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May 27, 2011, 05:21 PM
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LiPo Technical / Engineering info


I am looking for engineering data and application notes on LiPo cells. I am not looking for rc hobby sources but rather the sort of information an engineer might use to learn about and created designs using the technology. I'd appreciate any links to relevant sources.
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May 27, 2011, 05:39 PM
Zero Expo
typeRA's Avatar
Found through Google:

http://www.minamoto.com/en/default.a...ndard&panel=0&
May 28, 2011, 09:24 AM
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Originally Posted by typeRA
I've come across sites such as the one that you pointed out, which is very light on technical data. They typically provide you with dimensions, capacity and a few other measurements but no real in-depth tech data.

Thanks.
May 28, 2011, 09:36 AM
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One of the data points I am looking for is the maximum temperature of a LiPo fire.
May 28, 2011, 09:45 AM
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OK, the secret is to search for the actual name of the technology, which is not "LiPo" but rather LiCoO2 or Lithium Cobalt Oxide or Lithium Colbaltate.
May 28, 2011, 10:06 AM
just look at it smokin'
z-matrix's Avatar
i believe you can't find these kind of informations since they are considered industrial secret, maybe you can ask a job at some cell manufacturer and they share cell informations with you.

You can get general cell informations from manufacturers like A123 systems, and there are many cell testing information on this forum too.
I remember the most dangerous cells are the cobalt ones you wrote.
And Lithium was/is being used in some A-bombs too.

Z
May 28, 2011, 10:18 AM
Southern Pride
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Temperature of LiPoly fire, fact that they can burn under water and many other such facts were discussed here back when I was a new member (Oct 2004) just like the fact that Lithiun is barely a trace element in LiPolys unless one float charges them for hours on end at 4.2 volts which does cause Lithum plating to take place in them.

hobby use to have links to numerious LiPoly White paper) and there is a great deal of data posted on the FMA Website from the early days.

Charles
May 28, 2011, 10:38 AM
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Originally Posted by everydayflyer
Temperature of LiPoly fire, fact that they can burn under water and many other such facts were discussed here back when I was a new member (Oct 2004) just like the fact that Lithiun is barely a trace element in LiPolys unless one float charges them for hours on end at 4.2 volts which does cause Lithum plating to take place in them.

hobby use to have links to numerious LiPoly White paper) and there is a great deal of data posted on the FMA Website from the early days.

Charles
I'll look around some more. I realize that there's a lot on this and other RC sites but I am looking for engineering data from the horses mouth, if you will. I'll keep digging.

Thanks.
May 28, 2011, 11:09 AM
Space Coast USA
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Quote:
Originally Posted by everydayflyer

hobby use to have links to numerious LiPoly White paper) and there is a great deal of data posted on the FMA Website from the early days.

Charles
Hobby
A hobby is an activity or interest that is undertaken for pleasure, typically done during one's leisure time

Hoppy
A long time member of RCG.

May 28, 2011, 11:10 AM
Space Coast USA
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Quote:
Originally Posted by martin_05
I'll look around some more. I realize that there's a lot on this and other RC sites but I am looking for engineering data from the horses mouth, if you will. I'll keep digging.

Thanks.
What kind of engineering data for example?
May 31, 2011, 10:52 AM
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Originally Posted by hoppy
What kind of engineering data for example?
Chemistry
Operation
Charging and discharging characteristics
Failure modes
Material safety
Life expectancy
Application data

In the case of the failure mode where cells out-gas and catch fire I am looking for detailed data: pressures, fire temperature, duration in relation to cell size and type, energy content, etc.

A number of the above items can be found spread across various sites. I was hoping to find a cell manufacturer that took the time to treat the subject to hear it from the horses mouth, if you will.
May 31, 2011, 11:16 AM
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For example, popular knowledge in RC circles says that you don't want to discharge a LiCoO2 cell below 3.0V. The question is: Why? What happens chemically at or below 3.0V?

Same for the opposite end: What happens at or above 4.2V?

What is the tolerance?

What are the principles that determine these voltages?

How are they affected by the operating temperature of the cell?

Are they affected by the number of charge/discharge cycles?

...and a bunch of other questions that I don't know yet.
May 31, 2011, 11:40 AM
どうもありがとうミスターロボット
Wrend's Avatar
Sounds like you're somewhat after the actual electrochemical reactions within each cell and how they deteriorate over time and cycle life.

Kind of curious about some of these specific inner mechanics myself.

Wikipedia has helped me a little.
May 31, 2011, 01:40 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Wrend
Sounds like you're somewhat after the actual electrochemical reactions within each cell and how they deteriorate over time and cycle life.

Kind of curious about some of these specific inner mechanics myself.

Wikipedia has helped me a little.
I'll check out Wikipedia, thanks.

I am working on a number of things, including an idea for a charger that I've been wanting to build for a while. I don't want to use "hear-say" data for my assumptions.


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