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Jun 16, 2011, 04:28 PM
Gaftopher
Gary Mortimer's Avatar
I think their must have been a fire.
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Jun 16, 2011, 07:01 PM
Registered User
Quote:
Originally Posted by peabody124
Thanks very much Peabody.

Hard to tell until more CopterControl FPV videos are available, but based on this one alone, the board looks to be producing pretty jittery corrections on every bank and turn. I didn't notice any wobbling, which is nice, but most FPV videos I've seen from MultiWii based copters look to transition thru turns and banks far smoother. Maybe as the code matures it'll reach MultiWii and even MK on-board video production quality.
Jun 16, 2011, 07:19 PM
www.joescnc.com
Joecnc2006's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by patricklupo
Thanks very much Peabody.

Hard to tell until more CopterControl FPV videos are available, but based on this one alone, the board looks to be producing pretty jittery corrections on every bank and turn. I didn't notice any wobbling, which is nice, but most FPV videos I've seen from MultiWii based copters look to transition thru turns and banks far smoother. Maybe as the code matures it'll reach MultiWii and even MK on-board video production quality.
There are to many variable at play to make a statement that the Openpilot CC Board is not up to par with multiWii or MK smoothness, You should look at the many video's of the quads flying and can easily tell it is with par or maybe above the multiwii in performance.
I would not use one video to judge as you mentioned, I would wait for more FPV Videos to emerge.

As stated this depends on the quad build, motors used, is the camera hard mounted or has dampening material when mounted, etc. etc. the list goes on.
Jun 16, 2011, 07:42 PM
Registered User
Quote:
Originally Posted by Joecnc2006
There are to many variable at play to make a statement that the Openpilot CC Board is not up to par with multiWii or MK smoothness, You should look at the many video's of the quads flying and can easily tell it is with par or maybe above the multiwii in performance.
I would not use one video to judge as you mentioned, I would wait for more FPV Videos to emerge.

As stated this depends on the quad build, motors used, is the camera hard mounted or has dampening material when mounted, etc. etc. the list goes on.
I completely agree and look forward to many more FPV videos from CC based copters. I think it has tremendous potential. From a 3rd person perspective it looks amazingly stable, but I also know that a lot of flight characteristic details tend to only show up in on-board videos.
Jun 17, 2011, 12:12 PM
Registered User
Quote:
Originally Posted by patricklupo
Thanks very much Peabody.

Hard to tell until more CopterControl FPV videos are available, but based on this one alone, the board looks to be producing pretty jittery corrections on every bank and turn. I didn't notice any wobbling, which is nice, but most FPV videos I've seen from MultiWii based copters look to transition thru turns and banks far smoother. Maybe as the code matures it'll reach MultiWii and even MK on-board video production quality.
Keep in mind a few things:

1) Basically it's up to how you tune the aircraft. He was tuning that pretty tightly to get a fast response which will push it towards oscillations. Having a fast response and having a smooth response are unfortunately trade offs (especially in attitude mode when you have layered loops)

2) this is in attitude control as opposed to rate mode (multiwii). you will get less oscillations in rate mode because you don't have that outer control loop.

3) MK can do as well as they can in attitude mode because of their ESCs having much higher bandwidth than off the shelf ones. This is why I've been working on an ESC for openpilot (and why my finger is hurting right now to type this) Here is a big prototype of it (final board will be much smaller)
More OpenPilot ESC testing (1 min 11 sec)


Also the pro series (and in principle CC, but untested) can use MK ESCs. If you look in the video from our 2011 Summit you can see an MK frame being controlled by the beta hardware of our pro series and it's VERY stable and reacts quickly. It's basically the thing that made an ESC a high priority for me:

OpenPilot Summit 2011 (36 min 47 sec)
Jun 17, 2011, 12:22 PM
Suspended Account
Quote:
Originally Posted by patricklupo
Thanks very much Peabody.

Hard to tell until more CopterControl FPV videos are available, but based on this one alone, the board looks to be producing pretty jittery corrections on every bank and turn. I didn't notice any wobbling, which is nice, but most FPV videos I've seen from MultiWii based copters look to transition thru turns and banks far smoother. Maybe as the code matures it'll reach MultiWii and even MK on-board video production quality.
mine are not jittery or bouncy at all, smooth as most of my solid setups.
Jun 17, 2011, 04:00 PM
www.joescnc.com
Joecnc2006's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by peabody124
Keep in mind a few things:

1) Basically it's up to how you tune the aircraft. He was tuning that pretty tightly to get a fast response which will push it towards oscillations. Having a fast response and having a smooth response are unfortunately trade offs (especially in attitude mode when you have layered loops)

2) this is in attitude control as opposed to rate mode (multiwii). you will get less oscillations in rate mode because you don't have that outer control loop.

3) MK can do as well as they can in attitude mode because of their ESCs having much higher bandwidth than off the shelf ones. This is why I've been working on an ESC for openpilot (and why my finger is hurting right now to type this) Here is a big prototype of it (final board will be much smaller)
The Esc Looks very promising, Nice work, Looking forward to seeing more testing of it.
Jun 17, 2011, 09:52 PM
'FPV'er...not a "LOS'er
Vantasstic's Avatar
Semi-success with my T-copter. Tonight I replaced all three ESCs (one was acting up) and installed some spare Castle Creations Phoenix 25 ESCs. I set them for manual throttle calibration and then calibrated them through the CC via the procedures mentioned earlier in this thread. Initial motor checks were good with motors running in the proper directions.

I took the T outside for a hover maiden. This time the T lifting evenly (with the bad esc I was getting forward tilt all the time); however, unlike with the other ESCs, the T quickly started banking left and right until it started banging the arms on the ground (was only hovering a few inches up). Previous flight was nice and smooth in the roll, now there is nothing smooth in the roll at all. I'm in stabilization (auto level) mode. Obviously I need to adjust my roll PID. Before doing so, what is recommended to adjust first and do I need to increase or decrease the setting?

I don't quite understand why it was roll stable with the original ESCs and roll unstable with the new (and supposedly better) ESCs. Oh yeah, yes I did calibrate the accelerometers already. Thanks for your learned advice.
Jun 17, 2011, 10:14 PM
FPV really is fun.
Scotth72's Avatar
Castle esc's don't work well in multirotors. They will not accept the high pwm rates being outputted by the flight controller.
Jun 18, 2011, 05:10 AM
Tri-Quad-Hexa-Octo-copters!!
This is corect. Also some Castle ESC versions have auto throttle calibration at power-on which is what makes ESC's incompatable with multicopters which mandate manual throttle calibration. Also some Castle ESC's have a built-in throttle curve "smoothing" which is not compatable for multicopter use. See ESC info in the Quadrocopter and Tricopter Mega Link Index for ESCs known to work well with multicopters.
Cheers,
Jim

Quote:
Originally Posted by Scotth72
Castle esc's don't work well in multirotors. They will not accept the high pwm rates being outputted by the flight controller.
Jun 18, 2011, 10:24 AM
'FPV'er...not a "LOS'er
Vantasstic's Avatar
Thanks guys. I remember reading about the CC controllers and multi-copters. I was thinking the T-bird series didn't work well where the Phoenix series did. I set up my controllers for manual throttle calibration and 'normal' settings like my RCTimer ESCs. I'll do some more looking in the MultiWii thread and the Mega thread to see what info I can find.
Jun 18, 2011, 10:41 AM
'FPV'er...not a "LOS'er
Vantasstic's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by jesolins
T See ESC info in the Quadrocopter and Tricopter Mega Link Index for ESCs known to work well with multicopters.
Cheers,
Jim
All I can see in that thread is a POLL. How do you look for the ESC info?
Jun 18, 2011, 10:45 AM
Registered User
Quote:
Originally Posted by peabody124
Keep in mind a few things:

1) Basically it's up to how you tune the aircraft. He was tuning that pretty tightly to get a fast response which will push it towards oscillations. Having a fast response and having a smooth response are unfortunately trade offs (especially in attitude mode when you have layered loops)

2) this is in attitude control as opposed to rate mode (multiwii). you will get less oscillations in rate mode because you don't have that outer control loop.

3) MK can do as well as they can in attitude mode because of their ESCs having much higher bandwidth than off the shelf ones. This is why I've been working on an ESC for openpilot (and why my finger is hurting right now to type this) Here is a big prototype of it (final board will be much smaller) http://vimeo.com/24952342

Also the pro series (and in principle CC, but untested) can use MK ESCs. If you look in the video from our 2011 Summit you can see an MK frame being controlled by the beta hardware of our pro series and it's VERY stable and reacts quickly. It's basically the thing that made an ESC a high priority for me:

http://vimeo.com/23865574
Have you considered putting dynamic breaking function on your esc? https://www.rcgroups.com/forums/showthread.php?t=958957
Jun 18, 2011, 12:54 PM
Registered User
SupraGo's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by Vantasstic
All I can see in that thread is a POLL. How do you look for the ESC info?
Scroll down??
Jun 18, 2011, 01:00 PM
Suspended Account
Quote:
Originally Posted by Vantasstic
All I can see in that thread is a POLL. How do you look for the ESC info?
thread tools, dont pay attention to the poll. because you cant edit the poll it doesnt even make sense.


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