The REAL (#11) HD Key Cam Thread (PLEASE! READ POSTS #1-#3 BEFORE POSTING QUESTIONS!) - Page 49 - RC Groups
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Jun 19, 2011, 09:40 PM
Registered User
CANNONFODDER0's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tom Frank
There's a link to the camera instructions in post #3, but they don't tell you anything!
  • Does the yellow LED come on when power button pushed?
  • Is battery charged? Does it hold a charge?
  • Will camera record with power from car charger?
  • Did you try another USB cable?
  • Did you try a different USB port (one on the PC case, not a remote hub)?
  • Did you reformat the flash card(s) (preferrably with SDformatter utility)?
  • Does the flash card work in other devices?
SInce the camera shows some signs of life off and on, it's an intermittant problem... likely connectivity/data communication problem.
Thanks for the help. The camera turns on the red LED when connected to a USB port on the laptop, and turns it off after a little while, consistent with recharging behavior experienced before. Used two different USB cables, but I think this is internal to the device, as I noticed it when getting ready to record and failing to turn it on with the power button. Other than the *one* time, there has been no response to the power button.

Trying it out on a new computer (Dell Netbook WinXP) with the old microSD card, and rapidly pressing the power button, I did get it to recognize the USB mode just now. Not sure how to diagnose if the microswitch is bad, or if it is something else.

Should I reapply the firmware? I have other devices to read the cards, so I can take the firmware off outside the device if necessary, but I'm not sure I can turn the thing on to even see that it is there...

v/r,
C-F
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Jun 19, 2011, 09:46 PM
Dance the skies...
Tom Frank's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by CANNONFODDER0
Thanks for the help. The camera turns on the red LED when connected to a USB port on the laptop, and turns it off after a little while, consistent with recharging behavior experienced before. Used two different USB cables, but I think this is internal to the device, as I noticed it when getting ready to record and failing to turn it on with the power button. Other than the *one* time, there has been no response to the power button.

Trying it out on a new computer (Dell Netbook WinXP) with the old microSD card, and rapidly pressing the power button, I did get it to recognize the USB mode just now. Not sure how to diagnose if the microswitch is bad, or if it is something else.

Should I reapply the firmware? I have other devices to read the cards, so I can take the firmware off outside the device if necessary, but I'm not sure I can turn the thing on to even see that it is there...

v/r,
C-F
If it functions occasionally, I think the firmware is OK. It does sound like maybe the power button switch is flakey, doesn't it? I'm not sure which pins of the power switch get shorted when you push the button... maybe someone has tested this and can confirm here? Then you could just short those two pins rather than push the button to see if the button contacts are flakey.
Jun 19, 2011, 09:59 PM
Registered User
CANNONFODDER0's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tom Frank
If it functions occasionally, I think the firmware is OK. It does sound like maybe the power button switch is flakey, doesn't it? I'm not sure which pins of the power switch get shorted when you push the button... maybe someone has tested this and can confirm here? Then you could just short those two pins rather than push the button to see if the button contacts are flakey.
I think you are right. *Fudge-cicles*, I was rather hoping it was something procedural I had done to put it in a funny state/mood.

Thanks for helping confirm the temporary diagnosis, I have to get to bed to get up for travel in a couple hours, so this will have to wait. When I go on leave in July, I will ask my dad to help trace that power button out, he did instrumentation/controls before he retired (one more distraction, he's recovering from heart surgery).

v/r,
C-F
Jun 19, 2011, 10:22 PM
AMA Member since 1984
Well, there is F/w files to:

A. Remove timestamp, 20min. close and continue.
B. Restore timestamp, 20min. close and continue.
C. Continuous recording, remove timestamp.

Can we get one to:

D. Continuous recording, restore timestamp.

That should cover all the bases.

I know some people have mentioned this, and it would be convenient for some situations.

Any luck with this Tom????
Jun 19, 2011, 10:43 PM
Ugly planes do not fly
_Sergey_'s Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tom Frank
Yes... all of the one's denoted as "808" with versions up to #10 are COMPLETELY different. Some are OK, #3 especially, but all have non-HD CMOS sensors with only VGA (640x480) frame sizes. There's another "MEGA Keychain" thread discussing all those. When The #11 appeared, it was out of place being discussed with all those others, and that's why I started this thread.

GREAT price on the Transcend card. I had not even seen a CL10 card listed for Transcend previously. That's the price I paid for my CL6 cards. But, my CL6 cards will produce sequential write speed test results (between 11-12 MB/s) in excess of CL10 minimum speed requirements, so I'm wondering if Transcend has merely increased the speed rating on their existing cards, or created an even faster card. Either way your card should be more than adequate.

If you get a chance, maybe you can test yours using the CrystalDiskMark utility (free download) and post the results here? If I needed more flash cards, I'd jump on the ones you linked.
Here is my card's speed test.
Jun 19, 2011, 11:53 PM
Registered User
timetec's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tom Frank
All of the #11 cameras show darkening at the right/left edges and corners of the video (vignetting). Some are worse than others, but they all show this problem to some degree. Mine is one of the worse ones, I think.
Hi Tom - it may seem frivirlous, but have you at any time attributed this edge darkening effect, to shadowing caused by the small case hole in front of the camera lens ? - just a thought and easy to rule out..

You asked in an earlier post about the inconsistent speed test results you were getting using CL6 4GB and 8GB cards. Not entirely sure - plain odd in fact, but I don't get anything like the random read/write throughput yourself and others users have attained. My stats are consintenty below 5GB across the board, CL4 & CL6.

Richard
Jun 20, 2011, 01:11 AM
Dance the skies...
Tom Frank's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by CANNONFODDER0
I think you are right. *Fudge-cicles*, I was rather hoping it was something procedural I had done to put it in a funny state/mood.
...
v/r,
C-F
The camera is still powered when the power button is off, at least part of that keeps the real time clock ticking. I have another camera, not a #11, that I have 2-3 times managed to put into an inoperative state when pushing buttons going through various configuration menu options. I never managed to isolate the exact cause, but once done, the camera would no longer respond to the power or record buttons. BUT, if I popped out the battery (easy since it's a hard case Li-Ion cell, not wiring in place cell), then reinstalled it, the camera would regain normal operation. That is still a possibility with your #11 camera, hence the last resort option of disconnecting the battery briefly. One user claimed that restored his "dead" camera, others have not had that success. But worth a try if the button diagnosis doesn't show anything wrong.

Good luck with it, and let us know what you find. If the camera is fairly new and has not experienced crash damage, you can probably get it replaced by your vendor.
Jun 20, 2011, 01:17 AM
Dance the skies...
Tom Frank's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by RcNutDave
Well, there is F/w files to:

A. Remove timestamp, 20min. close and continue.
B. Restore timestamp, 20min. close and continue.
C. Continuous recording, remove timestamp.

Can we get one to:

D. Continuous recording, restore timestamp.

That should cover all the bases.

I know some people have mentioned this, and it would be convenient for some situations.

Any luck with this Tom????
No, not yet. But, this has been flagged on a wish list.


There are other bigger issues that will benefit all users, e.g taming the excessive saturation and white balance shift as the exposure level shifts that have been flagged as higher priority, along with fixing the continuous recording bug that does not restart a new segment after the 4GB files size limit. We're lucky we are getting any firmware changes in my opinion... not many companies would do this for their customers. But they are a small company and developing new camera designs, so I think there is a limit on what we can expect.
Jun 20, 2011, 01:20 AM
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Tom Frank's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by _Sergey_
Here is my card's speed test.
Thanks for posting. It meets the minimum CL10 sequential read/write criteria, but it's a bit slower overall than my CL 6 cards! So I think they have just re-branded the older CL6 cards, which seems the smart thing for them to do from a marketing standpoint.
Jun 20, 2011, 01:32 AM
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Tom Frank's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by timetec
Hi Tom - it may seem frivirlous, but have you at any time attributed this edge darkening effect, to shadowing caused by the small case hole in front of the camera lens ? - just a thought and easy to rule out..

You asked in an earlier post about the inconsistent speed test results you were getting using CL6 4GB and 8GB cards. Not entirely sure - plain odd in fact, but I don't get anything like the random read/write throughput yourself and others users have attained. My stats are consintenty below 5GB across the board, CL4 & CL6.

Richard
Yes, the possibility of the small case hole as well as the lens not being perfectly centered in it has come up here in the past as a possible contributor of the vignetting. One user had posted the fact that he reamed his case opening larger to test this, and did not see any difference. Coincidentally, I was just looking at mine earlier this evening and saw the lens was not perfectly centered, and the side that was closer to the lens also had a very slightly greater darkening in the corners of the frame. You can see this in the mask bitmap file I made for the correction filter. I did a little beveling of the case hole and shot a brief clip with overcast day light, but did not see any improvement in that short clip. But will do some more test video on a brighter day.
Jun 20, 2011, 04:44 AM
Registered User
Hey what is this? Long time not here hearing now that there are 3 different version of the #11 cam? How to identify mine? Heard there is now a jumbo version with a larger battery? what is the capacity? mine does have 250mah. Well by talking by the battery mine seems to have died. Please give a link to a replacement battery fitting inside the #11 case, a stronger one would be nice like that one from the jumbo version. can be that the cmos is getting damaged? the video quality suffers from day to day. it looks like i was in FOG but it is a clear sunny day
Jun 20, 2011, 05:42 AM
Registered User
Quote:
Originally Posted by Karkadam
Please give a link to a replacement battery fitting inside the #11 case (
You could contact hxelepro (Diana), she is more than happy to sell you the original 250mA battery for CAD3,99 + shipping. I suspect the other #11 vendors may have simular offers.
Jun 20, 2011, 06:49 AM
Just thumbing through...
victapilot's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tom Frank
I've attached two frame grabs from my #11 camera showing a before and after picture of how this filter mask can improve the video.
That's a big improvement! Maybe some of the newer #11 cameras have less to start with, at least it seems that way?
Jun 20, 2011, 09:40 AM
AMA #903699
Tony_Fletcher's Avatar
Hello gang:

A few days back I posted a question regarding cockpit video and audio. You may recall I'm thinking of using my #11 cam in the cockpit of my full-size aircraft to record my lessons for later study. I read that you only retain about half of the hour lesson since you're bombarded with so much info.

Wouldn't it be cool to record audio and video and watch your lesson again to really absorb all that the plane was doing, what your instructor was saying, etc?

Well here's what I found. It looks like one way to get audio for your #11 cam footage is this cable from Barnstormer Audio. It connects between the plane's audio jacks and your headset, so you could patch in a iPhone, pocket recorder, etc.

I also found this solution. Very cool, but $500 is pretty steep, when it looks like I could get the #11 cam and audio tracks synced together in something like iMovie or Final Cut.

I know that all this audio talk on the outward bounds of this #11 camera discussion, but I wanted to respond to those that responded to my questions, as well as anyone else that might have the same idea. Hopefully soon I can post a #11 clip of one of my super-smooth landings, with audio!

Thanks again for all the great #11 info.
Jun 20, 2011, 09:53 AM
Just thumbing through...
victapilot's Avatar
I'm cheap, so I would attempt to carefully remove the little microphone from a #3 cam ($13) and add a servo connector and servo extension. Tuck that little mike under the headset, maybe wrap in Saran wrap to keep the sweat and wax off

Then you could use the #3 to catch glimpses of joy or horror as you do those landings, and patch the sound in, and/or use PIP.

Haven't tested if there is a problem with extending the mike without some kind of amplification, but it should work for 3ft or so.
Jun 20, 2011, 10:22 AM
Lucid Dreamer
kobkobico's Avatar
I was wondering if anybody has tried AP with a solar balloon. You can see how to build them here: http://www.solar-balloons.com/howto.html

I've never actually built one, but I was thinking you could probably attach a little "pod" on it with a camera, a single servo, a receiver, and maybe a GPS. This #11 camera would be perfect. You'd rig it so that moving the servo would detach the pod from the balloon. I think all you'd need is a streamer and some bubble wrap on the bottom so the pod wouldn't drift too far.

The cool thing about this is that you should be able to release the pod when you can barely make out the balloon. What limits me with my plane is that I lose orientation, but I think with one of these you could go much higher for little money.
Jun 20, 2011, 10:40 AM
Fidler & twidler
empeabee's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by kobkobico
I was wondering if anybody has tried AP with a solar balloon. You can see how to build them here: http://www.solar-balloons.com/howto.html

I've never actually built one, but I was thinking you could probably attach a little "pod" on it with a camera, a single servo, a receiver, and maybe a GPS. This #11 camera would be perfect. You'd rig it so that moving the servo would detach the pod from the balloon. I think all you'd need is a streamer and some bubble wrap on the bottom so the pod wouldn't drift too far.

The cool thing about this is that you should be able to release the pod when you can barely make out the balloon. What limits me with my plane is that I lose orientation, but I think with one of these you could go much higher for little money.
In some countries, dropping things from the sky causes a Big Unsmiling Man With A Blue Flashing Head to come knocking at your door......
Mike
Jun 20, 2011, 11:04 AM
Dance the skies...
Tom Frank's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by Karkadam
Hey what is this? Long time not here hearing now that there are 3 different version of the #11 cam? How to identify mine? Heard there is now a jumbo version with a larger battery? what is the capacity?
...
Post#2 is your friend for questions like this...
Jun 20, 2011, 11:09 AM
Lucid Dreamer
kobkobico's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by empeabee
In some countries, dropping things from the sky causes a Big Unsmiling Man With A Blue Flashing Head to come knocking at your door......
Mike
True, good point... I couldn't do it in my area because we have a small airport about 3 miles away and I don't want to endanger anyone.

I'm sure it could be done in a "middle of nowhere" area but then there wouldn't be much of a view.
Jun 20, 2011, 11:34 AM
KC
KC
Registered Loiterer.
KC's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by kobkobico
I was wondering if anybody has tried AP with a solar balloon. You can see how to build them here: http://www.solar-balloons.com/howto.html...
iPhone goes to space. #11 with a GPS device... perfectly doable.

Homemade Spacecraft (6 min 59 sec)



KC
Last edited by KC; Jun 20, 2011 at 11:40 AM.
Jun 20, 2011, 12:27 PM
Just thumbing through...
victapilot's Avatar
It could be easy with a weather balloon from Ebay, and only a light load. This is worth reading
Jun 20, 2011, 02:08 PM
AMA Member since 1984
What are the dimensions of the battery? My #11 hasn't arrived yet to measure. Will be sometime, just ordered 2 Cams today.
Can't find anything in FAQ section as to size.
Maybe should be in there somewhere.
Like maybe the "My camera battery died and need to replace it." section.

??/??/??mm


Thanks
Jun 20, 2011, 02:40 PM
Must not buy more planes!
mclarkson's Avatar
Argh! One of my cameras had problems (detailed a few pages back.) The vendor was supportive, but I have to send the camera back to China so they can send me a replacement.

No problem, except ... the post office won't let me. My wife took it in today, and she says: "When I went to mail this I had to explain what it was. Then the post office employees (I ended up talking to a supervisor) informed me that cameras are on a list of things, along with wristwatches, radios, TV sets, and other common electronic items, that are prohibited from being sent to China."

That's both crazy and disappointing. And crazy. All those things come from China in the first place!
Last edited by mclarkson; Jun 20, 2011 at 02:48 PM.
Jun 20, 2011, 03:20 PM
Registered User

#13 1080p AVI MJPEG


2011 June 26 UPDATE - a second video sample from the #13 has no missing frames for the first 4 seconds, then 67% missing frames. Terrible. See YouTube videos wWQao7y4trY and 8eew3A9CVQc.

==========

If you like the #11 you probably won't be interested in the #13.

The FPS is only 15 but the missing frame rate is zero, the image sensor seems to be 1920x1080 and the AVI file is 1920x1080.

It has a slightly different case than the #11 but is about the same size.

Preliminary information comes from one outdoor video sample provided by a camera seller. Although the video exposure is dark and high contrast, the video frames are sharp and the shutter speed is much faster than the FPS.

Information about camera features like composite video output and battery life are unknown until somebody does some bench tests.

www.chucklohr.com/808/C13

-- Chuck at www.chucklohr.com/808
Last edited by Normandy5; Jun 26, 2011 at 05:03 PM.
Jun 20, 2011, 03:35 PM
Dance the skies...
Tom Frank's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by RcNutDave
What are the dimensions of the battery? My #11 hasn't arrived yet to measure. Will be sometime, just ordered 2 Cams today.
Can't find anything in FAQ section as to size.
Maybe should be in there somewhere.
Like maybe the "My camera battery died and need to replace it." section.

??/??/??mm


Thanks
The battery size is the same as the old 808... 4mm x 20mm x 30mm. I have not found a source for one that size with 250 mAH rated capacity other than from the orginal sellers. I'll add the size info to the FAQs.
Jun 20, 2011, 03:59 PM
AMA Member since 1984
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tom Frank
......I'll add the size info to the FAQs.


Thanks Tom
Jun 20, 2011, 04:10 PM
Episyrphus balteatus
Paxman's Avatar
The battery looks very similar to the ones used for micro helis. Only those are LiPo and might not be the best option since they need to be charged with a LiPo-charger. However, if the voltage is the same a LiPo could be a good alternative since the can be charged much faster. Or am I missing something here...?
Jun 20, 2011, 04:21 PM
AMA Member since 1984
Glad I bought these then.

I have 6 of them.

https://www.rcgroups.com/forums/show...postcount=4268
Jun 20, 2011, 04:25 PM
AMA Member since 1984
Quote:
Originally Posted by Paxman
The battery looks very similar to the ones used for micro helis. Only those are LiPo and might not be the best option since they need to be charged with a LiPo-charger. However, if the voltage is the same a LiPo could be a good alternative since the can be charged much faster. Or am I missing something here...?

YES, these are LIPO's
Last edited by RcNutDave; Jun 20, 2011 at 04:33 PM.
Jun 20, 2011, 04:33 PM
KC
KC
Registered Loiterer.
KC's Avatar
Hobby King has some (supposedly) 240 mAh 1s lipos for $1.82, but doesn't appear to have the LVC protection PCB. The reviews indicates that the actual capacity is more realistically around 180 mAh. (but the measurements were made at a much higher Amp draw than what the #11 uses.)

The size seems to be very close.

KC

Edit: Has anyone charged a depleted OEM #11 lipo with an external charger to see what the actual capacity is?
Last edited by KC; Jun 20, 2011 at 04:41 PM.
Jun 20, 2011, 04:45 PM
Dance the skies...
Tom Frank's Avatar
deleted... redundant
Jun 20, 2011, 04:49 PM
RC pilot by soul
Can anyone recommend a good and cheap wide angle lens for the 808 #11 cam ?
Jun 20, 2011, 05:20 PM
Dance the skies...
Tom Frank's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by i3dm
Can anyone recommend a good and cheap wide angle lens for the 808 #11 cam ?
Search this thread for "wide lens" and look in the FAQs in post #3
Jun 20, 2011, 05:23 PM
Dance the skies...
Tom Frank's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by KC
Hobby King has some (supposedly) 240 mAh 1s lipos for $1.82, but doesn't appear to have the LVC protection PCB. The reviews indicates that the actual capacity is more realistically around 180 mAh. (but the measurements were made at a much higher Amp draw than what the #11 uses.)

The size seems to be very close.

KC

Edit: Has anyone charged a depleted OEM #11 lipo with an external charger to see what the actual capacity is?
Yes... some tests were done when when the external battery packs were being tested. I forget exactly what I measured... slightly less than the advertised capacity, but more than 180 mAh. You can do a search to find the external battery posts if you need more accurate numbers.
Jun 20, 2011, 05:27 PM
RC pilot by soul
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tom Frank
Search this thread for "wide lens" and look in the FAQs in post #3
oe do i search this thread only ?
Jun 20, 2011, 05:28 PM
a.d.m.i.n
reptor's Avatar
Anyone know if there would be any new version of this camera, maybe with video out, 1080p ?
Jun 20, 2011, 05:31 PM
Episyrphus balteatus
Paxman's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by RcNutDave
YES, these are LIPO's
They are?! In the picture in post #2 it says Lithium-Ion (LiIo) not Lithium-Polymer (LiPo).

For those of us that are planing to not use the original case the physical size of the battery is not that important. As long as the voltage is correct any mA is good. Really big mA numbers would be good for continuous recording...if this will be a future feature.

Question is how will the USB-charging inflict with a LiPo (if the original is not a LiPO)? Im thinking of having a simple connector between the #11 and the battery so I can use my regular LiPo-charger but what will connecting the #11 via USB do to the LiPo?.
Jun 20, 2011, 05:43 PM
Dance the skies...
Tom Frank's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by Normandy5
If you like the #11 you probably won't be interested in the #13.

The FPS is only 15 but the missing frame rate is zero, the image sensor seems to be 1920x1080 and the AVI file is 1920x1080.

It has a slightly different case than the #11 but is about the same size.

Preliminary information comes from one outdoor video sample provided by a camera seller. Although the video exposure is dark and high contrast, the video frames are sharp and the shutter speed is much faster than the FPS.

Information about camera features like composite video output and battery life are unknown until somebody does some bench tests.

www.chucklohr.com/808/C13

-- Chuck at www.chucklohr.com/808
Thanks for the heads up, Chuck. We definitely want to know whats new or better in the #11 camera's class.

I D/L the video clip from the link you gave and ran it through G-spot (report image below). As I suspected, the video codec is MJPEG, not H.264. And the video bit rate averaged a tick less than 18,000 kbps to capture the larger amount (2.25 times more) data per frame, with no dropped frames as you mentioned. So it's no surprise the frame rate had to be dropped to 15 fps to do that.

For AV purposes, my take on this new camera is:

The Good:
  • The price point is a tick LESS than the #11 ($38 US delivered)
  • The larger frame size almost fills up my widescreen monitor at it's native resolution (with no upsizing)
The Bad:
  • The file size is a little over twice as large as the #11 for the same duration video
  • Even though this camera has a higher density CMOS sensor, the lens still produces some light drop-off and discoloration at the right/left frame edges, just like the #11
  • The image detail appears to be no better (and maybe a little worse, if not focus related) than the #11.
  • There is a sudden exposure shift (image darkening) when the image panned to a much darker area in the example.
  • Even though my video players will play the native .AVI file, some editors may not be able to edit it (e.g. Vdub will load it, but complains it can't edit a file with a frame dimension not divisable by 16... i.e. 1080). AviDemux, WLMM, VideoPad, MAGIC MEP17+ work fine, though.
The Ugly
  • The 15 fps is unwatchable to my eye with even a small amount of motion in the frame (objects moving or panning)
The Potential
  • If the firmware could be toggled to subsample this larger CMOS array at 1280x720 frame size at 30 fps, this could reduce the recorded image size such that it is inside the vignetting of the lens, and produce an image that is much more uniform in color and brightness and focus across the entire recorded frame... something that could make this better than the #11 is now.
FWIW, the developer of the #11 recently told me he is developing a 1080p camera that could be ready within a month or two. I don't know if this might be the prototype or not... the eBay seller is not one of his that market the #11, but he has a couple other sellers and was developing other sales outlets. I gave him early feedback on the issues of 1080HD video that mimick my observations of this one I outlined above.

Also FWIW, I do like to see a post that gives readers a heads up on new competing or better products in this size and price range. But I do not plan to support this new camera in this thread, and do not encourage more posts or more video samples from it here. It only confuses the discussion of the #11. Other different cameras should have their own support threads IMHO.
Jun 20, 2011, 05:47 PM
Dance the skies...
Tom Frank's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by i3dm
oe do i search this thread only ?
Yes.
Jun 20, 2011, 05:50 PM
AMA Member since 1984
Quote:
Originally Posted by Paxman
They are?! In the picture in post #2 it says Lithium-Ion (LiIo) not Lithium-Polymer (LiPo).

For those of us that are planing to not use the original case the physical size of the battery is not that important. As long as the voltage is correct any mA is good. Really big mA numbers would be good for continuous recording...if this will be a future feature.

Question is how will the USB-charging inflict with a LiPo (if the original is not a LiPO)? Im thinking of having a simple connector between the #11 and the battery so I can use my regular LiPo-charger but what will connecting the #11 via USB do to the LiPo?.
They are indeed LIPO.

These #11's are supposed to have a CC/CV charging chip onboard similar
to the MCP73811. Google that number and look at data sheets.


Look at lines 9 & 10 on attached pic

LION is usually metal cased like the batt's in a laptop. Looks like a large
AA battery, round and long.
LIPO are in poly sacks like shown in pics for cam. Flat and wide.
Last edited by RcNutDave; Jun 20, 2011 at 06:24 PM.
Jun 20, 2011, 05:50 PM
Dance the skies...
Tom Frank's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by reptor
Anyone know if there would be any new version of this camera, maybe with video out, 1080p ?
Video out - not planned that I know of.
1080p - yes... one is under development right now, but it will likely be a different camera... in the size range of the Jumbo #11's I think. And with different hardware and firmware, it will deserve it's own thread, so will not be supported in this one.
Jun 20, 2011, 06:05 PM
AMA Member since 1984
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tom Frank
........ And with different hardware and firmware, it will deserve it's own thread, so will not be supported in this one.
Well Tom, you have plenty of time on youe hands. Guess you'll just
have to run that one too
Jun 20, 2011, 06:11 PM
Episyrphus balteatus
Paxman's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by i3dm
oe do i search this thread only ?
I guess you are asking how you search this thread only? In the blue bar there is a selection "Search this thread". Click it and the search form will appear.
Jun 20, 2011, 06:22 PM
Episyrphus balteatus
Paxman's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by RcNutDave
They are indeed LIPO.

These #11's are supposed to have a CC/CV charging chip onboard similar
to the MCP73811. Google that number and look at data sheets.


Look at lines 9 & 10 on attached pic

LION is usually metal cased like the batt's in a laptop. Looks like a large
AA battery, round and long.
LIPO are in poly sacks like shown in pics for cam. Flat and wide.
Well then...its settled! I guess that we are talking about a one cell LiPo, 3,7 V? Here is one with 340% more capacity for $3.67!
Jun 20, 2011, 06:37 PM
AMA Member since 1984
Quote:
Originally Posted by Paxman
Well then...its settled! I guess that we are talking about a one cell LiPo, 3,7 V? Here is one with 340% more capacity for $3.67!


I'm going this route:::::
[URL]http://cgi.ebay.com/270765012218?ru=http%3A%2F%2Fshop.ebay.com%3A80%2F i.html%3F_from%3DR40%26_trksid%3Dm570.l2736%26_nkw %3D270765012218%26_fvi%3D1&_rdc=1[/URL


Along with this::::::

http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/_W0QQcmdZViewItemQQ_rdcZ1QQitemZ160605027176QQruZh ttpQ3aQ2fQ2fshopQ2eebayQ2ecomQ3a80Q2fiQ2ehtmlQ3fQ5 ffromQ3dR40Q26Q5ftrksidQ3dm570Q2el2736Q26Q5fnkwQ3d 160605027176Q26Q5ffviQ3d1
Jun 20, 2011, 06:45 PM
Episyrphus balteatus
Paxman's Avatar
5 amps?! The cam will never need a charge!
Jun 20, 2011, 06:50 PM
Dance the skies...
Tom Frank's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by RcNutDave
Well Tom, you have plenty of time on youe hands. Guess you'll just
have to run that one too
Yeah right! I do have a lot of time being retired now, but I'd like to to spend SOME of it flying, playing golf, etc. Maybe, if the developer wanted to send me a free new camera to field test and trouble of maintaining a dedicated thread, I'd consider it... can't support something I don't have. But then I'd back off on the current thread support... do you know how many times I've posted "see the FAQs links in Post #3"? Frustrating... give someone the help to help themselves, and they won't even take the time to use it.

Quite honestly, 1080HD doesn't interest me much because unless the lens and CMOS quality are improved so that they can not only capture finer detail, but also focus it and display it with uniform color and brightness across the entire frame, there is nothing to gain. The larger display just emphasizes any defects in the imaging hardware. And the larger files sizes, larger flash card memory, and larger battery size needed to power the whole thing drives up the price, size, and weight, all of which are not conducive to hauling it up in an RC powered plane which could crash and destroy or lose the whole affair!

For me, a 720HD display is best suited to my hobby interests. Getting that in higher quality than we have right now in a small package like the #11 would be my nirvana. I think a larger CMOS array and lens is needed to do that, but might be able to stuff it in a Jumbo #11 case.
Last edited by Tom Frank; Jun 20, 2011 at 07:23 PM.
Jun 20, 2011, 06:55 PM
AMA Member since 1984
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tom Frank
Yeah right!... do you know how many times I've posted "see the FAQs links in Post #3"? Frustrating... give someone the help to help themselves, and they won't even take the time to use it.

.

Know what you mean.

I've read thru the whole post in the last 5 days, (took me that long),
and I've seen countless post from you and others about that.

Frustrating indeed!


I was getting frustrated just watching it all.
Jun 20, 2011, 07:04 PM
Episyrphus balteatus
Paxman's Avatar
Edit: Concerning the power supplies with super big capacity.

For me, these are NOT alternatives since my application for the #11 is light RC planes and helis.

Suddenly I felt that I just barged in on this thread without presentation and without giving credit to the MAN of this thread.

Well, Im Fred from Sweden and I want to do some nice AP from my E-Starter float plane and my T-Rex 450 heli. Thats how I found this thread.

All credit to Tom Frank who has compiled and moderated this thread, not to mention gathering all the information and having contact both with vendors and developer of this sweet product!

Thanks!
/Fred
Last edited by Paxman; Jun 20, 2011 at 07:09 PM. Reason: Post not clear since other posters got in between.
Jun 20, 2011, 07:27 PM
Dance the skies...
Tom Frank's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by RcNutDave
They are indeed LIPO.

These #11's are supposed to have a CC/CV charging chip onboard similar
to the MCP73811. Google that number and look at data sheets.


Look at lines 9 & 10 on attached pic

LION is usually metal cased like the batt's in a laptop. Looks like a large
AA battery, round and long.
LIPO are in poly sacks like shown in pics for cam. Flat and wide.
My other cameras, cell phone, etc. also use Li-Ion cells but in flat hard shell cases just slightly larger than the #11 Lipo cells. Not all are cylinders.
Jun 20, 2011, 07:43 PM
Dance the skies...
Tom Frank's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by Paxman
Edit: Concerning the power supplies with super big capacity.

For me, these are NOT alternatives since my application for the #11 is light RC planes and helis.

Suddenly I felt that I just barged in on this thread without presentation and without giving credit to the MAN of this thread.

Well, Im Fred from Sweden and I want to do some nice AP from my E-Starter float plane and my T-Rex 450 heli. Thats how I found this thread.

All credit to Tom Frank who has compiled and moderated this thread, not to mention gathering all the information and having contact both with vendors and developer of this sweet product!

Thanks!
/Fred
Thanks, Fred, and welcome to the thread. My use for this camera is similar to yours, but for winged aircraft only. Fortunately, the Slow Stick can haul one heck of a load, much larger than these tiny cameras, but the small size means you can mount them almost anywhere.

Before the #11 came along, I used an HD camcorder that started out at about 5 oz. weight, then I pared that down to 2-1/2 oz. by ditching the case and (very heavy) LCD display. I still like that option since it has a 5MP CMOS sensor and larger lens, with even color and brightness across the 1280x720 display. But the #11 can go where it can't! I'd just like some more firmware tweaks to improve the white balance shift when going from bright to darker areas, diminish the color saturation level, and fix the continuous recording continuation bug. After that, only a larger CMOS array and lens can fix the vignetting at the edges, I think.

But it seems this thread has picked up many people who do not use the camera for AV purposes, but rather many different ground uses. They don't have the same constraints that we do with size, weight, etc. But my focus in this thread and with the sellers/developer is, and will continue to be, biased towards AV use.
Jun 20, 2011, 07:54 PM
Must not buy more planes!
mclarkson's Avatar
Not to spam the thread, but I'm gonna try one more time in case my post rolled off before anyone could notice it.

Has anyone ever returned a camera to one of these vendors? The post office employees (I ended up talking to a supervisor) informed me that cameras are on a list of things, along with wristwatches, radios, TV sets, and other common electronic items, that are prohibited from being sent to China. That even if it's not labeled as a camera, it can be opened either in the U.S. or in China and confiscated, etc.

Any suggestions? Am I just ed?
Jun 20, 2011, 07:59 PM
Dance the skies...
Tom Frank's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by mclarkson
Not to spam the thread, but I'm gonna try one more time in case my post rolled off before anyone could notice it.

Has anyone ever returned a camera to one of these vendors? The post office employees (I ended up talking to a supervisor) informed me that cameras are on a list of things, along with wristwatches, radios, TV sets, and other common electronic items, that are prohibited from being sent to China. That even if it's not labeled as a camera, it can be opened either in the U.S. or in China and confiscated, etc.

Any suggestions? Am I just ed?
Yes, I have returned a camera to China, by the cheapest US parcel post. I forget what I put on the customs declaration... maybe something like "toy key chain recorder" (which is what it is). It was received OK and I got a replacement OK. First time I have heard of this ridiculous restriction in the mail!
Jun 20, 2011, 10:37 PM
Registered User
Prof100's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by mclarkson
Argh! One of my cameras had problems (detailed a few pages back.) The vendor was supportive, but I have to send the camera back to China so they can send me a replacement.

No problem, except ... the post office won't let me. My wife took it in today, and she says: "When I went to mail this I had to explain what it was. Then the post office employees (I ended up talking to a supervisor) informed me that cameras are on a list of things, along with wristwatches, radios, TV sets, and other common electronic items, that are prohibited from being sent to China."

That's both crazy and disappointing. And crazy. All those things come from China in the first place!
That's one way to block and prevent honoring any warranty. I'd go back and say it was a key chain you wanted to return to China.
Jun 21, 2011, 03:58 AM
Episyrphus balteatus
Paxman's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tom Frank
I'd just like some more firmware tweaks to===>fix the continuous recording continuation bug.
I was thinking about this "little" problem. If I understand this correctly this restriction is related to the file system FAT32. The cam would need to be able to handle NTFS to create files bigger than 4 G if Im not mistaken. Is there even a way to get around this with firmware?
Jun 21, 2011, 07:48 AM
Registered User
jantares's Avatar
Current date in right bottom horn on pictures displays me.
I earlier did not see on pictures this near old firmware.
There are no date and time on film, incorrect geometry is.
It should be a circle like the photo and not an ellipse.
Jun 21, 2011, 08:15 AM
RC Crazy
billhally's Avatar
Hi all

Been lurking for a while reading posts and finally took the plunge and ordered my #11 cam from power-gps as advised at page 1.

I already downloaded the no time stamp firmware as I would like this removed is it OK to use this firmware irrespective of the version of camera I receive from him as long as its defo a #11 ?

Also have an 8gb card already in my #3 camera that works good in there so ran the speed test and attached here is the result. Will this be sufficient for the #11 camera or will I need to purchase another?

TIA Bill
Jun 21, 2011, 08:29 AM
Registered User
Quote:
Originally Posted by Paxman
If I understand this correctly this restriction is related to the file system FAT32. The cam would need to be able to handle NTFS to create files bigger than 4 G if Im not mistaken. Is there even a way to get around this with firmware?
You are absolutely right about the 4Gb limit with FAT32, but I thought the bug was that after the first 4Gb file was saved, a second file should start but it doesn't.
Jun 21, 2011, 08:43 AM
Registered User
Quote:
Originally Posted by mclarkson
Not to spam the thread, but I'm gonna try one more time in case my post rolled off before anyone could notice it.

Has anyone ever returned a camera to one of these vendors? The post office employees (I ended up talking to a supervisor) informed me that cameras are on a list of things, along with wristwatches, radios, TV sets, and other common electronic items, that are prohibited from being sent to China. That even if it's not labeled as a camera, it can be opened either in the U.S. or in China and confiscated, etc.

Any suggestions? Am I just ed?
I have returned two of these cameras, a fake #3 and my original broken #11. In both instances I declared them as "key car remote" which is what they came to me labeled as. No issues with the post office. I would think if it was that important to not allow those things to China they would specifically ask me, which they didn't. Since it originally came from China I don't see the problem. That's why you shouldn't go out of your way explaining every little detail to the post office. Just tell them the bare minimum (whether it is liquid, perishable or not) and be done with it.
Jun 21, 2011, 08:44 AM
Registered User
Quote:
Originally Posted by jantares
Current date in right bottom horn on pictures displays me.
I earlier did not see on pictures this near old firmware.
There are no date and time on film, incorrect geometry is.
It should be a circle like the photo and not an ellipse.
Flash the release 2 firmware listed in the FAQ.
Jun 21, 2011, 08:46 AM
Registered User
Quote:
Originally Posted by Paxman
I was thinking about this "little" problem. If I understand this correctly this restriction is related to the file system FAT32. The cam would need to be able to handle NTFS to create files bigger than 4 G if Im not mistaken. Is there even a way to get around this with firmware?
The bug is that it does not continue after the first 4GB file is finished. You are not mistaken about the NTFS vs. FAT32 issue but it has nothing to do with what they were talking about.
Jun 21, 2011, 08:56 AM
a.d.m.i.n
reptor's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tom Frank
Video out - not planned that I know of.
1080p - yes... one is under development right now, but it will likely be a different camera... in the size range of the Jumbo #11's I think. And with different hardware and firmware, it will deserve it's own thread, so will not be supported in this one.
I search for Jumbo #11, but didn't find anything to see what it will look like. When it will be released and for what prize? It's worth to wait or buy #11 ?
Jun 21, 2011, 09:11 AM
Registered User
Quote:
Originally Posted by jantares
Current date in right bottom horn on pictures displays me.
I earlier did not see on pictures this near old firmware.
There are no date and time on film, incorrect geometry is.
It should be a circle like the photo and not an ellipse.
I did not quite understood.

I think what you`re saying is that with some firmware versions (and/or camera version) the photo does not have the correct aspect ratio, but it is distorted. So the circle displays as an eclipse.
Is this correct? Did I understood right?
And if yes, then which firmware(s) have this problem? And does this happen to any camera version if only the bad firmware is used? Or is it related to the camera version and firmware has nothing to do with the problem? Or both?

And that with some firmware versions the photos do not have the timestamp, while with some other they have. Well this might has to do whether the firmware is a timestamp on (date on) or timestamp off (date off).
Is this correct? Did I understood right?
Jun 21, 2011, 10:04 AM
Dance the skies...
Tom Frank's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by Paxman
I was thinking about this "little" problem. If I understand this correctly this restriction is related to the file system FAT32. The cam would need to be able to handle NTFS to create files bigger than 4 G if Im not mistaken. Is there even a way to get around this with firmware?
Yes, it's a FAT32 file system limitation. The SDformatter utility, created by the SD Association specifically to give an SD card maximum performance, doesn't give the option to format with anything other than FAT32, so it may be a requirement of the flash memory... don't know for sure. But there should only be about a 3 second delay every 50 minutes or so while the camera closes one file and starts a new one when they fix the bug in the continuous recording firmware, so it's not a very big loss of video.
Jun 21, 2011, 10:17 AM
Registered User
Hello all,

I bought a keychain camera #11. First it was out of focus, so I opened case and saw that lens were cross threaded, so found instructions here and tried to fix that. But... I broked CMOS sensor (I think lens were glued, becouse after I broke still didnt manage to losen the lens, only plastic broken in the end).

So I am interested where can I find a new CMOS sensor for replace. Or maybe here anyone could sell broken camera for low price with good CMOS sensor.
Sensor on connection is marked: C971P FCT

Will be waiting for anwer
Jun 21, 2011, 10:25 AM
Registered User
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tom Frank
Yes, it's a FAT32 file system limitation. The SDformatter utility, created by the SD Association specifically to give an SD card maximum performance, doesn't give the option to format with anything other than FAT32, so it may be a requirement of the flash memory... don't know for sure.
The SDformatter utility is there for people who don't know anything about computers. It just formats the SD card to the standard filesystem that every device expects to see. If you wanted, you could format an SD card with NTFS or ext3 or any other filesystem you want. You can even create multiple partitions on one if you wanted, it's just another block device like a hard drive. Your only limitations are based on the operating system you are using.

I actually delete the partition table and recreate it on all my new flash media as in some instances it has improved performance. And some flash devices I have bought (PNY in this case) came with an incorrect partition table from the factory that worked but caused warnings when mounted.
Jun 21, 2011, 05:01 PM
Registered User
jmdlcar's Avatar
I think my lens is glued so what can I use to soften up the glue so I can adj the lens?
Jun 21, 2011, 05:21 PM
Dance the skies...
Tom Frank's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by reptor
I search for Jumbo #11, but didn't find anything to see what it will look like. When it will be released and for what prize? It's worth to wait or buy #11 ?
The Jumbos #11s are available now... see post #2 and vendor web sites. It's no 1080p... just a #11 with bigger battery.

Who knows what their 1080 will be like, or whether it will be worth waiting for. Read my opinion in the post a page or two back on the new #13 1080 camera. Not worth it if it's anything like that one.
Jun 21, 2011, 05:51 PM
Drifting off the reservation..
JumpySticks's Avatar
I ordered 2 of the Jumbos with the 500 ma battery. I will embed into my Radian pro wingtips, one aimed forward and one toward the glider.

I wish they offered these without the redundant charger/accessories at a cheaper price. I would have ordered 3 or 4.

Thanks for the great info pages Mr. Frank!
Jun 21, 2011, 06:12 PM
Dance the skies...
Tom Frank's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by jmdlcar
I think my lens is glued so what can I use to soften up the glue so I can adj the lens?
It's just hot melt adhesive. If there is not a lot of it, you might be able to pick it off with a small screwdriver like I did. But be careful you don't torque the lens housing without supporting it. Also, I had to remove the circuit board to get at the glue on the underside. Cover the circuit components with masking tape when you handle the circuit board... avoid touching any bare wires or solder pads.
Jun 21, 2011, 06:12 PM
AMA Member since 1984
Hey Tom, what's the latest from your "Informant" on the updated F/W.

Would really like to have the "continuous with date/time stamp",
although just having the close and continue would be nice.


Dave
Jun 21, 2011, 06:14 PM
Dance the skies...
Tom Frank's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by JumpySticks
...
I wish they offered these without the redundant charger/accessories at a cheaper price. I would have ordered 3 or 4.
...
Welcome to the crowd! I made this suggestion to them some time ago as well as offering the accessories separately, including spare batteries!
Jun 21, 2011, 06:22 PM
Dance the skies...
Tom Frank's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by RcNutDave
Hey Tom, what's the latest from your "Informant" on the updated F/W.

Would really like to have the "continuous with date/time stamp",
although just having the close and continue would be nice.


Dave
I thought I answered this a couple days ago.. I don't get frequent updates and don't nag them frequently... when the firmware is done, it will be sent to me by either the developer or one of the vendors. I think the 4GB close and continue will be the next, but beyond that we may not get anything more... they haven't made any promises other than to look at other improvements when they have time to do so. Anyone can query their vendor about firmware... maybe hearing from other users will speed things up!
Jun 21, 2011, 06:30 PM
a.d.m.i.n
reptor's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tom Frank
Welcome to the crowd! I made this suggestion to them some time ago as well as offering the accessories separately, including spare batteries!

This is what we all need, who need extra car charger if you will use it on plane... Also you can charge with usb cable, which everyone have it already at home from any other electric stuff. But if you extra need some of this stuff you could buy separately....

I also don't understand these Chinese people
Jun 21, 2011, 06:34 PM
Dance the skies...
Tom Frank's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by xamindar
The SDformatter utility is there for people who don't know anything about computers. It just formats the SD card to the standard filesystem that every device expects to see. If you wanted, you could format an SD card with NTFS or ext3 or any other filesystem you want. You can even create multiple partitions on one if you wanted, it's just another block device like a hard drive. Your only limitations are based on the operating system you are using.

I actually delete the partition table and recreate it on all my new flash media as in some instances it has improved performance. And some flash devices I have bought (PNY in this case) came with an incorrect partition table from the factory that worked but caused warnings when mounted.
I seriously doubt anyone who doesn't know anything about computers would know about the SDformatter or where to find it. Yes, you can format the cards any number of ways, but I stick with the recommendations of the people who created the SD card specifications. This is cut verbatim from their web page (the bolding is theirs):

"The SD Formatter was created specifically for memory cards using the SD/SDHC/SDXC standards. It is strongly recommended to use the SD Formatter instead of formatting utilities provided with operating systems that format various types of storage media. Using generic formatting utilities may result in less than optimal performance for your memory cards."
Jun 21, 2011, 06:42 PM
Dance the skies...
Tom Frank's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by reptor
This is what we all need, who need extra car charger if you will use it on plane... Also you can charge with usb cable, which everyone have it already at home from any other electric stuff. But if you extra need some of this stuff you could buy separately....

I also don't understand these Chinese people
The car charger comes in handy if you need fly at a field and have no laptop for recharging the camera battery. Just about every device I buy that needs USB communication comes with a USB cable... that's why you have so many of them. This camera is no different.

Realistically, omitting the car charger and USB cable is only going to save you a few dollars... not enough to make buying another camera that much less expensive.
Jun 21, 2011, 07:33 PM
Registered User
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tom Frank
I seriously doubt anyone who doesn't know anything about computers would know about the SDformatter or where to find it. Yes, you can format the cards any number of ways, but I stick with the recommendations of the people who created the SD card specifications.
It's nice you agree now. As you stated: "so it may be a requirement of the flash memory... don't know for sure" regarding formatting it as FAT32 so I was attempting to help you out by clarifying that flash media can be formatted as anything you like. The reason for the specification using FAT32 is just so everything is standardized and any device can read/write to any card.

It's nice that you stick with using the SDformatter tool because their website stated it is the best. You are entitled to your opinion. I wasn't saying otherwise, just trying to clarify something you were not sure of.
Jun 21, 2011, 07:55 PM
Drifting off the reservation..
JumpySticks's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tom Frank
The car charger comes in handy if you need fly at a field and have no laptop for recharging the camera battery. Just about every device I buy that needs USB communication comes with a USB cable... that's why you have so many of them. This camera is no different.

Realistically, omitting the car charger and USB cable is only going to save you a few dollars... not enough to make buying another camera that much less expensive.
Maybe I was not clear. I may need the charger that comes with the first cam, but I don't need 6 of them if I buy 6 cams. One or maybe 2 is plenty, the rest just end up with my already huge box of now extinct chargers and cables. It's inefficient and wasteful. I'd rather get $5.00 off the price.

I probably won't use any of them though, since I have a little cigarette lighter usb jack with a 4 way splitter from Radio Shack in the car. Most new cars have usb jacks now.
Jun 21, 2011, 08:19 PM
Registered User
rwingvr6's Avatar
I don't know if this is a first but I just received my #11 today in the mail and it has NO time stamp stock right out of the package. Sweet! I don't have to screw with FW!
Jun 21, 2011, 09:21 PM
Registered User
jims123's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by rwingvr6
I don't know if this is a first but I just received my #11 today in the mail and it has NO time stamp stock right out of the package. Sweet! I don't have to screw with FW!
Yup.. I think it is a 1st.. and you did not ask them to delete it? cool.. there are more of us that aren't "spies" out here than you might think.. perhaps we are gaining some influence. JimS
Jun 21, 2011, 10:22 PM
Registered User
rwingvr6's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by jims123
Yup.. I think it is a 1st.. and you did not ask them to delete it? cool.. there are more of us that aren't "spies" out here than you might think.. perhaps we are gaining some influence. JimS
Nope, I didn't ask them to delete it. I didn't check if the 20 thing is on there but I probably won't shoot more than 20 minutes at a time either.
I got it from this guy. http://cgi.ebay.com/Mini-HD-DV-key-c...item2561584a5a
Jun 21, 2011, 10:28 PM
Dance the skies...
Tom Frank's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by xamindar
It's nice you agree now. As you stated: "so it may be a requirement of the flash memory... don't know for sure" regarding formatting it as FAT32 so I was attempting to help you out by clarifying that flash media can be formatted as anything you like. The reason for the specification using FAT32 is just so everything is standardized and any device can read/write to any card.

It's nice that you stick with using the SDformatter tool because their website stated it is the best. You are entitled to your opinion. I wasn't saying otherwise, just trying to clarify something you were not sure of.
The part I was not sure of, but left out of my post, was whether the SDformatter was a requirement of the flash memory "for optimal performance" as the SD web page says. We found further back in this thread that formatting with Windows OS using different formatting block sizes that the write speed to the card could be changed, dramatically in some cases, like from 7k kbps to 10k kbps... don't know if you were reading this forum then. Then when the newer Release 2 firmware was flashed in, this changed the write speed to the card, too, even though the formatting was the same. So, it is still uncertain to me what "optimal" means, e.g. best read/write speed on average, best file integrity, security, or what?
Jun 21, 2011, 10:39 PM
Dance the skies...
Tom Frank's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by JumpySticks
Maybe I was not clear. I may need the charger that comes with the first cam, but I don't need 6 of them if I buy 6 cams. One or maybe 2 is plenty, the rest just end up with my already huge box of now extinct chargers and cables. It's inefficient and wasteful. I'd rather get $5.00 off the price.

I probably won't use any of them though, since I have a little cigarette lighter usb jack with a 4 way splitter from Radio Shack in the car. Most new cars have usb jacks now.
I understood what you were saying, and I agree. But when you said if you would have bought 3-4 more if you could have gotten them without the accessory cables, it sounded like the amount you thought might be saved could have substantially covered the cost of the cameras, which wouldn't be the case.

If you contact the ebay seller direct via their email, some have said they can give a slight volume discount if they don't have to process the transaction through eBay. Basically this just passes on the fee they would have to give eBay to you as a discount. But you'd still get the cables, I think.
Jun 21, 2011, 11:11 PM
Registered User
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tom Frank
The part I was not sure of, but left out of my post, was whether the SDformatter was a requirement of the flash memory "for optimal performance" as the SD web page says. We found further back in this thread that formatting with Windows OS using different formatting block sizes that the write speed to the card could be changed, dramatically in some cases, like from 7k kbps to 10k kbps... don't know if you were reading this forum then. Then when the newer Release 2 firmware was flashed in, this changed the write speed to the card, too, even though the formatting was the same. So, it is still uncertain to me what "optimal" means, e.g. best read/write speed on average, best file integrity, security, or what?
Are you sure that is the card write speed? I was reading the thread back then and I always took it to mean those numbers were the bit rate of the video which is something entirely different than card write speed. If those posts really were talking about card write speed then you are right. But if it was video bit rate, that would all depend on how the video encoder decided to encode the video before writing it to the card (a decision that seemed to depend on how the card was formatted, not the card's write speed).
Jun 22, 2011, 12:14 AM
Dance the skies...
Tom Frank's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by xamindar
Are you sure that is the card write speed? I was reading the thread back then and I always took it to mean those numbers were the bit rate of the video which is something entirely different than card write speed. If those posts really were talking about card write speed then you are right. But if it was video bit rate, that would all depend on how the video encoder decided to encode the video before writing it to the card (a decision that seemed to depend on how the card was formatted, not the card's write speed).
Bad use of terms on my part... write speed TO the card (i.e. total average data rate output by the camera and written to the card), not write speed OF the card (e.g. as measured by CrystalDiskmark, etc.). Write speed of the card is obviously faster than the data rate being written to it since no dropped frames. But the formatting of the card affected the data rate the camera put out, which was the interesting part. And since the SD cards have the ability to store key data about it's characteristics that can be read by the host device, this was the only credible explanation for why that would occur.
Jun 22, 2011, 01:09 AM
Registered User
Anybody knows where is posible to get CMOS sensor (C971P) separetally for this camera?
Jun 22, 2011, 03:44 AM
Registered User
I just made a floating camera mount for my #11 cam out of light ply.
Jun 22, 2011, 04:13 AM
RC Crazy
billhally's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by billhally
Hi all

Been lurking for a while reading posts and finally took the plunge and ordered my #11 cam from power-gps as advised at page 1.

I already downloaded the no time stamp firmware as I would like this removed is it OK to use this firmware irrespective of the version of camera I receive from him as long as its defo a #11 ?

Also have an 8gb card already in my #3 camera that works good in there so ran the speed test and attached here is the result. Will this be sufficient for the #11 camera or will I need to purchase another?

TIA Bill
Anyone?
Jun 22, 2011, 04:15 AM
Registered User
Why such a mount? Do your video's vibrate to much?

I use my camera's on my velomobile (recumbent tricycle with fairing). My camera's are placed directly on the fairing (okay, I made a pad with 2 magnets which sticks to the fairing and the camera sits on the pad with velcro). I expected a lot of vibrations because of the road surface but non of that.

(there is movement from side to side because of me using my legs to pedal but you need a very large mount to get that movement out of the movie)

Trillingstest magneetbevestiging (1 min 55 sec)


Some pictures can be found here:
http://velomobielfan.blogspot.com/20...-monteren.html
Jun 22, 2011, 04:19 AM
Registered User
Quote:
Originally Posted by wfvn
Why such a mount? Do your video's vibrate to much?
Have you tried taking videos with the #11 cam on a multi-rotor helicopter?
Jun 22, 2011, 04:39 AM
Fidler & twidler
empeabee's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by rwingvr6
Nope, I didn't ask them to delete it. I didn't check if the 20 thing is on there but I probably won't shoot more than 20 minutes at a time either.
I got it from this guy. http://cgi.ebay.com/Mini-HD-DV-key-c...item2561584a5a
if you scroll down that link, it says it has the "latest" timeoff 20min close&continue s/w
Mike
Jun 22, 2011, 05:45 AM
Registered User
Quote:
Originally Posted by FlyingMcCoy
Have you tried taking videos with the #11 cam on a multi-rotor helicopter?
Nope...... But that's a lot worse I guess?

I'm curious about the difference with and without your mount.
Jun 22, 2011, 06:10 AM
Don't Call Me Shirley
Tucknut's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by rwingvr6
I ordered one from the same guy. I added a note asking him to remove the time/date stamp. He replied that he would do so and check it before shipping.
Jun 22, 2011, 06:13 AM
a.d.m.i.n
reptor's Avatar
I think that he already update all his camera's:

Quote:
The latest updated file can do :


1 It removes the time and date


2 When the battery dies, the current recording is now saved, rather than lost.


3 Rather than creating a new file every 20 mins, it now creates a new one every 4GB.


4 The video files created can be edited as normal - no transcoding required.
Jun 22, 2011, 08:23 AM
Registered User
jims123's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by wfvn
.

I use my camera's on my velomobile (recumbent tricycle with fairing). M.
http://velomobielfan.blogspot.com/20...-monteren.html
wfvn,
nice movie.. very stable.. what intrigued me most and I'd like to ask about is the USB cable .. normally if its a standard miniUSB cable as this white one looks to be .. I did not think you could record at the same time you charge the cam.. was this white cable modified to be a special Pin 4 type at the camera end?

But the other odd thing is the audio beeps.. generally you should not be getting these beeps unless disconnected and the internal cam battery is low.. .. or I suppose .. unless the cam is connected to a special Pin 4 cable and the external 5.0 battery is low.. Was the external battery low if this cable was connected?? Just curious.. Nice looking Bike .. have you got a photo of the entire Bike?
Jun 22, 2011, 09:58 AM
Registered User
Quote:
Originally Posted by jims123
wfvn,
nice movie.. very stable.. what intrigued me most and I'd like to ask about is the USB cable .. normally if its a standard miniUSB cable as this white one looks to be .. I did not think you could record at the same time you charge the cam.. was this white cable modified to be a special Pin 4 type at the camera end?
The white cable isn't working properly. I used a diode to lower the voltage by 0,7V. But that isn't a good idea. Just connect the red +5V cable directly to pin 4 and it DOES work. Don't connect the two data cables so just the black (0V) to pin 5 and red (+5V) to pin 4. I have one cable without diode, this one does work, zo record AND power the camera at the same time. Unfortunately I don't have much use for it right now because the current firmware (V2) does not support continuous recording at 4GB files. But one of my camera's has a bad battery, it only works about 12 minutes. But when connected to the special cable, it can record up to 4 GB at a time.
Quote:
But the other odd thing is the audio beeps.. generally you should not be getting these beeps unless disconnected and the internal cam battery is low..
See above. Problem solved with diode removed.
I ordered new miniUSB connectors so I can make all cables suitable for powering while recording.

Another cable (which also works) is a normal USB which has the miniUSB cut off. I connected it to the original car adaptor cable (also cut off of the car adaptor).

Quote:
Just curious.. Nice looking Bike .. have you got a photo of the entire Bike?
apparently I can't place images from my weblog (I just get a icon, not even a thumbnail) so a link to my weblog with the first pictures of the finished bike:

http://velomobielfan.blogspot.com/20...hem-quemo.html

[edit]
I see I missed a thing or 2:

1) a pic of my bike is also in the link you mention in the quote.
2) the white cable on the picture is a completely standard USB cable (which doesn't power while recording as you know). Later on I cut off the mini USB connector and connected a new connector to the cable, using pin 4 and 5 AND a diode between the red +5V cable and pin 4. Now I have the same cable, same pins in use (4 and 5) but no diode. The last cable does work.
Last edited by wfvn; Jun 22, 2011 at 10:37 AM.
Jun 22, 2011, 10:01 AM
Dance the skies...
Tom Frank's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by billhally
Anyone?
Yes, and Yes!
Jun 22, 2011, 03:23 PM
AMA Member since 1984
Some of you guys might want to take a look at this.
Uses 18650 LION batterys.
I ordered one for myself just cause I have dozens and dozens of the 18650's pulled from laptop battery packs.

I've found that on most dead packs that there is usualy only 1 battery
that is dead, the rest are OK.

4 2600ma 18650's=10400mah.

http://cgi.ebay.com/280676551414?ru=...fvi%3D1&_rdc=1
Jun 22, 2011, 03:51 PM
Registered User
That's a really cool pack RcNutDave. Wish I would have found that months ago. That should power the camera all day lol.
Jun 22, 2011, 04:55 PM
Curiouser and curiouser
Kokopeli's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by RcNutDave
Some of you guys might want to take a look at this.
Uses 18650 LION batterys.
I ordered one for myself just cause I have dozens and dozens of the 18650's pulled from laptop battery packs.

I've found that on most dead packs that there is usualy only 1 battery
that is dead, the rest are OK.

4 2600ma 18650's=10400mah.

http://cgi.ebay.com/280676551414?ru=...fvi%3D1&_rdc=1
From the picture, it appears that the cells are wired in series.
So, that would only be 2600 mah, wouldn't it?
I think that only the voltage would be multiplied by four, not the mah.
I guess you could rewire it to make it parallel to get the higher capacity, but then the voltage would be X 1. Is that high enough?
If you went to the bother to rewire it, it might be easier to just make your own box out of scrap, eh?

Walt


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