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May 04, 2019, 04:58 PM
Gunslinger
Gunslinger68's Avatar

Horten!


Hi guys!

After quiet a while I am back into KFM - sorry, I did some multicopters meanwhile and after that I did nothing. But now: watch this! A KFM2 Horten 229 style foamie (there is a thread somewhere in the past: davereap me thinks), and I had to do this. Spent the whole sh***y day to make it. Weather was ***, not the built. Some time ago I made the fancy variante 75 Horten created by a french pilot. Still have the stripped bird, since it is so sexy! Used this to check the setup. Could happen that my build makes a maiden this sunday morning. Everythings set up, battery charged.
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May 10, 2019, 08:20 AM
NoobRC.com
thatjoshguy's Avatar

KFM style flying wing for 360 camera


hello all , I'm hoping this is the right place to ask this!

I have this camera:

Name: Global-Version-Xiaomi-Mijia-360-Panorama-Camera-23-88MP-Mi-Sphere-Camera-Action-Camera-Ambarella.jpg
Views: 10
Size: 51.8 KB
Description: xiaomi mijia sphere 360 camera

and I have mounted it on top of a few aircraft for some neat videos:

Chasing Daylight - 360 VR Video on Remote Control Plane (5 min 45 sec)


Out-Of-Body Experience - WARNING: MAY CAUSE DIZZINESS (Xiaomi Mijia Mi Sphere) (2 min 15 sec)



But I can do better

I've been tossing the idea around in my head of a KFM style wing with this camera embedded in the center laying flat with one lens up and one lens down.

There is a small dead zone between the lenses where they overlap, the result being that objects close to the camera along the video seam get cropped out. The visible seam in the plane video above was the result of me trying to get around this as the camera was mounted vertically with the lenses facing left and right (to reduce drag vs. front to back).

I think this effect could work in favor on a very thin wing however, as the resulting video would be free of obstruction.

I'm thinking along the lines of a 40" or so KFM-6 style wing, but my concerns are getting the COG correct with the electronics I have handy, protecting the bottom camera lens when landing, and reinforcing the wings as I have never built a large KFM wing before.

Also, I live in an area with no hobby shops... So I'll be relying on either DTFB or insulation foam from Lowes and whatever materials I can gather from the other flyers in my club.

Could anyone recommend a set of plans that I could use as a jumping off point, or has anyone tried something similar?



Edit: So I just found this http://rcwingcog.a0001.net/ which is awesome since it allows me to add parts with dimensions and weights to calculate the COG... Awesome! Are there any similar calculators that would help me determine whether or not a mock up made in this would actually fly?
Last edited by thatjoshguy; May 10, 2019 at 08:31 AM.
May 10, 2019, 08:57 AM
Too old to rock-n-roll...
TooJung2Die's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by thatjoshguy
Also, I live in an area with no hobby shops... So I'll be relying on either DTFB or insulation foam from Lowes and whatever materials I can gather from the other flyers in my club.

Could anyone recommend a set of plans that I could use as a jumping off point, or has anyone tried something similar?
Did you see this yet? Looks exactly like what you want to try.

Unobstructed 360 aerial cam?? | Insta360 One X (16 min 25 sec)


jon
May 10, 2019, 10:45 AM
NoobRC.com
thatjoshguy's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by TooJung2Die
Did you see this yet? Looks exactly like what you want to try.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=R3ILq0gq_zM

jon
DANGIT, those guys always bet me to my ideas... Time to break out the tin foil hat!

That's about right, but I'm looking to build something that can stay up for a while and maybe support some 2.4ghz FPV gear.

Playing with that designer I linked, as well as working out some things in Fusion 360, I think a 50" KFM-6 wing with a 20 degree sweep would work. 350 root cord, 280 at the tip. I need to weight my batteries when I get home to see what its the best candidate for weight/position.
May 14, 2019, 06:44 AM
Registered User
davereap's Avatar
chasing daylight..... nice.....

calculators..
http://wingcgcalc.bruder.com.br/en_US/? flying wings
http://winglib.com/wings/create similar

my normal full plane one has vanished...

If you use sketchup it is easy enough to work out a balance point...
https://www.rcgroups.com/forums/show...postcount=1367
Last edited by davereap; May 21, 2019 at 02:34 AM.
May 15, 2019, 06:47 AM
Jack
jackerbes's Avatar
Thread OP
That was Polecat Aero right? It looks like it is gone for good. The web site location is for sale but everything is gone...

http://www.polecataero.com/handlaunchu/cg-location

If anyone has saved off the html pages from that page maybe we'll find a genius here that can turn it into a stand-alone app. Or just put it in a zip file and post it and we can run it?

Jack
May 15, 2019, 07:19 AM
NoobRC.com
thatjoshguy's Avatar
Well I stacked up some foam and a kfm6 is too thick for my camera for an obstruction-free 360. Luckily a buddy of mine has the same camera, so I may try with two and try to mix the footage. I have a feeling Flite Test ran into the same issue since they only showed the front view. I'm sure that boom in the back was visible at least

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May 15, 2019, 08:03 AM
Jack
jackerbes's Avatar
Thread OP
If you want to get a CG location that is about right or safe for a maiden flight for a typical wing over fuselage plane you can set it up on a CG locater like the one in the image and balance the aircraft to level with it resting at 1/3rd of the root chord if the wing has little or no sweep back at the tip.s.

Move components or add weight to the tail or nose until the aircraft balances level when resting on the stand you'll have a pretty good chance of a plane that will fly OK. Make the maiden and then fine tune.

If you have some room to move the battery fore and aft and then put Velcro discs on the battery and a strip of Velcro in the bottom of the battery box it will give a way to quickly move the CG fore and aft.

Jack
May 15, 2019, 08:17 AM
Registered User
I use the pencil and eraser block also. My FB added the hollow female part of a snap button to the bottom of the wing once the best CG is located. Makes it very easy to locate the locations later. In most planes I have found 28% to be the CG. Danato
May 16, 2019, 04:36 PM
scratchbuilder
Thomas B.'s Avatar

Small fast KFm 4 plane: Giftzwerg


I tried to build a fast model under 250g. This is the second flight Great fun.
Projekt Giftzwerg: U 250g Speed, 2. Flug (1 min 54 sec)
May 16, 2019, 04:43 PM
Out Standing In The Field
RexGalore's Avatar
You've succeeded (again), Thomas!
Looks like a zippy little unit!
May 18, 2019, 03:57 PM
scratchbuilder
Thomas B.'s Avatar
With APC 4,75x5,5 prop even faster. 50 cm span, KFm 4 wing.
Giftzwerg U 250g Speed: APC 4,75x5,5 Prop (1 min 58 sec)
May 19, 2019, 01:13 AM
Registered User
davereap's Avatar
It reminds me a bit of a powered up Limit ..the limit being a small slope glider
https://www.rcgroups.com/forums/show...light=Limit+EX
May 19, 2019, 09:47 AM
oof
oof
Registered User
RC Plane design fail (and bad CG) (3 min 58 sec)

How did I improve the unflyable foamboard RC plane? (37 min 13 sec)

DIY RC Plane - it flys perfectly! (5 min 31 sec)


I loved this series of 3 videos from xjet in which Bruce iterates through a design, starting from a flat plate and eventually adopting a KF step with beveled leading edge to fix an initially un-flyable plane (along with some CG and vertical stabilizer adjustments).

Anyone else come across pitch stability issues on KF airfoils? What are your solutions? Following Bruce's line of reasoning, I imagine roughening the upper wing surface can help to trip the boundary layer and help it stay attached before the step. Thoughts?
May 19, 2019, 02:53 PM
Reap the wild wind
headlessagain's Avatar
[QUOTE=Thomas B.;41888889]With APC 4,75x5,5 prop even faster. 50 cm span, KFm 4 wing. QUOTE]
That reminds me of the Little Babyshark depron mini hotliner although this was only on 3s
The Wicked Little Babyshark Depron foamie RC micro speed plane (3 min 17 sec)

What motor and esc are you using in your rocket ship?
Andy


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