Pride of Baltimore (the first one) c.1981 - Page 9 - RC Groups
Shop our Airplanes Products Drone Products Sales
Thread Tools
May 03, 2012, 07:45 PM
SCALE Sailor
JerryTodd's Avatar
Looking closely at the forecastle hatch I noted that my "corrected" one wasn't correct. The hatch nearly fills the space between the bitts, is about as tall, and has a bit of a step in the forward end so the lid will have room to hinge open. So I think I finally have something that's as right as I can get it short of diving two miles to measure it.

I'm real pleased with how the tiller turned out. I didn't have any tubing the right size, but I had a little brass sheet and rolled that around a drill bit smaller than the tiller. I CAed that on and filed the seam till it nearly disappeared. How it will be attached to the rudder is another matter.

I put some metal tape on the pump boxes to simulate banding. The pump lever pivots on a yoke in the center - a couple of folks could sit on the cabin top and work the pumps. I don't know if the yoke was on a bar between the two boxes and fasten to the deck. I'll come back to that later.

So, fiddling with the sheet lengths and such I figured I needed more than the sail arm could give me and decided to use a trolly system to handle the sheets; fore and main at least. I made a tray out of some aircraft ply and mounted in on top of the daggerboard trunk.

I need 21" for the main sheet straight out, so I need at least 10" or 11" of travel in the trolly. The figures out just right for the fores'l sheet as well. I think the heads'ls will both go on the arm with the square tops'l

The fore end of the trolly with be anchored in the bow under the focs'l hatch. The aft end will go in the cabin hatch and be spring loaded to maintain tension in the system.

The rudder servo will go back aft too - there'll be too much to get tangled in the main hatch area.

If I need to make the trolly system longer, I may anchor it further aft and open the lazerette hatch to access it.
Last edited by JerryTodd; May 03, 2012 at 11:50 PM.
Sign up now
to remove ads between posts
May 04, 2012, 06:10 PM
SCALE Sailor
JerryTodd's Avatar
I finally nailed down where the rudder servo will go. I decided to drop it in the cabin, but as far aft as I could make it so it wouldn't be in the way of servicing the motor.

It's mounted in a tray of aircraft ply that is suspended below deck level by a couple of wood blocks glued under the cabin side stringers. The tray is held by a pair of screws so it's removable.

The focs'l hatch lid got a hinge and a coat of primer. It sort of snaps shut, but it'll get a magnet to hold it just to be sure.

I made a paper mock-up of the mains'l so I could get a feel for how much travel the main sheet will need. There's going to be a lot of sail on this baby! I plan to set main, fore, jackyard tops'l, fore tops'l, t'gallant, forestays'l, jib, and maybe the flying jib. I marked all the 1:20 measurements on the sail plan, I'll figure out the sail area later.

I need to open the hole for the prop shaft and install the stuffing box, etc. I ordered a Traxis #1260 speed control for the boat that I'll control with one of those little servos that came with the DX-6. I need a new battery. When Constellation sailed last July, the battery didn't just die, it failed and won't charge - it's a paper weight now.
May 06, 2012, 12:50 AM
Damp and Dizzy member
Brooks's Avatar
I'm impressed, both with the deck details and your engineering. I forget, are your mainmast backstays adjustable? If not, then the main boom will hit them long before perdendicularity. Thus, you may not need all that mainsheet adjustment, allowing for simpler below-decks running rigging.

My experience with Aldebaran is that model schooners are over-canvased if built to scale. If you can't reef your sails to match wind conditions, Pride will likely spend a lot of time on her side. JimmyJames, over on modelmahem site, has nice ideas on fast and easy reefing methods. I know you've posted over there, so perhaps you've already seen his work, and developed reefing methods of your own.
May 06, 2012, 10:02 AM
SCALE Sailor
JerryTodd's Avatar
This one was over canvased before she got off the paper, but then, she's a Baltimore Clipper
I do intend to have operating running backs, and running main stays - I just have to figure out all the geometry.

Odds are she'll be sailing under the 4 lowers and the square most of the time, but I'll have a jackyard tops'l, t'gallant, and flying jib for her when it's light.

The fore and main will have a jiffy-reefing set ups.

I don't have any plans for remote reefing - or a clue of how to stuff such a thing into this hull.
May 06, 2012, 06:57 PM
SCALE Sailor
JerryTodd's Avatar

Cinco de Mayo

The weekend was spent with a visitor from long ago and far away - ie: not much done.

I did spend some of this afternoon trying to scope out the shuttle system.
Name: servos.gif
Views: 141
Size: 6.9 KB
Description: General servo schematic

I had some wooden wheels from the hole cutter laying about that I draft as sheaves. Made a quick and nasty spring tensioner for one end and set things up in the boat.
Name: pri20120506a.jpg
Views: 116
Size: 112.6 KB
Description: Aft pulley with spring tensioning

The forward pulley is mounted on a knee that would be attached to the forward post. The pulley with the tensioner I was going to mount to a block attached to the engine bulkhead. I call this draft #1.
Name: pri20120506h.jpg
Views: 125
Size: 88.1 KB
Description: Draft #1 of shuttle system

Draft #2 moves the aft pulley further aft to the port-forward corner of the cabin. That gives me a little longer run, but more importantly, easier access for working on it.

Draft #3 swaps the tensioner fore-and-aft so it's in the access hatch and even easier to service.

Draft #4 puts the tensioned pulley up under the focs'l hatch and back to the winch with no third wheel in the set-up.
Name: pri20120506l.jpg
Views: 129
Size: 102.3 KB
Description: Draft #4

Draft #5 is a beam with the pulleys mounted at either end, the tensioner incorporated into it, and the whole thing as a removable module. Besides being able to remove the whole thing as a unit, this idea helps keep the pulleys aligned to each other better on the horizontal and in relative height.
Name: pri20120506m.jpg
Views: 117
Size: 83.4 KB
Description: Draft #5

I'm really liking aspects of draft #5. I can fasten it to the two bulkheads already in place with out adding any addition structure in the hull. #4 is simple and probably the way I'll go.

PS: looking again, #4 is just too much trouble to deal with, with the tensioner up in the focs'l where I can't reach very well. Heck, I didn't go up there in the real boat if I didn't have too

So, #5 it is. I'll get a piece of aluminum channel to build it on, and make a better pair of pulleys. I need to check the length to make sure the servo won't over shoot.
Last edited by JerryTodd; May 06, 2012 at 11:06 PM.
May 08, 2012, 12:23 AM
SCALE Sailor
JerryTodd's Avatar

The boat gets the shaft

I drilled the pilot hole for the shaft from the inside with a 1/8" bit before all the deck beams and stuff went in. Now I needed to open it to 1/4" but couldn't go at it from inside. So, I went and got a 16" long 1/4" drill bit. That done, if anyone needs something drilled from the next room, let me know.

The speed control came in today; a Traxxas 1260 rotary type. It and a new battery got a tryout almost immediately. It has three speeds forward and reverse and connects right to the head of a servo.

I taped the hole outside the sternpost and punched a small hole in it. Then I stood the hull up on it's transom so gravity would help get the J.B.Weld get where it needed to go.

Taped over the end of the stuffing box and pushed it into the hole and through the tape on the sternpost. I used the shaft to hold the shaft aligned with the motor. I also glued in a beam to steady the inboard end of the shaft.
Last edited by JerryTodd; May 08, 2012 at 12:35 AM.
May 10, 2012, 01:07 PM
SCALE Sailor
JerryTodd's Avatar

Full Size Sail Plan

The speed control was married to a micro servo and mounted in the hull; wired up to the motor and Rx and tested. Everything worked great so it was on to geometry class.
Name: pri20120508e.jpg
Views: 92
Size: 99.7 KB
Description: Made a mount for the speed control Name: pri20120509b.jpg
Views: 92
Size: 144.4 KB
Description: and mounted the mount in the hull
(did I mention I have a can of red spray paint?)

I found some simple idea for handling all the over lapping sails on this little racehorse so Mark and I spent a lot of time rigging up mock-ups and trying to see if it would work. We got to the point were I need to rig up a test rig to really see if it'll function. I'll post more on that

I cut out paper patterns for the sails and pinned them on the shop wall in their respective locations to the hull. Staring at them I noticed something was wrong - the t'gallant was too tall, should have been 6" and not 9". Quick fix with the siz, then recalculate the sail area.

I also thought there was too much overlap in the heads'ls and moved the clew forward on the jib, and up the miter on the flying jib. This doesn't change the sail area of the fore-triangle - when determining the area for CE these sails are measured as one anyway. The stats below reflect these changes in the heads'ls.
Name: Dscf0006.jpg
Views: 91
Size: 99.7 KB
Description: Full size sail plan full sized sailplan
Name: Dscf0007.jpg
Views: 85
Size: 91.5 KB
Description: Full size sail plan with altered head sails to reduce overlap. with overlap reduced

1,504.13 s" - Sail area of just the four lowers
1,971.13 s" - plus tops'ls
2,049.13 s" - plus t'gallant
2,205.13 s" - plus flying jib (max sail area)
Last edited by JerryTodd; May 10, 2012 at 04:37 PM.
May 11, 2012, 07:38 PM
SCALE Sailor
JerryTodd's Avatar

Straight from the bird's mouth

I started experimenting with making the masts with the birds-mouth method.

CaptMSR brought over a V groove router bit and I set it up in the router table. I ripped some cut-off from a 2x4 down to 1/4" thick and cut the V in one edge.
I ripped the piece down to about 3/8" wide, and chopped off 8 pieces about 2" long.
Name: pri20120511b.jpg
Views: 95
Size: 140.3 KB
Description: V groove cut in edge of 1/4" thick plank
This was glued up and clamped up with rubber-bands. When the glue set, I knocked off the corners that stood proud and made it 8-sided. Then I made it 16 sided by eye on the belt sander. Finally I made it round.
Name: pri20120511c.jpg
Views: 101
Size: 97.4 KB
Description: 8 of them glued together make a spar
I made another test piece about 3-1/2" long, but I not going to round it.

Pride's masts will be 15/16" in diameter at the deck and taper to 5/8" at the hounds. Each stave of the mast gets the taper cut into it after the groove is cut. That's why the staves are only 1/4" thick as they'll nearly be touching at the top of the mast.

I almost forgot to put the cheek blocks on the riding bits, that got done today.
Name: pri20120511f.jpg
Views: 73
Size: 104.0 KB
Description: Cheek blocks for riding bitts Name: pri20120511g.jpg
Views: 82
Size: 111.7 KB
Description: Cheek blocks for forward riding bitts Name: pri20120511j.jpg
Views: 88
Size: 138.8 KB
Description: Cheek blocks for aft riding bitts

Another detail I couldn't track down was how the manual pump handle was attached to the pump boxes - CaptMSR found a video of her trip to the islands in 77 and in a scene of Smith shooting a sight - there at his feet are the pumps - partially disassembled - but the only image I've found where you can see them, and between them.
Name: pride77melbourne_sights.jpg
Views: 98
Size: 94.2 KB
Description: Melbourne Smith takes a sight on her maiden voyage to the Carribean in 1977
Note pump boxes bottom center.
May 13, 2012, 12:40 AM
SCALE Sailor
JerryTodd's Avatar
Based on the capture from the video, I removed the metal tape which wasn't thick enough, and used bass to represent the iron banding and the V strap between the pumps.
Name: pri20120512a.jpg
Views: 80
Size: 86.9 KB
Description: Pumps Name: pri20120512b.jpg
Views: 83
Size: 89.0 KB
Description: Pumps

Then I started making the foremast.

Checking all the plans I determined that neither mast had any measurable taper and at 1:20 scale was 15/16" in diameter from deck to hounds.

The bird's mouth calculator, to make an 8 sided mast with 1/4" thick staves called for the staves to be .358" wide, or just a fuzz under 3/8".

I sliced off 1/4" strips off left over cedar from Constellation's masts and spars, then ripped them down to just under 3/8". Then it was over to the router table to cut the bird's mouth. I wish I had a way to do the with a saw - I think it would have come out more accurately, but the router's what I have.

None of the pieces is the full length of the mast, so there's a butt joint or two in each stave, but I made sure they were all staggered with plenty of overlap.

Then I glued them up and wrapped rubber bands around the spar every 3 inches or so. When that set up, I made a plug for the bottom of the mast that was about 6 inches long and stuck out about 5/8" to act as a tenon for the mast step.
Name: pri20120512g.jpg
Views: 85
Size: 84.3 KB
Description: Trimmed to length Name: pri20120512f.jpg
Views: 91
Size: 66.4 KB
Description: Mast tennon Name: pri20120512h.jpg
Views: 80
Size: 110.7 KB
Description: Oak mast step

Using a block plane, I made the mast 16 sided from about 2" above the deck to the top. Then I knocked off these corners and sand it round.
I painted the 8-side lower end, which includes the bury and tenon, and I stained the round part with golden oak stain.
Name: pri20120512j.jpg
Views: 97
Size: 50.5 KB
Description: Stain and paint

The top needs a plug and then to get shaped square with a tenon for the cap. The whole spar is 37-3/8" end-to-end and between the cedar and this method of construction, is so light I'll need the rigging to keep it from floating away.
May 13, 2012, 10:37 AM
Damp and Dizzy member
Brooks's Avatar
I am impressed, once again, with your work. The bird's mouth masts are really neat.

Perhaps if you called the Pride's current office, they could furnish you with a Version 1 pump photo?
May 13, 2012, 04:54 PM
SCALE Sailor
JerryTodd's Avatar
Tried that - they just say they don't have any photos of the old boat.
May 14, 2012, 08:29 AM
SCALE Sailor
JerryTodd's Avatar

Mother's Day

For Mother's Day the lady decided we would plant something, and off to the Home Despot we went, returning with tomato plants, mint, and little flowers. I managed to sneak off to the paint department and got a pint of the cream color everything inboard on Pride seemed to get painted.

After planting everything, including two of the tomato plants going into those upside down hanging things, I dropped into the shop to get a coat of the new paint on.
Name: house20120513a.jpg
Views: 83
Size: 139.5 KB
Description: Upside down tomato planters

The cabin sides, coamings, the counter decking, and the 8-sided portion of the foremast, all got a coat of the cream colored paint.
Name: pri20120513b.jpg
Views: 88
Size: 32.0 KB
Description: The bury of the foremast painted with Pride's inboard cream color

The "iron" banding on the pumps got some black paint as well. I also drilled a hole was drilled in the subdeck for the foremast to go through.
Name: pri20120513c.jpg
Views: 86
Size: 125.3 KB
Description: Pump "irons" painted black and cream color applyied.  Inside the bulwarks will get creamed eventually. Name: pri20120513i.jpg
Views: 93
Size: 137.8 KB
Description: Foremast hole made in the subdeck Name: pri20120513d.jpg
Views: 84
Size: 134.4 KB
Description: more painting
May 14, 2012, 05:48 PM
SCALE Sailor
JerryTodd's Avatar

Today is the anniversary of the loss of the Pride of Baltimore

Twenty-six years ago today, the Pride of Baltimore was stuck by a microburst squall, rolled on her side and sank.

Lost with her were:

Armin Elsaesser, 42, Captain
Vincent Lazarro, 27, Engineer
Barry Duckworth, 29, Carpenter
Nina Schack, 23, Seaman

Name: pride_memorial.jpg
Views: 92
Size: 68.6 KB
Description: The memorial at, Baltimore's Inner Harbor, to the Pride and the 4 crew members lost with her.
Last edited by JerryTodd; May 14, 2012 at 06:01 PM.
May 14, 2012, 09:49 PM
Registered User
my gosh you must be working 10 hours a day on this.....
May 14, 2012, 11:55 PM
SCALE Sailor
JerryTodd's Avatar
Not really, I spend the mornings looking for a job, afternoons posting stuff on ebay and making stuff in the shop to sell - then I work on the model.

Today I worked on the mast head. Squared the doubling, made the cross-trees and trestle-trees, attached the hounds, and gave it all a coat of paint. I have to cut the tenon in the head for the cap yet.

The main mast set of cross-trees and trestle-trees is cut and ready to go when that mast is done.

Thread Tools

Similar Threads
Category Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Gallery American Pride Camaro SS JohnnyDeluxe Life, The Universe, and Politics 30 Nov 22, 2010 02:22 PM
For Sale Discovery Channel Wings - American Pride Collection Set Bombay Non R/C Items (FS/W) 2 Nov 07, 2010 09:35 AM
Discussion Show your Pride in the Most Unique Location Contest! Matt Gunn Electric Heli Talk 0 Oct 25, 2010 03:48 PM
Sold Model Shipways Pride of Baltimore kit $80 crashnburned Non R/C Items (FS/W) 0 Jul 01, 2008 08:18 AM