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Oct 29, 2009, 10:43 AM
Live FPV or Die
VRflyer's Avatar
Severals video goggle on the market have the 3D option, they all use the same principle, so it will work fine with the Headplay googgle, it make me no doubt.
Headplay use one display and with mirror they send the picture for the two eyes. They probably also have a clear lcd for each eye that come black alternatly from one eye to the other in 3D mode.

Zoltan I want to try them! I beleive youwhen you tell you can see clearly the pole in the football feild. The distance between the two camera in your module appear to be the same as the human eye, so any object inside 30 feet will appear with depth compare to background. So it should work well for flying very close to ground in football feild. Most of peoples don't fly low it's why I said it will not work.

I got much more depth perception with my Funjet, well over 200-300 feet because I put more space between my cameras, and it become usefull at any altitude. Just for info.
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Oct 29, 2009, 11:00 AM
MelihK's Avatar
Hi Zoltan,

His system using separeted shutter signal for making 3D with 2 camera.
Microprocessor sending shutter signal to cameras and cameras giving 1 frame NTSC, then sending second signal to second camera.... then you have 15 frame left + 15 frame right on the ground.

Am i right? I should right because this is standart way for shutter type 3D systems.

My question is:
are you feeling real when fast movements. Because i think 15fps not enough for fast moves. You can feel 3D when everything stable but fast movements, is it comportable?

About PAL, it will only 12 FPS. This is why we dont have 3D televisions
Oct 29, 2009, 11:09 AM
my karma ranover my dogma
galaxiex's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by rc_ron
do you know how the 922s and heaplays project the images in the goggles? are there two separate lcds? how are the images being separated for monocular view?
Yes, 2 separate LCD's in the 922 goggles.

The rest...IDK....
Oct 29, 2009, 12:01 PM
Registered User
oxxyfx's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mr.Pibb
Zoltan,
Wow, I had no idea the 922's could even do 3d. lol, now I'll have to try that out!
Tim
The one I sell can do. Not all the EVG's can do 3D.
Oct 29, 2009, 12:06 PM
Registered User
oxxyfx's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by MelihK
Hi Zoltan,

His system using separeted shutter signal for making 3D with 2 camera.
Microprocessor sending shutter signal to cameras and cameras giving 1 frame NTSC, then sending second signal to second camera.... then you have 15 frame left + 15 frame right on the ground.

Am i right? I should right because this is standart way for shutter type 3D systems.

My question is:
are you feeling real when fast movements. Because i think 15fps not enough for fast moves. You can feel 3D when everything stable but fast movements, is it comportable?

About PAL, it will only 12 FPS. This is why we dont have 3D televisions
My understanding is that one line is sent to one of the displays and the second line is to the second display. However don't quote me on that, the developer will join us later today to give some more explanation. Since it is field sequencial I think the refresh rate can stay at 30pfs - but again, I am not the expert.
Oct 29, 2009, 12:07 PM
Registered User
oxxyfx's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by VRflyer
Severals video goggle on the market have the 3D option, they all use the same principle, so it will work fine with the Headplay googgle, it make me no doubt.
Headplay use one display and with mirror they send the picture for the two eyes. They probably also have a clear lcd for each eye that come black alternatly from one eye to the other in 3D mode.

Zoltan I want to try them! I beleive youwhen you tell you can see clearly the pole in the football feild. The distance between the two camera in your module appear to be the same as the human eye, so any object inside 30 feet will appear with depth compare to background. So it should work well for flying very close to ground in football feild. Most of peoples don't fly low it's why I said it will not work.

I got much more depth perception with my Funjet, well over 200-300 feet because I put more space between my cameras, and it become usefull at any altitude. Just for info.
Thank you Denis. And you shall try them...
Oct 29, 2009, 12:30 PM
Registered User
Great news!

And my Icuiti 920 are 3D ready too
Oct 30, 2009, 09:07 PM
Registered User
Hugeone's Avatar
The way I see it is like this: I think that what "move" so the cameras converge closer or farther is the portion of the CMOS sensor that used to capture the image. Not that the sensor itself move but that it is wider than what's needed to produce the image. Only a portion is used at a time and the portion can move parallel to the lense within the extra pixels. That way, it can capture light from different angles in a very precise way.

Make sense no?

It'll be cool to have the cameras much farther apart, so it can "scale up" the distance between our eyes. We could see much farther in 3D than the usual 10-15M, a bit like a giant would see... Problem is, that it'll need to be VERY rigid

-Hugo
Oct 30, 2009, 10:05 PM
Live FPV or Die
VRflyer's Avatar
I think I know how he proceed to syncronize the two cameras. If I'm right, it should have around 4-5 wire comming out from the camera. So it should be possible to remove one cam from the board and with wire extend the distance. You will need to align the camera by yourself of course. It's not hard, to do it, I go outside with my plane and goggle and direct one camera at a object far away in front, after i align the second camera to same object. At first it very weird to have two picture not align, but when you found the good position, everything appear clearly in 3D and you will be able to glue it with a third hand

some of my test in 3D, in French so you need to traduct it:
http://pilotage.immersion.free.fr/Funjet3D.html
Oct 30, 2009, 10:47 PM
Registered User
emrlabs's Avatar

Greetings


Hey Guys,

I can tell by reading the posts in this thread that there are some knowledgeable people contributing to this forum.

I developed the 3D-Cam FPV to be optimized for flight. Now I will never FPV without the 3D-Cam; I can't go back. In my opinion the only problem with the technology is that we can't easily share videos, but we can work on that ;-)

This camera is the 3rd generation, two completely different cameras came before it. For me this year has seen hours of testing, tweaking, refining and sometimes crashing :-( The first versions were tested extensively on glow airplanes and helicopters.

The Gen 2 3D-Cam was flown in July-August and the current version was completed in late September.

About the camera: field sequential 3D video provides the first field(even lines) to one eye while the second field(odd lines) to the other eye.

There are many misunderstandings about 3D perception and whole text books have been written about the subject. RC-RON hit on some important points. Depth cues are provided by many factors (approx. ten depending on how you classify them). The one we are exploiting here is Stereopsis, an important cue that is missing from 2D video.

So is it beneficial for flight? Absolutely, the obvious reason is the ability to see relational distance. We fly FPV using camera lenses that provide a wider field of view then what we would actually see if we looked through a window frame the same apparent size as the projected screen within our glasses. This can take time to learn how to judge distances with wide field lenses. The same is true for 3D video, you adapt to the projected image and your brain learns to interpret the scene to provide more intense depth cues.

This is an important point because stereoscopy is a psychology about interpretation. For instance, is your brain getting less information from FS3D(ie 15fps vs 30fps). Actually your brain is still receiving 30 fps it just gets it from two different sources; each eye. However stereo information is encoded in FS3D. Is there more information then? That's debatable. Your brain is at work changing the data in other ways as well which can lead to the perception of less vertical resolution(not horizontal resolution though as is referred to as 'tv lines').

Can you see 3D at 1000'. Sure you can. Just watch the 3D video and turn the glasses to 2D mode. In 3D you can see the ground is far down using the glasses, in 2D the image is simply laying flat on the screen only 1.5 meters away. You might not be able to tell which objects on the ground are taller from 1000' just as you can't if you were actually flying the plane. Of course why would you care which surface features are taller from 1000', those judgment calls can be made a lot closer to the ground. But I can guarantee that if you were flying my plane at 1000' you'd be disappointed if I turned off the 3D.

You don't need 3D to fly FPV anymore then you need 3D to watch a movie. Of course if immersion is what your trying to achieve then there really is no substitute (at this time) for 3D experiences, whether at the movies or 'in' your plane. Making a 3D FPV video is what is really needed to settle the 3D-FPV debate and then everyone can judge for themselves whether they want to try it.

I don't want to go on and on but I do want to share something with you guys. I'm not sure if this will work but I imagine many of you can get this to happen. I just recorded some video onto a DVD in the computer lab I'm in right now. I pulled the files off the disk and uploaded the files to megashares.
the DVD contained two folders named VIDEO_RM and VIDEO_TS the first folder contains the 3 files that have video_rm in the name and the rest of the files were in the video_ts folder. The links to these files are provided below. Try and reassemble this DVD and play it on a standard DVD player using 3D capable video glasses. Let me know if anyone can get this to work and share you experience about how to burn the DVD. Remember to create the two folders.

http://d01.megashares.com/dl/acc41ed/VIDEO_RM.BUP
http://d01.megashares.com/dl/39dff8f/VIDEO_RM.DAT
http://d01.megashares.com/dl/8a0bb6c/VIDEO_RM.IFO
http://d01.megashares.com/dl/3e09607/VIDEO_TS.BUP
http://d01.megashares.com/dl/a501435/VIDEO_TS.VOB
http://d01.megashares.com/dl/39ccbd2/VTS_01_0.BUP
http://d01.megashares.com/dl/b5d1192/VTS_01_0.IFO
http://d01.megashares.com/dl/e5c0bea/VTS_01_1.VOB

I know, I know, you want actual FPV video. I will try and work on it. I don't have any new video on hand. I have Gen 2 stuff on VHS but it isn't great when coping to the DVD recorder. Lets see if this works first.

Trevor
Oct 30, 2009, 10:49 PM
Registered User
emrlabs's Avatar
No its not possible to remove a camera from the board ;-) The board is the camera.
Oct 31, 2009, 01:04 AM
MelihK's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by emrlabs
About the camera: field sequential 3D video provides the first field(even lines) to one eye while the second field(odd lines) to the other eye.
Trevor

Hi Trevor,

Looking very good product.
My question is about vertical resolution of this.
Because Row Interleaved Image systems have big problem about vertical resolution. We can see only half of vertical lines when sapareted odd and even lines.

Can you transmit your camera's all lines(480 line X 2) or only 240 line per camera?

I'm very impressed and interested because I was working about 3D scanner system with 2 camera.
Oct 31, 2009, 03:46 PM
Mums the word.
man2000me's Avatar
Is it possible to capture the two video signals and put them on here like you did with that picture. Maybe we can have cross eye example of 3d FPV???
Oct 31, 2009, 09:23 PM
Registered User
emrlabs's Avatar
The camera uses the field sequential 3D video to be compatible with all 3D capable glasses. So we have to stick with the compatible format. Have you tested the video? I'm sure you'll find the quality to be excellent. Your not missing anything by using this format with LCD glasses.

It really is amazing video just the way it is ;-)
Nov 01, 2009, 01:37 AM
Registered User
Hi,

Possibly a dumb question, but does the camera come with the goggles?

Good looking product, I can see it being useful for maneuvering a heli/quad around obstructions.

Ben


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