6S 2200mah motor/fan tests as a substitute to 4S 3700-4000mah. - Page 2 - RC Groups
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Apr 16, 2012, 05:12 PM
AKA Terry Till
ex-racr's Avatar
I understand Erik. I try to get the highest system efficiency I can.
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Apr 16, 2012, 05:37 PM
3DHOG
jcdfrd's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by ex-racr
I got this a few days ago and ran it up.
Details of the fan are here:
https://www.rcgroups.com/forums/show....php?t=1359237
The set up: 6S 2200 50C with Mega 16/25/2E (kv-2300, Rm .015)

Amps: 35
Watts: 760
Thrust: 48 ounces
Grams/Watt: 1.79
I suspect the mediocre G/W reading is because the ESC was losing sync with the motor at full throttle a little.
Never the less, it's in the same ball park as others.
One important thing to note is that the motor used has a higher kv than the ARC 28-47-2 used for most testing.
For my goals, this is a perfect match of motor and EDF unit, as my goal is to get about mid 30 amps static, without a thrust tube. That way I get 900-1000 watts installed.

Terry
well we just tested a mega 16/40/1.5rc motor in our TJ70 fan with the cs 10blade on 6s 4500 35c
and here is the result.......rock solid performance
Mega Snake (3 min 58 sec)
Apr 16, 2012, 06:08 PM
AKA Terry Till
ex-racr's Avatar
JC,
I've been following the CS 10 70mm thread. That's definitely a nice set up.
By the way my test was with the 4-bladed rotor; not the 10 bladed one
For those interested, I just ran up a couple installed set ups:

70mm Composite F-16
6S 2200
Cyclone 60amp ESC*
HET 2W-30 (2200KV)
RC Lander rotor in Change Sun Shroud.
Settled readings:
Volts: 21.9
Amps: 36.5
Watts:800

HET F-86
6S 2200 (same as above)
Castle Phoenix 80* with Hyperion cool SBEC
Mega 16/25/2E (2300KV)
RC Lander rotor in Change Sun Housing
Settled readings:
Volts: 21.42 (used same packs above and didn't "top off")
Amps: 42
Watts: 900

* I don't remember what timing the ESC's were on. These also include thrust tubes with an exit diameter of about 57mm.
-Though I didn't use Mini Fans, I think it's a pretty good comparison to a mini-fan, as the RC Lander rotors are similar.
Last edited by ex-racr; Apr 16, 2012 at 06:16 PM.
Oct 04, 2017, 08:57 PM
AKA Terry Till
ex-racr's Avatar

More 6S tests


I've posted these results in some other threads so I figured I would consolidate my results.

ADDITIONAL 6S TESTS

Battery: (2) Roaring Top 6S 2700 man 35C (used alternately for testing)
ESC: Castle Phoenix 80 with Hyperion “Cool” 5A BEC
Motor: Cyclone power 2200kv 4 pole motor (weight ca. 180 g.; length ca. 60mm)
A thrust tube (470mm long from back of housing tapering to ca. 57mm outlet- worst case scenario) was used and then the fan/rotors were tested without the tube (open exhaust).

First runs (with thrust tube) were with fully charged battery. Open exhaust runs were done with same battery, slightly depleted.

For comparison the Cyclone motor was used throughout, while mounted in a FreeWing 8 stator housing. It just made things easier than re-mounting the motor every time.

Bear in mind, grams/watt is a measurement of system efficiency; not just fan efficiency. But, if you use the same motor/controller/batteries, the edf units are directly comparable.
The other comparison is g/watt efficiency based on watts into the system. The controller and batteries were always the same, but the motors and fans were different, so the system efficiencies can be compared by how much thrust is produced at a similar watt input.


I have videos of each test run, on my computer.

RESULTS (Settled Numbers) AMPS WATTS THRUST
RCLander 10 blade rotor (with thrust tube) 65.4 1445 1710*
g/watt=1.18
RCLander 10 blade rotor (w/o thrust tube) 65 1401 1934*
g/watt=1.38
* I didn’t use a spinner for the RCL rotor as I couldn’t get rid of the vibrations and I wasn’t going to spend all day balancing it for a quick test.
The spinner probably gives an additional 3%, so you could add it in if you want and re-calculate grams/watt.


FMS 8 blade rotor (w/ thrust tube) 70.8 1532 1948
g/watt=1.27
FMS 8 blade rotor (w/o thrust tube) 68.1 1474 2133
g/watt=1.45
FreeWing 12 blade EDF (w/ thrust tube) 66.4 1447 1817
g/watt=1.26
FreeWing 12 blade EDF (w/o thrust tube) 64.5 1401 1944
g/watt=1.39

FMS 70mm 12 BLADE EDF (V. 1) Using FMS Predator 1850kV:
Using the thrust tube: 61.3 1438 1850
At 18s in to the run: Volts: 23.3
Grams/watt: 1.287

Without the thrust tube: 61.3 1425 2030
At 19s in to the run: Volts: 23.1
Grams/watt: 1.424

Temp of motor after full throttle run up (no thrust tube) 60C (140F)
Temp of motor after 30s cool down (no thrust tube) 40C (104F)


Using Medusa Research 28-56-1900kV: Amps Watts Thrust
CS 12bl. EDF with tube g/watt=1.338 56.5 1271 1700
Change Sun 12bl. g/watt=1.588 52.1 1133 1799
(W/O tube)

With FMS 8 Bl. rotor g/watt=1.686 47.1 1058 1784
(no tube)

Using FMS Predator 1850kV:
With FMS 8 Bl. rotor g/watt=1.633 50.3 1095 1788
(no tube)
For a thrust tube result, you can calculate the %loss from the 2200kv test above.

Change Sun 12bl. EDF 53 (values about the same as Medusa)

The FMS 8bl. rotor has a loud howl. I needed ear protection.

Using different fans and motor combos I have:

HET 2W-30 with Wemo EVO (W/ thrust tube) 49.3 1129 1640
g/watt=1.45
(W/O thrust tube) 45.9 1028 1694
g/watt=1.648

HET 2W-30 with E-Flite 5 blade rotor in
Change Sun 7 stator housing (w/ thrust tube) 45.3 1014 1527
g/watt=1.51
(without thrust tube) 40.6 913 1636
g/watt=1.79

Nue 1112-1.5y (2250 kv) with HET 6904
(with thrust tube) 52 1145 1788
g/watt=1.56
(without thrust tube) 49.2 1079 1824
g/watt=1.69

Nue 1112-2y (2250 kv) with Wemo pro 5 blade rotor clone in HET 6904 housing
(with thrust tube) 43.8 991 1485
g/watt=1.50
(without thrust tube) 41.8 933 1550
g/watt=1.66
(Not that good a housing/rotor combination)

MEGA 16/25/2E (2300 kv) with RCLander
5 blade rotor (WEMO clone)(with thrust tube) 45.1 1020 1453
g/watt=1.42
(w/o thrust tube) 43 990 1530
g/watt=1.545

Cyclone power 2200kv motor with
FreeWing 6 bladed rotor (with thrust tube) 52.2 1155 1650
g/watt=1.43
(without thrust tube) 50.0 1114 1811
g/watt=1.63

Medusa 1925kv with MBS 10 blade rotor in 41.1 926 1560
8 stator housing (no rotor; no thrust tube; no spinner) g/watt=1.68

The thrust figures, as well as the amp readings jumped up and down a little. The measurements are an approximation.
Also, as the battery was partially depleted, the open exhaust runs would be a little higher- if I used a fully charged battery.

If anyone would like to add their results, please do so, especially if they have a similar set-up.
I'm curious to see if me limiting the 2200kv Cyclone motor tests to just the Freewing housing had any negative effect over using the correct housing with the correct rotor.
Last edited by ex-racr; Oct 05, 2017 at 05:49 PM. Reason: Had to add disclaimer about g/watt comparison
Oct 05, 2017, 01:04 AM
Battery Puffer
ex-racr

I would like to see your test done with a a better battery. I will give you a break on price if your interested. https://www.dinogylipos.com/

Mark
Oct 05, 2017, 11:52 AM
Big gov never Works
St. Martin's Avatar
Hi Terry, good info, thanks bunch! I have learned a long time ago, that high "C" packs are not needed in a high volt low amp system. Something the new people have not learned in the use of Lipo's.

Thank you my friend

Fuzz
Oct 05, 2017, 06:14 PM
AKA Terry Till
ex-racr's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by St. Martin
Hi Terry, good info, thanks bunch! I have learned a long time ago, that high "C" packs are not needed in a high volt low amp system. Something the new people have not learned in the use of Lipo's.

Thank you my friend

Fuzz
Quote:
Originally Posted by MarkF
ex-racr

I would like to see your test done with a a better battery. I will give you a break on price if your interested. https://www.dinogylipos.com/

Mark
Mark, thank you for your kind offer. It so happens I just bought 3 new 6S 3500mah batteries that a fellow RCGer recommended. Also, it's nearing the end of my flying season. After Columbus day, there's no longer many good flying days.
When it comes to batteries, I try to find the lightest batteries for a given capacity. I also use a "C" rating of 30 or higher. "C" ratings are BS; it's resistance values that count- but you know this
I also make sure the max draw on my batteries are 20C, and I usually fly at about 50% throttle, so the batteries aren't being stressed at all.
I've included a couple pics. one of the new battery and one of the Roaring Top 6S 2700.
I may not be able to fly the new batteries for a while since it's raining this weekend and I need to change the connectors before I can use them.

Steve,
You're welcome! I started all this testing for a friend, to help him evalute and compare his EDF to all the others that I had lying around. But, you knew that
As I said above, resistance is what counts; not "C" rating. I try to make things as efficient as I can- even with foamies, to get the most performance out of them and the most flight time. Pairing the right motor with the correct fan; meticulous balancing (oh the hours I've spent...); streamlining things as best I can; etc.
See here, if you're (or anyone is) curious:
https://www.rcgroups.com/forums/show...&postcount=160

The results are here for all to see, and as I added above, anyone is welcome to post results of what they are using. All anyone needs to do is make a simple U-shaped vertical stand, mount a fan to it, place it on a scale, and record the results.

Terry
Last edited by ex-racr; Oct 05, 2017 at 06:22 PM. Reason: Forgot to add pics.
Oct 06, 2017, 02:27 AM
Big gov never Works
St. Martin's Avatar
I hope soon, that our friend will allow us to expose his fan. I flew the Cougar again, thurs afternoon. The man knows what he is doing. I have learned very much from all of you.

Fuzz


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