planes should be?
Last edited by RknRusty; Oct 02, 2011 at 12:39 AM.
Oct 01, 2011, 07:33 PM
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Looking good ! Should be done real soon. My last Li'l Satan had a RR1 and was very fast. Engine really ran good with Cox racing fuel. This was many years ago. I used silk back then and models looked great. One sq. yard would cover a VooDoo and scraps did a L/Satan. Keep up the good work.
Last edited by dankar04; Oct 01, 2011 at 07:33 PM. Reason: updated
Oct 01, 2011, 08:41 PM
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RknRusty's Avatar
OOPS! Ya know what... I forgot to glue a weight on the wingtip.
If it needs one I'm a pretty good surgeon. I'd rather have to take one out than put one in. I always do at least one thing thing dumb. I guess that was it.

It'll probably be alright, the plans don't call for it, but it helps in the wind. Damnit.
Oct 02, 2011, 09:47 PM
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Just use masking tape and stick it on the covering that way you can adjust weights as necessary. Will work fine.
Oct 05, 2011, 11:06 PM
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The finishing touches

I used an Exacto knife to carve the ultracote off of the wing to accommodate the tail booms and glued them on with 6 min Great Planes epoxy. Almost made another boo boo. I aligned everything straight and square. Or so I thought until I peered over the wing at the stab and realized it wasn't level. The glue set faster than I was working, but I laid some pressure on it and left it a while and it came back straight... almost. If I look close, the outboard side dips slightly lower. I'll see how it flies, but I've figured an easy fix if it acts up in the air. I'm talking about only a small skew, but does anybody think that will cause the plane to want to roll one way or the other? I hope not.

I assembled the nacelle and firewall. That was a bit of a pain, the plans not having a good picture of the original parts, some of which were long gone. The sheeting and firewall went on with CA, the bulkheads and doublers went inside with Testors airplane cement.
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I cut out the wing covering and tacked on some fiberglass tape to give it strength and a good surface to glue to. I put a few dots of CA to hold it in place, to be later painted with epoxy when the nacelle went on.
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Here, I did the same for the fiberglass around the firewall. With a brush I painted the whole exposed area of the wing and the mating surfaces of the nacelle with 6 min epoxy, slid it on and clamped it. I would have just pressed it, but the sheeting wasn't quite flush so I had to clamp it.
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Now I painted the whole thing with 6 min epoxy, except the firewall and its fiberglass which I did with 60 min Loctite epoxy. It'll be cured by tomorrow afternoon. I'm a firm believer in slow cure glue for securing and fuel proofing firewalls.
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As soon as the glue is cured I'll mask it off and prime and paint it black. While I'm waiting on the paint I'll put a good Black Widow together for it. Maybe after I fly it a few times I'll see if there's some way to put a wedge tank on it.

Being the klutz that I am, I got some smears on the wing that are a bit hazy after cleaning. But it ain't a showpiece anyway. This sure as hell can't be the way you guys mass produce combat planes.
Last edited by RknRusty; Oct 05, 2011 at 11:23 PM. Reason: Add a title

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