Thread Tools
Oct 01, 2013, 11:30 PM
Scout CX | mCX2 | mSR | 120SR
North_of_49's Avatar
On an ultra micro plane or heli I'm talking about these, which can easily be placed inline in the battery lead... a battery lead, like the Parkzone one, that is sold as a replacement part and is, in fact, intended to be replaced by the user...
Name: pico_fuse.gif
Views: 27
Size: 4.0 KB
Description:
I'd much rather replace a 3 or 4 dollar component (Horizon charges $2 for the PKZ3052) than a $60 brick.



Anything larger than a UM, like the several park flyers I own, and fuse type, cost and real estate are not even a concern. We add UBECs, servo rate adjusters, battery adapters, LED controllers etc. that are 10's of times the size, weight and cost of a little 10, 20, 30, 40amp fuse. Like those components, they could be sold as a plug-in accessory and not necessarily be designed into the stock electronics. I don't understand why this doesn't exist in aftermarket? Maybe it does? If, not, maybe I need to start a side business

Even better would be a reset-able or even a thermal auto-resetting breaker (which could actually be onboard an ESC since it doesn't ever need to be replaced).
Sign up now
to remove ads between posts
Oct 02, 2013, 07:45 AM
Registered User
I'm not sure what kind of situation would cause you to overstress the esc/,rx on the Champ. Maybe if someone over propped or used too big of a motor?
Oct 02, 2013, 09:45 AM
Custom User Name Title
bhoov128's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by jwp2 View Post
I'm not sure what kind of situation would cause you to overstress the esc/,rx on the Champ. Maybe if someone over propped or used too big of a motor?
My PKZ P-51 motor is pushing it. I think one of the main problems is you're basically talking about OCP which some of the bricks already have; and if you're blowing a fuse because your motor pulled too much amperage you will lose all control of the plane. On the other hand, for instance with my Beast 3D, if I prop it up too high or run it on 3S without heatsinks on the FETs and VR, then the over-current protection can kick in, it'll kill the motor, but the servos still respond. Over temp protection results in a full lockout, and a crash.

Ben
Oct 02, 2013, 11:26 AM
Registered User
Hi all

I have just brought my 1st RC plane and I went fot the HBZ Champ.
What a wicked little plane. I have come from FP and CP Heli (Of which i am still learning how to fly my CP heli) I am really impressed as to how easy it is to fly and it give you very little if no stress at all. 1st time out I got a few loops out of it and a stall turn which was nice.
Just cant stop smiling when I take it out lol.

Red
Oct 02, 2013, 03:46 PM
Registered User
Quote:
Originally Posted by bhoov128 View Post
My PKZ P-51 motor is pushing it. I think one of the main problems is you're basically talking about OCP which some of the bricks already have; and if you're blowing a fuse because your motor pulled too much amperage you will lose all control of the plane. On the other hand, for instance with my Beast 3D, if I prop it up too high or run it on 3S without heatsinks on the FETs and VR, then the over-current protection can kick in, it'll kill the motor, but the servos still respond. Over temp protection results in a full lockout, and a crash.

Ben
Thanks for clearing that up for me. It makes sense.So we need a brick that can react the same way to ocp as it does lvc.
Oct 02, 2013, 03:49 PM
Registered User
Quote:
Originally Posted by Red12 View Post
Hi all

I have just brought my 1st RC plane and I went fot the HBZ Champ.
What a wicked little plane. I have come from FP and CP Heli (Of which i am still learning how to fly my CP heli) I am really impressed as to how easy it is to fly and it give you very little if no stress at all. 1st time out I got a few loops out of it and a stall turn which was nice.
Just cant stop smiling when I take it out lol.

Red
Welcome to the HZChamp forum. This is a wonderful little plane with a huge following. This is an awesome forum with Some very smart, good hearted people here.
Oct 02, 2013, 04:40 PM
Scout CX | mCX2 | mSR | 120SR
North_of_49's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by jwp2 View Post
I'm not sure what kind of situation would cause you to overstress the esc/,rx on the Champ. Maybe if someone over propped or used too big of a motor?
Not getting off the throttle quick enough when the prop (or heli rotor) gets jammed in a nose-over/crash etc. will shoot the motor's current draw up to what's called its stall current... that kind of thing will let the magic smoke out of your ESC pretty quick if the motor doesn't fry first. This is probably the most common cause of blown FETs in ESCs/bricks.

ESC's and motors sometimes get dunked flying off floats, sometimes before you have a chance to get off the throttle quick enough (short).

Like Ben said, over-propping... but hopefully you've bench tested to avoid that if you're playing around with props.


etc.
Oct 02, 2013, 04:56 PM
Scout CX | mCX2 | mSR | 120SR
North_of_49's Avatar
Ben, I forgot your CC has OCP. That would be one of the things I was talking about , so I guess it does exist. How does it work?
Oct 02, 2013, 04:59 PM
Elfi Flyer
Doug Sipprell's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by Red12 View Post
Hi all

I have just brought my 1st RC plane and I went fot the HBZ Champ.
What a wicked little plane. I am really impressed as to how easy it is to fly and it give you very little if no stress at all. Just cant stop smiling when I take it out lol.

Red
Arguably, one of the most successful, "right out of the box" micros out there, and IMHO, one of the best "starter" micros for those new to the venue. Reasons for it's success? Take your pick:

- Easy to see in the air
- Will fly in light to moderate winds
- Stronger motor than the comparison UM J-3 cub, with stronger prop shaft
- Good availability of spare parts
- Can be flown in large indoor facilities
- and, BIG advantage, DSM2/DSMX compatible. Amazing for a non-ParkZone product.

One major caution: Be VERY careful when working with micros! They can be VERY addictive. You will find that, like good potato chips, you can't have just one!! Don't ask how I know!

RD
Oct 02, 2013, 05:13 PM
Registered User
Quote:
Originally Posted by North_of_49 View Post
Not getting off the throttle quick enough when the prop (or heli rotor) gets jammed in a nose-over/crash etc. will shoot the motor's current draw up to what's called its stall current... that kind of thing will let the magic smoke out of your ESC pretty quick if the motor doesn't fry first. This is probably the most common cause of blown FETs in ESCs/bricks.

ESC's and motors sometimes get dunked flying off floats, sometimes before you have a chance to get off the throttle quick enough (short).

Like Ben said, over-propping... but hopefully you've bench tested to avoid that if you're playing around with props.


etc.
Thanks North, I forgot about a nose-over while forgetting to kill the throttle. That would make the magic smoke come out for sure. I fuse would be a good idea!
Oct 02, 2013, 05:38 PM
Scout CX | mCX2 | mSR | 120SR
North_of_49's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by jwp2
Thanks North, I forgot about a nose-over while forgetting to kill the throttle. That would make the magic smoke come out for sure. I fuse would be a good idea!
I bought packs of pico fuses off ebay at amperages suitable for my LED systems... I should have grabbed some at suitable amperage for the Champ electronics... not sure what that would be though... in other words, at what amp draw a Champ's motor and/or FETs fry. Hmmm
Oct 02, 2013, 08:12 PM
Custom User Name Title
bhoov128's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by North_of_49
Ben, I forgot your CC has OCP. That would be one of the things I was talking about , so I guess it does exist. How does it work?
I have no idea how it works electrically but it detects if the motor is pulling more than approx. 6A on the UMX brick and it deactivates the throttle channel. Pulling your stick on the tx to 0 resets it and it will rearm usually within a second or two, allowing you to glide ok unless you're hovering your Beast3d.

Quote:
Originally Posted by North_of_49
I bought packs of pico fuses off ebay at amperages suitable for my LED systems... I should have grabbed some at suitable amperage for the Champ electronics... not sure what that would be though... in other words, at what amp draw a Champ's motor and/or FETs fry. Hmmm
I dunno what amp draw they'll fry at but a Champ motor nominally pulls around max 0.8A. I am running two of them in parallel on an AR6400 brick with a 2A ESC for a scratchbuild contest I'm doing and it hasn't had any problems yet, even with full throttle fresh battery thrust testing.
Oct 02, 2013, 09:17 PM
Scout CX | mCX2 | mSR | 120SR
North_of_49's Avatar
Good info, Ben. Thanks.
Oct 02, 2013, 10:00 PM
Custom User Name Title
bhoov128's Avatar
By the way, it looks as if the two Champ motors on an AR6400 1S setup, with the UM Mossie props, will put out around 50g of thrust. Not too shabby.
Oct 03, 2013, 03:04 PM
Registered User
Quote:
Originally Posted by Doug Sipprell
Arguably, one of the most successful, "right out of the box" micros out there, and IMHO, one of the best "starter" micros for those new to the venue. Reasons for it's success? Take your pick:

- Easy to see in the air
- Will fly in light to moderate winds
- Stronger motor than the comparison UM J-3 cub, with stronger prop shaft
- Good availability of spare parts
- Can be flown in large indoor facilities
- and, BIG advantage, DSM2/DSMX compatible. Amazing for a non-ParkZone product.

One major caution: Be VERY careful when working with micros! They can be VERY addictive. You will find that, like good potato chips, you can't have just one!! Don't ask how I know!

RD
Ah... mate you got some toys there bud +1 for you my friend. lol
I would like to get out flying agian soon (mini cp & Champ) but the weather hear has turned crap, oh well what can you do.

Red
Oct 03, 2013, 03:16 PM
Registered User
rccraze's Avatar

Champ with OCP Issues


I have had about 70-80 flights on my Champ. It has been flying great with everything original. In the first few flights while learning, I did crash few times. But glued the wing back. But I have not crashed for last 50+ flights.

But lately, many times my champ won't start with new freshly charged batteries! Motor starts and quits right away. After 10-15 attempts, it starts. Sometimes, different battery does not have the issue. I am using eflite and nanotech batteries. Has anyone else seen this issue? Is my receiver going bad? How do I find if this is OCP or LVC issues? Is it possible to drop the voltage at the start below LVC cutoff and then it recovers back? I have checked the voltage of these batteries after this issue and it is always over 4.
Oct 03, 2013, 03:17 PM
Custom User Name Title
bhoov128's Avatar
I wouldn't be too amazed by the DSM2/DSMX compatibility... after all, Hobbyzone is a Horizon brand, who manufactures Parkzone, E-Flite, Hangar 9, Spektrum, Losi, etc etc etc. Hope I didn't burst your bubble too much.

Ben
Oct 03, 2013, 06:31 PM
Registered User
Quote:
Originally Posted by rccraze
I have had about 70-80 flights on my Champ.

But lately, many times my champ won't start with new freshly charged batteries! Motor starts and quits right away. After 10-15 attempts, it starts. Sometimes, different battery does not have the issue.
The motor brushes are worn out. The slightly stronger battery can sometimes overcome that, but that will eventually fail too. Be aware that those '10-15 attempts' plus very short flights are tearing the *snot* out of the batteries and will drastically shorten their lifespan.

The only real fix is to change the motor. There are brushed options better than stock: https://www.rcgroups.com/forums/show....php?t=1326158 or for a real kick in the pants major upgrade to brushless: https://www.rcgroups.com/forums/show....php?t=1283423
Oct 03, 2013, 06:43 PM
Scout CX | mCX2 | mSR | 120SR
North_of_49's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by rccraze
I have had about 70-80 flights on my Champ. It has been flying great with everything original. In the first few flights while learning, I did crash few times. But glued the wing back. But I have not crashed for last 50+ flights.

But lately, many times my champ won't start with new freshly charged batteries! Motor starts and quits right away. After 10-15 attempts, it starts. Sometimes, different battery does not have the issue. I am using eflite and nanotech batteries. Has anyone else seen this issue? Is my receiver going bad? How do I find if this is OCP or LVC issues? Is it possible to drop the voltage at the start below LVC cutoff and then it recovers back? I have checked the voltage of these batteries after this issue and it is always over 4.
I went through this a year ago. No one suggested at the time the motor was going bad (it did get alot of use that summer) and we chased alot of dead ends including the possibility my Thunder Power pocket charger was not charging my lipos when it indicated it had. It was hair pulling, I thought my brick was going bad and was going to chuck it. This now seems to be the known cause... wish I knew this last year.

Quote:
Originally Posted by bhoov128
I wouldn't be too amazed by the DSM2/DSMX compatibility... after all, Hobbyzone is a Horizon brand, who manufactures Parkzone, E-Flite, Hangar 9, Spektrum, Losi, etc etc etc. Hope I didn't burst your bubble too much.

Ben
Actually there is currently some moaning in the HZ Duet thread that that new HZ plane is not DSM2/X. So, maybe not amazed but I'm thankful

EDIT
My Blade Scout CX is also 2.4ghz non DSM2/X
Last edited by North_of_49; Oct 03, 2013 at 06:59 PM.
Oct 03, 2013, 07:39 PM
2016 The Year for Air Shows
Red.Sneakers's Avatar

Champ motor replacement


I always go with the E-flite EFL9052 black & white extra long wire.Twist the old one off, insert new one, a little special glue (I use clear RTV silicone adhesive sealant - 24 hr cure time) and you will have a stronger motor and flying again. That's the motor we all upgrade to at our club.
Oct 03, 2013, 11:10 PM
Heli's rule!
dacaur's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by North_of_49
I went through this a year ago. No one suggested at the time the motor was going bad (it did get alot of use that summer) and we chased alot of dead ends including the possibility my Thunder Power pocket charger was not charging my lipos when it indicated it had. It was hair pulling, I thought my brick was going bad and was going to chuck it. This now seems to be the known cause... wish I knew this last year.

Actually there is currently some moaning in the HZ Duet thread that that new HZ plane is not DSM2/X. So, maybe not amazed but I'm thankful

EDIT
My Blade Scout CX is also 2.4ghz non DSM2/X
yea thats because they are in a lower price point, they arent worth of spektrum compatability, and have their own special 2.4 system, they also dont have seperate chargers.... I bet the scout TX would fly a duet though....
Oct 03, 2013, 11:51 PM
Scout CX | mCX2 | mSR | 120SR
North_of_49's Avatar
That's what I sort of tried to explain to them (although the HH rep had already more or less done that already).
Oct 04, 2013, 10:51 AM
Registered User
Torch8's Avatar

Good Trainer


Champ owners is this really good trainer that will help rc plane pilot progress into 4 channel? I am used to rudder on left stick after flying cp heli. Also would this be good beginner micro? I got UM-T28 on a whim but its bit fast for my to learn on. My goal is just scale flying micro size planes such as UM T-28 and UM P-51d As3x but I also like slow flyer for relax flying.
Oct 04, 2013, 10:55 AM
LiPo-Sucker & Airframe EMT
pugsam's Avatar
...

Oct 04, 2013, 01:47 PM
Heli's rule!
dacaur's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by Torch8
Champ owners is this really good trainer that will help rc plane pilot progress into 4 channel? I am used to rudder on left stick after flying cp heli. Also would this be good beginner micro? I got UM-T28 on a whim but its bit fast for my to learn on. My goal is just scale flying micro size planes such as UM T-28 and UM P-51d As3x but I also like slow flyer for relax flying.
Yes its great for progressing to a 4ch plane. 3ch or 4ch, you really dont fly them that differently. On both the main bank/turn control goes on the right stick, and on both you can completly ignore the left stick if you want (except throttle of course)
Oct 04, 2013, 02:19 PM
2016 The Year for Air Shows
Red.Sneakers's Avatar

Learn to Fly with Rudder & Aileron


Quote:
Originally Posted by Torch8
Champ owners is this really good trainer that will help rc plane pilot progress into 4 channel? I am used to rudder on left stick after flying cp heli. Also would this be good beginner micro? I got UM-T28 on a whim but its bit fast for my to learn on. My goal is just scale flying micro size planes such as UM T-28 and UM P-51d As3x but I also like slow flyer for relax flying.
You can train with the Champ. I mix Rud > Ail so I have rudder control on both the left & right stick. Mentally, if I want to practice Ail, I use the right stick. Practice Rudder, use the left stick. It's all about hand / eye coordination. My Champ review is at link https://www.rcgroups.com/forums/show...31Report#18463

For a 'slow flyer for relax flying', check out La Bella Dame. My review is at link https://www.rcgroups.com/forums/show...+dame&reort#10
...
Last edited by Red.Sneakers; Mar 28, 2014 at 09:53 AM. Reason: update
Oct 04, 2013, 05:59 PM
65 years of RC flying
Daedalus66's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by dacaur
Yes its great for progressing to a 4ch plane. 3ch or 4ch, you really dont fly them that differently. On both the main bank/turn control goes on the right stick, and on both you can completly ignore the left stick if you want (except throttle of course)
You certainly can't ignore rudder on a 4 channel model! How are you going to steer during taxi and takeoff, let alone align the model during a crosswind landing? Teaching students to use rudder is one of the key points in any decent training program.

Learning with a three channel model can help learn to use rudder, provided the rudder channel (CH4) is mixed to the aileron channel (CH2), which is actually controlling rudder on a three channel. This allows you to control on the ground with the left stick and in the air with the right stick -- just like an aileron model.

(As noted by Red Sneakers.)
Oct 04, 2013, 06:47 PM
Heli's rule!
dacaur's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by Daedalus66
You certainly can't ignore rudder on a 4 channel model! How are you going to steer during taxi and takeoff, let alone align the model during a crosswind landing?
ok, you can ignore it except during takeoff and landing Unless of course, you hand launch and belly land into the wind, then my original statment stands.... My point is simply that, when talking about learning to fly, the rudder on a 4ch plane isnt needed to fly. If it is, then you arent flying a very good trainer. I guess that depends on your definition of trainer... Im sure there are many different levels of 'trainer" out there, from nice easy flying planes you can easily learn to fly on your own, to less easy flying planes that basicaly require a buddy box if you want a chance of sucess...
Obviously, there is certainly no reason you NEED to ignore the rudder, but a new flier has enough on their mind, that making turns look pretty shouldnt be very high on the priorities list.... Later, when they start to get comfortable then they can start learning to use the rudder...

Just my $0.02. Personaly, I prefer not to use the rudder most of the time if I dont have to, as it just doesnt add anything to the enjoyment of the hobby to me to have pretty looking turns. Bank-n-yank is a lot more fun. When flying a heli where the rudder is required to turn the nose of the heli, I will use it, but if its not required, I dont see a reason to do it. I just want to make sure the newbs out there know that they dont HAVE to use the rudder on their 4ch plane untill hey are comfortable with it....
Oct 04, 2013, 07:30 PM
Registered User
My first 4 channel plane was a PZmicro p51. One of the 1st generation ones. I only used the rudder on the ground but once in the air, it was yank and bank all the way. I never touched the rudder until I progressed to a more advanced state of pilotage. That's a big word for me!
Oct 04, 2013, 07:40 PM
Custom User Name Title
bhoov128's Avatar
we went thru this a while back, it got stupid, i was quite the guilty party in that, so let's just leave it where it's at - mix or don't mix, so long as you get the plane in the air and work on keeping the nose level through turns. It's different than heli world for sure (I can fly a FP heli 'ok' but a CP heli forget about it, might as well set my wallet on fire). However you turn the plane, you have to keep the nose up. You can do it with added throttle or with elevator. There aren't any rotating wings on a plane (yes, I know this is obvious, sorry) so you won't generate lift unless you're MOVING through the air, You can fly a heli very very slowly because it generates lift as long as its rotors are turning, but if you try slowing down a plane, even a Champ, too slow, you are just going to eat dirt. If you get a champ I would recommend you to take it up about 40 feet or so, and try to fly a box pattern with nice turns at each corner without losing altitude. 40' is a good altitude for a champ because it's still easily visible. The dihedral on any airplane is a roll-stability feature i.e. it wants to resist an airplane being in a rolled attitude. The incidence on the wing and the stability of the high-wing on the Champ means that with added airspeed, it picks up the nose. (this is actually true for ANY airplane; it's just very very very obvoius on the Champ.) I've shown people how easy it is to fly the Champ and how difficult it actually can be to crash it - I'll flip it upside down and basically full throttle tweak it out in the sky and then just kill the throttle and let go of the transmitter. I've even held it by the handle by my side. The Champ 99 times out of 100 pulls out of a dive and levels its wings all by itself. The other 1 time it's usually upside down and who knows what the happens,

Just get the fundamentals of always moving forward and keeping momentum up and you'll be okay. Worry about 4 channel and all that stuff later. Torch I think you were given advice a while back that a Champ would be the place to start but you had decided you'd purchase either the T-28 or the UM P-51 AS3X version, and I will tell you that the Champ is a much better foot in the door. It flies comfortably at half the airspeed of the other two. That means more time to react, more time to think, more time to relax and control the plane.

And then later on when you're flying EDF jets going 150mph and torque rolling a 128" AJ Slick with a 4 cycle gas engine, I promise you'll still pull out your Champ, look around to make sure no one is looking, and go fly a 35 gram 3-channel orange cartoony looking plane with a big, sappy, excited grin on your face.

Ben
Oct 04, 2013, 07:41 PM
65 years of RC flying
Daedalus66's Avatar
Of course it depends what you're flying. Lots of models are hand launched and many don't even have rudder.

But we're talking about learning to fly and for me that means learning to takeoff and land above all else. You just can't do it without rudder and you need to learn to use the left stick. So setting up the Champ to emulate a four channel model makes sense. You can learn with just the right stick for steering, and it will fly perfectly well. But it's much better, if you have a programmable transmitter, to set up a mix and learn the skills you'll need later for more advanced models (like the T-28).

If you don't have a programmable transmitter, it just means you'll have to unlearn ground steering with the right hand and learn to use the left. Not a big deal.

Do follow the advice above and learn on the Champ until you are good at it. Then go to the T-28. When you can fly that well, you'll be ready for the P-51.
Oct 04, 2013, 08:21 PM
Registered User
Ginohio's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by Daedalus66
Of course it depends what you're flying. Lots of models are hand launched and many don't even have rudder.

But we're talking about learning to fly and for me that means learning to takeoff and land above all else. You just can't do it without rudder and you need to learn to use the left stick. So setting up the Champ to emulate a four channel model makes sense. You can learn with just the right stick for steering, and it will fly perfectly well. But it's much better, if you have a programmable transmitter, to set up a mix and learn the skills you'll need later for more advanced models (like the T-28).

If you don't have a programmable transmitter, it just means you'll have to unlearn ground steering with the right hand and learn to use the left. Not a big deal.

Do follow the advice above and learn on the Champ until you are good at it. Then go to the T-28. When you can fly that well, you'll be ready for the P-51.


Not everyone that owns a champ has a flying field that they can do ground take off or landing. Like all my planes they are hand thrown and a belly landing. And I have a few different ones. I live in the country so crop fields are where I mainly fly..no landing strip in a tilled corn/soybean field around here.
Oct 04, 2013, 10:03 PM
Scout CX | mCX2 | mSR | 120SR
North_of_49's Avatar
I've posted my DX6i photo of my rudder/aileron mix several times in this and the other Champ thread with an explanation of why I did it, which was to practice and develop the muscle memory for left stick ground steering knowing that my next purchase would be a 4ch plane...

... I did get that 4ch plane this summer, my Glasair (converted it to a taildragger) and found out quickly why it probably would have been in my best interest to have actually been using that Champ mix but wasn't... got lazy and didn't use the left stick steering on the ground even though I had it available to me...

... in my Glasair maiden video I posted in another thread, you can see that my first 2 take-offs ended up being literally 90 degrees to the orientation they began at... knowing that I hadn't developed that necessary throttle/rudder coordination, I didn't want to complicate my left hand operation of my Tx and just wanted to delegate that hand to only throttle for my first take-offs (less thinking to do)... since I was in a large field, I could just let it veer wherever it wanted and, due to p-factor and motor torque, it did do that and I expected it would (if I had have had curbs on either side of me I would have severely damaged my bushwheels and/or gear... which I did actually do weeks later but that's another story).

But, on my 3rd take-off, I tried adding in right rudder and got a nice straight take-off and have been doing it ever since... I even add in some down elevator on initial acceleration to get the tail flying right away before the mains come off the ground... looks soooo scale! Ben knows what I'm talkin' about

When I get my Champ back in the air, I'll definitely be using that rudder-aileron mix to keep my ground steering muscle memory honed while switching back and forth between my current collection of planes which now includes another 4ch and one soon to be converted from 3 to 4ch. There was some discussion at one point as to whether my 100% mix would double drive and overdrive the Champ's linear servos if putting both sticks fully to one side... in about a week, I'll be joining Ben in the DX9 club and that Tx has an absolute (servo) travel feature you can use to prevent mixes from doing exactly that

anyhoo... just tellin' my little story, maybe it will be of benefit to someone

(by the way, the Glasair manual says to turn with the ailerons and not even use the rudder other than for ground steering. Can't do those cool looking slips without rudder so I'll be ignoring that suggestion )


EDIT
Here's the vid that shows my take-offs before learning ground steering...

0:05 1st take-off
2:15 2nd take-off
then
4:53 3rd take-off trying some p-factor/torque countering with rudder (yay!)

click picture to watch at YouTube to avoid the low frame-rate forum embeded player
There's 1080HD in the video options for it




My take-offs now (between curbs!)
(easier to see in HD and full screen and viewed on YouTube without the jerkiness of the crippled framerate of the RCG embedded player)

HobbyZone Glasair Sportsman Taildragger Bushwheels Scale Take-off (0 min 8 sec)
Oct 04, 2013, 10:15 PM
Registered User
Nice take off there North. A little right rudder on a take off roll makes all the difference!
Oct 04, 2013, 10:21 PM
Scout CX | mCX2 | mSR | 120SR
North_of_49's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by jwp2
Nice take off there North. A little right rudder on a take off roll makes all the difference!
absolutely, my friend!
Oct 04, 2013, 11:17 PM
Custom User Name Title
bhoov128's Avatar
I just took my Champ outside for a couple battery romp and I just set it up on my brandy-new DX9 ...

"Timer Start."

"Ten minutes remaining."

"Timer Stop."


(I like my sexy British voiced transmitter friend, I shall name her Gemma Arterton and we shall be very close)

Anyways, I've always used the rud>ail mix on my Champ, and I fly it with left and right stick turning, kinda coordinated turns without anything to coordinate with. Put the Champ on the ground, pushed the throttle forward, and ate grass. Tried to taxi, nothing's happening, why's my rudder broken, what the f... oh yeah. I forgot to set up the mix. beep, beep, click, roll, roll, beep, beep, says Gemma, and next thing you know I'm rolling down the street at midnight under the streetlights with the tail flying and the big fatso bushwheel mains rolling and up up UP we goes, and from there it was like old friends.

That's how ingrained left stick rudder on the Champ is for me.
Oct 05, 2013, 07:40 AM
Registered User
Thats an awesome story. I use the same mix on my DX6I and it works great. I know what you mean about left stick rudder being ingrained. Its the same way for me. If the female voice on the DX9 is that sexy, I have to get one!
Oct 05, 2013, 10:28 AM
2016 The Year for Air Shows
Red.Sneakers's Avatar

Champ Failsafe


OK, we lost a Champ this week at the field. Indiana Jones, flew off into the wild blue yonder. Based on my Google Earth calculations, he was out 1,000 feet out. I think the plane lost radio contact and fell out of the sky. Baldy says the rated radio range for the Champ brick is 500 feet – conservative estimate, but he would not try doubling it. I checked the pattern I fly and looks like I fly 500 to 600 feet out and 200 to 300 feet up – clear visual and orientation maintained (interesting it is the same ratio as my 2 meter Radian at 2000 feet out & 1000 feet high with a satellite Rx– max for me). So I think he lost Rx control and the Champ fell out of the sky.

If the Champ has no throttle and Elev control it will tend to drop out of the sky. So I tried testing binding it with 40% throttle and Elev trim. When I turned off the radio, no throttle. Does it have a failsafe system in the DSMX Rx?

Wha' say you?
...
Oct 05, 2013, 11:26 AM
Scout CX | mCX2 | mSR | 120SR
North_of_49's Avatar
I'm surprised it would let you bind it without the throttle being off. Are you sure it did?
Oct 05, 2013, 11:43 AM
Registered User
Quote:
Originally Posted by Red.Sneakers
If the Champ has no throttle and Elev control it will tend to drop out of the sky.
I just tested this. Of course the motor turns off - do you want it to keep flying away???

I turned everything on, gave full elevator and rudder. When I shut off the radio the surfaces -snapped- back to -neutral-.

But 'drop,' no. CG and elevator trim should be set to -glide- with power off and no input. Half throttle or thereabouts means level flight, and more throttle = more lift = ascend.

Range is a Tx factor, not Rx. I have Futaba 8FG with Spectrum trainer port module. For DSM mode the module is turned on and the Futaba Tx is actually turned off to save battery power, so the plane 'hears' only the Spektrum module not the Futaba.

The one time I lost it in too much wind, I found it later and measured 1800', and no more than 100' up the whole way out. I had control all the way but at that distance could not see orientation any more so I killed he throttle and let go of the right stick and let it drop. [sigh]

I was very very lucky - it passed over a treed wilderness patch of a few acres, then over a plant nursery. It happened to land on a -road- in the nursery not the middle of acres of plants. However, it was in its wheels with no other damage! Meaning it -had- to have -glided- down to land. (((patting good little Champ on it's cowl LOL!!!)))
Oct 05, 2013, 12:26 PM
Heli's rule!
dacaur's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by Red.Sneakers
If the Champ has no throttle and Elev control it will tend to drop out of the sky. So I tried testing binding it with 40% throttle and Elev trim. When I turned off the radio, no throttle. Does it have a failsafe system in the DSMX Rx?

Wha' say you?
...
only the higher end spektrum RX's have settable failsafes for the control surfaces.

As for the throttle, that makes sense that it goes to zero throttle regardless of throttle at bind, considering that in order to bind it with the RTF transmitter, the throttle is most likely going to be at 50% when you bind it... You bind by pushing the throttle stick down while turning on.... would be tough to do that with the throttle stick all the way down. Since these things are made for newbs, sounds like just another case of HH protecting us from ourselves... No matter how you look at it, having throttle "on" during failsafe is a terrible idea....
Oct 05, 2013, 05:28 PM
Registered User

Thanks


Thank you jarchuk. We took apart the plane and the big gear was chipped. We ordered a new servo for the plane to replace the gear.
Oct 12, 2013, 11:40 AM
Registered User
just got my champ a few days ago,and today was the first flight.
i noticed that no matter how much i trim it, it wants to turn to the left. allso if im turning left it responds quickly, but when im turning right, its like doing a really slow turn...is it possible that the linear servos came out of factory un centered?
Oct 12, 2013, 12:12 PM
Custom User Name Title
bhoov128's Avatar
isn't very likely, check to make sure the horizontal stab / rudder aren't warped or misaligned. Also double check to make sure the hinges aren't ripped, it could be pulling away in flight and causing your turns.
Oct 12, 2013, 01:03 PM
Registered User
nothing is ripped or warped ...its brand new...i added a pic for you to see..there is a difference of 2-3 mm from left to right




Oct 12, 2013, 03:04 PM
Custom User Name Title
bhoov128's Avatar
Maybe just a trick of the camera angle but this looks suspicious to me.
Oct 12, 2013, 03:09 PM
The figure "9" Specialist
aeronca's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by david87
nothing is ripped or warped ...its brand new...i added a pic for you to see..there is a difference of 2-3 mm from left to right




How about a pic from the same top-view angle with the servos neither left nor right, but centered.

Aeronca
Oct 12, 2013, 04:27 PM
Dinosaur
condor12's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by david87
just got my champ a few days ago,and today was the first flight.
i noticed that no matter how much i trim it, it wants to turn to the left. allso if im turning left it responds quickly, but when im turning right, its like doing a really slow turn...is it possible that the linear servos came out of factory un centered?
G'Day, David87. Mine was exactly the same. I think the reluctance to turn starboard is due mainly to engine torque/prop lift. My rudder turned equally left and right. There were no apparent warpage of the fin, wings or horizontal stab. To fix mine, I ran a bead of epoxy along both sides of the fin base (to stiffen the fin), and put a dab on the horn/rudder interface. I also moved the control rod to the second inside hole on the rudder horn. I also fly with max rates on a DX8. The Champ is now a whole new aircraft with normal turns left and right.
Oct 12, 2013, 05:11 PM
Registered User
Quote:
Originally Posted by david87
i noticed that no matter how much i trim it, it wants to turn to the left. allso if im turning left it responds quickly, but when im turning right, its like doing a really slow turn...
I'll give the cheap-quick-dirty solution first. And it's not even 'pick any two' they're all valid. First, turn down the endpoint on the left side of the rudder. Second, move the control rod in by one hole to make up for the loss in travel.

But that's a really cheap quick dirty bandaid and doesn't actually -fix- the problem.

This next paragraph I actually wrote *last* but moved it up here because it's a very likely culprit... Check that the hinges are tight. I've had the tape stick to the paint, but the paint peel slightly off the foam, so steering is very sloppy. This is usually caused by various noseovers and 'tail first landings' but it could have been bonked during assembly or packing and pulled the paint loose.

The UMs have so few centimeters of surface areas that -every- cm counts for -more- than in larger planes. I have planes with pieces bent and broken and holes in wings and gouges and chunks missing and they make almost no difference.

A 1 deg twist/warp in the wings can throw it off. Don't just look at the rudder to see if it's straight and parallel to the stab - lay a straightedge up to it and see if any light comes through.

Also make sure the elevator is flat-parallel to the h-stab.

Not likely but check lateral balance by holding the tip of the spinner and the tip of the tail on your fingertips. A fraction of a gram is a lot in a plane that weighs only a few grams.

Quote:
is it possible that the linear servos came out of factory un centered?
There's no 'centering.' It's electronic.

Hey do this... Turn down -both- left and right endpoints. That's often a standard thing to do so the slider doesn't run past the end of the sensor (causing loss of surface response and stall-spin-crash.) You may have -too- -much- travel on one -end-, which you think is the normal side and the 'less responsive' side is the one that's really correct.

Given the number of possibilities and variables and sheer -fragility- it's very possible that a -number- of these factors are out of whack in favor of the left turn that all add up to poor response to the right.
Oct 12, 2013, 05:13 PM
65 years of RC flying
Daedalus66's Avatar
Don't use epoxy for flexible foam such as the stuff the Champ is made from. Use a flexible glue such as Foam Tac or UHU Por.
Oct 12, 2013, 09:22 PM
Registered User
Ginohio's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by aeronca
How about a pic from the same top-view angle with the servos neither left nor right, but centered.

Aeronca
take it back to your LHS and tell them to fly it and fix it.. All this stuff about lateral alignment is gooberish when it applys to the Champ. When my one of 3 was turning left way more than right.. It was the tab at bottom of rudder was broke. Now my LHS guy said this would not cause this but..when I glued bottom tab back on No problems..
Oct 12, 2013, 10:46 PM
Dinosaur
condor12's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by Daedalus66
Don't use epoxy for flexible foam such as the stuff the Champ is made from. Use a flexible glue such as Foam Tac or UHU Por.
Probably a good general rule. I used epoxy on mine because the fin was very floppy side to side. The epoxy stiffened it right up. Only needed a bead 2mm or so high. Also put two 12mm strips of Blenderm tape along the rudder hinge line (top & bottom) - just in case! Mightn't be everyones cup of tea, but solved my problem. Enjoy the littl'un, it's a top fun machine.
Oct 12, 2013, 10:59 PM
Scout CX | mCX2 | mSR | 120SR
North_of_49's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by condor12
...
I used epoxy on mine because the fin was very floppy side to side. ...
https://www.rcgroups.com/forums/show....php?t=1683386


Oct 13, 2013, 12:17 AM
Registered User
Ginohio's Avatar
No fair Nortn...we all know how precise your mods are...They are nice tnough..
Oct 13, 2013, 02:52 AM
Dinosaur
condor12's Avatar
Top job, North. I've only got 30 or so flights on mine. If I could be sure I would get a 100 more I'd probably do the same! Not the Champs fault - my flying style...
Oct 13, 2013, 10:14 AM
Registered User
Quote:
Originally Posted by david87
just got my champ a few days ago,and today was the first flight.
i noticed that no matter how much i trim it, it wants to turn to the left. allso if im turning left it responds quickly, but when im turning right, its like doing a really slow turn...is it possible that the linear servos came out of factory un centered?
Take it to the store.
Oct 13, 2013, 01:57 PM
Registered User
im not from america, i orderd it online so there is no store i can take it to.
and jbarchuki didnt quite understand you ....what to do with the straightedge ?
and also what is endpoints? im kinda new to this and also english is not my native language
Quote:
Originally Posted by jbarchuk

A 1 deg twist/warp in the wings can throw it off. Don't just look at the rudder to see if it's straight and parallel to the stab - lay a straightedge up to it and see if any light comes through.

Also make sure the elevator is flat-parallel to the h-stab.

Hey do this... Turn down -both- left and right endpoints. That's often a standard thing to do so the slider doesn't run past the end of the sensor (causing loss of surface response and stall-spin-crash.) You may have -too- -much- travel on one -end-, which you think is the normal side and the 'less responsive' side is the one that's really correct.
.
Oct 13, 2013, 03:09 PM
Registered User
Quote:
Originally Posted by david87
jbarchuki didnt quite understand you ....what to do with the straightedge ?
Turn on the Tx, plug in the plane. Make sure the right stick makes the surfaces move.

Check the pic below. The gap between the straightedge and the elevator means it's trimmed down. A brand new plane, first flight and such, surfaces should be as flat and neutral as possible, because it was -designed- to fly that way and they usually do.

I don't recall why -mine- is that way. It's been through two motor changes so the thrust is likely off, and as you an see there are chunks missing here and there. LOL! It flies and that's all I care about.

Check both sides of the elevator, in case they're twisted in the middle.

And obviously you can use this same technique for the rudder. I did the elevator pic simply because it was easier to set up the straightedge for it. My rudder is twisted and bent anyway in much worse shape than the elevator so that would not have been a good reference example.

Are you doing hand toss? With someone to do that for you? That's often easier for a new plane and new pilot.

When you launch, if you see anything go weird such as pitch up or rolling one way ot the other, just throttle off and use the elevator to glide down. Don't try to gain altitude and -make- it work if it's starting out badly. Take the time to -think- about what happened, and make adjustments for that.

A properly trimmed and balanced Champ is a pussycat and any 8 year old can learn to fly in ten minutes. But a badly trimmed or balanced -anything- can be extremely difficult if not impossible for a very experienced pilot.

Quote:
and also what is endpoints?
Download the PDF manual for your radio, and do a search for 'endpoints.' That will explain what they do and how to adjust them.
Oct 13, 2013, 09:28 PM
Registered User
I have two Champs and both have a slight bit of right rudder and fly straight.
Oct 23, 2013, 10:41 AM
Registered User
Its been pretty quiet here lately. has anyone been out flying their Champs lately?
Oct 23, 2013, 12:50 PM
"Champ'ion Newb"
thosmosis's Avatar
For me, it's going to be the Mini Vapor at lunch time. Then I just got my replacement Champ from Amazon last night -- Rudder servo motor failed in the first one. Returned within 30 days. So, I have the replacement (Camp Mark 2!) in the car, waiting for me to stop on the way home to try her out after work!
Last edited by thosmosis; Oct 23, 2013 at 03:32 PM.
Oct 23, 2013, 01:48 PM
2016 The Year for Air Shows
Red.Sneakers's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by jwp2
Its been pretty quiet here lately. has anyone been out flying their Champs lately?
Every chance we get. Come over to New Jersey. It's becoming a tradition at our club to fly the Champ during lunch intermission. Have a few up at a time. Every regular at our club has one, well as of today, when an intermediate pilot showed without a plane & I had him fly mine. He ordered one before he left.

Join our Gallery of Champs at
https://www.rcgroups.com/forums/show...=champ+galleri
...
Oct 23, 2013, 02:07 PM
Registered User
Its cool that you guys are flying the Champ at intermissions at your club. Unfortunately, New Jersey is a little too far for me to travel as I live in Illinois. Thanks for the offer though and I love the gallery thread. If I ever learn to post a picture, it would be great to post them on the thread.
Oct 23, 2013, 09:11 PM
"Champ'ion Newb"
thosmosis's Avatar
Well, I got to fly the Mini Vapor twice during the day. Sneaking out at work, and flying in the courtyard. (Cigarette break!)

But my ideas of maidening my replacemt Chap was foiled. Got to the park. One side had lots of little kids with soccer balls. Left. Went back two hours later. Still stragglers, and it was getting late. Rats!

Tomorrow I'm off work for business at home. But have four hours easy if I get up at the break of dawn! I'll bring the T28, if the Champ, and my newbie flying skills get better.

Up to handling 7MPH winds with the Champ. But it's all over the place at times and I've been in a big area of open space.

It's the white knuckle "learning" moments that do it! And it happens often.

Part of me feels that if I actually wasn't on the verge of destruction around a few corners of flight each time -- how much more I would love it. I'd say none more. I really don't want to get better, and want to stay at beginner level, where it's a rush to land without falling to pieces.
Oct 23, 2013, 09:50 PM
2016 The Year for Air Shows
Red.Sneakers's Avatar
My recommendations for flying in the wind: Calm ~ 0 to 2 mph is a great start for beginners; Breeze ~ 3 to 4 mph is ok for advanced beginners, constant input required; Wind ~ 5 to 7 mph is for advanced beginners, application of down elevator and trim will be required to maintain level; Windy ~ 8+ mph good luck, it will fly more like a kite, may want to consider attaching a kite string.
...
Oct 23, 2013, 09:56 PM
"Champ'ion Newb"
thosmosis's Avatar
Really, the fun was graduating -- the wind. I never would have flown in 7MPH starting out -- a month ago.

Flying in a breeze (between buildings in the city) three times a day (with the PZ Mini Vapor) during work breaks, has helped me to understand flight in wind. Though I have a limit. I don't want to fly in 7MH with the Champ. But when in Rome, and itching to fly -- you weigh your skills... We landed successfully every time -- pretty much... and went through three batteries. So, it was a success!!
Last edited by thosmosis; Oct 23, 2013 at 10:04 PM.
Oct 24, 2013, 08:18 PM
Elfi Flyer
Doug Sipprell's Avatar
With rare exception, I always bring my Champ #2 to the field when I am going to be flying other planes. When the wind prevents my other micros from flying (exception, the UMX Habu 180 EDF), I put up my Champ and really enjoy the flight.

RD
Oct 31, 2013, 03:32 PM
2016 The Year for Air Shows
Red.Sneakers's Avatar

Motor Cooked



My Champ motor got cooked today. Signs to look for: Stage 0: (I disconnected the battery, plugged it in again firmly and it was fine after that.); Stage 1 (periodically sputters with fresh battery); Stage 2 (full throttle, no response, spin the prop by hand and she goes); Final Stage (low power). Have a P-51 motor mothballed in the hanger.

P.S. It had a total of 13 flight hours logged.

UPDATE: It was not the motor. See https://www.rcgroups.com/forums/show...ostcount=18602
...
Last edited by Red.Sneakers; Nov 12, 2013 at 12:13 PM. Reason: update
Oct 31, 2013, 04:57 PM
Registered User
Sorry to hear that. At least there isn't much to changing out the motor. The p51 motor should be a direct fit.
My new champ only has maybe 5 hours on it and the sputtering and dying out at full throttle are starting to happen already.
Oct 31, 2013, 05:45 PM
Registered User
Ginohio's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by jwp2
Sorry to hear that. At least there isn't much to changing out the motor. The p51 motor should be a direct fit.
My new champ only has maybe 5 hours on it and the sputtering and dying out at full throttle are starting to happen already.
yep direct fit and a little extra zip to boot.
Oct 31, 2013, 06:47 PM
Registered User
Yeah. I have one waiting for when the stocker dies. Its been so windy here lately, the Champ has been grounded for awhile now. Maybe tomorrow morning.
Oct 31, 2013, 07:16 PM
Registered User
Ginohio's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by jwp2
Yeah. I have one waiting for when the stocker dies. Its been so windy here lately, the Champ has been grounded for awhile now. Maybe tomorrow morning.
same here windy and rainy, got my champ out the other day though. I haven't flown it much since I got the Delta Ray. But love seeing that little orange plane flying in blue sky's and it is so relaxing to just buzz it around.
Oct 31, 2013, 07:35 PM
Registered User
It sure is. I bet that Delta Ray is a nice flyer as well. I usually fly my Champ in front of my house. It spends 99% of its time doing touch and goes on my street. Very relaxing break from flying some of the faster planes.
Oct 31, 2013, 08:46 PM
Registered User
Ginohio's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by jwp2
It sure is. I bet that Delta Ray is a nice flyer as well. I usually fly my Champ in front of my house. It spends 99% of its time doing touch and goes on my street. Very relaxing break from flying some of the faster planes.
It's a very good flyer.. But I still like my Champ...I can take my eyes off it and still know where's it's going. Just a relaxing flight. And that's why I do this..
Nov 01, 2013, 06:52 PM
Registered User

New Member


Hi

I just joined the forum! I purchased a Champ to get back into RC flight. Ironically, 45 years ago my Dad and I built a freeflight Champ. I know I won't have much to add for a while, so bare with my questions. With over 1000 pages of posts, I might have missed one or two.
Nov 01, 2013, 09:20 PM
Registered User
Welcome back to RC flight Flyer56! Things sure have have changed a lot in the last 45 years! You'll love this little Champ. Has it had its maiden flight yet?
Nov 01, 2013, 09:36 PM
Custom User Name Title
bhoov128's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by Flyer56
Hi

I just joined the forum! I purchased a Champ to get back into RC flight. Ironically, 45 years ago my Dad and I built a freeflight Champ. I know I won't have much to add for a while, so bare with my questions. With over 1000 pages of posts, I might have missed one or two.
Welcome sir, ask away. It's too windy here for me to ignore you and be out flying!

Ben
Nov 01, 2013, 10:17 PM
Registered User
Quote:
Originally Posted by Flyer56
I purchased a Champ to get back into RC flight. Ironically, 45 years ago my Dad and I built a freeflight Champ.
1. You need zero to near-zero wind to try it for the first time. if you have *any* wind at all, always face into it to launch and land. That is an absolute rule for newbies and not optional.

2. You need about half a football/soccer field for first flights. Champ can be flown in half a basketball court, but not for newbies.

3. Check that elevator and rudder move smoothly, and equally in both directions.

4. Hand toss (by an assistant) is actually easier for newbies. There's no 'takeoff' involved because with half throttle and gentle (very gentle) toss it's already flying. The only thing left to do is land it.

5. Important: half throttle (to 5/8) is all you need to fly because it's -designed- to fly straight and level at that speed. Later you can hot dog and zoom around, but not for a little while.

6. Be *GENTLE* with the *STICKS*. (Yes I yelled that because it's the #1 newbie mistake.) When it drops altitude add a couple of clicks of throttle, and that's it, *not* the elevator.

7. Don't jam the rudder to turn - ease into it, and pull back a little elevator. Then straighten out smoothly and push elevator forward back to where it was.

8. If you *ever* get confused or disoriented just kill the throttle, pull back a little on the elevator, and it will glide to the ground. Then take a few minutes to -think- through what happened to cause your confusion, and try again. Don't hesitate to bail out. It's hard to think when you're disoriented, which is very common for newbies. -Thinking- about it will help you the -next- time you get into the same situation that caused disorientation. Eventually you will learn reflex and 'finger memory' that will in a sense 'fly the plane for you.'

9. Champ is the ultimate trainer and a pure pussycat. 8 yr olds learn to fly this in 10 minutes. Which should be easy for you if you can find an 8 yr old somewhere. LOL!!

10. GL and have a *blast*.
Nov 02, 2013, 03:50 PM
Epilepsy Awareness
Flying High Mike's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by Flyer56
Hi

I just joined the forum! I purchased a Champ to get back into RC flight. Ironically, 45 years ago my Dad and I built a freeflight Champ. I know I won't have much to add for a while, so bare with my questions. With over 1000 pages of posts, I might have missed one or two.
Welcome Guy. I'm just the village idiot So, you and your Dad built a free flight Champ. Very impressive. As far as flying, it won't take you long to get back into things. Like riding a bike eh

Mike.
Nov 04, 2013, 05:36 AM
Registered User
Sun Eagle's Avatar

Problem with Champ - very odd


I got this Champ 2nd hand from a friend.

I thought the motor was bad because it would often just cut-out when attempting to throttle up.

I just installed a new motor and it does the exact same thing.. now I'm stumped. I've tried all my batteries, same result I apply throttle and it spins for 1/2 second and stops.

I'm hoping it's not a bad brick... open to suggestions and hoping for many.
Nov 04, 2013, 09:58 AM
Custom User Name Title
bhoov128's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sun Eagle
I got this Champ 2nd hand from a friend.

I thought the motor was bad because it would often just cut-out when attempting to throttle up.

I just installed a new motor and it does the exact same thing.. now I'm stumped. I've tried all my batteries, same result I apply throttle and it spins for 1/2 second and stops.

I'm hoping it's not a bad brick... open to suggestions and hoping for many.
Are you sure your batteries aren't just tired? Have you tried a brand new one? Other than that check for obstructions in the gearbox or if the prop's rubbing.

When the cut-out happens, does it completely turn off the brick (LED goes off, no servo control) or is it just the motor that cuts off?
Nov 04, 2013, 08:17 PM
Registered User
Sun Eagle's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by bhoov128
Are you sure your batteries aren't just tired? Have you tried a brand new one? Other than that check for obstructions in the gearbox or if the prop's rubbing.

When the cut-out happens, does it completely turn off the brick (LED goes off, no servo control) or is it just the motor that cuts off?
LED goes off and then back on. At first I thought it was a bad charger as it seemed my batteries were going bad. So I got a new one and new bats but the problem persisted. I suspected the motor and changed that out and no joy.
Nov 04, 2013, 08:18 PM
Scout CX | mCX2 | mSR | 120SR
North_of_49's Avatar
might be the battery cable/plug
Nov 05, 2013, 05:15 PM
Registered User
Sun Eagle's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by North_of_49
might be the battery cable/plug
Maybe but no amount of jiggling and wiggling will get it to disconnect so I doubt it.

Oy. My cub has weird issues, my champ has weird issues and my transmitter has weird issues. every single thing I own right now has mystery issues that nobody can solve..what are the odds?
Nov 05, 2013, 05:23 PM
Epilepsy Awareness
Flying High Mike's Avatar
Sun Eagle,Do you have a volt meter to verify the electrical system?

Mike.
Nov 05, 2013, 07:46 PM
Flyin' low & slow T-28s!
MaladroitFL's Avatar
Sun Eagle

You'll need to bump your throttle trim down to neutral.

It should stop all of your problems.

Mac
Nov 06, 2013, 12:51 AM
Registered User
Sun Eagle's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by MaladroitFL View Post
Sun Eagle

You'll need to bump your throttle trim down to neutral.

It should stop all of your problems.

Mac
Already neutral, no effect. Also moved the trim up and down. Moving the trim up slowly is the same as applying throttle. Once it's high enough to engage, it does the same thing.
Nov 06, 2013, 10:41 AM
RC addict? I'm not addicted...
Nighthawk74's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sun Eagle View Post
Already neutral, no effect. Also moved the trim up and down. Moving the trim up slowly is the same as applying throttle. Once it's high enough to engage, it does the same thing.
Hmm you mention your transmitter. Have you tried a range check? I had serious binding issues with my dx6i. It was driving me crazy. When I did a search and turned out, it was a bad tx antenna. Solved a lot of issues including intermittent cut outs (Brown outs, Black outs).
Nov 06, 2013, 08:51 PM
Registered User
Sun Eagle's Avatar
Range is not an issue, yes checked. Works with my other planes (when it is not glitching itself)..

This is not a TX issue...I posted it here specifically because it's an issue with the Champ.

Nobody ever had this problem before?? I really can't believe that.
Nov 06, 2013, 09:05 PM
Scout CX | mCX2 | mSR | 120SR
North_of_49's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by North_of_49 View Post
might be the battery cable/plug
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sun Eagle View Post
Maybe but no amount of jiggling and wiggling will get it to disconnect so I doubt it.

Oy. My cub has weird issues, my champ has weird issues and my transmitter has weird issues. every single thing I own right now has mystery issues that nobody can solve..what are the odds?
I'm going to mention this again. Sometimes the connection can be just hanging on by part of the strand(s), especially if the battery has been ejected off the belly alot.... odd things don't appear until higher throttle settings when the brick tries to draw more current. It could be at either end of the cable... even under the slicone at the brick end.
Nov 06, 2013, 11:08 PM
Epilepsy Awareness
Flying High Mike's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by Chap1012 View Post
Sun Eagle,Do you have a volt meter to verify the electrical system?

Mike.
Quote:
Originally Posted by North_of_49 View Post
I'm going to mention this again. Sometimes the connection can be just hanging on by part of the strand(s), especially if the battery has been ejected off the belly alot.... odd things don't appear until higher throttle settings when the brick tries to draw more current. It could be at either end of the cable... even under the slicone at the brick end.
This is why I asked Sun Eagle if he had a volt meter but, he never answered me

Mike.
Nov 07, 2013, 01:11 AM
Registered User
I now have 2 ASK-21 gliders. Just wondering if anyone has been successful at converting a champ into a tow plane? My champ gets little love. Infact I let my buddy learn on it at a indoor and he blew it up real good a year ago. Thinking a BL conversion and a tow hook might be enough to get it done. So anyone successful at this? Your findings may save me valuable time and effort.
Nov 07, 2013, 02:21 AM
Registered User
schuey19's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sun Eagle View Post
I got this Champ 2nd hand from a friend.

I thought the motor was bad because it would often just cut-out when attempting to throttle up.

I just installed a new motor and it does the exact same thing.. now I'm stumped. I've tried all my batteries, same result I apply throttle and it spins for 1/2 second and stops.

I'm hoping it's not a bad brick... open to suggestions and hoping for many.
Does it make a rough grinding/graunchy sound when it does run. Mine does the same as yours but with this sound. Going to replace the motor and see how that goes. Have new nanotechs.
Nov 07, 2013, 12:47 PM
Registered User
Quote:
Originally Posted by litehawkdown View Post
I now have 2 ASK-21 gliders. Just wondering if anyone has been successful at converting a champ into a tow plane? My champ gets little love. Infact I let my buddy learn on it at a indoor and he blew it up real good a year ago. Thinking a BL conversion and a tow hook might be enough to get it done. So anyone successful at this? Your findings may save me valuable time and effort.
I've never tried using the Champ as a tow plane but I have done the brushless conversion. I believe it will deffinately have enough power to tow a glider . With the added brushless motor and 2s battery it has gained a considerable amount of weight. It weighs in at 60 grams and has to fly noticeably faster than stock.
But I would not be afraid to tow a glider with it.
Nov 08, 2013, 02:45 AM
Registered User
Quote:
Originally Posted by jwp2 View Post
I've never tried using the Champ as a tow plane but I have done the brushless conversion. I believe it will deffinately have enough power to tow a glider . With the added brushless motor and 2s battery it has gained a considerable amount of weight. It weighs in at 60 grams and has to fly noticeably faster than stock.
But I would not be afraid to tow a glider with it.
OK then I will give it a go. Thanks.

Since my champ is in pieces I might increase the size of the wing to handle the extra weight then.
Nov 08, 2013, 03:35 AM
Registered User
That would help a lot. Cant wait to hear a full report on how it works out.
.
Nov 11, 2013, 01:22 PM
Registered User
Quote:
Originally Posted by jwp2 View Post
That would help a lot. Cant wait to hear a full report on how it works out.
.
I am the king of unfinished projects. Lol But I want to get this one done asap. But need to help a buddy move 700 km and have a clients house in prices. So no time at the moment. But I managed to gut the electronics and fix the blown up fuse. Just got hung up on the wing fix. I noticed I could increase the wing load and still get it in the original box. Also waiting on a CF sheet from hobby king to build my motor mount. So you may be waiting a while. But I will post back when its done for sure.
Nov 11, 2013, 06:55 PM
Registered User
Well it has been weeks since my initial post, so I thought I'd update after about 9 batteries. I really do enjoy this slow flying electric thing compared to the high speed crashes with my nitro plane from days of yore!.. I can pretty much get her to go where I ask, and can keep it in front of me and out of the sun. I can say that all it wants to do is climb if given more than 3/8 throttle, and I have 2-3mm of down elevator dialed in just to keep it level. When you cut the throttle, it descends quickly and up elevator on the controller is required. I did manage 2 (yes two) landings where she came to a stop on her wheels today. I know I'd have a few more if I did not fly over rough desert mixed with small bushes (its actually a horse park). The bushes make for what I call "carrier landings". Out of the box the CG is a little forward of the recommended position. I'm thinking a little weight on the nose might help the tail heavy issue. The battery is as far forward as it will go unless I carve out some foam from the front of the battery slot, and cut out a little foam where the wire comes out of the fuselage. How much weight? My plan is to get a larger 3-channel plane some time next year and fly at a real. I have been hanging around one for a while and just look forward to it. For now I just love what I have.
Nov 11, 2013, 07:03 PM
Registered User
Glad to hear your enjoying your Champ. I was lucky and didn't have any CG issues. One thing you might want to do is go to bigger wheels. It helps avoid prop strikes.
Nov 11, 2013, 09:40 PM
Suneagle, you might try checking the battery wires at the brick. I have had planes do what you describe. The wires are soldered then secured with a drop of glue, and the wires can fray there and keep enough Contact to be intermittent,


Quick Reply
Message:

Thread Tools

Similar Threads
Category Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Discussion What plane is this? Debolt Livewire Champ-w/short video reacher10 The Builders Workshop 48 Mar 29, 2011 03:20 PM
Discussion Super Champ Restoration x-craft Off-road Cars 48 May 25, 2010 07:48 PM
For Sale Champ (1/8th scale, electric) Maggie Han Aircraft - Electric - Airplanes (FS/W) 12 Mar 19, 2010 08:31 PM
For Sale 2x Ni-Mh batts will fit PKZ or HBZ planes gazza1 Aircraft - Electric - Batteries & Chargers (FS/W) 0 Sep 07, 2009 09:46 AM
Question digital camera for hbz extreme bluescoobydoo Aerial Photography 0 Jul 31, 2005 11:25 AM