Yet Another Tomboy - third rebuild - Page 11 - RC Groups
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Jan 14, 2012, 02:19 AM
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Teals1's Avatar
That's brilliant Owl. Leaves you with a very satisfying feeling after a long flight against the elements doesn't it. Hoping to get in a few flights with my Tomboy in the next month or two while summer is here. Having said that, summer seems a bit slow coming this year in this part of the world.
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Jan 14, 2012, 03:17 AM
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owlsabie's Avatar
I really enjoy my Tomboy, probably becasue I struggled with it so much? I'm hoping to take it to a vintage fly in soon, but any purists there might pull there hair out when they see it (so I'll take the Live Wire as well)

This aircraft has been an interesting journey for me. Planes that fly well from the begining are obviously what we all strive for, but with this one I've learned a lot about balance/trimming/power and props and that transparent yellow oralite is invisible is some lights.

It still surprises me that it equally challenging to get good duration out of an old timer (and I guess gliders) as it is to other types of flying. The only difference being you are not as likely to crash

For interest sake - I'm currently running an 8x5 prop on a AXI 2208/34 with 1300mah 3 cell pack. I've yet to put back more than 300 mah into the battery with this set up, but it is a little to powerfull for the airframe.
Jan 14, 2012, 04:41 AM
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Teals1's Avatar
Yes, most definitely worth working with balance, props, etc to get the best performance. Interesting that you make the comparison with gliders. I built a 2m Prophet glider that was supposed to be a great performer but I just could not get a half decent flight out of it. Another modelling mate who built it found the same. It had a thin aerofoil section and I think needed speed (ballast) to actually perform well. Aerofoil sections are not really talked about with vintage to any great degree but they do make a difference. Of course, if building for competition purposes we are locked in to the designers choice in that regard.

I had a wing fold on my Tomboy, built a new one to the same specifications with the exception of strengthening the spar. To date, I haven't been able to same the same performance as before - there must be some small difference that I am unable to put my finger on. These are the challenges that make life interesting. As you say, getting the best performance out of a vintage model is just as challenging as any other discipline. But I do like the "not as likely to crash" bit.

Electrics is not something I am familiar with. However, as I've mentioned in another post, I try to fly with as low a pitch prop as possible. This takes a little 'trial and error' but the aim is pulling power not speed. This has to be balanced against engine revs to get as long a run time as possible although I am speaking of fuel engines and don't know the outcome with electric. I've just bought a 7x3 and 8x3 to experiment with. Kind regards, Allen
Jan 14, 2012, 05:12 AM
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owlsabie's Avatar
Allen - I am afraid my knowledge of props is minimal! What I have realised is that different brands make a huge difference. The one on the Tomboy at present was an emergency buy as I had broken a prop, and didn't want to go to all the trouble on mail ordering one. Normally I try and use only APC props - this one compared to an APC is very very noisy (although it is balanced) and definately doesn't work as well. Yet the numbers are the same

The important thing is that it works
Jan 14, 2012, 10:10 AM
Use your imagination....
czirh's Avatar
Hi Owl,
Tomboy very beautiful...

Jan 14, 2012, 10:58 AM
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owlsabie's Avatar
Thanks Cem
Feb 01, 2012, 01:24 PM
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owlsabie's Avatar

A wise man learns from the mistakes of others . . .

It is said that a fool learns from his own mistakes, but a wise man learns from the mistakes of others - but this is bizarre

Quite a while ago I posted here that my Tomboy needed a huge amount of up trim when flown at the club field (which is at a significantly lower altitude), and several possibilities were raised why this may be - most likely being that the pushrods had lengthened a touch (its also a lot hotter there) - which makes the most sense to me too.

But, rather than just being happy to fly the plane locally in the park, I just had to take it to the club field again recently (see - I don't learn from my own mistakes) !!!

This time I couldn't get enough down trim on the plane - eventually with full down trim it was OK on about 1/3 throttle, but if I cut the throttle to glide and land, it nosed up, slowed down and stalled viciously. Anyway, eventually I managed a series of swoops with full down elevator which terminated with a nasty stall/droped wing and a wheel removed (and injured pride)

After not checking the u/c mount I then drove her into a wall and broke the motor mount last week

Today, with everything sorted, I tried her at home with a bit more nose weight and the elevator exactly neutral, and she flew just fine. It actually flew great seeing as there was a strong breeze, and I could still do figure eights, hover into the breeze, play with the lift over the trees etc. I added the weight because I figured maybe the balance was a little critical and I should try for more conservative. The only problem was that on landing the prop go caught up in the longish grass and popped the motor off again.

So - I've learned my lesson The Tomboy is strictly for flying after work and in the very early morning here in Sabie

The "why" remains bit of a mystery to me, but then life without mystery would be no fun

Mar 15, 2012, 12:35 PM
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owlsabie's Avatar

Sometimes its all a little special . . .

Obviously we all enjoy building, and ultimately flying our models, but some days are just a little special

After work this afternoon it was warm and really humid, with the smoke from chimneys going almost straight up. What can you do? Its old timer weather

So - off I went with my Tomboy. After a couple of clicks of trim she was cruising nicely when the wings started to wobble. I know that sign - it means a stall is imminent on my plane, but I was wrong! I flew into a really stunning thermal

After messing around until my neck was starting creak, and my eyes were geting a bit strained, I eventually dialled in some down trim to get her out of the thermal. Just endless smooth air all going up at once. I even managed to avoid my favourite shed when landing

Mostly I enjoy flying, but this afternoon was probably the most relaxing few mintues I've had in a couple of weeks. I might stop grinning tomorrow

Mar 15, 2012, 12:50 PM
I like real wooden aeroplanes!
Sundancer's Avatar
Great stuff Owl. Seems like we have had the same weather today - see the Witch thread! I'm feeling good too, just hopping (literally) up to the field for another flight before it gets dark.
Mar 15, 2012, 06:44 PM
Visitor from Reality
Have often idly thought that the main reason for adding RC to a vintage model is to save having to chase several fields' worth of down-wind to retrieve one's model!

These models were meant to be be trimmed out to fly at a constant speed and in a constant turn. The best use of the radio thus has to be a close finish between saving the model from those awkward moments when a FF model went somewhat beserk, swooping and zooming around the field while the builder watched in horror and keeping the model circling gently over the same field it took off from, rather than having to follow it downwind as it circled gently, but with a directional aspect!

Owl also demonstrated above that RC gear makes a great 'dethermaliser', with a variable timing setting to boot

Okay, will admit to wringing out both my FAC Sportster and Frog Raven 2X models - but only when folk weren't watching and mostly because the plans were going to be published and I wanted to fully explore the models' flight envelopes rather than leave it to builders who'd bought my plans...

Back on Tomboys! Anyone flown an RC version off and back onto water? I've seen the floats on the plan, but assumed they were only for a watery take off - a FF Tomboy would, naturally, land in another field and not make it back to the lake it started from, whereas an RC version could easily land back on the water - plus the best part of water based flying is shooting 'splash and go' until the juice runs out!


Mar 16, 2012, 06:00 AM
Sticks, Tissue & old Diesels
brokenenglish's Avatar
Originally Posted by Dereck
Back on Tomboys! Anyone flown an RC version off and back onto water? I've seen the floats on the plan, but assumed they were only for a watery take off - a FF Tomboy would, naturally, land in another field and not make it back to the lake it started from, whereas an RC version could easily land back on the water - plus the best part of water based flying is shooting 'splash and go' until the juice runs out!
OK, its not RC, but I think its worth mentioning that Vic flew his original from the sea at Herne Bay. It landed back on the sea as well, but sometimes tipped over and needed drying out (good thing there was no RC gear - and he used cellulose balsa cement!). When you consider Vics exploits, not to mention those of Dr. Forster and Claude Bowden, I often think were all getting a bit soft and overcautious...
Also, AM staff tested Vics model, close to the office, and it was said to take off in half the width of the Grand Union Canal , which has always made me think that the width of the Grand Union Canal at Watford should obviously be adopted as a universal distance reference, a bit like the official metre in a national laboratory...
Mar 16, 2012, 06:39 AM
I like real wooden aeroplanes!
Sundancer's Avatar
Well, despite my electric Tomboy being equipped with interchangeable wheels and floats, and there being lots of lakes around here, I have yet to pluck up the courage to fly it off water. It flies perfectly well with it's water boots on, no different from the trim with the wheels, and as I deliberately over powered it with a 140 watt out runner there is plenty of poke. Actually I have no real qualms about the take off part of the flight, but I'm sure that unless the landing is pretty much perfect it probably will trip over on it's nose, which would mean sudden death for the ESC at least as water would enter through the cooling air scoop. I think it will have to be more or less stalled onto the water in a three point attitude to avoid this, something which, judging by the results of trying it on the field, I can probably achieve four times out of five - but guess which one of the five my first water landing attempt will probably be!

However, when the water in the lakes has warmed up a bit, in case I have to swim for it, I WILL try it this year, I promise.
Mar 16, 2012, 07:03 AM
Registered User
I have a freeflight APS Miranda seaplane, that ROW well, but when landing back on the water it just stops dead as it hits it.

Not sure what Tomboy will do???????
Mar 16, 2012, 10:46 AM
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owlsabie's Avatar
Just speculating - but with the Tomboy's relatively aft balance, and the fairly far forward floats, I think it will settle OK, but it may be best to try on a day with a decent breeze so she lands really slowly?
Apr 01, 2012, 09:26 AM
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owlsabie's Avatar

Where did my wheel go?

After yesterday's maiden, I decided I needed some relaxing flying. The weather is cool, but calm with very low cloud - good Tomboy weather. After doing an in-flight video with my stick, I decided to chill with the Tomboy. Just at the end of the "runway" she swerved viciously left - I corrected right and up she went after a couple of nasty wobbles. To my horror I saw that one of the wheels had come off

Anyway - I can report that a Tomboy flies just fine with one wheel, although landing requires some planning . . .

No harm done, and I even found the wheel

I've added the video although its not from the Tomboy to give an idea of where I fly my smaller planes. Unfortunately the mountains aren't visible, and the camera wasn't charged so it ends before I get very high . ..

Inflight video (1 min 36 sec)

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